Re: deny, deny, deny

[Guest guest]

I read every word, Love. Your father can't be excused and deserves every bit

of your rage. I will mail you my copy of Toxic Parents if you can't buy it

and promise to read it. Please don't post your address, send it to me

offline. The book talks a lot about incest. Unforgivable.

I say do it. Take the f-ing letter and burn it to ashes. Just don't set fire

to your own " house " in the process.

Love, girlscout

>

> I'd started to share this on another post and then decided to share

> it in it's own thread/ I can't understand how the bpd can deny the

> most heinous things. I more clearly understand the whinging,

> manipulative, childish, martyristic, poor me garbage they pull on a

> daily basis, but...

>

> I was looking for file folders today and came across the letter my

> brother wrote my dad when he went NC a few years ago. My brother had

> written about how my sister and I might possibly have been abused by

> an uncle who was a hard-core pedophile and served almost a decade in

> prison. (I read the letter when it was sent so it wasn't private).

> But today I saw my dad had gone over it point by point and

> responded to my brother's accusations, I only saw the first page

> and where my brother noted that my sister and I might have been

> abused by this man (I had been targeted by him from my earliest

> memory, I realize now) next to this my father had written " not true,

> there was never an opportunity. " I about dropped it, and what I

> really wanted was to take it outside and set it on fire. That was

> all I read before I continued my search for the file folders...this

> man was always around us, from my birth to six years old when we

> moved. My father brought him to our house and allowed him to live

> with us for a couple years when I was around the age of 8 or 9. He

> babysat us many many times. My father has completely repainted the

> past, at my and my sister's expense. When I brought up his brother

> about this a couple years ago, he said that his brother, the

> uncle, 'weirded him out' and that he 'got a chill whenever xxxxx

> walked into his house.' Yet this is someone he left alone with his

> children. Repeatedly. Which he now denies. It's unbelievable to me.

> I am getting more and more suspicious of my whole family and the

> lies that we are built on. It is so clear from his writing that he

> absolutely *does not care* to know what happened to his children at

> the hands of this man, he only cares that his parenting skills came

> into question. Once when we had a horrible argument right after he

> went NC, I broached the issue of him allowing us to be abused by our

> grandfather and also being unsupervised around the uncle and he

> turned the conversation around on me saying 'you two always wrestled

> all the time and I had to break you up' etc, almost seeming to imply

> that I was some kind of lolita (?) or something. I just need to vent

> this. I know my posts have been very long lately, alot of stuff is

> coming up, (maybe because of studying the math so intensely or

> something) so I appreciate anyone taking the time to read this. But

> the dereliction of duty as a parent is staggering to me. He didn't

> care then, and he doesn't want to know now. And I don't even know

> how to process something like this...I realize in the past I made

> myself into a person about whom no one should care if she was

> violated. I was doing their dance, and I can't do that anymore

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I think the most important thing to glean from your memories is to not continue

the abuse into the next generation.  Whenever my nada says or does something

that's just plain nuts I think " would I do this to my child? or treat my child

this way? "   The answer is always no, it's not right.  THAT is what I try to

remember so that it doesn't continue.

Are you talking to a therapist about the potential sexual abuse?  If the

evidence is there....

*hugs*

Amy

deny, deny, deny

I'd started to share this on another post and then decided to share

it in it's own thread/ I can't understand how the bpd can deny the

most heinous things. I more clearly understand the whinging,

manipulative, childish, martyristic, poor me garbage they pull on a

daily basis, but...

I was looking for file folders today and came across the letter my

brother wrote my dad when he went NC a few years ago. My brother had

written about how my sister and I might possibly have been abused by

an uncle who was a hard-core pedophile and served almost a decade in

prison. (I read the letter when it was sent so it wasn't private).

But today I saw my dad had gone over it point by point and

responded to my brother's accusations, I only saw the first page

and where my brother noted that my sister and I might have been

abused by this man (I had been targeted by him from my earliest

memory, I realize now) next to this my father had written " not true,

there was never an opportunity. " I about dropped it, and what I

really wanted was to take it outside and set it on fire. That was

all I read before I continued my search for the file folders...this

man was always around us, from my birth to six years old when we

moved. My father brought him to our house and allowed him to live

with us for a couple years when I was around the age of 8 or 9. He

babysat us many many times. My father has completely repainted the

past, at my and my sister's expense. When I brought up his brother

about this a couple years ago, he said that his brother, the

uncle, 'weirded him out' and that he 'got a chill whenever xxxxx

walked into his house.' Yet this is someone he left alone with his

children. Repeatedly. Which he now denies. It's unbelievable to me.

