Re: bp lies

[Guest guest]

<<It's just one example, but how do you deal

with this, both the feelings and how to 'handle' the other person

who believes the lies?>>

First -- welcome!

And how do you handle the lies? You DON'T. You are not responsible

for what others say, nor are you responsible for managing others'

responses to what they say. You will absolutely make yourself

CRAZY. In addition to running your own life, you want to manage the

utterings of other, sometimes emotionally unbalanced people? Who

has time for that? Who wants that much stress when there's nothing

you can do about it anyway? It's not your responsibility to take it

on -- so why sign up for all that stress when it's not your business?

You have to rewrite your mindset that you must run around convincing

people that the BP is telling lies about you. People who care about

you will either 1) not believe the BP, or 2) ask you about it. And

guess what: many people will distrust what the BP is telling them,

even if they seem to be taking it all in hook, line and sinker.

It's a mark of maturity to realize that WE know what is true and we

don't have to run around managing others' opinions. You are a good

person in your own right, and you should have people in your life

who care, and who won't believe lies about you. If they believe the

lies, then there's really nothing you can do about that. It hurts,

yes, but as a mature adult, you have to let that go and concentrate

on those in your life who believe in you. Look at it this way: if

the BP is telling lies about you, and the other person BELIEVES it,

you can count that person as not being close to you in the first

place. It hurts, but you might as well know who your real friends

(and relatives) are.

-Kyla

>

> As I posted previous I am new here and I have a question. How do

> people deal with knowing they are lied about, and that the person

> they have been lied about to believes the bp instead of them. This

> is the behavior that tears me up worse than anything else, it

drives

> me nuts. I don't know how to defend myself. My father frequently

> distorts things and my mother believes him. A few months ago he

was

> bitten by a dog that was a stray and hadn't been vaccinated for

> rabies. I had called the vet and asked them what to do, etc, I'd

> asked them if they could euthanize the dog, etc. My mother came

home

> and came firing out to my cabin where I live (on their property)

and

> raging about how 'a human life is more important than an animal

> life, etc, etc, etc'. I couldn't even figure out what she was

going

> on about til she told me that my father had told her I refused to

do

> anything about the dog bite and didn't want the dog put to sleep,

a

> gross distortion of the facts (because he didn't want the dog put

to

> sleep). I reacted badly because no matter how many times it

happens,

> I still get stunned by his level of dishonesty and her willingness

> to believe him over me. (the dog passed her rabies quarantine and

> still lives here, btw). It's just one example, but how do you deal

> with this, both the feelings and how to 'handle' the other person

> who believes the lies?

>

[Guest guest]

P.S. If your parents are that volatile and addicted to dramas that

include you as one of the players on their " stage " , maybe you should

look at leaving the cabin on their property, and living your own

life. Stress takes its toll on our mind and body -- sometimes moving

away from the source can be life saving. If you're living on their

property for free, maybe consider that the toll it takes is not worth

it. Like the old saying goes: " Cheap is sometimes expensive. "

You can't change them -- you can only protect yourself by either

demanding they respect your boundaries, or leaving.

-Kyla

[Guest guest]

You are so right about this. I left a job in SC to care for a relative

(my dad's mom) and when she passed away I came here. The rages and

abuse started almost immediately, I got into a depression, gained a

bunch of weight and am trying to dig myself out. I am trying to get

into an LPN program which will give me job security if I can hang on

here for another year and a half. I had gotten certified in medical

transcription only to find that most places are converting to voice-

recognition software so opportunities in that field are dwindling a

bit. But since I have so many of the prereq's for the LPN program if I

can get in and complete it, it will mean job security and financial

independence again. I never expected to lose my footing like this but

the behavior I was confronted with (and my mother's willingness to go

to any length to deny it, as always) had a pretty profound effect on

me; I was in my own denial about it because I never should have gotten

re-involved with them.

I did ask my dad, yesterday, very nicely, to knock before coming in

the room I'm using the computer on (I always knock before entering a

room with a closed door). He said " fine I won't come in at all " and

then I heard him say " damn right, b*tch " on the way down the hall. And

of course now it's like that never happened; he never apologizes or

admits wrong-doing. I don't consider my mother to be involved in

dramas, she just denies what he does and tries to make me culpable, so

she can stay in denial about his raging, most of which is aimed at me.

