Advice

November 7, 2011

Hi All,

Need a bit of advice. ( Constructive please!) I am slowly pushing myself out of

my comfort zone. And I have some 'bigger' leaps planned. - I have booked

that trip to Italy!

The thing is - I am wondering if it would be a good idea to take some beta

blockers. Not because I need them on a day to day basis - because I don't - but

for big situational stretches where I have my daughter - and many other kids

in toe too. I am practising willingness and expansion - and I can continue to do

this whilst on beta blockers and then gradually come off of them when I have

become more used to the bigger leaps. I don't want to go on them but neither do

I want to freak out in front of the class! ( I hear you say - go ahead and freak

out) but I want to save my daughter from that embarrassment.

I know the best thing to do would be to just go ahead and feel my racing heart -

allow myself to freeze and backtrack. But I just don't feel that that is an

option when I have my daughter to look after. I want to be relaxed, fun and

engaged - which is difficult when you have a heart that goes likes a steam

train, legs that say, run like hell, and a brain like mush!

I am thinking that maybe taking beta blockers might be the more compasionate

approach and give me a bit of 'support' whilst I continue to break through some

very old habits.

I have never taken any medication for anxiety - just avoided a hellava lot- so

if this medication can support me in moving out some more, whilst practcing ACT,

I think it might be a good idea. Just wondering what others have experienced.

Thanks

Simone

November 7, 2011

Fantastic news about Italy!!!! Well done, Simone!!! I offer you a personal view about taking beta-blockers to help with situational anxiety.I take beta-blockers, and they help me enormously. Just today, I gave a presentation. Eeek! The physical sensation of my pounding heart and shortness of breath makes public speaking physically (as well as emotionally) very difficult: my beta blockers just take the edge of it so I can get my words out a little more clearly. Personally, my Propranolol have never given me side effects. Whenever stuck with a decision about something that might

not seem ACT consistent, the ultimate test is if it helps you live a valued life overall? For example, I also listen to an MP3 of rainfall at night as it helps drown out negative thoughts and gets me to sleep. This may appear to be "avoidance", but it helps me to get to sleep and live well the next day, so why not?Somewhere between being a coward and a martyr are an awful lot of workable compromises that we can miss in pursuit of the "right" approach. Take care, buona... er..... flight. (???) xFrom: adrianandboo

To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Monday, 7 November 2011, 16:02Subject: Advice Hi All,Need a bit of advice. ( Constructive please!) I am slowly pushing myself out of my comfort zone. And I have some 'bigger' leaps planned. - I have booked that trip to Italy!The thing is - I am wondering if it would be a good idea to take some beta blockers. Not because I need them on a day to day basis - because I don't - but for big situational stretches where I have my daughter - and many other kids in toe too. I am practising willingness and expansion - and I can continue to do this whilst on beta blockers and then gradually come off of them when I have become more used to the bigger leaps. I don't want to

go on them but neither do I want to freak out in front of the class! ( I hear you say - go ahead and freak out) but I want to save my daughter from that embarrassment.I know the best thing to do would be to just go ahead and feel my racing heart - allow myself to freeze and backtrack. But I just don't feel that that is an option when I have my daughter to look after. I want to be relaxed, fun and engaged - which is difficult when you have a heart that goes likes a steam train, legs that say, run like hell, and a brain like mush!I am thinking that maybe taking beta blockers might be the more compasionate approach and give me a bit of 'support' whilst I continue to break through some very old habits.I have never taken any medication for anxiety - just avoided a hellava lot- so if this medication can support me in moving out some more, whilst practcing ACT, I think it might be a good idea. Just wondering what others have

experienced.ThanksSimone------------------------------------For other ACT materials and list serves see www.contextualpsychology.orgIf you do not wish to belong to ACT_for_the_Public, you may unsubscribe by sending an email to ACT_for_the_Public-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links<*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ACT_for_the_Public/<*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional<*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ACT_for_the_Public/join (Yahoo! ID required)<*> To change settings via email: ACT_for_the_Public-digest ACT_for_the_Public-fullfeatured <*>

November 7, 2011

I think compromises that are in fact steps forwardare well within an ACT approach. They are a bit more risky than the fullleap. And be clear that you know you will need to out them down eventually

to be liberated. Still a step forward is a step forward.I would trust your deepest, wisest voice and then keep your eyes wide.And keep it on the table. The time this become most toxic is when you begin to think

your mind can decide on what a step forward or back is and therefore you arrogantlyclaim " I can keep doing this forever without cost. " or " that far and no farther. " That puts your mind

in the drivers seat and guess where you go over time?The thing in here that sounds a bit off though is that " I have never taken any medication for anxiety - just avoided a hellava lot "

So the beta blocker would open up a new territory for youand you don't really know that territory

The other thing. The truth about this part " I just don't feel that that is an option when I have my daughter to look after. I want to be relaxed, fun and engaged - which is difficult when you have a heart that goes likes a steam train, legs that say, run like hell, and a brain like mush! "

is that avoidance makes that MORE likely, not less. Meds? Who knows.

