Guest guest Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 , I can't believe your insurance carrier lets you do your own PRV testing. Your liability exposure is much higher than any consultant's or contractor's would be because you do everything. Steve Temes Group, With all the talk about conflicts of interest and impropriety ... hasn't anyone questioned why most consultants and contractors have NO mold insurance? S520 clearly recommends mold insurance but you don't need it to be listed on the IICRC web site. You don't need it to be on the IAQA or AmIAQC web sites. This all sounds very disingenuous to me. It is my belief that because professional associations don't enforce the insurance requirement, states like FLA are taking things into their own hands and coming out with their own licensing programs that require insurance. As a result this can become a big hardship for some contractors that work in many states due to the cost of state licensing, training, continuing ed etc. Surely requiring contractors to be insured in order to claim they are certified would solve many if not most of the issues about bogus activities. For example, with a $1M min iinsurance policy a client with a gripe can get an attorney to make a claim on the consultant's E & O policy. No iinsurance = No work. Rosen, Ph.D. www.Mold-Books.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 , Good point. No insurance = No work I believe there have been cases where insurers have been held responsible when they have contractors, with mold exclusions on their policies also on the insurer's preferred vendor lists to address mold, and have sent these non-insured contractors (recommended them), to address the matter. If I was an insurer, I too would be saying "No insurance, no work". Sharon See what's free at AOL.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 I have to say this, for the first time in a long time I agree with . Insurance requirements will sure knock a lot out or make them step up. It is not the easiest thing to get insurance for remediation, professional liability, etc. for mold or environmental work. Josh From: iequality [mailto:iequality ] On Behalf Of gary rosen Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 6:22 AM To: iequality Cc: creaney@... Subject: Mold Insurance Group, With all the talk about conflicts of interest and impropriety ... hasn't anyone questioned why most consultants and contractors have NO mold insurance? S520 clearly recommends mold insurance but you don't need it to be listed on the IICRC web site. You don't need it to be on the IAQA or AmIAQC web sites. This all sounds very disingenuous to me. It is my belief that because professional associations don't enforce the insurance requirement, states like FLA are taking things into their own hands and coming out with their own licensing programs that require insurance. As a result this can become a big hardship for some contractors that work in many states due to the cost of state licensing, training, continuing ed etc. Surely requiring contractors to be insured in order to claim they are certified would solve many if not most of the issues about bogus activities. For example, with a $1M min iinsurance policy a client with a gripe can get an attorney to make a claim on the consultant's E & O policy. No iinsurance = No work. Rosen, Ph.D. www.Mold-Books.com Ahhh...imagining that irresistible " new car " smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 Josh, Glenn Fellman at IAQA has told me that insurance for both assessors and remediators is available to qualified members. I have E & O thru their program. Rosen, Ph.D. www.Green-Buildings.org Mold Insurance Group, With all the talk about conflicts of interest and impropriety ... hasn't anyone questioned why most consultants and contractors have NO mold insurance? S520 clearly recommends mold insurance but you don't need it to be listed on the IICRC web site. You don't need it to be on the IAQA or AmIAQC web sites. This all sounds very disingenuous to me. It is my belief that because professional associations don't enforce the insurance requirement, states like FLA are taking things into their own hands and coming out with their own licensing programs that require insurance. As a result this can become a big hardship for some contractors that work in many states due to the cost of state licensing, training, continuing ed etc. Surely requiring contractors to be insured in order to claim they are certified would solve many if not most of the issues about bogus activities. For example, with a $1M min iinsurance policy a client with a gripe can get an attorney to make a claim on the consultant's E & O policy. No iinsurance = No work. Rosen, Ph.D. www.Mold-Books. com Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 We at Legends Environmental Insurance Services, LLC totally agree. Thanks, Bill From: iequality [mailto:iequality ] On Behalf Of gary rosen Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 3:22 AM To: iequality Cc: creaney@... Subject: Mold Insurance Group, With all the talk about