Re: Going off depression medications risks relapse

[Guest guest]

> There is no evidence to date of any persistent side effect

of

> antidepressants - physical or cognitive - caused by long-term use.

>

The cheeky gits. I like how they just sweep aside a whole body of

research evidence, and comments from patients. I got the same set of

awful side effects from every drug I took. The doctors often didn't

ask; and when I told them, they didn't listen.

> Finally, it's worth noting that a major depressive illness

is

> associated with more than depressed mood - it is a biological

illness, just

> as diabetes and hypertension are biological illnesses. As such,

people

> cannot simply pull themselves up by their own bootstraps and move

forward.

> They need to seek medical attention and receive appropriate

treatment for

> relieving the symptoms associated with their condition.

This is the big lie I was told by many well-meaning authorities, in

person, in books, on websites, etc. It makes me really sad that this

sort of thinking is what is keeping people enslaved to these drugs

for years. When I came off my own medications and felt awful, I had

to have faith that it was the drugs causing it -- the doctors would

have me believe that it meant that the drug was keeping me " well "

and that going off it made the depression get worse.

How did we end up in this situation where the people who are

supposed to be helping us to get better are actually giving us

poison and telling us to take it for some mysterious non-existent

deficiency in the brain. And we have to arrogance to think that our

health care is better than ever before?

.

[Guest guest]

, I'm rather jaded and wouldn't usually be inclined to

reply to something like this because people don't tend to listen --

and why should they listen to ME? But you came here and asked, so I

thought I'd have a go; who knows, maybe it will help in some way.

.

***

Dear Journal Gazette,

I was disturbed to read the advice given by the Mayo Clinic to the

person who wrote in asking about discontinuing Doxepin. ( " Going Off

Depression Medications Risks Relapse, Sun., July 9 2006) By printing

this, you are perpetuating the great myth that those of us with

clinical depression are told by society and much of the medical

community.

When I was diagnosed with depression two years ago, this is exactly

the sort of information I read about, and was told. Websites such as

yours would offer the comofrting words to those suffering mental

anguish: There is help to be had. See your doctor.

Seeing your doctor for this kind of condition almost inevitably

means being given a prescription for an antidepressant. These drugs

are prescribed in such a cavalier way today that even people without

serious depression are given them, for such complaints as muscle

pain.

When one doesn't work, or it produces intolerable side effects, we

are told to jump on the revolving platform of antidepressant trial-

and-error until we find the " right " drug.

I can tell you that every drug I tried -- and I tried several --

gave me the same set of dehumanizing side effects, and none of them

really helped with my depression. I was robbed of emotions and left

feeling numb. I had insomnia, stomach pains, and sexual dysfunction.

Yet I am told to just keep trying different drugs, like pick & mix

candy, until I find one that somehow makes me feel better as well as

not causing these side effects. My answer: rubbish. I refuse to

continue to abuse my body in this way.

Coming off the drugs, I experienced the same dilemma as your

questioner: Am I feeling so bad because of withdrawal from the drug,

or because my underlying depression is rising up to throttle me

again? Anyone who asked their doctor this question would likely be

told the latter, and that therefore they need to stay on these drugs

long-term. Again, my answer: rubbish. The very definition of drug

withdrawal was changed during the dawn of the Prozac era so that the

effects of coming off these drugs could be catrgorized under the

nebulous term " discontinuation syndrome, " rather than being labelled

as what they really are: withdrawal, pure and simple.

I discontinued my own medication abruptly three months ago and am

still paying for it. But my health is also improving. I found my way

to an internet support list for people who want to discontinue these

drugs, and learned that the underlying problem is often a host of

nutritional deficiencies (exacerbated by the drugs), as well as

possibly a need for a helpful kind of therapy like CBT (cognitive

behavioral therapy). By changing to a healthy diet and taking

nutritional supplements, I am gradually not only overcoming the

effects of discontinuing my drug, but am also overcoming the

depression itself. I would probably be feeling even better now if I

had done the gradual taper off my drug that my list recommends,

which is the unconventionally slow -- but highly successful -- rate

of 5-10% reductions.

My case is not unique. There are many, many other people on these

drugs who don't want to be. It is unhelpful to them to read articles

such as the one you have published, telling them that they should

not be getting long-term side effects from their drugs, that it's OK

and safe to be on them for life, and that they have some kind of

debilitating deficiency in their brains that necessitates this.