I am getting more and more suspicious of my whole family and the

lies that we are built on. It is so clear from his writing that he

absolutely *does not care* to know what happened to his children at

the hands of this man, he only cares that his parenting skills came

into question. Once when we had a horrible argument right after he

went NC, I broached the issue of him allowing us to be abused by our

grandfather and also being unsupervised around the uncle and he

turned the conversation around on me saying 'you two always wrestled

all the time and I had to break you up' etc, almost seeming to imply

that I was some kind of lolita (?) or something. I just need to vent

this. I know my posts have been very long lately, alot of stuff is

coming up, (maybe because of studying the math so intensely or

something) so I appreciate anyone taking the time to read this. But

the dereliction of duty as a parent is staggering to me. He didn't

care then, and he doesn't want to know now. And I don't even know

how to process something like this....I realize in the past I made

myself into a person about whom no one should care if she was

violated. I was doing their dance, and I can't do that anymore

[Guest guest]

thanks, I've been in therapy off and on about this (the sexual abuse)

since I was 18 which is 20 years, plus I've attended survivors groups.

This denial from him is so traumatic it's like a whole other wound.

He seems to either want to deny it or want to shift the blame onto me

somehow. It's completely freaking insane and wrong in every way. I

guess this deals with wanting a normal sane reaction from a parent and

not getting one.

[Guest guest]

very true. What is bringing this up is that my parents perceive my now

soon to be SIL as the cause of all the problems and the instigator of

the letter being written. And now they want to paint her as putting

him up to writing that letter, and the letter itself as full of lies.

In that letter my brother wrote is the only accurate telling of what

really happened in my childhood that has ever been told by someone

besides myself; it was incredibly validating at the time. My father

brought the letter up yesterday so it's ironic and probably 'cosmic'

that I stumbled onto his 'rebuttal' of it today. I loathe my SIL with

every particle of my being but I am not going to refute anything my

brother said in that letter, even though I feel like my dad is leaning

on me too. It is making me suspicious of he himself in ways I don't

even want to go into. I don't think my brother would retract anything

he wrote, either, but he won't force the issue right now because he is

depending on my parents to help him financially. I think my father and

I might be heading for an explosion, because one thing I won't do is

minimize or deny what happened to me as a little girl. And the fact

that he would, instead of giving a damn, is just beyond words.

[Guest guest]

I was doing their dance, and I can't do that anymore

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

This my dear is all that is important. The rest you cannot control but you have

every right to be enraged by. Your fada was an aider of a rapist which in my

view makes him responsible for the act. That he chooses to block that means that

he is FULLY aware of his role in your abuse. Dispicable and unforgivable. No

doubt he has some excuse which is absolutely irrelevant. It was his

responsibility to protect you and he failed miserably. He will go to his grave

running from that only to realize that it is now a part of his miserable soul. I

have no respect for this man. I am so sorry you were failed by the very people

who should have flayed this man alive for even thinking about abusing you. It is

unfair. It will always be unfair. Their denial is not your shame. This shame is

not yours to bear, it is theirs. It will remain theirs until they own up to what

was done to you and ask YOUR forgiveness. That is unlikely to happen, but there

it is.

Be strong

deny, deny, deny

I'd started to share this on another post and then decided to share

it in it's own thread/ I can't understand how the bpd can deny the

most heinous things. I more clearly understand the whinging,

manipulative, childish, martyristic, poor me garbage they pull on a

daily basis, but...

I was looking for file folders today and came across the letter my

brother wrote my dad when he went NC a few years ago. My brother had

written about how my sister and I might possibly have been abused by

an uncle who was a hard-core pedophile and served almost a decade in

prison. (I read the letter when it was sent so it wasn't private).

But today I saw my dad had gone over it point by point and

responded to my brother's accusations, I only saw the first page

and where my brother noted that my sister and I might have been

abused by this man (I had been targeted by him from my earliest

memory, I realize now) next to this my father had written " not true,

there was never an opportunity. " I about dropped it, and what I

really wanted was to take it outside and set it on fire. That was

all I read before I continued my search for the file folders...this

man was always around us, from my birth to six years old when we

moved. My father brought him to our house and allowed him to live

with us for a couple years when I was around the age of 8 or 9. He

babysat us many many times. My father has completely repainted the

past, at my and my sister's expense. When I brought up his brother

about this a couple years ago, he said that his brother, the

uncle, 'weirded him out' and that he 'got a chill whenever xxxxx

walked into his house.' Yet this is someone he left alone with his

children. Repeatedly. Which he now denies. It's unbelievable to me.