Still, there this race is not being timed, and there is no finish line.Turning ACT into a critical waging finger

(a new list of musts) is just not what it is aboutI took beta blockers for a while. Then less and less. The last time I used one (a couple of decades ago I licked the pill --

so the fading out was pretty silly in how far it went. Then I left the pills back in the car or hotel room. Then at home.I have a 18-20 year old small bottle somewhere upstairs somewhere as a souvenir. ACT of that was during my ACT

work. I don't recommend that path -- it is slow for one thing. Still it is more important to move forwardthan to try to climb into a rigid rule list

- S

C. Foundation ProfessorDepartment of Psychology /298University of NevadaReno, NV 89557-0062 " Love isn't everything, it's the only thing " hayes@... or stevenchayes@...

Fax: Psych Department: Contextual Change (you can use this number for messages if need be): Blogs: Psychology Today http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/get-out-your-mind

Huffington Post http://www.huffingtonpost.com/steven-c-hayes-phdIf you want my vita, publications, PowerPoint slides, try my training page or my blog at the ACBS site:

http://www.contextualpsychology.org/steven_hayes http://www.contextualpsychology.org/blog/steven_hayes

or you can try my website (it is semi-functional) stevenchayes.comIf you have any questions about ACT or RFT (articles, AAQ information etc), please first check the vast resources at website of the Association for Contextual Behavioral Science (ACBS): www.contextualpsychology.org. You have to register on the site to download things, but the cost if up to your own values.

If you are a professional or student and want to be part of the world wide ACT discussion or RFT discussions go to http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/acceptanceandcommitmenttherapy/join

orhttp://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/relationalframetheory/joinIf you are a member of the public reading ACT self-help books (e.g., " Get Out of Your Mind and Into Your Life " etc) and want to be part of the conversation go to: http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/ACT_for_the_Public/join

Hi All,

Need a bit of advice. ( Constructive please!) I am slowly pushing myself out of my comfort zone. And I have some 'bigger' leaps planned. - I have booked that trip to Italy!

The thing is - I am wondering if it would be a good idea to take some beta blockers. Not because I need them on a day to day basis - because I don't - but for big situational stretches where I have my daughter - and many other kids in toe too. I am practising willingness and expansion - and I can continue to do this whilst on beta blockers and then gradually come off of them when I have become more used to the bigger leaps. I don't want to go on them but neither do I want to freak out in front of the class! ( I hear you say - go ahead and freak out) but I want to save my daughter from that embarrassment.

I know the best thing to do would be to just go ahead and feel my racing heart - allow myself to freeze and backtrack. But I just don't feel that that is an option when I have my daughter to look after. I want to be relaxed, fun and engaged - which is difficult when you have a heart that goes likes a steam train, legs that say, run like hell, and a brain like mush!

I am thinking that maybe taking beta blockers might be the more compasionate approach and give me a bit of 'support' whilst I continue to break through some very old habits.

I have never taken any medication for anxiety - just avoided a hellava lot- so if this medication can support me in moving out some more, whilst practcing ACT, I think it might be a good idea. Just wondering what others have experienced.

Thanks

Simone

November 8, 2011

Thanks for that . Italy won't be until next spring so I have plenty of time to visit the airport - maybe take a shorter flight first. Take it a step at a time. But for me, even booking the trip is a big step forward. And I have told my daughter and she is all excited - so there is no backing out this time!

It's useful to know your experience of beta blockers - I am still a bit hesitant- but I think I may give it a go. I wish I could just pop one, as and when, but they don't seem to work like that. Thanks again.

Simone

To: "ACT_for_the_Public " <ACT_for_the_Public >Sent: Monday, 7 November 2011, 16:47Subject: Re: Advice

Fantastic news about Italy!!!! Well done, Simone!!! I offer you a personal view about taking beta-blockers to help with situational anxiety.