These things are simply not true. If there is any actual deficiency

in the brain, it is a nutritional deficiency. The power of nutrition

to heal has been grossly underestimated by mainstream medicine, but

the evidence is out there is anyone cares to look. Personally I

would start with the work of Linus ing, Abram Hoffer, or the

Shute brothers.

I would urge you to re-open this topic and try to find someone with

a less pro-antidepressant stance who can give some genuinely helpful

advice. Your questioner is being condemned to a lifetime of mental

illness and drug dependency if they believe what they've been told,

and this is simply tragic.

Sincerely,

Tweed.

[Guest guest]

, you're a force of nature!

This is a marvelous letter. You write with power and lucidity. Don't stop writing these kinds of things--if this paper doesn't listen, another will. You have a great gift for advocacy, and I'm glad you're with us!

Hugs,

Kim

, I'm rather jaded and wouldn't usually be inclined to reply to something like this because people don't tend to listen -- and why should they listen to ME? But you came here and asked, so I thought I'd have a go; who knows, maybe it will help in some way.

.***Dear Journal Gazette,I was disturbed to read the advice given by the Mayo Clinic to the person who wrote in asking about discontinuing Doxepin. ( " Going Off Depression Medications Risks Relapse, Sun., July 9 2006) By printing this, you are perpetuating the great myth that those of us with clinical depression are told by society and much of the medical community.When I was diagnosed with depression two years ago, this is exactly the sort of information I read about, and was told. Websites such as yours would offer the comofrting words to those suffering mental anguish: There is help to be had. See your doctor.Seeing your doctor for this kind of condition almost inevitably means being given a prescription for an antidepressant. These drugs are prescribed in such a cavalier way today that even people without serious depression are given them, for such complaints as muscle pain.

When one doesn't work, or it produces intolerable side effects, we are told to jump on the revolving platform of antidepressant trial-and-error until we find the " right " drug. I can tell you that every drug I tried -- and I tried several -- gave me the same set of dehumanizing side effects, and none of them really helped with my depression. I was robbed of emotions and left feeling numb. I had insomnia, stomach pains, and sexual dysfunction.

Yet I am told to just keep trying different drugs, like pick & mix candy, until I find one that somehow makes me feel better as well as not causing these side effects. My answer: rubbish. I refuse to continue to abuse my body in this way.

Coming off the drugs, I experienced the same dilemma as your questioner: Am I feeling so bad because of withdrawal from the drug, or because my underlying depression is rising up to throttle me again? Anyone who asked their doctor this question would likely be told the latter, and that therefore they need to stay on these drugs long-term. Again, my answer: rubbish. The very definition of drug withdrawal was changed during the dawn of the Prozac era so that the effects of coming off these drugs could be catrgorized under the nebulous term " discontinuation syndrome, " rather than being labelled as what they really are: withdrawal, pure and simple. I discontinued my own medication abruptly three months ago and am still paying for it. But my health is also improving. I found my way to an internet support list for people who want to discontinue these drugs, and learned that the underlying problem is often a host of nutritional deficiencies (exacerbated by the drugs), as well as possibly a need for a helpful kind of therapy like CBT (cognitive behavioral therapy). By changing to a healthy diet and taking nutritional supplements, I am gradually not only overcoming the effects of discontinuing my drug, but am also overcoming the depression itself. I would probably be feeling even better now if I had done the gradual taper off my drug that my list recommends, which is the unconventionally slow -- but highly successful -- rate of 5-10% reductions.My case is not unique. There are many, many other people on these drugs who don't want to be. It is unhelpful to them to read articles such as the one you have published, telling them that they should not be getting long-term side effects from their drugs, that it's OK and safe to be on them for life, and that they have some kind of debilitating deficiency in their brains that necessitates this. These things are simply not true. If there is any actual deficiency in the brain, it is a nutritional deficiency. The power of nutrition to heal has been grossly underestimated by mainstream medicine, but the evidence is out there is anyone cares to look. Personally I would start with the work of Linus ing, Abram Hoffer, or the Shute brothers.I would urge you to re-open this topic and try to find someone with a less pro-antidepressant stance who can give some genuinely helpful advice. Your questioner is being condemned to a lifetime of mental illness and drug dependency if they believe what they've been told, and this is simply tragic.

Sincerely, Tweed.

