Re: Is it really Gallstones or gook/ saponification reaction (so...

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/12/01 5:26:50 PM Pacific Daylight Time, parentsresources@... writes:

I just came across this web site by a doctor who advises against the flush. He says that the olive oil and citrus makes soap in the body and what actually comes out in a flush is soap chips. Now I am confused. I am just trying to get to the bottom of this.

I've read this, and here are my thoughts:

1) If the "stones" are just "soap chips" then why have my food allergies cleared up with the flush when *nothing* else has had any effect on them?

(And don't say "the placebo effect!)

2) I've known someone who has done 20+ flushes. The last three flushes he got nothing, which I think means his liver/GB are clear. If the "stones" were soap chips, then you would produce "stones" indefinitely, even if you did 100 flushes. This is clearly not the case. Many people have 18-20 flushes, and eventually no stones come out.

3) Medical doctors are always going to "debunk" methods that will deprive them of their $10,000+ fee for gallbladder surgery, or deprive them of their authority over patients. None of them want people treating themselves with low-cost or no-cost remedies.

Just my HO.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 5/12/01 9:28:22 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Da_@... writes:

I'm not going to bother with it this time because

of how many times we've been over this.

I am trying to get this type of info out of these boards but am having a lot of difficulty. Can you give me a keyword to search these archives please? I am coming up empty and am not about to trudge through pages and pages of stuff.

Isn't there a FAQ on this board? -- with real facts? Has anyone had their stones tested by a lab? If I do a flush and it works I am marching a jarfull of gallstones down to my doc *with pride*! ;o)

Am I the only one who is going to research this flush thoroughly before I just "Do a flush"???? Listen, I do not want to have my gallbladder out.

I don't get it. I keep hearing people talk about how well they take care of their bodies and the stuff they won't put in it but at the same time I am told to just "Do a flush-you'll get stones". NO! Geeze I feel like I am on the playground and I am being told "just do it" ;o)

Nixhiv@... writes:

Many people have 18-20 flushes, and eventually no stones come out.

I will seriously consider doing a flush if someone can show me:

1. Evidence that a flush is safe (i.e. no-one has had to have emergency surgery because one of these suckers got stuck -- and I do not mean just on these boards)

2. Evidence that it really works (I want to hear from someone who has an ultrasound before and after showing that the stones were removed this way -- evidence is not that after 20 flushes nothing came out anymore -- I want to hear what the laboratory said came out)

Think about it, if someone can really come up with evidence supporting this then the "slashers" and the "The gallbladder jerking-out system" have nothing to hide behind. And I will be the first to line up for my FLUSH! yum-yum... looking forward to it! I really do LOVE olive oil and lemon especially in my Tzadziki and Hummos.

I am vaguely remembering an article that came out about 10 years ago about the doctor? from Australia? who swallowed bacteria to prove the stomach ulcers were caused by bacteria not stomach acid. (I hope I am remembering right) He proved it by doing it and **documenting it** and that is when they took him seriously. Now it is mainstream.

Please, please, please show me some **evidence** that it is safe and it really works.

One more thought...if my child came to me and told me they were going to flush their system of gallstones and I asked her what type of research have you done? And she tells me "oh I searched the Net and some nice people on a bulletin board said it works, so I am going to do it".... (thud, that is my jaw dropping)

Can someone please point me to some other resources and links?

[Guest guest]

I just came across this web site by a doctor who advises against the

flush. He says that the olive oil and citrus makes soap in the body

and what actually comes out in a flush is soap chips. Now I am

confused. I am just trying to get to the bottom of this.

**********************************

Hi, Everyone,

I don't care what this so-called doctor says, those of us who do the cleanse

know that it definitely works. I think that he's got soap on his brain.

If he would go back and read the testimonials of various people who have done

this flush and see that many upon many have wanted their stuff tested, then

to just be laughed at by their doctors, it's just unreal.

One thing, I have a friend that's been doing this well over 10 years. He's

doing great. His mother died this last year in the fall of CHF or pneumonia

or something, but she was 97 when she died and had been doing the GB cleanse

for tons of years, even though she had a bad GB.

I think this doctor (heehee) needs to go back and do some serious research

this time or maybe go back to school again.

Susie

[Guest guest]

Yes, such words as soap and saponification will certainly bring up the past on the subject of stone actually being soap. There is some common sense reasoning, which has already been presented in just a few of the messages that have followed your request.

One is the simple fact that there is no consistency with the production and size of the stones produced. One my last few flushes had only produced very small green stones around 2 to 4 mm in size. Those compared to some of the ones I've gotten out in the past were next to nothing. (See Files online)

Now searching the archives you'll probably come across some of the "experiments" I've tried with a few of my stones. One has to do with the facts of saponification, i.e. soap making, I couldn't get the stones to show as any form of saponified material. It in no way made water wetter, it didn't lather, and it had to be washed off with real soap, in fact detergent. IF it were soap, in any form, I certainly wouldn't have had that problem.

These hypothesized reports of the probability facts, from so call other authority, has at no time presented any substantive information other than "I think" or "it's believed" regarding the stones forming from oil. If I were to be presented with substantive, factual information, from these "authorities" I would be ever so willing to change my perspective regarding the flushing process. However, my own doctor has stated to me, and my wife,after the last ultrasound showed no stones, "You can't argue with success !". This is the man who seven months before this was telling me my gallbladder had probably not been working well for the last ten years and that the thickened walls meant it was diseased. Well, many do and that's just something we're going to be having to live with on this list.