I take beta-blockers, and they help me enormously. Just today, I gave a presentation. Eeek! The physical sensation of my pounding heart and shortness of breath makes public speaking physically (as well as emotionally) very difficult: my beta blockers just take the edge of it so I can get my words out a little more clearly. Personally, my Propranolol have never given me side effects.

Whenever stuck with a decision about something that might not seem ACT consistent, the ultimate test is if it helps you live a valued life overall? For example, I also listen to an MP3 of rainfall at night as it helps drown out negative thoughts and gets me to sleep. This may appear to be "avoidance", but it helps me to get to sleep and live well the next day, so why not?Somewhere between being a coward and a martyr are an awful lot of workable compromises that we can miss in pursuit of the "right" approach.

Take care, buona... er..... flight. (???)

x

To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Monday, 7 November 2011, 16:02Subject: AdviceHi All,Need a bit of advice. ( Constructive please!) I am slowly pushing myself out of my comfort zone. And I have some 'bigger' leaps planned. - I have booked that trip to Italy!The thing is - I am wondering if it would be a good idea to take some

beta blockers. Not because I need them on a day to day basis - because I don't - but for big situational stretches where I have my daughter - and many other kids in toe too. I am practising willingness and expansion - and I can continue to do this whilst on beta blockers and then gradually come off of them when I have become more used to the bigger leaps. I don't want to go on them but neither do I want to freak out in front of the class! ( I hear you say - go ahead and freak out) but I want to save my daughter from that embarrassment.I know the best thing to do would be to just go ahead and feel my racing heart - allow myself to freeze and backtrack. But I just don't feel that that is an option when I have my daughter to look after. I want to be relaxed, fun and engaged - which is difficult when you have a heart that goes likes a steam train, legs that say, run like hell, and a brain like mush!I am thinking that maybe taking beta

blockers might be the more compasionate approach and give me a bit of 'support' whilst I continue to break through some very old habits.I have never taken any medication for anxiety - just avoided a hellava lot- so if this medication can support me in moving out some more, whilst practcing ACT, I think it might be a good idea. Just wondering what others have experienced.ThanksSimone------------------------------------For other ACT materials and list serves see www.contextualpsychology.orgIf you do not wish to belong to ACT_for_the_Public, you may unsubscribe by sending an email to ACT_for_the_Public-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links<*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ACT_for_the_Public/<*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional<*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ACT_for_the_Public/join (Yahoo! ID required)<*> To change settings via email: ACT_for_the_Public-digest ACT_for_the_Public-fullfeatured <*>

November 8, 2011

Thanks for that , I hear what you are saying. Part of me know that the best way forward is no pills - full acceptance, expansion, defusion, ect. I am kind of hoping that taking these pills will help me break the cycle of racing heart = freeze=retreat=disappointment, like pavlovs dogs. I am getting there without pills - but it is ohh so sloooooooooooow. I might just get this act stuff by the time I am 99! I am hoping that the double whammy of pills and ACT might nail it for me. I want to do some big leaps and learn to fly - with eyes wide open all on fronts.

I have had a lot of fear around my heart racing and skipping so that is why I have avoided these drugs before - but maybe that was a decision made out of fear - whereas this decision is made out of the desire to go forward - so in that respect maybe it is the right choice. I am thinking 6 months on these drugs - see what happens- and then ween myself off. Unknown territory yes - but I am ready for that now- bring it on!

Simone

Ps. The other day, for a couple of weeks after doing some defusion - I felt completely liberated-open, free, spacious. I just couldn't worry anymore about anything - then I lost it again! As Jesus said 'You will know the truth - and the truth will set you free'. I felt that I had tasted that.

I'm not giving up.

To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Monday, 7 November 2011, 16:56Subject: Re: Advice

I think compromises that are in fact steps forward are well within an ACT approach. They are a bit more risky than the full

leap. And be clear that you know you will need to out them down eventually

to be liberated. Still a step forward is a step forward.

I would trust your deepest, wisest voice and then keep your eyes wide.

And keep it on the table.

The time this become most toxic is when you begin to think

your mind can decide on what a step forward or back is and therefore you arrogantly

claim "I can keep doing this forever without cost." or "that far and no farther." That puts your mind

in the drivers seat and guess where you go over time?

The thing in here that sounds a bit off though is that

"I have never taken any medication for anxiety - just avoided a hellava lot"

So the beta blocker would open up a new territory for you

and you don't really know that territory

The other thing. The truth about this part

"I just don't feel that that is an option when I have my daughter to look after. I want to be relaxed, fun and engaged - which is difficult when you have a heart that goes likes a steam train, legs that say, run like hell, and a brain like mush!"

is that avoidance makes that MORE likely, not less. Meds? Who knows.

