Re: Dreams

[Guest guest]

-Hey! Neat dream!!!

This year when I really started becoming aware of the extent of this

inner child stuff (i.e. it was going to take more to make her happy

than just giving her some candy)- I started having dreams..

In one dream my dad told me I needed to take parenting classes. He

just said that and walked away... and wouldn't discuss it (just like

my dad would do - avoiding sticky topics).

The next day I was telling my boyfriend about the dream and how I was

mad at my dad for treating me like that. He reminded me it was only a

dream - but I was thinking - " Hey! It was MY dream! He had NO right

to come in MY dream and announce I needed parenting classes and then

walk off! "

Hey! Wow!! Now that I am writing this - I DO remember though he DID

tell me the first class was scheduled on my birhtday and so he didn't

know if I would go...

AND (drumroll here)I AM going to a retreat where we will do a lot of

healing work this next week (Oct. 6,7, 8) AND the 8th IS my

birthday!!! Maybe that is a good sign.

And, in fact, I was really not moving in any direction to go because

of my classes - but my b/f offered to teach my classes for me next

week because he would like for me to be able to go...

Might be something to that dream...

The other dream had a little girl... and I went to check on her and

saw that her feet were muddy - I was trying to take her and clean her

up but the other lady there in my dream kept insisting that she

wasn't dirty - even though I could see very well that she was.

I shared this dream with my friend... because though I have tried to

tell people I need to do " inner child " work - everyone seems to balk

at the idea... and keeps assuring me that what I need to do is leave

it ALONE - so I can go back to being the happy self they want me to

be.. I explained how I could see she was dirty even though others

couldn't..A sign I am on the right track here....

Well.. my friend tried to interpret the dream to mean... that since

the OTHER lady told me she WASN'T dirty - that meant she really

wasn't and that I only THOUGHT she was dirty - but I should know she

wasn't because the other person TOLD me..

ARGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You have the right to remain silent... Anything you say can and will

be used against you.......

Again.. thankfully my b/f was supportive... " Yes, dear.. if you think

she has dirty feet - then she DOES have dirty feet.. regardless of

what the other lady tells you... "

Sometimes it feels so good to be validated...

Free

-- In ModOasis , " anyrae " <anyrae75@a...> wrote:

> > When we're wrestling with

> > a raging bull in the middle of the living room, it's very

difficult

> > to remember the times when it lay lazily in the meadow nibbling

> > daisies.

> > Carol

>

> I read this post the other day and I guess it made an impression on

> my subconsious because I worked it into a dream! lol

> I was following a friend, she wanted me to come into this field of

> flowers with her, they were all purple, yellow and white. She went

> into the field ahead of me, I was scared of the busy road next to

the

> field and also afraid there would be snakes in the tall grass. So

I

> was working up my courage to go into the field and I saw 3 bulls

> laying together, nibbling on daisies! They had big white horns,

> their fur was black and shiny and each of them had little purple

> flowers stuck on thier butts!! The flowers were in little circular

> bunches, like buns - one on each cheek! In my dream, they had been

> rolling in the flowers and playing. They were not far from me at

all

> but I wasn't afraid of them, even though they had sharp horns and

> they were great big bulls! They just looked so sweet with their

> flowery bums.

> P.S. Another part of this dream, the reason I was following this

> friend is because I was taking some packages to the post office,

one

> of them was going to " monsters. " Before I could send the monsters

> thier package and note, I had to translate it from English

> to " Monster. " Not just the words, but also the overall tone of the

> note was supposed to be rude and mean because that's what monsters

> understand.. If I left it in " polite " English, they would be

really

> offended! haha

[Guest guest]

> This year when I really started becoming aware of the extent of

> this inner child stuff (i.e. it was going to take more to make her

> happy than just giving her some candy)- I started having dreams..

>

> Free

A couple of months ago, I had at least two dreams about injured baby

animals. In all of these dreams, I was able to help the baby

animals, even though I really felt terrified of seeing their injuries

or of not being able to help them. I would try to get someone else

to help, or if I was alone, I'd try to wait for help. Each time, the

baby animals were crying too loud to ignore and I'd have to " get

over " my fear and just help them anyway. Then I was able to leave

them behind peacefully or confidently, knowing that they would be

OK.