I am putting all my ducks in a row to leave, but I want to do it in a

way that won't leave me destitute again 6 months down the road.

>

> P.S. If your parents are that volatile and addicted to dramas that

> include you as one of the players on their " stage " , maybe you should

> look at leaving the cabin on their property, and living your own

> life. Stress takes its toll on our mind and body -- sometimes

moving

> away from the source can be life saving. If you're living on their

> property for free, maybe consider that the toll it takes is not

worth

> it. Like the old saying goes: " Cheap is sometimes expensive. "

>

> You can't change them -- you can only protect yourself by either

> demanding they respect your boundaries, or leaving.

>

> -Kyla

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for your input. This is a game my family has always played. I

have a sister that stirs the pot behind the scenes with my dad as

well. I guess I am stuck in the dynamic that the only love I have

ever been able to get from my family has been in fighting with my dad

and trying to 'convince' my mother that I am lovable, against my

sister and Dad's slander. Or something. It's bizarre...I know it has

something to do with his competitive feelings and resentment against

his younger sister, which he projects on me, and my sister has those

same feelings against her younger sister (me) so I guess they are both

operating from the same playbook (although she is recently married and

thus hasn't participated in the games nearly so much).

I needed to hear that about not trying to defend myself against other

peolpe telling lies about me. My first reaction was, " I'm not? " . This

is so confusing to me. There is apparently just a big 'blank' in my

knowledge center where all that is supposed to be. I am a very late-

bloomer when it comes to this kind of thing, I test in range for

autism (aspergers syndrome) and am more gullible than most so maybe

I'm projecting and assuming that other people are as well. I get

really panicky when I think people might believe lies about me, but

that is because growing up there was that constant dynamic of my

father trying to smear me (for whatever reason, it's so twisted) and

my mother being the classic mother in denial choosing not to see so

that she could see her husband in a different light than actual

reality.

Look at it this way: if

> the BP is telling lies about you, and the other person BELIEVES it,

> you can count that person as not being close to you in the first

> place. It hurts, but you might as well know who your real friends

> (and relatives) are.

>

> -Kyla

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks so much, again, for the responses. I feel like a bit of a

doofus for just figuring out thanks to what I've read here not to

react emotionally. I feel like I have been baited my whole life. A

million thank you's for taking the time to write out all of that, it

makes so much sense I'm sitting here kicking myself going 'd'oh'.

*I* know that I've been working a twelve step program since the

early nineties and rigorous honesty is part of that but it means

nothing to them. I just get torn asunder when I get accused of such

stupid, distorted things...and then my mother doesn't believe that I

wouldn't tell lies, especially the ridiculous things my father comes

up with. But I know part of the problem is I react like a

child...and somehow if you have an emotional reaction that is what

they want and it confirms your guilt. Or something. Thanks for all

the good feedback.

> >

> > As I posted previous I am new here and I have a question. How do

> > people deal with knowing they are lied about, and that the

person

> > they have been lied about to believes the bp instead of them.

This

> > is the behavior that tears me up worse than anything else, it

> drives

> > me nuts. I don't know how to defend myself. My father frequently

> > distorts things and my mother believes him. A few months ago he

> was

> > bitten by a dog that was a stray and hadn't been vaccinated for

> > rabies. I had called the vet and asked them what to do, etc, I'd

> > asked them if they could euthanize the dog, etc. My mother came

> home

> > and came firing out to my cabin where I live (on their property)

> and

> > raging about how 'a human life is more important than an animal

> > life, etc, etc, etc'. I couldn't even figure out what she was

> going

> > on about til she told me that my father had told her I refused

to

> do

> > anything about the dog bite and didn't want the dog put to

sleep,

> a

> > gross distortion of the facts (because he didn't want the dog

put

> to

> > sleep). I reacted badly because no matter how many times it

> happens,

> > I still get stunned by his level of dishonesty and her

willingness

> > to believe him over me. (the dog passed her rabies quarantine

and

> > still lives here, btw). It's just one example, but how do you

deal

> > with this, both the feelings and how to 'handle' the other

person

> > who believes the lies?

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Just when I was thinking Kyla already covered EVERYTHING (lol, tongue

in cheek)...