Still, there this race is not being timed, and there is no finish line.

Turning ACT into a critical waging finger

(a new list of musts) is just not what it is about

I took beta blockers for a while. Then less and less. The last time I used one (a couple of decades ago I licked the pill --

so the fading out was pretty silly in how far it went. Then I left the pills back in the car or hotel room. Then at home.

I have a 18-20 year old small bottle somewhere upstairs somewhere as a souvenir. ACT of that was during my ACT

work. I don't recommend that path -- it is slow for one thing. Still it is more important to move forward

than to try to climb into a rigid rule list

- S

C. Foundation ProfessorDepartment of Psychology /298University of NevadaReno, NV 89557-0062"Love isn't everything, it's the only thing"hayes@... or stevenchayes@...Fax: Psych Department: Contextual Change (you can use this number for messages if need be): Blogs: Psychology Today http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/get-out-your-mindHuffington Post http://www.huffingtonpost.com/steven-c-hayes-phdIf you want my vita, publications, PowerPoint slides, try my training page or my blog at the ACBS site: http://www.contextualpsychology.org/steven_hayes http://www.contextualpsychology.org/blog/steven_hayes or you can try my website (it is semi-functional) stevenchayes.comIf you have any questions about ACT or RFT (articles, AAQ information etc), please first check the vast resources at website of the Association for Contextual Behavioral Science (ACBS): www.contextualpsychology.org. You have to register on the site to download

things, but the cost if up to your own values. If you are a professional or student and want to be part of the world wide ACT discussion or RFT discussions go to http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/acceptanceandcommitmenttherapy/joinorhttp://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/relationalframetheory/joinIf you are a member of the public reading ACT self-help books (e.g., "Get Out of Your Mind and Into Your Life" etc) and want to be part of the conversation go to: http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/ACT_for_the_Public/join

Hi All,Need a bit of advice. ( Constructive please!) I am slowly pushing myself out of my comfort zone. And I have some 'bigger' leaps planned. - I have booked that trip to Italy!The thing is - I am wondering if it would be a good idea to take some beta blockers. Not because I need them on a day to day basis - because I don't - but for big situational stretches where I have my daughter - and many other kids in toe too. I am practising willingness and expansion - and I can continue to do this whilst on beta blockers and then gradually come off of them when I have become more used to the bigger leaps. I don't want to go on them but neither do I want to freak out in front of the class! ( I hear you say - go ahead and freak out) but I want to save my daughter from that embarrassment.I know the best thing to do would be to just go ahead and feel my racing heart - allow myself to freeze and backtrack. But I just don't feel that

that is an option when I have my daughter to look after. I want to be relaxed, fun and engaged - which is difficult when you have a heart that goes likes a steam train, legs that say, run like hell, and a brain like mush!I am thinking that maybe taking beta blockers might be the more compasionate approach and give me a bit of 'support' whilst I continue to break through some very old habits.I have never taken any medication for anxiety - just avoided a hellava lot- so if this medication can support me in moving out some more, whilst practcing ACT, I think it might be a good idea. Just wondering what others have experienced.ThanksSimone

November 8, 2011

I hesitate to give you " medical advice " so check with your doctor Simone, but I

do take beta-blockers " as and when " , because I use them for singing performances

and no other time. They totally stop any adrenalin rush and physical sensations

that occur such as shaky voice etc. I take one 10 mg pill, and that does the

trick for a couple of hours. Many musicians use them.

I've actually found the experience of using them to be very interesting. Before

a performance I usually have the odd nervous thought ie " I'll be on in 15

minutes " and that would automatically result in adrenalin kicking in ie heart

racing etc - which in turn tends to work as a feedback loop making me even more

nervous. When I take the beta blockers, I still get the thoughts, but because

the physical sensations don't occur, the thoughts don't get reinforced - very

interesting to observe how the emotions and thoughts are so connected to the

physical manifestations and how they reinforce one another.

Cheers

Kate

>

> Thanks for that . Italy won't be until next spring so I have plenty of

time to visit the airport - maybe take a shorter flight first. Take it a step at

a time. But for me, even booking the trip is a big step forward. And I have told

my daughter and she is all excited - so there is no backing out this time!

> It's useful to know your experience of beta blockers - I am still a bit

hesitant- but I think I may give it a go. I wish I could just pop one, as and

when, but they don't seem to work like that. Thanks again.

