Re: Clots, more than just stroke

[Guest guest]

> Stroke risk.

> The risk of stroke comes from the blood not flowing very well in the atria, if

> it stays in one spot for a long enough time there's a risk the blood might

> form a clot.

Although a blood clot that causes a stroke is the most important

reason to thin your blood it is not the only reason.

There are studies that show that people with afib not taking a blood

thinner have less brain function after a period of time (years?)than a

control group that is taking a blood thinner. This is because tiny

(microscopic?) clots that form can permanently impair blood flow

through the brain.

I seem to recall that in these studies that aspirin was not as

effective as other blood thinners in this respect. I don't have a

reference but it was undoubtedly from some web site cited in this web

site. This reason alone is enought for me to take coumiden. I need all

of what limited brain power I have.

Jim Warneka

[Guest guest]

> There are studies that show that people with afib not taking a

blood

> thinner have less brain function after a period of time (years?)

than a

> control group that is taking a blood thinner. This is because tiny

> (microscopic?) clots that form can permanently impair blood flow

> through the brain.

Oh dear!!

Fran, with terrible brain fog, AF for 20 years and no blood thinners,

whose father died of an unknown dementia.

[Guest guest]

<<Although a blood clot that causes a stroke is the most important

reason to thin your blood it is not the only reason.

There are studies that show that people with afib not taking a blood

thinner have less brain function after a period of time (years?)than a

control group that is taking a blood thinner. This is because tiny

(microscopic?) clots that form can permanently impair blood flow

through the brain.

I seem to recall that in these studies that aspirin was not as

effective as other blood thinners in this respect. I don't have a

reference but it was undoubtedly from some web site cited in this web

site. This reason alone is enought for me to take coumiden. I need all

of what limited brain power I have.>>

I think they use the delightful phrase 'silent cerebral infarction'. Not a

pleasant thought! I think the research is pretty limited because they are

silent (a CT scan is required to spot them), if you spot it no doubt it is

promoted to mini stroke?? According to Waktare and Camm infacts may be

detected in 15% or more of AF patients without a history of cerebrovascular

event.

keep that blood flowing everyone

--

D -still on aspirin.

[Guest guest]

<<Oh dear!!

Fran, with terrible brain fog, AF for 20 years and no blood thinners,

whose father died of an unknown dementia.>>

This shouldn't be something to worry over. If you are at all concerned then

it's probably time to talk more about anticoagulation with the Docs. Thinking

about a problem that doesn't have any simple answers could equally result in

brain fog and we all do a lot of that.

talking about anticoag's with the professionals may lift some mist

--

D

[Guest guest]

<< I seem to recall that in these studies that aspirin was not as

effective as other blood thinners in this respect. >>

What I have learned with re: to Coumadin vis a vis aspirin is that Coumadin

is the only thing that will kill the excess Vita K that our bodies over

produce. The aspirin will only bust up platelets that tend to clump and form

clots. In my therapy, I take Coumadin, but I also take a baby aspirin after

any meal that is more than about 800 calories, with Dr. approval. My Dr

states that the blood tends to clot more quickly when we eat. Of course, have

YOUR doctor concur before trying this. I also get my INR checked often to

assure that the natural things I ingest, such as garlic, etc., are not

sending my INR into the stratosphere.

There are myriad things that will increase your INR and myriad things that

will decrease your INR. We can always have our coumadin doses adjusted. I

have had pretty good luck in being consistent, however, even though I do eat

and injest things that they say will both increase and decrease INR. For

example, I eat tons of salads and greens but I always eat garlic, ginger,

etc. with them. This is a very indvidualistic problem, so always rely on

your INR and DR's orders regardless of what we learn here. To be honest,

however, the info here is often revelatory to DRs, at least in my case, so I

am grateful to be part of such a great board of dedicated fellow Afibbers.

Thanks, all.

Comments appreciated...

[Guest guest]

> it's probably time to talk more about anticoagulation with the

Docs.

Yes this has been done. As I said in a previous post, my GP would

have had me on Warferin, but as my cardio said no as I was not at

stroke risk (??!!), he can't put me on them. So I have to wait for a

second opinion.

Declining cognitive functions and literal gaps in my memory (things I

have done, and places I have been)are some things I have noticed over

the last couple of years. So I have upped my asprin meantime and am

drinking loads and loads of water to keep the blood thin. I'm not

really worried. Whatever will be will be. But I do want to be aware

and do all I can to keep well. So all this information is very good.

Thanks

Fran

> <<Oh dear!!

>

> Fran, with terrible brain fog, AF for 20 years and no blood

thinners,

> whose father died of an unknown dementia.>>

>

> This shouldn't be something to worry over. If you are at all

concerned then

> it's probably time to talk more about anticoagulation with the

Docs. Thinking

> about a problem that doesn't have any simple answers could equally

result in

> brain fog and we all do a lot of that.

>

> talking about anticoag's with the professionals may lift some

mist

>

>

> --

> D

[Guest guest]

<< and am

drinking loads and loads of water to keep the blood thin. >>

------------------------------

Fran... is there evidence that hydration actually does help keep the blood

thin. I heard a very revelatory report recently in which it was disclosed

that doctors encourage people to drink large amounts of liquids on long

airplane trips (and other periods of being sedentary) to make a person get up

and use the bathroom, thus giving a chance to keep the blood flowing and thus

prevent clots. It was my understanding from this report that it was not the

water, per se, but the phyiscal movement. I would be most happy to learn

that water, itself, actually does thin the blood. Please advise. Comments

welcome!

Thank you!

[Guest guest]

<< It was my understanding from this report that it was not the

water, per se, but the phyiscal movement. I would be most happy to learn

that water, itself, actually does thin the blood. Please advise. Comments

welcome! >>

I agree that it is probably the movement that is the key. I think that

unless one has severe kidney disease the body regulates the specific gravity

of the blood very closely so that dilution incompatible with life does not

occur. Most parameters of the blood have very narrow normal ranges and any

excess water, for example, is handled by (normal) kidneys very well.

Brenta

[Guest guest]

No I have not heard anything which says that drinking lots of water

keeps the blood thin. But for a time in my life I got quite

dehydrated (unwittingly (drinking too much tea and coffee) and never

any fluids). During this period my skin got very dry and I was

getting blood taken at the Dr's. It was so thick. Even when I cut

myself the blood just formed a globule round it. It didn't run. So I

started drinking loads of water. It made sense to me the more you

drank the watery your blood would be and the better you skin

condition would be. It got better and the next time I got blood taken

it was running freely. I also read that drinking lots of water

removes toxins from the body. So from my own deductions I think it

helps. Sometimes I wonder if the alchohol thing is tied up with

dehydration, rather than a trigger. But then ..... There are so many

theories.

Fran

>

> In a message dated 1/26/02 03:45:31 AM, fross@e... writes:

>

> << and am

> drinking loads and loads of water to keep the blood thin. >>

>

> ------------------------------

> Fran... is there evidence that hydration actually does help keep

the blood

> thin. I heard a very revelatory report recently in which it was

disclosed

> that doctors encourage people to drink large amounts of liquids on

long

> airplane trips (and other periods of being sedentary) to make a

person get up

> and use the bathroom, thus giving a chance to keep the blood

flowing and thus

> prevent clots. It was my understanding from this report that it

was not the

> water, per se, but the phyiscal movement. I would be most happy to

learn

> that water, itself, actually does thin the blood. Please advise.

Comments

> welcome!

>

> Thank you!

>

>