Re: HELP--Need baby formula recommendation

May 18, 2005

I know that some women are deeply offended when I compare human reproduction

to my experience as a dog breeder, but I'll take the risk.

I don't know where you live, but if you can get goat's milk, it is often

called " the universal milk " because pretty much all mammals can be raised on

it. I've used it for orphaned puppies and kittens, and I know many people

who have used it on orphaned wild animals as well as dogs, cats, and horses.

I myself would hesitate to give a " formula " of any kind - by which I mean

even a homemade formula, anything with multiple ingredients - to a baby for

the same reason I wouldn't want to give it to a puppy: The immature mucosal

lining of the intestine is not ready for foreign proteins. If you truly

cannot give the baby enough to eat from your own breast milk, then obviously

a foreign protein it will have to be, but by using a " formula, " you're

exposing the baby to MANY foreign proteins.

If on the other hand you simply give your baby goat's milk, that's just ONE

foreign protein.

If this becomes a main part of your baby's diet, then clearly it isn't

nutritionally complete and you'll have to use some type of formula (by which

I mean a homemade one from NT), but if it's just a short term stop gap kind

of thing, then I think it should be OK by itself. Bitch's milk is much

richer than goat's milk, and richer than human milk, too, but puppies

still do OK raised on goat's milk.

Of course I don't know where you are, and maybe all you can get is the

hideous ultra-pasteurized goat's milk I see in supermarkets. I have always

been able to buy good raw goat's milk for my puppies, but I live in

California where raw milk is widely and legally available.

I hope I haven't offended you and I wish you the best.

Christie

Caber Feidh ish Deerhounds

Holistically Raising Our Dogs Since 1986

http://www.caberfeidh.com

http://doggedblog.com

May 18, 2005

also try in the group waphb for babies!

On 5/18/05, Carolyn <CarolynMaxson@...> wrote:

> My son is 6 days old and I'm having trouble with my soft breasts not

> wanting to produce milk. I am celiac and so I am going to assume my

> son is too (as it is genetic), so milk from other women is out. My

> Sally Fallon Native Nutrition book is loaned out and I will be trying

> to get it back, but even then I may have great difficulty getting the

> ingredients for a raw animal milk " formula. " I want something non-

> soy, definitely. Does such a product exist? I'm not giving up on

> breastfeeding, I just need to keep him sated and hydrated and

> nourished artificially because I can't do it naturally YET. I'm

> scheduled to see a highly-recommended lactation consultant tomorrow.

> That's all I can think to add at the moment. Please, please, if you

> have a recommendation or info to share, do so. Thank you all!

>

> ~~Carolyn in Austin, Texas

>

May 18, 2005

> I'm not giving up on

>breastfeeding, I just need to keep him sated and hydrated and

>nourished artificially because I can't do it naturally YET. I'm

>scheduled to see a highly-recommended lactation consultant tomorrow.

>That's all I can think to add at the moment. Please, please, if you

>have a recommendation or info to share, do so. Thank you all!

>

>~~Carolyn in Austin, Texas

I don't know what a good formula is, though it is said that in

Russia they use kefir on preemies. I did use kefir on my hard-to-

feed young'un and it worked fine, but he wasn't an infant

at the time. Getting probiotics is good for the baby to develop

gutwise (at least it seems so in mouse studies and some human

studies). Commercial formula is all *sterile* and yogurt has only

acidophilus, which isn't ideal either.

But I can tell you what I was told: even if you can't feed the

kid everything they need, pump or nurse as much as you can.

The immune factors will get to him even if it's just two feedings

a day. I had the same problem: I think now it was partly the Sjogren's

issue and partly that celiacs produce extra prolactin (the hormone

that starts milk production) their entire life, so when it comes time

to REALLY nurse there is some kind of " prolactin resistance " . OK,

well the rest of the hormones get messed up too, so who knows.

If you are on dairy, you might try cutting that out for a bit

and see what happens. Dairy really exacerbates my Sjogren's

symptoms, and the major symptom of THAT is that you don't

produce as much liquid in any of your glands (mammaries being

one such gland). Celiacs are often immunoreactive to casein

too, though I'm not sure of all the reasons why. (You can

get calcium from other sources too, like dried anchovies which

are loaded with good stuff, or from a good supplement or best,

bone meal).

Heidi Jean

May 18, 2005

Christie wrote:

>I don't know where you live, but if you can get goat's milk, it is often

>called " the universal milk " because pretty much all mammals can be raised on

>it. I've used it for orphaned puppies and kittens, and I know many people

>who have used it on orphaned wild animals as well as dogs, cats, and horses.

Goat milk is good stuff: the only caveat is that it lacks enough

folic acid for humans, so they say. Now KEFIRED goat milk is another story ...

the kefir bacteria produce more folic acid and do other nice things.

Humans have a much longer history with goats than with cows,

and I've seen the same thing you have: just about any animal does ok

on goat milk.

BTW our neighbor had a colt whose mother wouldn't nurse him,

and she ran out and brought back a milk goat *in her car*, which

she kept in the backyard feeding it alfalfa hay. Goat cost $100,

which is a darn sight cheaper than infant formula. A milk goat is

about as big as a large dog, is cheaper to feed, less messy, and doesn't bite

or bark. Eats your yard clippings too (if they aren't toxic or sprayed, anyway.

Our goats LOVE thistles and rose bush clippings and blackberry vines).

Heidi Jean

May 19, 2005

Regarding producing breast milk, my wife used Mother's Milk Tea - it helped

boost supply. A friend of ours said the herb Fenugreek was a life saver for

her.

Traditional Medicinals: Organic Mother's Milk

http://tinyurl.com/8n6q9

Fenugreek herb

http://tinyurl.com/94q7q

Dan

---------------------

Message: 22

Date: Thu, 19 May 2005 01:13:14 -0000

From: " Carolyn " <CarolynMaxson@...>

Subject: HELP--Need baby " formula " recommendation

My son is 6 days old and I'm having trouble with my soft breasts not

wanting to produce milk. ... I'm not giving up on

breastfeeding, I just need to keep him sated and hydrated and

nourished artificially because I can't do it naturally YET...

~~Carolyn in Austin, Texas

May 23, 2005

Carolyn,

After vacation I just saw your post. How is the baby doing? I can

sympathize. I'm gluten intolerant and never knew there's a connection

with low-ish breast milk. When Teddy was born in Feb. 04 he nursed

and nursed constantly! Turns out my milk was kind of low. Dr. Cowan

recommended supplementing. Nurse as much as you can but supplement if

you need to. The only goat's milk sold in CA is ultrapasteurized and

he spit it up all the time. The page below from the WAPF site has all

the NT formulas and more, including one based on store formula. If

you can't get good quality milk use a non-milk-based formula, but

don't let your baby be hungry. Good luck, congratulations, and please

let us know how it's going!

Baby Formulas:

http://www.westonaprice.org/children/recipes.html

On why moms may need to supplement breastfeeding, including Sally's

personal story:

http://www.westonaprice.org/children/breastfeed.html

http://www.westonaprice.org/children/saga.html

Group on NT Pregnancy / Babies:

waphb/

Hope to hear from you (although you are certainly exhausted)

Daphne