> Â

> Simone

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: " ACT_for_the_Public " <ACT_for_the_Public >

> Sent: Monday, 7 November 2011, 16:47

> Subject: Re: Advice

>

> Â

> Fantastic news about Italy!!!!Â Well done, Simone!!!Â I offer you a personal

view about taking beta-blockers to help with situational anxiety.

>

> I take beta-blockers, and they help me enormously.Â Just today, I gave a

presentation. Eeek!Â The physical sensation of my pounding heart and shortness

of breath makes public speaking physically (as well as emotionally) very

difficult: my beta blockers just take the edge of it so I can get my words out a

little more clearly.Â Personally, my Propranolol have never given me side

effects.Â

>

> Whenever stuck with a decision about something that might not seem ACT

consistent, the ultimate test is if it helps you live a valued life overall?Â

For example, I also listen to an MP3 of rainfall at night as it helps drown out

negative thoughts and gets me to sleep.Â This may appear to be " avoidance " , but

it helps me to get to sleep and live well the next day, so why not?

>

> Somewhere between being a coward and a martyr are an awful lot of workable

compromises that we can miss in pursuit of the " right " approach.Â

>

> Take care, buona... er..... flight. (???)

>

> x

>

> ________________________________

>

> To: ACT_for_the_Public

> Sent: Monday, 7 November 2011, 16:02

> Subject: Advice

>

> Hi All,

>

> Need a bit of advice. ( Constructive please!) I am slowly pushing myself out

of my comfort zone. And I have some 'bigger' leaps planned. - I have

booked that trip to Italy!

> The thing is - I am wondering if it would be a good idea to take some beta

blockers. Not because I need them on a day to day basis - because I don't - but

for big situational stretches where I have myÂ daughter - andÂ many other kids

in toe too. I am practising willingness and expansion - and I can continue to do

this whilst on beta blockers and then gradually come off of them when I have

become more used to the bigger leaps. I don't want to go on them but neither do

I want to freak out in front of the class! ( I hear you say - go ahead and freak

out) but I want to save my daughter from that embarrassment.

> I know the best thing to do would be to just go ahead and feel my racing heart

- allow myself to freeze and backtrack. But I just don't feel that that is an

option when I have my daughter to look after. I want to be relaxed, fun and

engaged - which is difficult when you have a heart that goes likes a steam

train, legs that say, run like hell, and a brain like mush!

> I am thinking that maybe taking beta blockers might be the more compasionate

approach and give me a bit of 'support' whilst I continue to break through some

very old habits.

> I have never taken any medication for anxiety - just avoided a hellava lot- so

if this medication can support me in moving out some more, whilst practcing ACT,

I think it might be a good idea. Just wondering what others have experienced.

>

> Thanks

> Simone

>

> ------------------------------------

>

> For other ACT materials and list serves see www.contextualpsychology.org

>

> If you do not wish to belong to ACT_for_the_Public, you may

> unsubscribe by sending an email to

> ACT_for_the_Public-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links

>

November 8, 2011

ummm. Interesting. That is what I am kind of hoping - that it will allow me to put a spanner in the feeback loops of thoughts, phyical sensations, more thoughts ect....

I think the doc wants me to take them regular because I do have an anxiety disorder and I think coming off and on them can in some people create more anxiety. Trouble is - I'm anxious about taking them! I keep getting the box out looking at it and putting it away again! Lots of anxious thoughts about what they might do to me! The doc has given me 40mg once a day. We 'll see..Thanks Kate

Simone

To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Tuesday, 8 November 2011, 9:58Subject: Re: Advice

I hesitate to give you "medical advice" so check with your doctor Simone, but I do take beta-blockers "as and when", because I use them for singing performances and no other time. They totally stop any adrenalin rush and physical sensations that occur such as shaky voice etc. I take one 10 mg pill, and that does the trick for a couple of hours. Many musicians use them. I've actually found the experience of using them to be very interesting. Before a performance I usually have the odd nervous thought ie "I'll be on in 15 minutes" and that would automatically result in adrenalin kicking in ie heart racing etc - which in turn tends to work as a feedback loop making me even more nervous. When I take the beta blockers, I still get the thoughts, but because the physical sensations don't occur, the thoughts don't get reinforced - very interesting to observe how the emotions and thoughts are so connected to the physical manifestations and how they

reinforce one another.CheersKate>> Thanks for that . Italy won't be until next spring so I have plenty of time to visit the airport - maybe take a shorter flight first. Take it a step at a time. But for me, even booking the trip is a big step forward. And I have told my daughter and she is all excited - so there is no backing out this time!> It's useful to know your experience of beta blockers - I am still a bit hesitant- but I think I may give it a go. I wish I could just pop one, as and when, but they don't seem to work like that. Thanks again.> Ã‚ > Simone> > > ________________________________> From: Robson

