Re: Diet advice for obesity? was Leptin (sorry, very long)

[Guest guest]

> I forget if you've had him allergy tested ... the

> York saliva test is easy, and with all this talk about IgG being a

pretty

> good indicator for IgA that would be one route. It's a lot easier

> to ditch allergens than it is to restrict food in general.

>

Yes, we've had IgG tests for 93 foods, and IgG and IgA for gliadin.

The gliadin tests were negative for both of us. The other results

were banded as " safe " , " eat no more than once every 4 days "

and " avoid " . DH's foods to avoid were: Cola nut, wheat, barley, rye,

pineapple, cows milk. He decided then to avoid these things. he is

now off the Diet Cokde (and I genuinely believe him on that one as he

made the decision, and he keeps telling me how many weeks free of it

he's been and is proud of himself). He openly avoids gluten in front

of me , except recently when we were on holiday. However, I suspect

that MacD is what is eating secretly, so he won't really be gluten or

dairy free.

Jo

[Guest guest]

Jo-

> Curry houses abound in most UK towns and cities, and

>generally use very cheap ingredients. I doubt anyone much cares about

>exactly what's in the ingredients, except me.

I'm sure that's true here too. It's too bad, because the curried goat at

Sisters is indescribably delicious.

-

[Guest guest]

> I once asked if the mushroom pakora had any wheat flour or gluten,

and

> was told no, just gram flour. 24 hours later, I had a definite

wheat

> reaction to that meal!!!

>

> Jo

I thought gram flour WAS whole wheat flour as in graham crackers.

Or gram as in " small seed including lentils and barley " ??

some of this is my lack of vocabulary.

Connie

[Guest guest]

Jo-

>And as he's not

>starving there's really only 1 explanation.

Well, look on the bright side -- it's better than a brain tumor! <g>

> >I'm not saying you're

> > wrong to want to push him to work on his health, because as your husband I

> > think he has a reasonable obligation to not die on you prematurely or

> > destroy your life with his medical problems,

>

>Glad I'm not the only one who thinks that! lol!

It can be difficult to find a workable balance. The only thing that works

for my girlfriend and me is to basically pretend the issue doesn't

exist. She thinks her health and diet are none of my business. I

disagree, but trying to make it my business doesn't work. So she's

convinced I'm headed for an octuple bypass and I know she's destroying

herself almost as thoroughly as possible. So it goes.

>We've done this a couple or 3 times since he started gaining weight.

>He stuck to it for a couple of weeks, and did lose weight (back

>before he got too heavy for the scales) then it seemed to stop

>working for him. Now I think we know why! When it stopped working

>he also went back to ordinary low carb in front of me. Then just

>carried on gaining.

Ah, that's too bad, though sometimes temptation strikes more effectively

when there's something wrong with macronutrient ratios or some

micronutrient is missing or present in insufficient quantities.

>It is made with ghee, so I've wondered if that's the problem.

Why would ghee be a problem? Microscopic traces of casein...?

>I've

>never made curry at home, so don't have a control test to use. I

>even gain weight if all I have is a small portion of saag bhaji

>(curried spinach) so it's not to do with the volume. The bhaji is

>literally just spinach, ghee, and herbs and spices - there's no sauce

>of any kind, no yoghurt marinade etc. It's a pity, cos I love curry!

Well, Deanna's probably right about there being starch in there. I'm going

to have to learn to make better curries myself, and maybe you should

experiment yourself since you evidently love it as much as I do.

-

[Guest guest]

Hi Jo,

>Hi Deanna

>

>There could be a whole host of things in the curry that the staff don't

>know about. Curry houses abound in most UK towns and cities, and

>generally use very cheap ingredients. I doubt anyone much cares about

>exactly what's in the ingredients, except me.

>

>I once asked if the mushroom pakora had any wheat flour or gluten, and

>was told no, just gram flour. 24 hours later, I had a definite wheat

>reaction to that meal!!!

>

Yes, exactly. I remember the Indian restaurants prevalent when I lived

in Suffolk. But yes, it is probably ignorance on the part of staff, so

you get a wheat dose and they think it is wheat free. So, , it may

not be a matter of honesty, but rather knowledge, lol.

