Guest guest Posted December 22, 2003 Report Share Posted December 22, 2003 -Oh! tiki! That is SO wonderful! I'm certainly in favor of forgiveness... in fact - so much in favor of it that I wish I could just LEAP there. But for some reason, the path to forgiveness starts with walking through the muck.....and sometimes it feels so... well.. mucky..... Free -- In ModOasis , " tiki " <jgmahalo@e...> wrote: > I hadn't dealt with my nonBP issues on a group site since last year but knew that I still had issues to work through. Basically this year I worked on the BP distortion attacks and spent time protecting myself legally rather than emotionally. Helpful, BTW, to know that our country affords us rights that our BP others abuse. The holidays bring the emotions to the fore and the concept of family is impossible to avoid. I came here a few weeks ago to clarify forgiveness and I am happy to say that it arrived gently over the past few days. > > > > Someone on the site generously sent me forgiveness information in a private email (I am so sorry I have lost the name of this person and would love to give you credit, thanks and bow at your feet for your service-I think I remember the name ?). Edith also made recommendations to look through the archives. Both of these things helped tremendously. > > > > My greatest fear in forgiveness was that I thought it would say to family members, " ok, nothing ever happened, let's just move forward in denial and here I am, ready to accept and tolerate your abuses again " . I also thought it would telegraph an admission of being wrong about the alcoholism and abuse in our family. (my NPD/BP fada and BP/Dishrag Nada overused and abused the phrase, forgive and forget) > > > > The first relief I found was when I made the distinction between forgiveness and reconciliation. Reconciliation is a process that takes two willing parties. Knowing this eliminated the fear that I would have to go back to where I came from. I didn't want to forgive because holding back created the large wall of protection that I have needed in order to heal. I can't believe I'm actually referring to myself as someone who has healed. (it's taken nearly 8 years of pretty intensive spiritual and therapeutic work--and anger was essential and long lasting) > > > > My second understanding came from a simple dictionary definition of forgiveness: it explained it in financial terms: if someone owes you money and they cannot pay, then you give them a piece of paper saying that you forgive the loan and they no longer are obligated to pay. It was then explained in BP terms-you forgive the notion that your BP's will ever apologize, appreciate you, or understand that BP can be helped with therapy and awareness. Believe me I've been campaigning and fighting for these moments to a frustrating no result. I realize now, I was abusing myself. > > > > The next relief was learning: " Forgiving is seen as a state of being that embraces YOU, not an action or intention toward someone else. " Knowing that this forgiveness could be a private moment between me and my God and did not have to be a public proclamation that could be open for misinterpretation-i.e. the BP saying, " I knew it was all your fault " , - left me free to try forgiveness. In knowing that it wouldn't destroy any boundary or any groundwork laid toward better mental health in my family and for myself, I felt more secure in the concept of forgiveness. > > > > Today, I went for a walk with my brother, who has not supported me at all during this process and is joined with my family against my new ideas, I no longer felt angry, I no longer felt fearful, I no longer longed for his words of support, validation, apology or appreciation for what I have tried to do. The note is forgiven. I didn't say anything, and for the first time in my life I felt a steady peace, a calm knowing that " Forgiveness is the process through which an injured personfirst fights off, then embraces, then conquers a situation that has nearly destroyed him. " > > > > Edith and others, thank you for this really wonderful gift. I hope you feel the love, tiki > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 22, 2003 Report Share Posted December 22, 2003 hey free spirit--believe me, i didn't leap here--it's the culmination of 8 years of therapy, learning about behavior through my husband while he was getting a masters degree in therapy and 5 years intensive spiritual yogi training. forgiveness is a concept that is thrown around--basically the abusers use it as a way to get off scott free--and it was so confused in my mind. i'm still getting used to the idea that it actually arrived. it feels really great--i feel like running across the world, flying, i feel a great sense of freedom and residual anger is starting to disappear- i think anger was becoming a habit and i just need to realize i don't have anything in my life right now to be mad about. that's a first, thanks for writing, tiki Re: at last, forgiveness-tiki -Oh! tiki! That is SO wonderful! I'm certainly in favor of forgiveness... in fact - so much in favor of it that I wish I could just LEAP there. But for some reason, the path to forgiveness starts with walking through the muck.....and sometimes it feels so... well.. mucky..... Free -- In ModOasis , " tiki " <jgmahalo@e...