In one of the dreams, a little girl brought me a dove with a hurt

wing (or foot maybe..I've forgotten). I helped the bird and then

praised the little girl for being able to get the bird some help and

hugged her. I told one of my friends about this dream and she

pointed out that the little girl could have been my 'inner child.'

They were nice dreams, I've had a lot of those lately. Definitely a

big improvement from the end of the world and natural disaster dreams

I used to have!

The dreams you described sound pretty frustrating to me. I hate

being told that something I see with my own eyes isn't *really*

there! If anything, the dream about the little dirty feet would get

me thinking I should trust what I see over what someone else wants or

expects me to see. Not the other way around.

[Guest guest]

> Definitely a big improvement from the end of the world

> and natural disaster dreams I used to have!

, I am still having a lot of end of the world and natural

disaster dreams. And a lot of dreams where I am looking for

something and can never find it, or I am lost in a maze of hallways.

- Dan

[Guest guest]

-You know.. I wish our dreams could speak to us more clearly. I don't

understand our why our dreams have to speak in such riddles.

Several years back I was spending the week with my sister after her

husband died. Suddenly I was awakened with this thought that kept

repeating and would not go away. The thought was " Jeffery Dalmer is

dining on Rick's sweetest. " I tried to go back to sleep but the

thought wouldn't leave.

So finally, I deciphered it. Rick's sweetest? Hmmm. That would be my

sister (her deceased husband's name was Rick...) .. Dalmer is

dining on my sister... Then - the lightbulb!!!! Something is eating

my sister...

So I leaped out of bed and ran downstairs. My sister was sleeping..

but a movie was on TV where people where yelling " He's dead! He's

dead! " Well... considering her husband had just died a few days

before - it probably wasn't a nice thing for her to be hearing in her

sleep. So I turned off the TV.

But why the riddle? Why didn't my dream just tell me - " Go downstairs

and turn off the TV. "

Free

-- In ModOasis , " Dan " <danc19fr@y...> wrote:

> > Definitely a big improvement from the end of the world

> > and natural disaster dreams I used to have!

>

> , I am still having a lot of end of the world and natural

> disaster dreams. And a lot of dreams where I am looking for

> something and can never find it, or I am lost in a maze of hallways.

>

> - Dan

[Guest guest]

Maybe the dreams speak in riddles to amplify the message. Sometimes

they make you think and ponder instead of dismiss the info of

ordinary stuff like " turn the tv off " you know what I mean?

> > --- free_spirit_etc <free_spirit_etc@y...> wrote:

> > > -You know.. I wish our dreams could speak to us more

> > > clearly. I don't

> > > understand our why our dreams have to speak in such

> > > riddles.

>

[Guest guest]

-You do have a very valid point.. It was probably the riddle that

woke me up.. pulled me in.. and kept my attention..

I may have responded to a mere " turn off the tv " with.. " yeah..

right. " I do so like this group and the insights and ideas shared.

Think I'm gonna keep hangin out here with all you smart folk..

Free

-- In ModOasis , " s " <ssw2003@s...> wrote:

> Maybe the dreams speak in riddles to amplify the message.

Sometimes

> they make you think and ponder instead of dismiss the info of

> ordinary stuff like " turn the tv off " you know what I mean?

>

> > > --- free_spirit_etc <free_spirit_etc@y...> wrote:

> > > > -You know.. I wish our dreams could speak to us more

> > > > clearly. I don't

> > > > understand our why our dreams have to speak in such

> > > > riddles.

> >

[Guest guest]

Jung taught that dreams allow us to see the action of our unconscious

mind. The unconscious is symbolic, and doesn't work the same way as

our conscious mind. This could explain why dreams are like riddles.

- Dan

[Guest guest]

Now my breast is itching like crazy!!!!

And I'm thinking of all the times my body (and SOUL) felt violated

and I either didn't speak it - or when I did - it backfired.