Best to get a nice cookbook and do your own Indian food. Grinding

spices for immediate use has no match for aroma and intense flavor, also.

Deanna

[Guest guest]

>Yes, we've had IgG tests for 93 foods, and IgG and IgA for gliadin.

>The gliadin tests were negative for both of us. The other results

>were banded as " safe " , " eat no more than once every 4 days "

>and " avoid " . DH's foods to avoid were: Cola nut, wheat, barley, rye,

>pineapple, cows milk. He decided then to avoid these things. he is

>now off the Diet Cokde (and I genuinely believe him on that one as he

>made the decision, and he keeps telling me how many weeks free of it

>he's been and is proud of himself). He openly avoids gluten in front

>of me , except recently when we were on holiday. However, I suspect

>that MacD is what is eating secretly, so he won't really be gluten or

>dairy free.

>

>Jo

OK, that rings a bell. I think the other issue was that he was on

a very low carb diet previously, so he wouldn't have been eating

a lot of the allergenic carbs anyway (seems like most of the allergens

ARE carbs, except milk).

McD's is an interesting case, btw. A kid I know just lost 60 lbs.

He had been wheat-free for a long time before that, and had

lost his bloating but was still overweight. He was eating at McD's,

but was NOT eating the hamburger buns. Then he gave up beef,

because he got afraid of BSE, and now only eats pork (mostly pork ribs).

He dropped the weight immediately! He is not eating low carb or

low fat, he just won't eat beef and he won't eat at restaurants.

He does eat a lot of processed foods, including GF cookies.

His Mom thinks the problem is the hormones in beef ... I can't

argue that since hamburger is often from old dairy cows, so

it may well be full of hormones, but I really don't know what

to make of it, except I saw it with my own eyes. If in fact

hormones are the problem, then anyone who has a weight

problem that is eating a lot of commercial beef or milk products

might have that same issue.

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

On 8/4/05, Connie Hampton <connie@...> wrote:

>

> > I once asked if the mushroom pakora had any wheat flour or gluten,

> and

> > was told no, just gram flour. 24 hours later, I had a definite

> wheat

> > reaction to that meal!!!

> >

> > Jo

>

> I thought gram flour WAS whole wheat flour as in graham crackers.

> Or gram as in " small seed including lentils and barley " ??

> some of this is my lack of vocabulary.

Most people's understanding of flour is rather unspophisticated. I

bought graham flour once, and it was whole wheat flour with I think

some corn flour and something else added in. Since it is called

something other than " wheat flour " some people probably don't notice

there is wheat flour in it. This is complicated by the fact that bread

companies will only call their bread " wheat bread " if it has some of

the germ added back into it.

So I think there are probably an awful lot of people who don't even

realize that " white bread " is made out of " wheat. "

Chris

[Guest guest]

> > > I once asked if the mushroom pakora had any wheat flour or gluten,

> > and

> > > was told no, just gram flour. 24 hours later, I had a definite

> > wheat

> > > reaction to that meal!!!

> > >

> > > Jo

> >

> > I thought gram flour WAS whole wheat flour as in graham crackers.

> > Or gram as in " small seed including lentils and barley " ??

> > some of this is my lack of vocabulary.

>

> Most people's understanding of flour is rather unspophisticated. I

> bought graham flour once, and it was whole wheat flour with I think

> some corn flour and something else added in. Since it is called

> something other than " wheat flour " some people probably don't notice

> there is wheat flour in it. This is complicated by the fact that bread

> companies will only call their bread " wheat bread " if it has some of

> the germ added back into it.

>

> So I think there are probably an awful lot of people who don't even

> realize that " white bread " is made out of " wheat. "

Jo means gram flour, just like she said. It's chickpea flour, used in

Indian cooking.

[Guest guest]

>Jo means gram flour, just like she said. It's chickpea flour, used in

>Indian cooking.

>

Isn't that also called besan?

