Re: How does Nada con the enmeshed? Remember OZ

[Guest guest]

Hey, --

What an insightful post! I have often theorized that these things

were behaviorally modeled in the family, and thus, passed down from

generation to generation. I just see it over and over again in my

relatives.

It really is a " miracle " that any of us made it out -- but, you

know, that gives hope to the human condition: that anything is

possible with each human being born.

I'd love to see links to those studies you mentioned --

I'm currently trying to find out more about the family dynamic in my

nada's FOO. What I DO know is there was alcoholism, anger and fear

in that house. (Who knows what else?!) I witnessed a lot of

drinking, smoking and carousing into the morning hours when I was a

child. Then my brother and I would wake up hungry while the adults

slept it off. I remember being bored for hours and hours -- but

having to be quiet so I wouldn't wake anyone. How selfish is that

of the adults in charge not to be " available " to tend to the little

ones in the morning? They were all hungover and slept until noon.

That was just what I witnessed -- There's no telling what my nada

lived through.

Even after all that, my nada hovered and fretted over her alcoholic

mother for the last years of grandmother's life. Grandmother made

sure to squeeze all she could out of my mom for free, long after she

should have had full-time help, or gone into assisted living --

which she resolutely refused to discuss. She would just rather have

my mom come in and provide free care -- and my mom did it.

So, my point is: Even after growing up with self-absorbed,

alcoholic and possibly raging, fearful parents, my mother still bent

over backwards to wait on my grandmother hand and foot. Couldn't

draw the line at being her full-time nurse. My grandmother wanted

ALL options given to her, with no regard that she was a burden to

her children. And still, my mother fretted and slaved.

I just find that to be a curious dynamic -- and the best logical

explanation I've found for it is in Celani's book " Leaving

Home " . He points out that the dysfunctional homes are the ones that

produce kids who can't seem to " leave " home, yet the functional ones

are the ones that push the kids out of the nest prepared to live

their own lives, and come back willingly and have healthy

relationships with their parents after they move out. It's the

dysfunctional ones who are still shackled to the dysfunctional

family of origin. Very strange.

-Kyla

[Guest guest]

Clarification: When I described the adults drinking and carousing

and my brother and I waking up hungry, I meant during visits to my

BPD nada's parents' house -- my alcoholic grandparents.

Although, in our own home, my mother would sleep in while I was

expected to help get my brother ready for school many, many, many

times. Surely that kind of selfishness in my nada was instilled in

her when she was growing up. (Another clue in the puzzle of my

nada's FOO?)

I can't IMAGINE sleeping in while my kids get themselves ready --

99% of our mornings are great times that we are together getting

ready for the day. I like sending them out on a positive note, with

a good breakfast in them.

Anyway -- I think the alcoholism, anger and fear -- overall, just

general self-centeredness in the adults -- led to my mother's

emotional regulator breaking down.

-Kyla

[Guest guest]

Kyla and ,

I agree with both of you. My mother's mom was extremely depressed. She would

sleep all day and when my mom came home from school she said she would wake up

and have a place on the back of her head where her hair was smashed from her

sleeping all day. She also had my mother buy her cigarettes when my mom was a

young girl so her church friends wouldn't know she smoked (everyone knew she was

a chain smoker and died from lung cancer). My mom also said she would not allow

anyone to roll down the windows while they were in the car, although she smoked

the entire time, because it might mess up her hair. I can see then where my

mother gets her vanity obessions, from her mother. Although my mother can see

both the good and some of the bad in her own mother she never worked through

these issues. Her father was an alcoholic and still is very bitter, cruel, and

mean (he is a first cousin to ny Cash and when I saw the movie " Walk the

Line " I saw a picture of my distant FOO). Kyla that statement from the book

Leaving Home also touched me. When I met with my parents to have our talk last

Sat. I said, " I think it is good when your teenage children " rebel or separate "

because this is how God designed us to develop into mature adults. I will make

sure my children have the space and freedom to separate from me as toddlers and

teens knowing this is part of the process of becoming a fully functional healthy

adult.

Kelley

To: WTOAdultChildren1@...: kylaboo728@...: Tue, 25 Dec

2007 05:33:24 +0000Subject: Re: How does Nada con the

enmeshed? Remember OZ

Hey, --What an insightful post! I have often theorized that these things

were behaviorally modeled in the family, and thus, passed down from generation

to generation. I just see it over and over again in my relatives. It really is a

" miracle " that any of us made it out -- but, you know, that gives hope to the

human condition: that anything is possible with each human being born.I'd love

to see links to those studies you mentioned -- I'm currently trying to find out

more about the family dynamic in my nada's FOO. What I DO know is there was

alcoholism, anger and fear in that house. (Who knows what else?!) I witnessed a

lot of drinking, smoking and carousing into the morning hours when I was a

child. Then my brother and I would wake up hungry while the adults slept it off.

I remember being bored for hours and hours -- but having to be quiet so I

wouldn't wake anyone. How selfish is that of the adults in charge not to be

" available " to tend to the little ones in the morning? They were all hungover

and slept until noon. That was just what I witnessed -- There's no telling what

my nada lived through.Even after all that, my nada hovered and fretted over her

alcoholic mother for the last years of grandmother's life. Grandmother made sure

to squeeze all she could out of my mom for free, long after she should have had

full-time help, or gone into assisted living -- which she resolutely refused to

discuss. She would just rather have my mom come in and provide free care -- and

my mom did it. So, my point is: Even after growing up with self-absorbed,

alcoholic and possibly raging, fearful parents, my mother still bent over

backwards to wait on my grandmother hand and foot. Couldn't draw the line at

being her full-time nurse. My grandmother wanted ALL options given to her, with

no regard that she was a burden to her children. And still, my mother fretted

and slaved. I just find that to be a curious dynamic -- and the best logical

explanation I've found for it is in Celani's book " Leaving Home " . He

points out that the dysfunctional homes are the ones that produce kids who can't

seem to " leave " home, yet the functional ones are the ones that push the kids

out of the nest prepared to live their own lives, and come back willingly and

have healthy relationships with their parents after they move out. It's the

dysfunctional ones who are still shackled to the dysfunctional family of origin.

Very strange.-Kyla

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