Starting all the way back to four years old....

I don't want to go into all that right now... and some of it is just

feelings with no words.... but I am sure that is what started the

pattern - unless the pattern was started earlier by other kinds of

abuse - that taught me my body was not mine really.

So some of the " highlights " that are coming out...

Running up the steps as a child in my nightgown... and my mother

making fun of us - announcing that she could see our butts! And it

seems like my father was ALWAYS there when she did THAT!!! And it was

done in the way that you can't say anything - because they are acting

like it's " cute " (though you couldn't say anything anyway). But how

dreaful and ashamed I felt...

and OMG! Church Camp... There was some jerk that felt my leg up at

church camp of all places. I was going into junior high. And this guy

was feeling my leg under the table during BIBLE STUDY!!! I THOUGHT of

SAYING something. But of course, he would have acted like nothing

happened and explained it all away - and *I* would be the one that

looked stupid. They are slick - those perverts are. They often know

JUST how to grab you - so that if you call them on it - they can act

like it was an innocent thing that YOU misinterpreted - leaving YOU

to look like a fool -

As I got older - I always watched out for that at church camp. There

were always lots of " christian " boys with hormones raging looking for

a " nice christian girl " to latch onto - so they could walk around

holding hands - and feel them up during prayers and campfire. And the

camp counselors smiled - seeing all the christian boys hooking up

with christian girls - feeling a sense of security in the fact they

would be groping other christians - rather than heathens. But church

camp is really a place to watch out for - if you want to not be pawed

on.

Oh.. there was a kid that did that in junior high too. First I

thought he dropped his pencil. Then he just started feeling my leg.

Again, I sat there in horror - afraid to SAY anything. His hands were

clammy too. But again, I had the feeling that if I SPOKE - it would

come back against ME.

And then there were all those rides on the school bus in junior high.

And the boys would make all kinds of rude remarks - and gestures. And

sometimes grab a girls head and try to push it down in their

laps...while everybody laughed... and the bus driver glared in the

mirror.

You know - there WERE times when I DID speak up though.

Once when I was pregnant - and went to six flags with a friend of

mine and a couple of guys she knew. I was walking down the street and

some guy just outright grabbed my butt when he walked by. He was

walking the OTHER direction - so he couldn't even hide behind

the " accidentally bumped into her - and she is making a big deal out

of it " excuse. And I just stopped right where I was - pointed at him -

and yelled " THAT MAN GRABBED MY A**!!!! " as loud as I could.

Well - no one apprehended the man. They all started laughing at ME!!

Even my friend and her friends. And all day long they kept making fun

of me for that. When we were riding the merry-go-round - they were on

the horses BEHIND me - and they kept reaching up and acting like they

were going to grab me - and pulling on the bottom of my shirt...and

laughing so hard!!! It was pretty humilating.

Another time I spoke up was when I was married. My husband introduced

me to one of his friends. The friend started talking to me - and

grabbed my upper arm - and then loosened the grip with his fingers on

the INSIDE of my arm...and started rubbing them up and down my

breast. I pulled away and went and told my husband. But of course..

the man had JUST grabbed my arm. I was making a big deal over

nothing.. it was all explained away...my husband felt compelled to

announce the amusing incident to the other people there....and the

GUY got by with feeling me up - while everyone laughed at ME for even

THINKING such a thing....

You know all that stuff just pisses me off!!!! Just remembering some

of those times I was violated... even though many people seemed to

think they were " small " things.. they were big to me... And it pisses

me off to think of how MANY times that happened... and how MANY times

I was AFRAID to speak up - and how it backfired on ME when I DID

speak...

Free

> Thank you to everyone for your responses to my post. They were kind

> and supportive - and shared information that will help me grow. I

> felt myself moving forward again - or at least turning around and

> moving in that direction.

>

> I was responding to tiki's post - and reached a point where I was

> starting to feel all kinds of things flowing - and realized I was

at

> a place where I would just pour out pages - or say nothing at all.