Deanna

[Guest guest]

>

>

> His Mom thinks the problem is the hormones in beef ... I can't

> argue that since hamburger is often from old dairy cows, so

> it may well be full of hormones, but I really don't know what

> to make of it, except I saw it with my own eyes. If in fact

> hormones are the problem, then anyone who has a weight

> problem that is eating a lot of commercial beef or milk products

> might have that same issue.

>

Heidi

The hormone theory in US beef makes sense, but in the UK, cows are

not given bovine growth hormone (thank goodness!). Obviously when I

buy beef it's grass fed and raised using sustainable farming

methods. I don't actually know where MacD in the UK gets its beef

from, but it won't be full of BGH as it's not approved for use here.

He lost a lot of weight when he was eating beef regularly before, so

I don't think is the issue for him - at least not an issue causing

200lbs weight gain.

Jo

[Guest guest]

> Isn't that also called besan?

Deanna,

yup.

B.

(HBHS)

[Guest guest]

On 8/5/05, downwardog7 <illneverbecool@...> wrote:

> Jo means gram flour, just like she said. It's chickpea flour, used in

> Indian cooking.

Oh. I've never heard of that. If she explained it, I must have

missed that post.

Chris

[Guest guest]

>He lost a lot of weight when he was eating beef regularly before, so

>I don't think is the issue for him - at least not an issue causing

>200lbs weight gain.

>

>Jo

Maybe not in Englend .. and I don't even know if the hormones are the issue

*here*. I have *no* idea what it is about McD food ... the guy in

Supersize Me go sooooo sick off it in a month, which is far

faster than you would expect from just, say, lack of nutrients.

I've always figured it was the gluten in the buns though (there

is LOTS of gluten I think, in those puffy buns!) and to hear a

good counterexample floors me. Maybe it's MSG, or all

those trans fats, or the pop, or some unknown something. Anyway, cheating

on a diet is bad, but cheating at McD's is like, grievous!

A hamburger there is far worse, IMO, than a cooked bit of

beef on some good bread at home, and I can't even tell

you why that is.

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

Heidi,

>Maybe not in Englend .. and I don't even know if the hormones are the issue

>*here*. I have *no* idea what it is about McD food ... the guy in

>Supersize Me go sooooo sick off it in a month, which is far

>faster than you would expect from just, say, lack of nutrients.

>I've always figured it was the gluten in the buns though (there

>is LOTS of gluten I think, in those puffy buns!) and to hear a

>good counterexample floors me. Maybe it's MSG, or all

>those trans fats, or the pop, or some unknown something.

>

Now now, let's not forget GMO soy included (at least) in the beef, food

additives, and pesticide residue. I think you've already touched on the

hormone and antibiotic load in the meat earlier. But yeah, it's all

that junk. The unknown possibilities are really scary to contemplate

when the stuff we know is bad enough!

Deanna

[Guest guest]

At 04:39 PM 8/5/2005, you wrote:

>Now now, let's not forget GMO soy included (at least) in the beef, food

>additives, and pesticide residue. I think you've already touched on the

>hormone and antibiotic load in the meat earlier. But yeah, it's all

>that junk. The unknown possibilities are really scary to contemplate

>when the stuff we know is bad enough!

>

>Deanna

The thing that gets me is, GMO soy, additives, pesticides, etc.

are in ALL the supermarket food. The guy in " Supersize Me "

was hardly an epitome of health food eating in his normal

life. So why did he get SOOO sick after a month of McD's that

his doctor wanted him to stop his experiment? Technically

speaking, the McD diet isn't *that* imbalanced: there has to be

some other factor to really throw him off so badly. (Spurlock

blames the fat: but obviously a lot of us eat more fat than

is in a McD meal).

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

> The thing that gets me is, GMO soy, additives, pesticides, etc.

> are in ALL the supermarket food. The guy in " Supersize Me "

> was hardly an epitome of health food eating in his normal

> life. So why did he get SOOO sick after a month of McD's that

> his doctor wanted him to stop his experiment? Technically

> speaking, the McD diet isn't *that* imbalanced: there has to be

> some other factor to really throw him off so badly. (Spurlock

> blames the fat: but obviously a lot of us eat more fat than

> is in a McD meal).