I am getting more and more suspicious of my whole family and the

lies that we are built on. It is so clear from his writing that he

absolutely *does not care* to know what happened to his children at

the hands of this man, he only cares that his parenting skills came

into question. Once when we had a horrible argument right after he

went NC, I broached the issue of him allowing us to be abused by our

grandfather and also being unsupervised around the uncle and he

turned the conversation around on me saying 'you two always wrestled

all the time and I had to break you up' etc, almost seeming to imply

that I was some kind of lolita (?) or something. I just need to vent

this. I know my posts have been very long lately, alot of stuff is

coming up, (maybe because of studying the math so intensely or

something) so I appreciate anyone taking the time to read this. But

the dereliction of duty as a parent is staggering to me. He didn't

care then, and he doesn't want to know now. And I don't even know

how to process something like this...I realize in the past I made

myself into a person about whom no one should care if she was

violated. I was doing their dance, and I can't do that anymore

[Guest guest]

thanks so much , reading this brought tears to my eyes, it is

exactly what I needed to hear. Thank you, thank you, thank you. It's

bad enough that he can't be supportive, which in itself is a crime but

for him to put pressure on me to refute my own experiences and then to

shift the blame on me for being (the implication) 'seductive' at the

age of 6 or 8 is heinous, like you said. Thanks for giving me the gift

of seeing what a sane reaction to this looks like. One of the feelings

I've identified about being in 'Oz' is the feeling of just drifting in

outer space, unanchored, groping and grasping. I realize it's because

there is never any mirroring or validation from the bpd/co-bpd

(together they are like a two-headed pod-person or something). And

when I get that here, the appropriate reaction to insanity and the

validation that is wrong, I can literally feel myself drifting down

and hitting solid ground again. (((Hugs)))

[Guest guest]

thanks GS I read it years ago but I need to have another go at it

again, I'm sure I can get a copy online, that is a great book, I

clearly remember feeling good about it. And I think Amy is right that

I might need to get back into the survivor groups etc again for this

especially since I am being put into an impossible position right now.

My father is elated that my SIL turned out to be a loon and he is

acting as if it exculpates (sp?) him from any blame or responsibility

for anything, when in truth he was an arsehole to her from the get go

because he is such a misogynist. I realize I am 'shutting down'

instead of getting help like was suggested.

[Guest guest]

i find that when i am studying math hard-core, my brain FEELS like it

is reorganizing itself, becoming more crystalline or something...

it's like the opposite of BP... logic pops out against background

noise much more prevalently. I would not be surprised IN THE LEAST if

it is affecting how you are seeing things now.

btw, your dad is a creep.

bink

>

> I'd started to share this on another post and then decided to share

> it in it's own thread/ I can't understand how the bpd can deny the

> most heinous things. I more clearly understand the whinging,

> manipulative, childish, martyristic, poor me garbage they pull on a

> daily basis, but...

>

> I was looking for file folders today and came across the letter my

> brother wrote my dad when he went NC a few years ago. My brother had

> written about how my sister and I might possibly have been abused by

> an uncle who was a hard-core pedophile and served almost a decade in

> prison. (I read the letter when it was sent so it wasn't private).

> But today I saw my dad had gone over it point by point and

> responded to my brother's accusations, I only saw the first page

> and where my brother noted that my sister and I might have been

> abused by this man (I had been targeted by him from my earliest

> memory, I realize now) next to this my father had written " not true,

> there was never an opportunity. " I about dropped it, and what I

> really wanted was to take it outside and set it on fire. That was

> all I read before I continued my search for the file folders...this

> man was always around us, from my birth to six years old when we

> moved. My father brought him to our house and allowed him to live

> with us for a couple years when I was around the age of 8 or 9. He

> babysat us many many times. My father has completely repainted the

> past, at my and my sister's expense. When I brought up his brother

> about this a couple years ago, he said that his brother, the

> uncle, 'weirded him out' and that he 'got a chill whenever xxxxx

> walked into his house.' Yet this is someone he left alone with his

> children. Repeatedly. Which he now denies. It's unbelievable to me.