> To: "ACT_for_the_Public " <ACT_for_the_Public >> Sent: Monday, 7 November 2011, 16:47> Subject: Re: Advice> > > Ã‚ > Fantastic news about Italy!!!!Ã‚ Well done, Simone!!!Ã‚ I offer you a personal view about taking beta-blockers to help with situational anxiety.> > > I take beta-blockers, and they help me enormously.Ã‚ Just today, I gave a presentation. Eeek!Ã‚ The physical sensation of my pounding heart and shortness of breath makes public speaking physically (as well as emotionally) very difficult:

my beta blockers just take the edge of it so I can get my words out a little more clearly.Ã‚ Personally, my Propranolol have never given me side effects.Ã‚ > > Whenever stuck with a decision about something that might not seem ACT consistent, the ultimate test is if it helps you live a valued life overall?Ã‚ For example, I also listen to an MP3 of rainfall at night as it helps drown out negative thoughts and gets me to sleep.Ã‚ This may appear to be "avoidance", but it helps me to get to sleep and live well the next day, so why not?> > Somewhere between being a coward and a martyr are an awful lot of workable compromises that we can miss in pursuit of the "right" approach.Ã‚ > > > Take care, buona... er..... flight. (???)> > > x> > > ________________________________> > To:

ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Monday, 7 November 2011, 16:02> Subject: Advice> > > Hi All,> > Need a bit of advice. ( Constructive please!) I am slowly pushing myself out of my comfort zone. And I have some 'bigger' leaps planned. - I have booked that trip to Italy!> The thing is - I am wondering if it would be a good idea to take some beta blockers. Not because I need them on a day to day basis - because I don't - but for big situational stretches where I have myÃ‚ daughter - andÃ‚ many other kids in toe too. I am practising willingness and expansion - and I can continue to do this whilst on beta blockers and then gradually come off of them when I have become more used to the bigger leaps. I don't want to go on

them but neither do I want to freak out in front of the class! ( I hear you say - go ahead and freak out) but I want to save my daughter from that embarrassment.> I know the best thing to do would be to just go ahead and feel my racing heart - allow myself to freeze and backtrack. But I just don't feel that that is an option when I have my daughter to look after. I want to be relaxed, fun and engaged - which is difficult when you have a heart that goes likes a steam train, legs that say, run like hell, and a brain like mush!> I am thinking that maybe taking beta blockers might be the more compasionate approach and give me a bit of 'support' whilst I continue to break through some very old habits.> I have never taken any medication for anxiety - just avoided a hellava lot- so if this medication can support me in moving out some more, whilst practcing ACT, I think it might be a good idea. Just wondering what others have

experienced.> > Thanks> Simone> > > > ------------------------------------> > For other ACT materials and list serves see www.contextualpsychology.org> > If you do not wish to belong to ACT_for_the_Public, you may > unsubscribe by sending an email to > ACT_for_the_Public-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links>

November 8, 2011

Somewhere between being a coward and a martyr are an awful lot of workable compromises that we can miss in pursuit of the "right" approach. So True...

November 8, 2011

Wow, just how many here use beta-blockers and/or do public speaking or sing or do poetry beats?! Looks like I'll need to add this to list of uncanny similar interests and abilities for such a group!To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Tuesday, November 8, 2011 1:58 AMSubject: Re: Advice

I hesitate to give you "medical advice" so check with your doctor Simone, but I do take beta-blockers "as and when", because I use them for singing performances and no other time. They totally stop any adrenalin rush and physical sensations that occur such as shaky voice etc. I take one 10 mg pill, and that does the trick for a couple of hours. Many musicians use them. I've actually found the experience of using them to be very interesting. Before a performance I usually have the odd nervous thought ie "I'll be on in 15 minutes" and that would automatically result in adrenalin kicking in ie heart racing etc - which in turn tends to work as a feedback loop making me even more nervous. When I take the beta blockers, I still get the thoughts, but because the physical sensations don't occur, the thoughts don't get reinforced - very interesting to observe how the emotions and thoughts are so connected to the

physical manifestations and how they reinforce one another.CheersKate>> Thanks for that . Italy won't be until next spring so I have plenty of time to visit the airport - maybe take a shorter flight first. Take it a step at a time. But for me, even booking the trip is a big step forward. And I have told my daughter and she is all excited - so there is no backing out this time!> It's useful to know your experience of beta blockers - I am still a bit hesitant- but I think I may give it a go. I wish I could just pop one, as and when, but they don't seem to work like that. Thanks again.> Â > Simone> > > ________________________________> From: Robson