I just wanted to add that while coming out of denial that a parent

has BPD is hard, it seems to be even harder to realize that the OTHER

parent--the supposedly " sane " one--has problems, too. Most of us

here have mothers with BPD, so the other parent is our father; for

you it is the other way around. As children, we needed to believe

that the other parent was on our side, our hero, defending us and

loving us. Often, though, the reality is that the other parent has

his own issues that keep him enmeshed with the BPD spouse.

It sounds like your mother has chosen to sacrifice you to your

father's mood so that she doesn't have to go against him herself.

This does not honor you or who you are--it is invalidating to you,

and that is why you are feeling so angry and hurt. It may be

difficult for you to come to terms with the reality that she is not

on your side. I can certainly relate. It was much easier to

recognize that my mother had a problem; in many ways, grieving over

realizing my dad did, too, was much more difficult. I always hoped

he would be able to understand, that he would defend me, that he

would stand up to her. It never happened. He chooses to stay

tangled up in her crazy emotional web.

That might be enough to really think about for right now. I do have

some practical questions for you, though. You say you are in a dire

financial situation. What does that mean? What options have you

explored? Have you priced housing? Looked into public assistance?

Do you have a job, or any ideas about where to apply for one? It

sounds like you are feeling really discouraged right now. I just

want to say that whatever your hopes and dreams are, you can make a

plan and set some goals. It sounds like staying with your parents is

really unhealthy for you and detrimental to your emotional well-

being. I agree with Kyla that it would be a good idea to consider

your options for moving out.

Hope that is helpful; please continue to ask if you have any more

questions. Glad you found the board.

[Guest guest]

mayalisa,

I agree with Kyla's suggestions. You need to make it be a " dad

problem. " Surely your mom knows his history and his irrational

thoughts. I would maintain as much composure as you can and just

look at her and say " do you REALLY think that's what happened? "

She'll know. And if she doesn't have understanding, maybe there's

nothing you can do but try your damndest to get out of their way.

You mentioned health and financial difficulties; these probably make

you feel trapped. Is there any way you can out, even depending on

the state? I would sign up for welfare and get my dignity and self-

respect back before living with my BPD fada.

Elle

> >

> > As I posted previous I am new here and I have a question. How do

> > people deal with knowing they are lied about, and that the person

> > they have been lied about to believes the bp instead of them.

This

> > is the behavior that tears me up worse than anything else, it

> drives

> > me nuts. I don't know how to defend myself. My father frequently

> > distorts things and my mother believes him. A few months ago he

> was

> > bitten by a dog that was a stray and hadn't been vaccinated for

> > rabies. I had called the vet and asked them what to do, etc, I'd

> > asked them if they could euthanize the dog, etc. My mother came

> home

> > and came firing out to my cabin where I live (on their property)

> and

> > raging about how 'a human life is more important than an animal

> > life, etc, etc, etc'. I couldn't even figure out what she was

> going

> > on about til she told me that my father had told her I refused to

> do

> > anything about the dog bite and didn't want the dog put to sleep,

> a

> > gross distortion of the facts (because he didn't want the dog put

> to

> > sleep). I reacted badly because no matter how many times it

> happens,

> > I still get stunned by his level of dishonesty and her

willingness

> > to believe him over me. (the dog passed her rabies quarantine and

> > still lives here, btw). It's just one example, but how do you

deal

> > with this, both the feelings and how to 'handle' the other person

> > who believes the lies?

> >

>

[Guest guest]

,

You are right on today girl,

When finding out about my BP mother I had no other choice than to

look at my father without my rose colored glasses on. It was a

major step off of his pedestal which was huge for him as I held him

up there close to GOD.

He is in no way shape or form as perfect as I thought him to be. He

is flawed.....

He was just lucky that he could divorce his problem (my nada)and I

am lucky, although he has dated some duzzies, he has not remarried,

as he seems to attract the worst of the worst. He has money, and

looks, and a huge heart....but gets is so wrong when it comes to the

ladies.

I have learned to stand up to him and make him listen and

understand....no matter how uncomfortable it might make him. He is

a great support to my NC as well.

Great topic.....drlingirl

>

> Just when I was thinking Kyla already covered EVERYTHING (lol,

tongue

> in cheek)...