>

> So I decided to take a break. I do that sometimes...write a post on

> the installment plan - breaking in between. Well - I decided to

take

> a nap... and maybe some things would sort out. I was hoping to have

> one of those naps where things that you have been over-reacting to

> just kind of sort out and return to their proper perspective.

>

> Egads! I got one of the other dreams.

>

> In the dream - a man who sexually abused me as a child was there.

He

> was old and sick and I felt sorry for him. So I reached out and

took

> his hand and tried to let him know I cared with my eyes..because I

> knew I couldn't say it. I don't know why - but this stood

out...about

> not being able to say it. It does seem though that was one of

> the " rules " in my family. If one of us was having a hard time -

they

> weren't allowed to SPEAK it. They just had to hope that someone

else

> might notice and offer support. But even in offering support - we

> were supposed to act like we didn't know what was going on. So the

> bad event was a secret - and knowing about it was also. Anyway - it

> really stood out in the dream that it was important not to SPEAK

it -

> and how I was happy I knew how to communicate in other ways to get

> the message across.

>

> (Odd - the big thing with the battles with the guy-friend-person is

> his anger at my insistance at being HEARD! Of SAYING what I have to

> say over and over until I FEEL heard. How I NEED to speak it!)

>

> Anyway - the dream turned bad pretty fast. The man let go of my

hand

> and grabbed my breast - just kind of " tweaking " the nipple. And I

> smacked his hand. The was another woman in the room. I don't know

who

> she was - but she looked, and let me know that she knew, but then

> went around acting like she didn't know. I didn't feel any support

> from her. It was more judgement than anything...of me.

>

> For some reason - I tried to hold the man's hands again - and give

> him support...in his dying. But he kept acting out. I don't

remember

> how - but I know that he did.And he wasn't taking me - or my

attempts

> to get him to act more appropriate seriously. And I was upset with

> him because for some reason I worried that my dad might find out he

> was acting like that and be mad.

>

> Then I remember him going under the table and pulling on my feet. I

> don't know what that was all about - but it was dreadful. Like I

was

> being pulled under.

>

> (And there is something about the feet too. I'm not sure what. But

I

> know I had trouble with one boyfriend because I would be laying on

> the couch or something - and he would take his FOOT.. and run it up

> my leg and stick it between my legs..and I would just feel sick all

> over and flip out! And I would try to tell him not to DO that. But

he

> didn't HEAR me either. He would just say " All I did was..... " and

> actually do it AGAIN!!!! What an a**hole!!!!!!!! I couldn't STAND

> that thing with the feet! And he wouldn't HEAR me!!!0

>

> Anyway - in the dream though - the man was pulling on MY feet. And

> then we were outside - and there was a schoolbus that had some

signs.

> I don't know what THAT was about. But he was asking about how we

> should ACT now. It was more like now that I was a grown-up - we

could

> still act like nothing was happening - or act like it was. Like now

> that I was a grown up - we didn't have to hide it. There were more

> choices of how to act... but I can't remember what they were....but

> they were spelled out in the signs on the school bus.

>

> I kept trying to TELL him that I didn't want to act ANY way. I

wanted

> him to STOP! But it was like he didn't HEAR me. He just kept on

going

> like I didn't say a thing - trying to touch me and things.

>

> Then - the next thing I knew...we were on a wagon or the back of a

> tractor. Both I think. My dad was driving the tractor (he was a

> farmer). And it seemed like we were on a wagon - but other times we

> were right on back of the tractor - right next to my dad.

>

> Well - the man kept grabbing me and pulling my feet again. And I

was

> trying to fight him. Now this is odd - but it was like I STARTED to

> tell my dad - but knew I couldn't. Earlier I had the feeling that

the

> man needed to behave - or my dad would be mad at HIM. But when it

> came down to it - It was like I couldn't SAY anything because *I*

> would get in trouble.