> I am getting more and more suspicious of my whole family and the

> lies that we are built on. It is so clear from his writing that he

> absolutely *does not care* to know what happened to his children at

> the hands of this man, he only cares that his parenting skills came

> into question. Once when we had a horrible argument right after he

> went NC, I broached the issue of him allowing us to be abused by our

> grandfather and also being unsupervised around the uncle and he

> turned the conversation around on me saying 'you two always wrestled

> all the time and I had to break you up' etc, almost seeming to imply

> that I was some kind of lolita (?) or something. I just need to vent

> this. I know my posts have been very long lately, alot of stuff is

> coming up, (maybe because of studying the math so intensely or

> something) so I appreciate anyone taking the time to read this. But

> the dereliction of duty as a parent is staggering to me. He didn't

> care then, and he doesn't want to know now. And I don't even know

> how to process something like this...I realize in the past I made

> myself into a person about whom no one should care if she was

> violated. I was doing their dance, and I can't do that anymore

>

[Guest guest]

I wouldn't burn the letter & here's why: maintaining NC/LC can be

difficult at times. It might be helpful to hold on to something

tangible demonstrating the actions of your parents that lead to

NC/LC. You KNOW what happened & fada's writing " not true " out in the

margins doesn't change that; it only confirms what you know about

your parents - that they were/are willing to do anything (including

letting you be harmed & then calling you the liar) to preserve their

illusions/delusions. Proof is powerful.

> > I am getting more and more suspicious of my whole family and the

lies that we are built on.

That's your healthy sense of self-preservation kicking in. Listen to

it. Embrace it.

> >

> > I'd started to share this on another post and then decided to

share

> > it in it's own thread/ I can't understand how the bpd can deny the

> > most heinous things. I more clearly understand the whinging,

> > manipulative, childish, martyristic, poor me garbage they pull on

a

> > daily basis, but...

> >

> > I was looking for file folders today and came across the letter my

> > brother wrote my dad when he went NC a few years ago. My brother

had

> > written about how my sister and I might possibly have been abused

by

> > an uncle who was a hard-core pedophile and served almost a decade

in

> > prison. (I read the letter when it was sent so it wasn't private).

> > But today I saw my dad had gone over it point by point and

> > responded to my brother's accusations, I only saw the first page

> > and where my brother noted that my sister and I might have been

> > abused by this man (I had been targeted by him from my earliest

> > memory, I realize now) next to this my father had written " not

true,

> > there was never an opportunity. " I about dropped it, and what I

> > really wanted was to take it outside and set it on fire. That was

> > all I read before I continued my search for the file

folders...this

> > man was always around us, from my birth to six years old when we

> > moved. My father brought him to our house and allowed him to live

> > with us for a couple years when I was around the age of 8 or 9. He

> > babysat us many many times. My father has completely repainted the

> > past, at my and my sister's expense. When I brought up his brother

> > about this a couple years ago, he said that his brother, the

> > uncle, 'weirded him out' and that he 'got a chill whenever xxxxx

> > walked into his house.' Yet this is someone he left alone with his

> > children. Repeatedly. Which he now denies. It's unbelievable to

me.

> > I am getting more and more suspicious of my whole family and the

> > lies that we are built on. It is so clear from his writing that he

> > absolutely *does not care* to know what happened to his children

at

> > the hands of this man, he only cares that his parenting skills

came

> > into question. Once when we had a horrible argument right after he

> > went NC, I broached the issue of him allowing us to be abused by

our

> > grandfather and also being unsupervised around the uncle and he

> > turned the conversation around on me saying 'you two always

wrestled

> > all the time and I had to break you up' etc, almost seeming to

imply

> > that I was some kind of lolita (?) or something. I just need to

vent

> > this. I know my posts have been very long lately, alot of stuff is

> > coming up, (maybe because of studying the math so intensely or

> > something) so I appreciate anyone taking the time to read this.

But

> > the dereliction of duty as a parent is staggering to me. He didn't

> > care then, and he doesn't want to know now. And I don't even know

> > how to process something like this...I realize in the past I made

> > myself into a person about whom no one should care if she was

> > violated. I was doing their dance, and I can't do that anymore

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Your fada was an aider of a rapist which in my view makes him

responsible for the act. >

>

> Just throwing this out here, maybe I'm the only one who sees the

relevance but isn't Warren Jeffs in prison now as accessory to rape in

arranging the forced marriage of a 14 year old to her cousin? Is this

different from what your father did (other than you were a lot

younger!)? Just because HE denies it doesn't make it go away.

Me, I'd be saving the letter for evidence. At least for my own

validation.

K>

[Guest guest]

wow, abby, that is really something. I am so sorry to hear that. I

think that I would seek professional advice on that one, not on the

whether you were abused but on your feelings about what you have

learned and how to deal with it and prepare yourself should any

memories arise from it. Many hugs.

[Guest guest]

wow, abby, that is really something. I am so sorry to hear that. I

think that I would seek professional advice on that one, not on the

whether you were abused but on your feelings about what you have

learned and how to deal with it and prepare yourself should any

memories arise from it. Many hugs.