>

>

> Heidi Jean

Yeah, but how long has that fat been sitting in the deep fryer and

whatelse got in there with it? And what happens to the metal that

the fryer is made of? Does whatever that is change when the fat

gets rancid? And then when they clean it, does the detergent really

get out of there before they put in new fat and heat it up?

Connie

[Guest guest]

>Yeah, but how long has that fat been sitting in the deep fryer and

>whatelse got in there with it? And what happens to the metal that

>the fryer is made of? Does whatever that is change when the fat

>gets rancid? And then when they clean it, does the detergent really

>get out of there before they put in new fat and heat it up?

>

>Connie

That's along the lines I've been thinking ... plus the

fact those fries are fried HOT so make more acrylamides,

and the potatoes are specially treated (not in a horribly

bad way, but who knows?). Plus it's all Omega 6 fat, I think?

(Soy and corn oil are what they sell for commercial frying).

There might be something weird about the beef too ...

and the milkshakes, made with dried milk powder I think.

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

Keep in mind also that Spurlock's fiancee is a vegan chef, so I

doubt he ate a lot of fat/meat to begin with. We showed " SuperSize Me "

to our 7-year-old and she actively loathes Mc's.

Lynn S.

------

Lynn Siprelle * web developer, writer, mama, fiber junky

http://www.siprelle.com * http://www.thenewhomemaker.com

http://www.deanspeaksforme.com * http://www.knitting911.net

[Guest guest]

>>The thing that gets me is, GMO soy, additives, pesticides, etc.

>>are in ALL the supermarket food. The guy in " Supersize Me "

>>was hardly an epitome of health food eating in his normal

>>life. So why did he get SOOO sick after a month of McD's that

>>his doctor wanted him to stop his experiment? Technically

>>speaking, the McD diet isn't *that* imbalanced: there has to be

>>some other factor to really throw him off so badly. (Spurlock

>>blames the fat: but obviously a lot of us eat more fat than

>>is in a McD meal).

>>

>>

>>Heidi Jean

>>

>>

Good point. Of course, " Supersize Me " wasn't controlled or anything

either, was it?

>

>Yeah, but how long has that fat been sitting in the deep fryer and

>whatelse got in there with it? And what happens to the metal that

>the fryer is made of? Does whatever that is change when the fat

>gets rancid? And then when they clean it, does the detergent really

>get out of there before they put in new fat and heat it up?

>

A good observation. Most restaurants cook with aluminum as well. From

the classy to the trashy, it seems.

Deanna

[Guest guest]

Deanna

>Good point. Of course, " Supersize Me " wasn't controlled or anything

>either, was it?

No, and as others have pointed out, he was doing it to make a FILM

too, and a humorous one at that. That kind of thing just makes

me curious. Like the guy on the PBS special who lost 30 lbs

and had constant diarrhea from converting to the " pioneer "

lifestyle (I blame that one on bread and too much exercise,

myself, but the docs found nothing wrong with him).

>

Heidi

[Guest guest]

Lynn,

>Keep in mind also that Spurlock's fiancee is a vegan chef, so I

>doubt he ate a lot of fat/meat to begin with. We showed " SuperSize Me "

>to our 7-year-old and she actively loathes Mc's.

>

Righto! His stuff is major in vegan circles. PCRM still sends me their

mag, and there's the SM DVD for sale on the back pages of it.

Deanna

[Guest guest]

>-----Original Message-----

>From:

>[mailto: ]On Behalf Of jopollack2001

He'll be miserable (particularly as I said he

>shouldn't be drinking 4L of fizzy water a day but try to cut down on

>the bubbles!)

There's always Gerolsteiner or other bubbly mineral waters!

Suze Fisher

Lapdog Design, Inc.

Web Design & Development

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze3shjg

Weston A. Price Foundation Chapter Leader, Mid Coast Maine

http://www.westonaprice.org

----------------------------

“The diet-heart idea (the idea that saturated fats and cholesterol cause

heart disease) is the greatest scientific deception of our times.” --

Mann, MD, former Professor of Medicine and Biochemistry at Vanderbilt

University, Tennessee; heart disease researcher.

The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics

<http://www.thincs.org>

----------------------------