conflicts of interest and impropriety ... hasn't anyone questioned why most consultants and contractors have NO mold insurance? S520 clearly recommends mold insurance but you don't need it to be listed on the IICRC web site. You don't need it to be on the IAQA or AmIAQC web sites. This all sounds very disingenuous to me. It is my belief that because professional associations don't enforce the insurance requirement, states like FLA are taking things into their own hands and coming out with their own licensing programs that require insurance. As a result this can become a big hardship for some contractors that work in many states due to the cost of state licensing, training, continuing ed etc. Surely requiring contractors to be insured in order to claim they are certified would solve many if not most of the issues about bogus activities. For example, with a $1M min iinsurance policy a client with a gripe can get an attorney to make a claim on the consultant's E & O policy. No iinsurance = No work. Rosen, Ph.D. www.Mold-Books.com Ahhh...imagining that irresistible " new car " smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 Sharon, Without state laws enforcing mold insurance requirement, home owner insurance companies will try to reduce costs by using non-licensed, non-certified, non-insured horrible low cost people whenever possible. In CA this may not be the case due to the high amounts of lawsuits. It is sure the case in FLA. This will probably change in FLA quite soon. Rosen www.Mold-Books.com Re: Mold Insurance , Good point. No insurance = No work I believe there have been cases where insurers have been held responsible when they have contractors, with mold exclusions on their policies also on the insurer's preferred vendor lists to address mold, and have sent these non-insured contractors (recommended them), to address the matter. If I was an insurer, I too would be saying "No insurance, no work". Sharon See what's free at AOL.com. Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 Bill, At least in FLA we are trying to do something about this! No mold insurance = No mold work ... if the new law passes. No training on water damage = No mold work ... if the new law passes. If the client and/or insurance provider does not want or cannot afford a consultant on a job ... the remediator is supposed to be able to do it. If not and he takes the job ... he will very shortly have no insurance and no license = No mold work. We have our problems in FLA but our construction, real estate and mortgage laws are here to protect the consumer with special emphasis on the elderly and the less fortunate. Florida's Construction Industry Licensing Board paid out over $7M dollars last year to consumers that were defrauded by licensed contractors. And those contractors are not able to practise in the state unless the make restitution! The test alone to become a state licensed builing contractor is 16 hours. That's more than most courses of training for mold assessors! Rosen, Ph.D. FLA State Licensed Building Contractor www.Green-Buildings.org Mold Insurance Group, With all the talk about conflicts of interest and impropriety ... hasn't anyone questioned why most consultants and contractors have NO mold insurance? S520 clearly recommends mold insurance but you don't need it to be listed on the IICRC web site. You don't need it to be on the IAQA or AmIAQC web sites. This all sounds very disingenuous to me. It is my belief that because professional associations don't enforce the insurance requirement, states like FLA are taking things into their own hands and coming out with their own licensing programs that require insurance. As a result this can become a big hardship for some contractors that work in many states due to the cost of state licensing, training, continuing ed etc. Surely requiring contractors to be insured in order to claim they are certified would solve many if not most of the issues about bogus activities. For example, with a $1M min iinsurance policy a client with a gripe can get an attorney to make a claim on the consultant's E & O policy. No iinsurance = No work. Rosen, Ph.D. www.Mold-Books. com Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2007 Report Share Posted April 18, 2007 I also agree. I have never been without insurance, and I do not intend to be EVER without it. It is a responsibility to our clients to have it in place, just in case. It is a duty to ourselves to ensure our futures. Don > > We at Legends Environmental Insurance Services, LLC totally agree. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Bill > > _____ > > From: iequality [mailto:iequality ] On Behalf > Of gary rosen > Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007 3:22 AM > To: iequality > Cc: creaney@... > Subject: Mold Insurance > > > > Group, > > > > With all the talk about conflicts of interest and impropriety ... hasn't > anyone questioned why most consultants and contractors have NO mold > insurance? S520 clearly recommends mold insurance but you don't need it to > be listed on the IICRC web site. You don't need it to be on the IAQA or > AmIAQC web sites. > > > > This all sounds very disingenuous to me. > > > > It is my belief that because professional associations don't enforce the > insurance requirement, states like FLA are taking things into their own > hands and coming out with their own licensing programs that require > insurance. > > > > As a result this can become a big hardship for some contractors that work in > many states due to the cost of state licensing, training, continuing ed etc. > > > > Surely requiring contractors to be insured in order to claim they are > certified would solve many if not most of the issues about bogus activities. > For example, with a $1M min iinsurance policy a client with a gripe can get > an attorney to make a claim on the consultant's E & O policy. No iinsurance = > No work. > > > > Rosen, Ph.D. > > www.Mold-Books. <http://www.Mold-Books.com> com > > > > > > _____ > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible " new car " smell? > Check out new > <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=48245/*http:/autos.yahoo.com/new_cars.html ;_ylc= > X3oDMTE1YW1jcXJ2BF9TAzk3MTA3MDc2BHNlYwNtYWlsdGFncwRzbGsDbmV3LWNhcnM- > cars > at Yahoo! Autos. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2007 Report Share Posted April 19, 2007 Without state laws enforcing mold insurance requirement, home owner insurance companies will try to reduce costs by using non-licensed, non-certified, non-insured horrible low cost people whenever possible. In CA this may not be the case due to the high amounts of lawsuits. , makes sense to me. There should also be a law that insurers must check the insurance of all vendors before they are placed on a preferred list. SharonSee what's free at AOL.com. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2007 Report Share Posted April 19, 2007 Sharon - that's an interesting point ... >>There should also be a law that insurers must check the insurance of all vendors before they are placed on a preferred list. When ever I have gotten mold work on an insurance claim (I am hired by home owner) it was when the homeowner refused to use anyone on the insurance company's preferred list unless they were both certified and had mold insurance! If the FLA law passes there will be very few left on the preferred list. Rosen, Ph.D. www.Green-Buildings.org Re: Mold Insurance In a message dated 4/19/2007 8:42:30 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, garyrosen72652@ yahoo.com writes: Without state laws enforcing mold insurance requirement, home owner insurance companies will try to reduce costs by using non-licensed, non-certified, non-insured horrible low cost people whenever possible. In CA this may not be the case due to the high amounts of lawsuits. , makes sense to me. There should also be a law that insurers must check the insurance of all vendors before they are placed on a preferred list. Sharon See what's free at AOL.com. Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2007 Report Share Posted April 19, 2007 : Hopefully, when IAQA passes the 'conflict of interest' statement in its Code of Ethics, the IAQA insurance group will take note, and will not offer E & O insurance to companies that perform PRV on their own projects. Don > > Josh, > > Glenn Fellman at IAQA has told me that insurance for both assessors and remediators is available to qualified members. I have E & O thru their program. > > Rosen, Ph.D. > www.Green-Buildings.org > > > > Mold Insurance > > Group, > > With all the talk about conflicts of interest and impropriety ... hasn't anyone questioned why most consultants and contractors have NO mold insurance? S520 clearly recommends mold insurance but you don't need it to be listed on the IICRC web site. You don't need it to be on the IAQA or AmIAQC web sites. > > This all sounds very disingenuous to me. > > It is my belief that because professional associations don't enforce the insurance requirement, states like FLA are taking things into their own hands and coming out with their own licensing programs that require insurance. > > As a result this can become a big hardship for some contractors that work in many states due to the cost of state licensing, training, continuing ed etc. > > Surely requiring contractors to be insured in order to claim they are certified would solve many if not most of the issues about bogus activities. For example, with a $1M min iinsurance policy a client with a gripe can get an attorney to make a claim on the consultant's E & O policy. No iinsurance = No work. > > Rosen, Ph.D. > www.Mold-Books. com > > > > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible " new car " smell? > Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2007 Report Share Posted April 20, 2007 Why would an insurance provider want to keep someone from checking their own work in light of state law that clearly has defined that they have NO problem with that? In the event of civil litigation in which they would be obligated to provide your legal defense. Whether you do a good job or not, , can't you see the problem