I'm sorry for being so tart regarding this subject, but it just gets my goat every time I hear and read this request on this list, and especially with pointers to these "authorities" who haven't said one supportive fact or solidly based thought to their hypothetical conclusion.

DaleDa_@...

----- Original Message -----

From: parentsresources@...

gallstones

Sent: Saturday, May 12, 2001 7:33 PM

Subject: Re: Is it really Gallstones or gook/ saponification reaction (so...

In a message dated 5/12/01 9:28:22 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Da_@... writes:

I'm not going to bother with it this time because of how many times we've been over this.I am trying to get this type of info out of these boards but am having a lot of difficulty. Can you give me a keyword to search these archives please? I am coming up empty and am not about to trudge through pages and pages of stuff. Isn't there a FAQ on this board? -- with real facts? Has anyone had their stones tested by a lab? If I do a flush and it works I am marching a jarfull of gallstones down to my doc *with pride*! ;o) Am I the only one who is going to research this flush thoroughly before I just "Do a flush"???? Listen, I do not want to have my gallbladder out. I don't get it. I keep hearing people talk about how well they take care of their bodies and the stuff they won't put in it but at the same time I am told to just "Do a flush-you'll get stones". NO! Geeze I feel like I am on the playground and I am being told "just do it" ;o) Nixhiv@... writes:

Many people have 18-20 flushes, and eventually no stones come out. I will seriously consider doing a flush if someone can show me: 1. Evidence that a flush is safe (i.e. no-one has had to have emergency surgery because one of these suckers got stuck -- and I do not mean just on these boards) 2. Evidence that it really works (I want to hear from someone who has an ultrasound before and after showing that the stones were removed this way -- evidence is not that after 20 flushes nothing came out anymore -- I want to hear what the laboratory said came out) Think about it, if someone can really come up with evidence supporting this then the "slashers" and the "The gallbladder jerking-out system" have nothing to hide behind. And I will be the first to line up for my FLUSH! yum-yum... looking forward to it! I really do LOVE olive oil and lemon especially in my Tzadziki and Hummos. I am vaguely remembering an article that came out about 10 years ago about the doctor? from Australia? who swallowed bacteria to prove the stomach ulcers were caused by bacteria not stomach acid. (I hope I am remembering right) He proved it by doing it and **documenting it** and that is when they took him seriously. Now it is mainstream. Please, please, please show me some **evidence** that it is safe and it really works. One more thought...if my child came to me and told me they were going to flush their system of gallstones and I asked her what type of research have you done? And she tells me "oh I searched the Net and some nice people on a bulletin board said it works, so I am going to do it".... (thud, that is my jaw dropping) Can someone please point me to some other resources and links? Collected testimonials:http:///messages/gallstones-testimonialsYou are receiving this email because you elected to subscribe to the Gallstones group on 's groups. Post message: gallstones Subscribe: gallstones-subscribe Unsubscribe: gallstones-unsubscribe URL to this page: gallstones By joining the list you agree to hold yourself FULLY responsible FOR yourself!List Archives: http:///messages/gallstonesWeb Site for more information: http://home.online.no/~dusan/gallstones/http://www.liverdoctor.com/ http://www.sensiblehealth.com/Have a nice day !

[Guest guest]

Doctors (M.D.s) can't handle testimonies. They have to have scientific proof

and scientific studies. One doctor I went to about something totally

different asked me when I was going to have my gallbladder out. I told him I

went to a specialist who didn't advise surgery. And this doctor said I was

predisposed to cancer of the gallbladder. So should we now cancer screen for

stones and have all gallbladders out that have them? Everyone has their own

opinion, including naturopathic. You can't listen 100% to anyone. Reason for

yourself.

----- Original Message -----

From: <Tishri7@...>

<gallstones >

Sent: Sunday, May 13, 2001 2:21 PM

Subject: Re: Is it really Gallstones or gook/ saponification

reaction (so...

> I just came across this web site by a doctor who advises against the

> flush. He says that the olive oil and citrus makes soap in the body

> and what actually comes out in a flush is soap chips. Now I am

> confused. I am just trying to get to the bottom of this.

> **********************************

> Hi, Everyone,

> I don't care what this so-called doctor says, those of us who do the

cleanse

> know that it definitely works. I think that he's got soap on his brain.

>

> If he would go back and read the testimonials of various people who have

done

> this flush and see that many upon many have wanted their stuff tested,

then

> to just be laughed at by their doctors, it's just unreal.

>

> One thing, I have a friend that's been doing this well over 10 years.

He's

> doing great. His mother died this last year in the fall of CHF or

pneumonia

> or something, but she was 97 when she died and had been doing the GB

cleanse

> for tons of years, even though she had a bad GB.

>

> I think this doctor (heehee) needs to go back and do some serious research

> this time or maybe go back to school again.

> Susie

>

> Collected testimonials:

> http:///messages/gallstones-testimonials

> You are receiving this email because you elected to subscribe to the

Gallstones group on 's groups.

> Post message: gallstones

> Subscribe: gallstones-subscribe

> Unsubscribe: gallstones-unsubscribe

> URL to this page: gallstones

> By joining the list you agree to hold yourself FULLY responsible FOR

yourself!

> List Archives: http:///messages/gallstones

> Web Site for more information: http://home.online.no/~dusan/gallstones/

> http://www.liverdoctor.com/

> http://www.sensiblehealth.com/

> Have a nice day !

>

>