> To: "ACT_for_the_Public " <ACT_for_the_Public >> Sent: Monday, 7 November 2011, 16:47> Subject: Re: Advice> > > Â > Fantastic news about Italy!!!!Â Well done, Simone!!!Â I offer you a personal view about taking beta-blockers to help with situational anxiety.> > > I take beta-blockers, and they help me enormously.Â Just today, I gave a presentation. Eeek!Â The physical sensation of my pounding heart and shortness of breath makes public speaking physically (as well as emotionally) very difficult: my beta blockers just take the edge of it so I can get my words

out a little more clearly.Â Personally, my Propranolol have never given me side effects.Â > > Whenever stuck with a decision about something that might not seem ACT consistent, the ultimate test is if it helps you live a valued life overall?Â For example, I also listen to an MP3 of rainfall at night as it helps drown out negative thoughts and gets me to sleep.Â This may appear to be "avoidance", but it helps me to get to sleep and live well the next day, so why not?> > Somewhere between being a coward and a martyr are an awful lot of workable compromises that we can miss in pursuit of the "right" approach.Â > > > Take care, buona... er..... flight. (???)> > > x> > > ________________________________> > To: ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Monday, 7 November 2011, 16:02> Subject: Advice> > > Hi All,> > Need a bit of advice. ( Constructive please!) I am slowly pushing myself out of my comfort zone. And I have some 'bigger' leaps planned. - I have booked that trip to Italy!> The thing is - I am wondering if it would be a good idea to take some beta blockers. Not because I need them on a day to day basis - because I don't - but for big situational stretches where I have myÂ daughter - andÂ many other kids in toe too. I am practising willingness and expansion - and I can continue to do this whilst on beta blockers and then gradually come off of them when I have become more used to the bigger leaps. I don't want to go on them but neither do I want to freak out in front of the class! ( I hear you say - go

ahead and freak out) but I want to save my daughter from that embarrassment.> I know the best thing to do would be to just go ahead and feel my racing heart - allow myself to freeze and backtrack. But I just don't feel that that is an option when I have my daughter to look after. I want to be relaxed, fun and engaged - which is difficult when you have a heart that goes likes a steam train, legs that say, run like hell, and a brain like mush!> I am thinking that maybe taking beta blockers might be the more compasionate approach and give me a bit of 'support' whilst I continue to break through some very old habits.> I have never taken any medication for anxiety - just avoided a hellava lot- so if this medication can support me in moving out some more, whilst practcing ACT, I think it might be a good idea. Just wondering what others have experienced.> > Thanks> Simone> > > >

------------------------------------> > For other ACT materials and list serves see www.contextualpsychology.org> > If you do not wish to belong to ACT_for_the_Public, you may > unsubscribe by sending an email to > ACT_for_the_Public-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links>------------------------------------For other ACT materials and list serves see www.contextualpsychology.orgIf you do not wish to belong to ACT_for_the_Public, you may unsubscribe by sending an email to ACT_for_the_Public-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:

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November 8, 2011

I guess to me the upside would be if the beta blockers could allow you to take some action you wouldn't take otherwise or get some distance from your feelings. Does your doctor think that could happen? If so, it seems like the beta blockers would be worth trying.My personal experience is that the positive effects of drugs don't last but your mileage may vary. I've had times where I thought a new drug was finally the answer but the effect has never lasted.Bruce ummm. Interesting. That is what I am kind of hoping - that it will allow me to put a spanner in the feeback loops of thoughts, phyical sensations, more thoughts ect.... I think the doc wants me to take them regular because I do have an anxiety disorder and I think coming off and on them can in some people create more anxiety. Trouble is - I'm anxious about taking them! I keep getting the box out looking at it and putting it away again! Lots of anxious thoughts about what they might do to me! The doc has given me 40mg once a day. We 'll see..Thanks Kate Simone To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Tuesday, 8 November 2011, 9:58Subject: Re: Advice I hesitate to give you "medical advice" so check with your doctor Simone, but I do take beta-blockers "as and when", because I use them for singing performances and no other time. They totally stop any adrenalin rush and physical sensations that occur such as shaky voice etc. I take one 10 mg pill, and that does the trick for a couple of hours. Many musicians use them. I've actually found the experience of using them to be very interesting. Before a performance I usually have the odd nervous thought ie "I'll be on in 15 minutes" and that would automatically result in adrenalin kicking in ie heart racing etc - which in turn tends to work as a feedback loop making me even more nervous. When I take the beta blockers, I still get the thoughts, but because the physical sensations don't occur, the thoughts don't get reinforced - very interesting to observe how the emotions and thoughts are so connected to the physical manifestations and how they reinforce one another.CheersKate>> Thanks for that . Italy won't be until next spring so I have plenty of time to visit the airport - maybe take a shorter flight first. Take it a step at a time. But for me, even booking the trip is a big step forward. And I have told my daughter and she is all excited - so there is no backing out this time!> It's useful to know your experience of beta blockers - I am still a bit hesitant- but I think I may give it a go. I wish I could just pop one, as and when, but they don't seem to work like that. Thanks again.> Â > Simone> > > ________________________________> > To: "ACT_for_the_Public " <ACT_for_the_Public >> Sent: Monday, 7 November 2011, 16:47> Subject: Re: Advice> > > Â > Fantastic news about Italy!!!!Â Well done, Simone!!!Â I offer you a personal view about taking beta-blockers to help with situational anxiety.> > > I take beta-blockers, and they help me enormously.Â Just today, I gave a presentation. Eeek!Â The physical sensation of my pounding heart and shortness of breath makes public speaking physically (as well as emotionally) very difficult: my beta blockers just take the edge of it so I can get my words out a little more clearly.Â Personally, my Propranolol have never given me side effects.Â > > Whenever stuck with a decision about something that might not seem ACT consistent, the ultimate test is if it helps you live a valued life overall?Â For example, I also listen to an MP3 of rainfall at night as it helps drown out negative thoughts and gets me to sleep.Â This may appear to be "avoidance", but it helps me to get to sleep and live well the next day, so why not?> > Somewhere between being a coward and a martyr are an awful lot of workable compromises that we can miss in pursuit of the "right" approach.Â > > > Take care, buona... er..... flight. (???)> > > x> > > ________________________________> > To: ACT_for_the_Public > Sent: Monday, 7 November 2011, 16:02> Subject: Advice> > > Hi All,> > Need a bit of advice. ( Constructive please!) I am slowly pushing myself out of my comfort zone. And I have some 'bigger' leaps planned. - I have booked that trip to Italy!> The thing is - I am wondering if it would be a good idea to take some beta blockers. Not because I need them on a day to day basis - because I don't - but for big situational stretches where I have myÂ daughter - andÂ many other kids in toe too. I am practising willingness and expansion - and I can continue to do this whilst on beta blockers and then gradually come off of them when I have become more used to the bigger leaps. I don't want to go on them but neither do I want to freak out in front of the class! ( I hear you say - go ahead and freak out) but I want to save my daughter from that embarrassment.> I know the best thing to do would be to just go ahead and feel my racing heart - allow myself to freeze and backtrack. But I just don't feel that that is an option when I have my daughter to look after. I want to be relaxed, fun and engaged - which is difficult when you have a heart that goes likes a steam train, legs that say, run like hell, and a brain like mush!> I am thinking that maybe taking beta blockers might be the more compasionate approach and give me a bit of 'support' whilst I continue to break through some very old habits.> I have never taken any medication for anxiety - just avoided a hellava lot- so if this medication can support me in moving out some more, whilst practcing ACT, I think it might be a good idea. Just wondering what others have experienced.> > Thanks> Simone> > > > ------------------------------------> > For other ACT materials and list serves see www.contextualpsychology.org> > If you do not wish to belong to ACT_for_the_Public, you may > unsubscribe by sending an email to > ACT_for_the_Public-unsubscribe@...! Groups Links>

November 9, 2011

Well, thats what I am hoping Bruce ....but I'm still hesitating. Seems like I'm stuck betwen a rock and a hard place.

Simone

To: ACT_for_the_Public Sent: Wednesday, 9 November 2011, 5:12Subject: Re: Re: Advice

I guess to me the upside would be if the beta blockers could allow you to take some action you wouldn't take otherwise or get some distance from your feelings. Does your doctor think that could happen? If so, it seems like the beta blockers would be worth trying.

My personal experience is that the positive effects of drugs don't last but your mileage may vary. I've had times where I thought a new drug was finally the answer but the effect has never lasted.

Bruce