with "checking your own work", as in the fox guarding the henhouse, and as in having to admit that you didn't do the first part of the job right. Even if you were able to admit after your PRV assessment that you didn't find or clean what you were supposed to earlier in the projec, the ability for anyone to be objective under these circumstances is questionable. Steve Temes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2007 Report Share Posted April 20, 2007 Don, I can assure you that I will follow any requirements that I must to comply with my insurance. However note that at the last IEQ conference I attended, the head guy from one of the top insurance companies recommended that I have him quote insurance for both my mold remediation/construction company and my consulting company as I would qualify for a reduced rate if he covered both! I also can assure you that no insurance company will develop requirements that conflict with state laws. If a mold remediator per FLA law can check their own work ... that is the law. Why would an insurance provider want to keep someone from checking their own work in light of state law that clearly has defined that they have NO problem with that? I would expect that mold remediation insurance should REQUIRE that a mold contractor check their own work in the absense of a third party consultant otherwise insurance coverage would be void. Rosen, Ph.D. www.Green-Buildings.org Mold Insurance> > Group,> > With all the talk about conflicts of interest and impropriety ... hasn't anyone questioned why most consultants and contractors have NO mold insurance? S520 clearly recommends mold insurance but you don't need it to be listed on the IICRC web site. You don't need it to be on the IAQA or AmIAQC web sites. > > This all sounds very disingenuous to me. > > It is my belief that because professional associations don't enforce the insurance requirement, states like FLA are taking things into their own hands and coming out with their own licensing programs that require insurance.> > As a result this can become a big hardship for some contractors that work in many states due to the cost of state licensing, training, continuing ed etc.> > Surely requiring contractors to be insured in order to claim they are certified would solve many if not most of the issues about bogus activities. For example, with a $1M min iinsurance policy a client with a gripe can get an attorney to make a claim on the consultant's E & O policy. No iinsurance = No work.> > Rosen, Ph.D.> www.Mold-Books. com> > > > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?> Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ __> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2007 Report Share Posted April 20, 2007 Don, To put some things into perspective about professional organizations ... there is not even a requirement or recommendation to understand S520 for CIE training. Here's the list of the knowledge base upon which the test is taken. Fungal Contamination; EPA, Building Air Quality; ASHRAE Standards 55 and 62; Managing Indoor Air Quality Professional organizations should focus on improving their programs and require insurance and then let the insurance companies that are the experts in risk assessment decide what is a risky practice (conflict of interest, subcontractor with non-insured consultants, etc.) According to the AmIAQC web site: There have been over 40 members of the AmIAQ/IAQA who have attained insurance through this program with an average savings of over 15% from their previous policy. That's out of 5000+ members! Don, please understand that in FLA if you do any contracting without a license ... THEY ARREST YOU. Rosen, Ph.D www.Mold-Books.com Mold Insurance> > Group,> > With all the talk about conflicts of interest and impropriety ... hasn't anyone questioned why most consultants and contractors have NO mold insurance? S520 clearly recommends mold insurance but you don't need it to be listed on the IICRC web site. You don't need it to be on the IAQA or AmIAQC web sites. > > This all sounds very disingenuous to me. > > It is my belief that because professional associations don't enforce the insurance requirement, states like FLA are taking things into their own hands and coming out with their own licensing programs that require insurance.> > As a result this can become a big hardship for some contractors that work in many states due to the cost of state licensing, training, continuing ed etc.> > Surely requiring contractors to be insured in order to claim they are certified would solve many if not most of the issues about bogus activities. For example, with a $1M min iinsurance policy a client with a gripe can get an attorney to make a claim on the consultant's E & O policy. No iinsurance = No work.> > Rosen, Ph.D.> www.Mold-Books. com> > > > > > Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?> Check out new cars at Yahoo! Autos. > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ __> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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