Messages in this topic (3)

Reply (via web post) |

Start a new topic

[Guest guest]

Dear ,

Thank you -- that is a powerful letter!

I want to explain a little so people understand more of why I'm

recommending people do this.

The goal is not to have any particular person do as any of you might

suggest, it is to plant seeds. This issue needs to be heard repeatedly and

documented everywhere because the drug industry and conventional medicine

has not documented it and will continue to resist documenting it. Too much

money is at stake here.

It is about making enough noise so that more people hear the real

issues. This si the only way change will occur. History shows us this.

That's why I'd like to see everyone write at least a paragraph.

Think of it this way -- if this had been done by others who went before

you, many of you wouldn't have ended up in the situation you are now in.

IMO, if a person won't take the 5 min. to write something about this, their

own complaints lose a lot of credibility.

Some people find it helpful to write up one generic statement and use

it whenever something like this is called for. I have a few I use. I don't

let an article go by that I don't send one of these " letters of concern " .

Even if I have to hunt to see how to email the reporter or author, I will do

that. It is also important to have one of these letters to send to

reporters and writers who speak out and write the truth. Your voice is

needed there, too. It encourages the author and bolsters the argument being

put forth.

Teen Screen protesters have had an enormous impact on how schools utilize

Teen Screen and have even managed to keep it out of some school districts.

How? By making a lot of noise -- constant noise. In fact, they have done

what antidepressant objectors could have done long ago had they acted by

writing every time they saw an article that was promoting the propaganda of

the drug industry.

Regards,

Re: Re: Going off depression medications

risks relapse

, you're a force of nature!

This is a marvelous letter. You write with power and lucidity. Don't stop

writing these kinds of things--if this paper doesn't listen, another will.

You have a great gift for advocacy, and I'm glad you're with us!

Hugs,

Kim

, I'm rather jaded and wouldn't usually be inclined to

reply to something like this because people don't tend to listen --

and why should they listen to ME? But you came here and asked, so I

thought I'd have a go; who knows, maybe it will help in some way.

.

***

Dear Journal Gazette,

I was disturbed to read the advice given by the Mayo Clinic to the

person who wrote in asking about discontinuing Doxepin. ( " Going Off

Depression Medications Risks Relapse, Sun., July 9 2006) By printing

this, you are perpetuating the great myth that those of us with

clinical depression are told by society and much of the medical

community.

When I was diagnosed with depression two years ago, this is exactly

the sort of information I read about, and was told. Websites such as

yours would offer the comofrting words to those suffering mental

anguish: There is help to be had. See your doctor.

Seeing your doctor for this kind of condition almost inevitably

means being given a prescription for an antidepressant. These drugs

are prescribed in such a cavalier way today that even people without

serious depression are given them, for such complaints as muscle

pain.

When one doesn't work, or it produces intolerable side effects, we

are told to jump on the revolving platform of antidepressant trial-

and-error until we find the " right " drug.

I can tell you that every drug I tried -- and I tried several --

gave me the same set of dehumanizing side effects, and none of them

really helped with my depression. I was robbed of emotions and left

feeling numb. I had insomnia, stomach pains, and sexual dysfunction.

Yet I am told to just keep trying different drugs, like pick & mix

candy, until I find one that somehow makes me feel better as well as

not causing these side effects. My answer: rubbish. I refuse to

continue to abuse my body in this way.

Coming off the drugs, I experienced the same dilemma as your

questioner: Am I feeling so bad because of withdrawal from the drug,

or because my underlying depression is rising up to throttle me

again? Anyone who asked their doctor this question would likely be

told the latter, and that therefore they need to stay on these drugs

long-term. Again, my answer: rubbish. The very definition of drug

withdrawal was changed during the dawn of the Prozac era so that the

effects of coming off these drugs could be catrgorized under the

nebulous term " discontinuation syndrome, " rather than being labelled

as what they really are: withdrawal, pure and simple.

I discontinued my own medication abruptly three months ago and am

still paying for it. But my health is also improving. I found my way

to an internet support list for people who want to discontinue these

drugs, and learned that the underlying problem is often a host of

nutritional deficiencies (exacerbated by the drugs), as well as

possibly a need for a helpful kind of therapy like CBT (cognitive

behavioral therapy). By changing to a healthy diet and taking

nutritional supplements, I am gradually not only overcoming the

effects of discontinuing my drug, but am also overcoming the

depression itself. I would probably be feeling even better now if I

had done the gradual taper off my drug that my list recommends,

which is the unconventionally slow -- but highly successful -- rate

of 5-10% reductions.