>

> I was fighting the man - RIGHT NEXT to my dad...but my dad just

kept

> on driving and didn't see a thing. Yet I felt I couldn't TELL my

dad -

> because if I did - the man would act like nothing had happened -

and

> *I* would be in trouble (or at least lose my dad's " approval " or

gain

> his " disapproval " or something) for " causing a scene. " (That MIGHT

> mean " speaking the truth. " ) I was panicked but I KNEW that if I

SAID

> anything - everyone would pull back and act like nothing happened -

> and that *I* would be the one that was wrong - the one who drew the

> judgement. But still I struggled - and it was like I was struggling

> and HOPING my dad would SEE the actual struggle - because if he

could

> SEE the struggle - he would KNOW it wasn't MY fault - that I was

just

> trying to defend myself - and he would make the man stop. But I

felt

> like he had to SEE it - because if I SPOKE it - it would all be

> explained away and I would be made to be " wrong. " But my dad didn't

> see the struggle. I don't know how he missed it - but he did. There

> were a few other people around from time to time also..I was aware

of

> their presence - but I don't know who they were - because ALL my

> attention was on my dad. I'm not sure if they saw the struggle or

> not. If they did- they never helped - they never said anything -

and

> they didn't tell my dad.

>

> Then I woke up. And here is another strange thing. I woke up with a

> memory I hadn't thought of for a long time.

>

> But about 20 years ago - when I was getting divorced - I got a job

in

> activities in a nursing home. My ex was doing all kinds of

distortion

> stuff - calling the nursing home and telling them I was a paranoid

> schizophrenic under psychiatric care and that I owed Bell Telephone

> $68. (I DID owe Bell Telephone $68). And when I went for my Order

of

> Protection my employer got a strange call during a court recess

where

> a man told them I was a drug addict and I wouldn't stay in one

place

> long enough for them to track me down - so he was just going to

> arrest me right there at work. And one day he showed up acting like

a

> bread salesman - of all things... and talked to the director and

> started asking questions about me.

>

> ANyway - what that has to do with the memory is that I was put

under

> enormous pressure by my employer - that if MY EX caused any more

> trouble *I* would probably lose my job. All these things were being

> put on MY record... and held against ME. So I tried listening to

his

> crap more - so he wouldn't feel driven to bother me at work - so I

> wouldn't lose my job. Yep. I sold out.

>

> Anyway - the dream and the memory (sorry folks - but everything

seems

> to tangle together). We had a client's son who came in to play the

> piano - and he seemed real nice. One day our cat (the nurinsg home

> had a cat) got sick and had to go to the vet. The man took us to

the

> vet. When we got back I had cat hair all over the front of me. The

> man started brushing the cat hair off of me and then reached down

and

> grabbed my breast - pinching the nipple - just like the man in the

> dream did. It even hurt - he pinched it that hard. I was totally

> SHOCKED! But he just smiled and acted like nothing happened. I

didn't

> know what to do. Once again, I was afraid if I said anything - it

> would all be explained away - and I would be accused of over-

reacting

> to something that didn't happen - and even if they believed me - I

> might lose MY job because HE pinched my breast. Again, I had the

> right to remain silent. To speak up would bring judgement on ME.

Just

> act like nothing happened...So I never told anyone.

>

> And something else REALLY strange is that for the past week my

right

> breast has been bothering me...it has been itching - and the nipple

> has been burning and hurting sometimes. I thought maybe some of the

> massage stuff was doing that to me - since we are massaging enough

to

> losen up the toxic stuff, but not enough to " get them out " well

yet.

> I even looked up signs of breast cancer the other day because I was

> getting concerned that something was really wrong with that breast.

>

> But it is the SAME breast the man grabbed in the dream (and the

same

> one the other man grabbed years ago). And in the dream the man

> pinched the nipple just like the guy at the nurinsg home did. And

it

> burned in the dream - just like it does now. So maybe - it has been

> bothering me this week because it was ready to come out. I hope so.

>

> Free

[Guest guest]

> > (Odd - the big thing with the battles with the guy-friend-person

is

> > his anger at my insistance at being HEARD! Of SAYING what I have

to

> > say over and over until I FEEL heard. How I NEED to speak it!)

