Re: Gluten Intolerance, continued

[Guest guest]

> connie,

>

> i'm really wondering about something.

>

> what you said, you are implying then that gluten is not a food per

se

> as we can't digest it, that no one can digest it.

>

> and yet gluten is in so many foods...taking away grains containing

> gluten from the human race would take away a LOT of food.

>

> there is something i really want to know and i will probably be

> jumped on here.

>

> SOMETHING is missing here. gluten is in a lot of worldwide

> foods...yet we can't digest it.

>

> first of all, is this REALLY true? either it is or it isn't.

A. Gluten is not the only thing in wheat (and spelt and that other

ancient wheat), rye and barley (three genetically related grasses,

not related to corn, rice, millet, teff, quinoa, buckwheat,

amaranth. The main reason grains are eaten is for the

starch/carbohydrates, not for the protein (for that the world

prefers meat and/or beans)

B. Wheat was first raised in the Fertile Crescent (Iraq, Iran,

Israel, Egypt) about 10,000 years ago. Before that it was a food

available only in the mountains near there and only in the Fall,

eaten mainly by birds and small rodents and possibly ancient sheep

and goats. It only started to be human food about the same time

that civilization and slavery started (it takes a good bit of

organization and unpleasant labor to produce quantities large enough

to last a whole year for many people). The grain silos were the

first treasure houses and the men who controled them controled the

whole tribe.

C. The Stanford scientists who are today trying to find something

that will break down the gliadin protein chain, would not be making

a recombinant peptide (a difficult process involving genetic

engineering) if something simplier would do. They looked.

D. IMHO the whole reason that gliadin evolved in these grasses is to

protect the seed (Like the bran and the husk, eaten whole usually,

not made into flour) on its trip through the animal's system on the

way to deposition in a lovely fertile pile of manure. The genetic

imperative of any seed/egg/sperm of any species is to make more of

itself and have more of those survive. So it stands to reason that

gliadin would not easily break down. I'm not even sure if wheat will

break down in a 2-stomached ruminant. Anybody know?

Connie

[Guest guest]

>>>>>>>>>>>> getting more and more

thirsty and having a weird taste in your mouth and

have to pee a lot ... but you don't know what is the

problem. Your doctor tells you " it's normal for a lot

of people " so you ignore it and read books about

your body's need for water. Then your eyes start

going bad. By the time you get diagnosed, you have

permanent damage.

Heidi >>>>>>>>

Hi Heidi, As you know I'm still pretty new to the gluten intolerance camp. I

hadn't heard about the weird taste in your mouth, thirst and eye thing. I

have all three. The symptoms are bothersome but I had no idea what they were

related to. You mention these symptoms here in terms of diabetics but are

you suggesting they often hold true for celiacs as well? Thanks. ~Robin

[Guest guest]

> So it stands to reason that

>gliadin would not easily break down. I'm not even sure if wheat will

>break down in a 2-stomached ruminant. Anybody know?

>

>Connie

Ruminants love grains, and eat them whenever they

can. They do break down ... but if they get too many

of said grains the ruminant dies, mainly because the starch

portion feeds the bacteria incorrectly. Ruminants do

most of their digestion via bacterial fermentation,

but the bacteria normally don't get much starch. So

ruminants that are fed high starch diets (like the grain

fed steer) get antibiotics in their feed to keep them

alive.

As for whether or not they can digest the gliadin

fraction ... I don't know! I'd guess it depends on

what bacteria are present ... there are some that

can digest gliadin fully. Cow bacteria can digest

cellulose though, which humans certainly can't!

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

>Hi Heidi, As you know I'm still pretty new to the gluten intolerance camp. I

>hadn't heard about the weird taste in your mouth, thirst and eye thing. I

>have all three. The symptoms are bothersome but I had no idea what they were

>related to. You mention these symptoms here in terms of diabetics but are

>you suggesting they often hold true for celiacs as well? Thanks. ~Robin

I'm not really up on those symptoms in terms

of diabetes. I can say that I was ALWAYS thirsty,

and had dry eyes with blurry vision, and dry mouth etc,

and those all were, as it turns out, from Sjogren's. Sjogren's

is commonly related to gluten intolerance. Good thing

too, because there is no cure for Sjogren's but there

is a treatment for GI. I had figured the dry mouth

etc. was just " age " so I wrote it off, but amazingly the

symptoms all went away when I went GFCF.

mentioned the same symptoms in terms of

diabetes, that she feels them when her blood sugar

is high.

I don't know if there is a connection ... Sjogren's is FAR

different than diabetes, as to how it works. Given

XYZ symptoms, the only way to really know the cause

is with testing. If a person is worried about high blood

sugar though, these days it's really easy to test that ... just

get a glucometer!

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

> B. Wheat was first raised in the Fertile Crescent (Iraq, Iran,

> Israel, Egypt) about 10,000 years ago. Before that it was a food

> available only in the mountains near there and only in the Fall,

> eaten mainly by birds and small rodents and possibly ancient sheep

> and goats.

Interesting point. Perhaps it was actually beneficial to eat grain

foods in the fall, since it led to the storage of calories as fat due

to the action of insulin.

> It only started to be human food about the same time

> that civilization and slavery started (it takes a good bit of

> organization and unpleasant labor to produce quantities large

enough

> to last a whole year for many people). The grain silos were the

> first treasure houses and the men who controled them controled the

> whole tribe.

>

Sounds like pyramids to me. ;-)

Or were the pyramids found throughout the world simply the sort

of " first national banks and temples " of the area, while the grain

storage silos were different structures? Pyramids sure did seem like

structures meant to serve as centers of control, and insurance

against catastrophic acts of god...at least for the controllers, even

if not the entire populace. It seems that many of them were located

near rivers, which probably flooded often enough to provide water for

grain cultivation, but might occasionally flood high enough to

threaten the people. I can imagine the leaders ended up being saved

at the top of the pyramid, and lots of regular people ended up being

drowned or washed away in such flood events.

Heh. " Get all you can. Can all you get. Sit on the can. And

poison the rest. " :-S

> D. IMHO the whole reason that gliadin evolved in these grasses is

to

> protect the seed (Like the bran and the husk, eaten whole usually,

> not made into flour) on its trip through the animal's system on the

> way to deposition in a lovely fertile pile of manure. The genetic

> imperative of any seed/egg/sperm of any species is to make more of

> itself and have more of those survive. So it stands to reason that

> gliadin would not easily break down. I'm not even sure if wheat

will

> break down in a 2-stomached ruminant. Anybody know?

>

> Connie

Your opinion sounds realistic to me. The next time we go to check

cattle, I will check the cow patties to look for whole grains. I

think I have seen the occasional whole kernel of corn, but I haven't

looked closely enough to see whether there are whole kernels of wheat

in them.