My case is not unique. There are many, many other people on these

drugs who don't want to be. It is unhelpful to them to read articles

such as the one you have published, telling them that they should

not be getting long-term side effects from their drugs, that it's OK

and safe to be on them for life, and that they have some kind of

debilitating deficiency in their brains that necessitates this.

These things are simply not true. If there is any actual deficiency

in the brain, it is a nutritional deficiency. The power of nutrition

to heal has been grossly underestimated by mainstream medicine, but

the evidence is out there is anyone cares to look. Personally I

would start with the work of Linus ing, Abram Hoffer, or the

Shute brothers.

I would urge you to re-open this topic and try to find someone with

a less pro-antidepressant stance who can give some genuinely helpful

advice. Your questioner is being condemned to a lifetime of mental

illness and drug dependency if they believe what they've been told,

and this is simply tragic.

Sincerely,

Tweed.

[Guest guest]

Bravo !!! Excellent reply to the Mayo Clinic! I live in Minnesota and KNOW the problems concerning these drugs first hand. They need to know the other side of the story and the truth. Thanks for your courage! Blessings,

Sandi

Re: Going off depression medications risks relapse

, I'm rather jaded and wouldn't usually be inclined to reply to something like this because people don't tend to listen -- and why should they listen to ME? But you came here and asked, so I thought I'd have a go; who knows, maybe it will help in some way..***Dear Journal Gazette,I was disturbed to read the advice given by the Mayo Clinic to the person who wrote in asking about discontinuing Doxepin. ("Going Off Depression Medications Risks Relapse, Sun., July 9 2006) By printing this, you are perpetuating the great myth that those of us with clinical depression are told by society and much of the medical community.When I was diagnosed with depression two years ago, this is exactly the sort of information I read about, and was told. Websites such as yours would offer the comofrting words to those suffering mental anguish: There is help to be had. See your doctor.Seeing your doctor for this kind of condition almost inevitably means being given a prescription for an antidepressant. These drugs are prescribed in such a cavalier way today that even people without serious depression are given them, for such complaints as muscle pain.When one doesn't work, or it produces intolerable side effects, we are told to jump on the revolving platform of antidepressant trial-and-error until we find the "right" drug. I can tell you that every drug I tried -- and I tried several -- gave me the same set of dehumanizing side effects, and none of them really helped with my depression. I was robbed of emotions and left feeling numb. I had insomnia, stomach pains, and sexual dysfunction. Yet I am told to just keep trying different drugs, like pick & mix candy, until I find one that somehow makes me feel better as well as not causing these side effects. My answer: rubbish. I refuse to continue to abuse my body in this way.Coming off the drugs, I experienced the same dilemma as your questioner: Am I feeling so bad because of withdrawal from the drug, or because my underlying depression is rising up to throttle me again? Anyone who asked their doctor this question would likely be told the latter, and that therefore they need to stay on these drugs long-term. Again, my answer: rubbish. The very definition of drug withdrawal was changed during the dawn of the Prozac era so that the effects of coming off these drugs could be catrgorized under the nebulous term "discontinuation syndrome," rather than being labelled as what they really are: withdrawal, pure and simple. I discontinued my own medication abruptly three months ago and am still paying for it. But my health is also improving. I found my way to an internet support list for people who want to discontinue these drugs, and learned that the underlying problem is often a host of nutritional deficiencies (exacerbated by the drugs), as well as possibly a need for a helpful kind of therapy like CBT (cognitive behavioral therapy). By changing to a healthy diet and taking nutritional supplements, I am gradually not only overcoming the effects of discontinuing my drug, but am also overcoming the depression itself. I would probably be feeling even better now if I had done the gradual taper off my drug that my list recommends, which is the unconventionally slow -- but highly successful -- rate of 5-10% reductions.My case is not unique. There are many, many other people on these drugs who don't want to be. It is unhelpful to them to read articles such as the one you have published, telling them that they should not be getting long-term side effects from their drugs, that it's OK and safe to be on them for life, and that they have some kind of debilitating deficiency in their brains that necessitates this. These things are simply not true. If there is any actual deficiency in the brain, it is a nutritional deficiency. The power of nutrition to heal has been grossly underestimated by mainstream medicine, but the evidence is out there is anyone cares to look. Personally I would start with the work of Linus ing, Abram Hoffer, or the Shute brothers.I would urge you to re-open this topic and try to find someone with a less pro-antidepressant stance who can give some genuinely helpful advice. Your questioner is being condemned to a lifetime of mental illness and drug dependency if they believe what they've been told, and this is simply tragic.Sincerely, Tweed.