> wrote: > I hadn't dealt with my nonBP issues on a group site since last year but knew that I still had issues to work through. Basically this year I worked on the BP distortion attacks and spent time protecting myself legally rather than emotionally. Helpful, BTW, to know that our country affords us rights that our BP others abuse. The holidays bring the emotions to the fore and the concept of family is impossible to avoid. I came here a few weeks ago to clarify forgiveness and I am happy to say that it arrived gently over the past few days. > > > > Someone on the site generously sent me forgiveness information in a private email (I am so sorry I have lost the name of this person and would love to give you credit, thanks and bow at your feet for your service-I think I remember the name ?). Edith also made recommendations to look through the archives. Both of these things helped tremendously. > > > > My greatest fear in forgiveness was that I thought it would say to family members, " ok, nothing ever happened, let's just move forward in denial and here I am, ready to accept and tolerate your abuses again " . I also thought it would telegraph an admission of being wrong about the alcoholism and abuse in our family. (my NPD/BP fada and BP/Dishrag Nada overused and abused the phrase, forgive and forget) > > > > The first relief I found was when I made the distinction between forgiveness and reconciliation. Reconciliation is a process that takes two willing parties. Knowing this eliminated the fear that I would have to go back to where I came from. I didn't want to forgive because holding back created the large wall of protection that I have needed in order to heal. I can't believe I'm actually referring to myself as someone who has healed. (it's taken nearly 8 years of pretty intensive spiritual and therapeutic work--and anger was essential and long lasting) > > > > My second understanding came from a simple dictionary definition of forgiveness: it explained it in financial terms: if someone owes you money and they cannot pay, then you give them a piece of paper saying that you forgive the loan and they no longer are obligated to pay. It was then explained in BP terms-you forgive the notion that your BP's will ever apologize, appreciate you, or understand that BP can be helped with therapy and awareness. Believe me I've been campaigning and fighting for these moments to a frustrating no result. I realize now, I was abusing myself. > > > > The next relief was learning: " Forgiving is seen as a state of being that embraces YOU, not an action or intention toward someone else. " Knowing that this forgiveness could be a private moment between me and my God and did not have to be a public proclamation that could be open for misinterpretation-i.e. the BP saying, " I knew it was all your fault " , - left me free to try forgiveness. In knowing that it wouldn't destroy any boundary or any groundwork laid toward better mental health in my family and for myself, I felt more secure in the concept of forgiveness. > > > > Today, I went for a walk with my brother, who has not supported me at all during this process and is joined with my family against my new ideas, I no longer felt angry, I no longer felt fearful, I no longer longed for his words of support, validation, apology or appreciation for what I have tried to do. The note is forgiven. I didn't say anything, and for the first time in my life I felt a steady peace, a calm knowing that " Forgiveness is the process through which an injured personfirst fights off, then embraces, then conquers a situation that has nearly destroyed him. " > > > > Edith and others, thank you for this really wonderful gift. I hope you feel the love, tiki > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 22, 2003 Report Share Posted December 22, 2003 free spirit & tiki -- are you saying eventually you learn to forgive the abuser/abusers? I'm glad you could do that -- sounds like a healthy thing to do. I am no where near that right now. I still feel like confronting everyone involved -- not that it would change anything. I'm not going to act, but I think about it a lot. Damn, this is hard. ~the beat goes on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 22, 2003 Report Share Posted December 22, 2003 I don't know the right answer to this but believe you me, I confronted. There is no doubt in anyone's mind why I have decided to leave. I tried to confront and change to no avail. My theory in confrontation-and this is open for debate, i don't even know if it is right--was to confront the people who abused me and let them know how i felt. i wanted to make sure that my anger went to the place that caused it so that i wouldn't ever take it out on some unsuspecting stranger or subconscious way that would hurt a potentially good relationship. I thought i needed to work out my sh* at the source so it was clear in my mind that my issues were with my family and not the rest of the entire world. it's a grueling process but well worth it. tiki Re: at last, forgiveness-tiki free spirit & tiki -- are you saying eventually you learn to forgive the abuser/abusers? I'm glad you could do that -- sounds like a healthy thing to do. I am no where near that right now. I still feel like confronting everyone involved -- not that it would change anything. I'm not going to act, but I think about it a lot. Damn, this is hard. ~the beat goes on To unsub send an empty email to ModOasis-unsubscribe Send questions and/or concerns to ModOasis-owner " Stop Walking on Eggshells, " a primer for non-BPs, can be ordered via 1-888-35-SHELL () and for the table of contents, go to: http://www.BPDCentral.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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