I do this too... I think mostly with people I feel safe with, which

is somewhat unfortunate because eventually people tire of my need of

having to not only say what I want to say, but elaborating, and

repeating it, and so on. Maybe it's a subconscious way of focusing

that inability to speak up or fight back in the past in a safe

direction, even though it is focused in the wrong place... I guess I

just have a need for people to not only know it but understand it,

even if it doesn't really matter. Or shouldn't matter, maybe... I

don't know.

> > And something else REALLY strange is that for the past week my

> right

> > breast has been bothering me...it has been itching - and the

nipple

> > has been burning and hurting sometimes. I thought maybe some of

the

> > massage stuff was doing that to me - since we are massaging

enough

> to

> > losen up the toxic stuff, but not enough to " get them out " well

> yet.

> > I even looked up signs of breast cancer the other day because I

was

> > getting concerned that something was really wrong with that

>breast.

I have had this problem lately not with worrying about breast cancer

but about ovarian cancer-- having serious pains and cramping

consistently since early January after having some disturbing

nightmares. I don't know what to make of it much; I have done a lot

of reading about somatization (which is pretty common in sexually

abuse survivors) and the notion that the 'body remembers' and

can 'act out' unresolved trauma through medical problems. Offhand

can't remember where I've read that.

[Guest guest]

free_spirit_etc wrote:

> Now my breast is itching like crazy!!!!

> And I'm thinking of all the times my body (and SOUL) felt

violated

> and I either didn't speak it - or when I did - it backfired.

Lawson (UBM, p 289):

" The body speaks for the soul if the soul does not find a voice. "

- Edith

[Guest guest]

---

Edith,

Absolutely! After over 30 years of suffering migraine headaches,

nausea, vomiting, and sleep paralysis, I'm finally starting to look

forward to the day when I no longer need my body to speak for my soul

because my soul will find it's voice. Does that happen before or

after you arrive at the lamp-post? Just curious.

Tammy

In ModOasis , Edith <psyprof@e...> wrote:

> free_spirit_etc wrote:

>

> > Now my breast is itching like crazy!!!!

> > And I'm thinking of all the times my body (and SOUL) felt

> violated

> > and I either didn't speak it - or when I did - it backfired.

>

>

> Lawson (UBM, p 289):

>

> " The body speaks for the soul if the soul does not find a voice. "

>

> - Edith

[Guest guest]

legoarwen2003 wrote:

> Edith,

>

> Absolutely! After over 30 years of suffering migraine headaches,

> nausea, vomiting, and sleep paralysis, I'm finally starting to look

> forward to the day when I no longer need my body to speak for my soul

> because my soul will find it's voice. Does that happen before or

> after you arrive at the lamp-post? Just curious.

>

> Tammy

Hi Tammy,

I don't think the sleep paralysis fits here?? I think that's a

different animal.

And, I still get the pre-migraine aura but not the migraine.

I've only had one migraine headache in my life. The doctor said

that what I have is " optic neuritis " w/o the migraine. I know

that its triggered by an intense flash of bright light (not from

a camera flash but like when sunlight is reflected off a car

windshied or bumper). And, it takes 20 minutes for the aura (ie,

shimmering color kaleidoscope) to go away. I understand they

have some pretty good medications now to prevent migraines.

The changes that occurred in my life happened gradually along

the way. And the funny thing is, I wasn't aware of the absence

of some of that stuff (like the tachycardias and PTSD) for

awhile cuz I wasn't expecting any changes to happen. And then

one day I'd notice that that stuff was gone. Walla!

And another thing was the lifting of a lifetime of low-grade

depression that I didn't even know I had. That was an

interesting happenstance because my moods shifted from their

usual low-grade to high and back and forth and finally, after a

couple of weeks, settled at a whole new setpoint.

We KOs just get used to the nada baggage we've carried for so

long that we think the baggage is normal. Hah!!!

Anyhow, you guys'll see...

- Edith

Lamp post leaner

[Guest guest]

This is beautiful thanks so much for this quote, Grace and Peace

>

> When your past tries to dominate your thoughts,

> let your dreams ignite your day!

>

> Anonymous

>

> Just something I ran across a few minutes ago and thought I'd share

here.

>

> Jace

>

>

>

>