>

> I just wanted to add that while coming out of denial that a parent

> has BPD is hard, it seems to be even harder to realize that the

OTHER

> parent--the supposedly " sane " one--has problems, too. Most of us

> here have mothers with BPD, so the other parent is our father; for

> you it is the other way around. As children, we needed to believe

> that the other parent was on our side, our hero, defending us and

> loving us. Often, though, the reality is that the other parent

has

> his own issues that keep him enmeshed with the BPD spouse.

>

> It sounds like your mother has chosen to sacrifice you to your

> father's mood so that she doesn't have to go against him herself.

> This does not honor you or who you are--it is invalidating to you,

> and that is why you are feeling so angry and hurt. It may be

> difficult for you to come to terms with the reality that she is

not

> on your side. I can certainly relate. It was much easier to

> recognize that my mother had a problem; in many ways, grieving

over

> realizing my dad did, too, was much more difficult. I always

hoped

> he would be able to understand, that he would defend me, that he

> would stand up to her. It never happened. He chooses to stay

> tangled up in her crazy emotional web.

>

> That might be enough to really think about for right now. I do

have

> some practical questions for you, though. You say you are in a

dire

> financial situation. What does that mean? What options have you

> explored? Have you priced housing? Looked into public

assistance?

> Do you have a job, or any ideas about where to apply for one? It

> sounds like you are feeling really discouraged right now. I just

> want to say that whatever your hopes and dreams are, you can make

a

> plan and set some goals. It sounds like staying with your parents

is

> really unhealthy for you and detrimental to your emotional well-

> being. I agree with Kyla that it would be a good idea to consider

> your options for moving out.

>

> Hope that is helpful; please continue to ask if you have any more

> questions. Glad you found the board.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Mayalisa,

This is a game I am far too familar with. My BP sister stirs up the

crap and keeps it going in my family. She is dysfunctional to say

the least. We have all been made to walk on eggshells around her

moods.

Now the funny thing is......is that my nada has always complained

about her own sister and her sister's shortcomings and the fact that

their mother favored her sister, blah, blah, blah. Well it didn't

take long for me to figure out that my nada was doing to me the

exact same thing that her mother did to her. Its like time hasn't

changed at all.....only the characters.

Good luck getting out. You sound like a very smart girl....I'm sure

you will see through all this crap you have been dealt with and come

out stronger inspite of them.

drlingirl

>

> Thanks for your input. This is a game my family has always played.

I

> have a sister that stirs the pot behind the scenes with my dad as

> well. I guess I am stuck in the dynamic that the only love I have

> ever been able to get from my family has been in fighting with my

dad

> and trying to 'convince' my mother that I am lovable, against my

> sister and Dad's slander. Or something. It's bizarre...I know it

has

> something to do with his competitive feelings and resentment

against

> his younger sister, which he projects on me, and my sister has

those

> same feelings against her younger sister (me) so I guess they are

both

> operating from the same playbook (although she is recently married

and

> thus hasn't participated in the games nearly so much).

>

> I needed to hear that about not trying to defend myself against

other

> peolpe telling lies about me. My first reaction was, " I'm not? " .

This

> is so confusing to me. There is apparently just a big 'blank' in

my

> knowledge center where all that is supposed to be. I am a very

late-

> bloomer when it comes to this kind of thing, I test in range for

> autism (aspergers syndrome) and am more gullible than most so

maybe

> I'm projecting and assuming that other people are as well. I get

> really panicky when I think people might believe lies about me,

but

> that is because growing up there was that constant dynamic of my

> father trying to smear me (for whatever reason, it's so twisted)

and

> my mother being the classic mother in denial choosing not to see

so

> that she could see her husband in a different light than actual

> reality.

>

>

>

> Look at it this way: if

> > the BP is telling lies about you, and the other person BELIEVES

it,

> > you can count that person as not being close to you in the first

> > place. It hurts, but you might as well know who your real

friends

> > (and relatives) are.

> >

> > -Kyla

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hey, sistah -- enough of the doofus talk! Just about all of us have

been where you are -- it's still a struggle for many of us. You're

not a doofus -- in fact, you're showing courage for being willing to

look at the situation. It's hard work -- easier just to go the path

of least resistance. To change it in a good way takes shaking it up a

bit, and that takes guts. Give yourself a pat on the back for taking

a step back to look at it and reaching out for help. That's the voice

inside you that wants to survive -- and grow.

