Re: eggs and arachadonic acid-(Sears)

[Guest guest]

Hi

I was going over some older posts and came upon this

one. I saw Dr. Sears on a talk show the other day

with another new book. Where is he getting his

information? From what studies? How can he and

others of the medical establishment be so wrong about

eggs? Doesn't he read the current research? Or is

he partially right about the arachadonic/ eiconsonoid

issue? Is there some truth in it?

Can anyone shed some light on this?

jafa

>

> I would say that eating egg whites only is the

> current societal " healthy

> norm " rather than the other way around. When I did

> my first experiment with

> the NHE diet and started eating egg yolks again I

> just absolutely knew that

> my arteries were clogging up with each bite. Dr.

> Sears had told me so.

> Arachadonic acid, eicosonoid imbalance, flipped

> hormonal pathways, yada,

> yada, yada.

>

> How far we have come....

>

> Ron

>

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

I think that he is basing his logic on the true assumption that

arachidonic acid is the direct precursor to inflammatory hormones.

However, most foods that are high in AA are also sources of DGLA,

which is an omega-6 precursor to anti-inflammatory hormones, and egg

yolks from pastured chickens, unlike the supermarket variety, are high

in DHA, which is a precursor to EPA, an omega-3 precursor to

anti-inflammatory hormones.

I also think AA might have some anti-inflammatory byproducts but I'm not sure.

I think the serious flaw in his logic is his general anti-inflammation

stance. Inflammation is a necessary process in the body. I'm not

positive, but I believe that long-chain EFAs are stored in cell

membranes and are used when needed, not simply used no matter what.

So inflammation is a regulated process. I'm sure if you have a

dramatic overabundance of AA in the diet and deficiency of omega-3s

you might have inflammation simpy do to a massive imbalance, but it

seems more reasonable to assume the proper approach is to get

sufficient dietary AA *and* EPA/DHA/DGLA.

I have an article on why egg yolks are great a whites are lame:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/Egg_Yolk.html

And the article " Tripping Down the Prostaglandin Pathways " at the WAPF

site might be helpful on this issue. Not sure the URL, but I think

it's in the " Know Your Fats " section.

Chris

[Guest guest]

Apologies in advance if the personal anecdote I'm about to relate here isn't

relevant to this discussion (I get a bit lost in the science), but when you

talk about egg white and inflammation, this does seem to tie in with an

experience of mine:

Over the last year or so, I have had, three or four times, the frightening

experience of waking up because of being unable to breathe or get my breath

after I've bolted from bed. I had suspected a mild case of sleep apnea, but

I seem to have none of the usual symptoms/hallmarks of that disease, and one

of the symptoms I did get when this happened was a swelling of my nostrils,

and also my upper and lower lips (My mouth felt very " big " and looked fat).

Anyway, the last time it happened, I was able to almost certainly tie it to

egg white and when I did a little research on egg white, I found those my

symptoms fit for an allergy leading to anaphylaxis (though my reaction is

comparatively slight and happens only about 4 hours after ingestion.)

For the last year or so I've been eating raw egg yolks only, disliking the

white and wanting to avoid any possibility of biotin destruction (I need

all the B vitamins I can get). I think now the few times I had this

experience was because I had either slipped up in allowing some white into

the yolks or I had applied some egg white to my face.

FWIW.

http://www.taichi4seniors.com

[Guest guest]

On 8/7/05, West <clairewest@...> wrote:

> Anyway, the last time it happened, I was able to almost certainly tie it to

> egg white and when I did a little research on egg white, I found those my

> symptoms fit for an allergy leading to anaphylaxis (though my reaction is

> comparatively slight and happens only about 4 hours after ingestion.)

Interesting story. Allergies are another source of inflammation

entirely independent of what Sears is discussing, and help put the

issue into perspective.