________________________________________

PeoplePC Online

A better way to Internet

http://www.peoplepc.com

[Guest guest]

>

> , you're a force of nature!

>

> This is a marvelous letter. You write with power and lucidity.

Don't stop

> writing these kinds of things--if this paper doesn't listen,

another will.

> You have a great gift for advocacy, and I'm glad you're with us!

Thanks very much Kim. I'm surprised at how well my brain is

functioning. It's almost like I'm two different people at the

moment. Today has been just awful, I've been tearful most of the

time, constant heart palpitations, no energy or motivation, just

want to sit and sleep. And yet my mental functioning is good. Maybe

I'm using it to channel some of the frustration. I'm getting myself

tied in knots trying to figure out what's keeping me feeling so bad,

assuming my cortisol has quieted down (the digestive problems have

stopped). I know what you guys would tell me but it's hard sometimes

to try to be patient and let it pass.

In the meantime I'm happy to do all sorts of big pharma bashing, if

I have the time Feels good.

.

[Guest guest]

...........WOW, I am still playing around with my response, deleteing ,

rewriting, deleting!!

I actually want to copy what you sent and send it to the Daily Mail (they

seem to be the National Newspaper so often on our side), I feel confident

someone who needs it will hear what you wrote, it speaks volumes.

Love ya

>

>Reply-To: Withdrawal_and_Recovery

>To: Withdrawal_and_Recovery

>Subject: Re: Re: Going off depression medications

>risks relapse

>Date: Mon, 10 Jul 2006 08:34:45 -0400

>

>, you're a force of nature!

>

>This is a marvelous letter. You write with power and lucidity. Don't stop

>writing these kinds of things--if this paper doesn't listen, another will.

>You have a great gift for advocacy, and I'm glad you're with us!

>

>Hugs,

>Kim

>

>

>

>

>

>>

>> , I'm rather jaded and wouldn't usually be inclined to

>>reply to something like this because people don't tend to listen --

>>and why should they listen to ME? But you came here and asked, so I

>>thought I'd have a go; who knows, maybe it will help in some way.

>>

>>.

>>

>>***

>>

>>Dear Journal Gazette,

>>

>>I was disturbed to read the advice given by the Mayo Clinic to the

>>person who wrote in asking about discontinuing Doxepin. ( " Going Off

>>Depression Medications Risks Relapse, Sun., July 9 2006) By printing

>>this, you are perpetuating the great myth that those of us with

>>clinical depression are told by society and much of the medical

>>community.

>>

>>When I was diagnosed with depression two years ago, this is exactly

>>the sort of information I read about, and was told. Websites such as

>>yours would offer the comofrting words to those suffering mental

>>anguish: There is help to be had. See your doctor.

>>

>>Seeing your doctor for this kind of condition almost inevitably

>>means being given a prescription for an antidepressant. These drugs

>>are prescribed in such a cavalier way today that even people without

>>serious depression are given them, for such complaints as muscle

>>pain.

>>

>>When one doesn't work, or it produces intolerable side effects, we

>>are told to jump on the revolving platform of antidepressant trial-

>>and-error until we find the " right " drug.

>>

>>I can tell you that every drug I tried -- and I tried several --

>>gave me the same set of dehumanizing side effects, and none of them

>>really helped with my depression. I was robbed of emotions and left

>>feeling numb. I had insomnia, stomach pains, and sexual dysfunction.

>>Yet I am told to just keep trying different drugs, like pick & mix

>>candy, until I find one that somehow makes me feel better as well as

>>not causing these side effects. My answer: rubbish. I refuse to

>>continue to abuse my body in this way.

>>

>>Coming off the drugs, I experienced the same dilemma as your

>>questioner: Am I feeling so bad because of withdrawal from the drug,

>>or because my underlying depression is rising up to throttle me

>>again? Anyone who asked their doctor this question would likely be

>>told the latter, and that therefore they need to stay on these drugs

>>long-term. Again, my answer: rubbish. The very definition of drug

>>withdrawal was changed during the dawn of the Prozac era so that the

>>effects of coming off these drugs could be catrgorized under the

>>nebulous term " discontinuation syndrome, " rather than being labelled

>>as what they really are: withdrawal, pure and simple.