-Kyla

[Guest guest]

Your post shows more insight than you give yourself credit for.

Also, you wrote: <<I am a very late-bloomer when it comes to this

kind of thing, I test in range for autism (aspergers syndrome) and

am more gullible than most so maybe I'm projecting and assuming that

other people are as well.>>

Hey, you're blooming earlier than I did! I was 43 when the

lightbulb went on! And I'm sorry to hear you struggle in the range

of autism, but I will tell you that this particular point in your

journey sounds exactly like what most of us have gone through. (I

STILL struggle with wanting to fix and argue with my parents.) It's

hard to unravel the mind games they've orchestrated many years ago

in our heads. I'm speaking out of school, but maybe you'll test

better in the autism spectrum after you unravel what they've done!

Who knows, could have been extreme stress! I know several posters

here have had health problems from the stress of enduring a BPD

family member, and their symptoms lessen (or disappear) once they

learn how to draw boundaries and detach from their family.

And don't think it takes too long, either -- once I found there was

a name for it (BPD) and that this community of wonderful people had

so many similar experiences as me -- I started to change. A shift

in a lifetime of thinking. It didn't take long. It's been less

than two years, and I really do have a different mindset. You can,

too.

-Kyla

[Guest guest]

I agree, drlingirl -- brought up a VERY important point: the

OTHER parent! What a great post.

I mindlessly defended my dad for years -- after he took my mom's side

so many times. Once, when I was defending him yet again by

saying " But he's a good dad! " , my therapist finally confronted me

with " No, he's NOT! "

I kind of woke up with that one -- and all of the memories of him

lining up with her against me came flooding back. I guess I protected

it in a pathetic attempt to pretend he was such a good dad. And,

as " Understanding the Borderline Mother " points out -- the husbands of

BPDs can be great fathers, UNTIL they must make a choice between their

children and their BPD spouse. They usually pick the spouse.

-Kyla

[Guest guest]

Wow......I keep saying wow today!!!

Do you think we split our parents by seeing our dads as all white???

I am still amazed at how I see my father now, after learning about

BP. I am almost always irritated with him these days. I called him

tonight looking for some validation over nada's husband calling

me......and instead of hearing me....he said " he is a nice guy " .

WHAT THE??? Who's side are you on.......what planet are you from???

Thought I raised him better than that....hehehehehe

drlingirl

>

> I agree, drlingirl -- brought up a VERY important point:

the

> OTHER parent! What a great post.

>

> I mindlessly defended my dad for years -- after he took my mom's

side

> so many times. Once, when I was defending him yet again by

> saying " But he's a good dad! " , my therapist finally confronted me

> with " No, he's NOT! "

>

> I kind of woke up with that one -- and all of the memories of him

> lining up with her against me came flooding back. I guess I

protected

> it in a pathetic attempt to pretend he was such a good dad. And,

> as " Understanding the Borderline Mother " points out -- the

husbands of

> BPDs can be great fathers, UNTIL they must make a choice between

their

> children and their BPD spouse. They usually pick the spouse.

>

> -Kyla

>

[Guest guest]

LOL...Kyla, I've had that EXACT same conversation with my own therapist about my

dad!

Ninera

kylaboo728 wrote:

. Once, when I was defending him yet again by

saying " But he's a good dad! " , my therapist finally confronted me

with " No, he's NOT! "

---------------------------------

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.

[Guest guest]

,

you hit the nail on the head. My final resort was my father, and he failed to

stand up for me. He would listen to me, and understand what I had to say. Then

he would talk to my mother, and get completely turned around and attack me and

my character. That's when I left and went NC for quite some time.

He is still enmeshed with her. And while he weeps for the loss of his

daughter, he still doesn't quite get why he lost his daughter. Thanks for the

reminder, that he won't ever get unstuck from her, or stick up for me, even in

his own private thoughts.

Honoria

" ktelewis " ktelewis@... ktelewis wrote:

>>As children, we needed to believe

that the other parent was on our side, our hero, defending us and

loving us. Often, though, the reality is that the other parent has

his own issues that keep him enmeshed with the BPD spouse.<<

---------------------------------

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search.

[Guest guest]

<< And while he weeps for the loss of his daughter, he still doesn't

quite get why he lost his daughter.>>

Sounds exactly like my father's current relationship with me.

-Kyla