Chris

[Guest guest]

Hi Jafa,

> I was going over some older posts and came upon this

> one. I saw Dr. Sears on a talk show the other day

> with another new book. Where is he getting his

> information? From what studies? How can he and

> others of the medical establishment be so wrong about

> eggs? Doesn't he read the current research? Or is

> he partially right about the arachadonic/ eiconsonoid

> issue? Is there some truth in it?

>

> Can anyone shed some light on this?

Those are good questions and ones I've wondered about for a couple of years.

I have a friend who actually knows Dr. Sears fairly well. They did some

work together years ago. He has told me that Sears will acknowledge

privately that saturated fats are not bad for you, so that calls into

question just about anything that he writes, eh?

OTOH, I have met Sears and seen him speak. He also helped my wife deal with

some fish oil difficulties when we were first starting on that regimen. He

has an eidetic memory and remembers almost every study that he's ever read.

I think that he comes by his conclusions about arachadonic acid honestly.

I'm not sure how he gets there and I've seen transcripts of him debating

that specific issue with other experts although he never said anything that

lead me to believe he was correct.

So, not much help but I'll be interested to see if anyone else has give you

any better info as I wade through the posts.

Ron

>

> jafa

> >

> > I would say that eating egg whites only is the

> > current societal " healthy

> > norm " rather than the other way around. When I did

> > my first experiment with

> > the NHE diet and started eating egg yolks again I

> > just absolutely knew that

> > my arteries were clogging up with each bite. Dr.

> > Sears had told me so.

> > Arachadonic acid, eicosonoid imbalance, flipped

> > hormonal pathways, yada,

> > yada, yada.

> >

> > How far we have come....

> >

> > Ron

> >

> >

> >

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

On 8/10/05, RBJR <rbjr@...> wrote:

> Those are good questions and ones I've wondered about for a couple of

> years.

> I have a friend who actually knows Dr. Sears fairly well. They did some

> work together years ago. He has told me that Sears will acknowledge

> privately that saturated fats are not bad for you, so that calls into

> question just about anything that he writes, eh?

Why? When I read _The Zone_, I believe what he wrote was that

saturated fats are largely irrelevant from the eicosanoid picture, but

that some of the " bad " animal foods should be avoided because of their

arachidonic acid content.

Chris

--

Want the other side of the cholesterol story?

Find out what your doctor isn't telling you:

http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com

[Guest guest]

Hi

> He has told me that Sears will acknowledge

> > privately that saturated fats are not bad for you, so that

> calls into

> > question just about anything that he writes, eh?

>

> Why? When I read _The Zone_, I believe what he wrote was that

> saturated fats are largely irrelevant from the eicosanoid picture, but

> that some of the " bad " animal foods should be avoided because of their

> arachidonic acid content.

You may be correct about his original comments in _Enter the Zone_ as my

memory is not as good as yours. I can tell you for certain, though, that he

no longer takes that benign of an approach in his lectures and public

appearances. He attacks saturated fats as much as Willet and the rest.

Perhaps he's changed his mind and is dealing honestly now, but I don't know.

There was also one specific event in my Zone history that really caused me

to increase my frustration level with him. My wife and son and I were doing

the diet religiously with no cheating for several months back in 1996, I

believe. My son was wrestling and was having a very difficult time eating

all of the food that was necessary at 20 blocks per day as we ate zero

unfavorable carbs. It's almost impossible to eat 6 blocks of fibrous

veggies in one sitting. So we called the support line and they told us to

simply increase his " good fat " intake. So in that one moment all of the

Zone orthodoxy that was so religiously promulgated that the low calorie

40/30/30 was the end all and be all of diets was destroyed in my mind. The

Zone was actually a higher or high fat diet in maintenance mode. Low cal

was fine for fat loss but in the face of heavy exercise or excessive weight

loss you increased the fat ratio. Had Sears presented his diet that way in

the book either before or since that time I would have been fine with it but

I lost a substantial amount of respect for his honesty when he continues to

deny the fact that there are really two Zone diets.

Despite all of that, the guy saved my life. I still think the Zone is a fine

diet for most people to lose weight on in a reasonably healthy way.

Ron