>>

>>I discontinued my own medication abruptly three months ago and am

>>still paying for it. But my health is also improving. I found my way

>>to an internet support list for people who want to discontinue these

>>drugs, and learned that the underlying problem is often a host of

>>nutritional deficiencies (exacerbated by the drugs), as well as

>>possibly a need for a helpful kind of therapy like CBT (cognitive

>>behavioral therapy). By changing to a healthy diet and taking

>>nutritional supplements, I am gradually not only overcoming the

>>effects of discontinuing my drug, but am also overcoming the

>>depression itself. I would probably be feeling even better now if I

>>had done the gradual taper off my drug that my list recommends,

>>which is the unconventionally slow -- but highly successful -- rate

>>of 5-10% reductions.

>>

>>My case is not unique. There are many, many other people on these

>>drugs who don't want to be. It is unhelpful to them to read articles

>>such as the one you have published, telling them that they should

>>not be getting long-term side effects from their drugs, that it's OK

>>and safe to be on them for life, and that they have some kind of

>>debilitating deficiency in their brains that necessitates this.

>>These things are simply not true. If there is any actual deficiency

>>in the brain, it is a nutritional deficiency. The power of nutrition

>>to heal has been grossly underestimated by mainstream medicine, but

>>the evidence is out there is anyone cares to look. Personally I

>>would start with the work of Linus ing, Abram Hoffer, or the

>>Shute brothers.

>>

>>I would urge you to re-open this topic and try to find someone with

>>a less pro-antidepressant stance who can give some genuinely helpful

>>advice. Your questioner is being condemned to a lifetime of mental

>>illness and drug dependency if they believe what they've been told,

>>and this is simply tragic.

>>

>>Sincerely,

>> Tweed.

>>

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>>

>>

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[Guest guest]

" How did we end up in this situation where the people who are

supposed to be helping us to get better are actually giving us

poison and telling us to take it for some mysterious non-existent

deficiency in the brain "

Just thank God that we found and this group . Here we

will always be safe and we can help others learn the truth to.

Love

[Guest guest]

" I know what you guys would tell me but it's hard sometimes

to try to be patient and let it pass. "

That's why patience is a virtue, it has to be it's hard work being

patient! LOL

Just keep telling yourself " It's just withdrawal and it WILL pass " ,

everybody is different , I withdrew slowly and I still vomited

for 6months. Give your body time, it will heal hun.

You are doing just fine

Love SHelley

[Guest guest]

>

> " How did we end up in this situation where the people who are

> supposed to be helping us to get better are actually giving us

> poison and telling us to take it for some mysterious non-existent

> deficiency in the brain "

>

> Just thank God that we found and this group . Here we

> will always be safe and we can help others learn the truth to.

There's a lot to teach but it's hard to find anyone who will listen --

though the people who find their way here, and follow 's

advice, show that there are some.

Every time I've discussed colds or illness with people lately, I've

slipped in a comment about taking vitamin C. If they've given me a

chance to carry on, I've mentioned that they can get some from the

chemist or health food shop. Usually it goes no further than that

because they change the subject. I also mentioned vitamin E to my aunt

who is struggling with the effects of blood pressure tablets. Normal

response: no thanks, she'll carry on with the tablets.

I think it shows that even though you and I have come to see that we

should no longer trust our doctors, the opposite is still true for

most people. They will do whatever their doctors tell them because the

doctors know best. At least I had the sense always to weigh what they

told me and question it, which may have made me a pain in the behind,

but I knew that the doctor was not God, and that he or she could make

mistakes, especially when they only have 5 minutes to talk to you and

give a diagnosis.

Guess we just need to keep spreading the word in case we find people

who do want to listen. If anyone had found me and told me, I would not

have wound up in this situation.

.

[Guest guest]

" Guess we just need to keep spreading the word in case we find people

who do want to listen. "

As and Kim say " All we can do is plant the seeds " ,people

will hear when it is their time to hear it, we all have different

journeys.

Do not wind yourself up by thinking no-one is listening to what you

say, this is never true, many people will hear you even if at this

point they choose not to act on it.

You have a chance to give little what you didn't get, that's

one life you can change.

Love