Re: help for acid reflux in infants?

[Guest guest]

>hi all,

>anyone w/ experience w/ this? would you recommend same type of diet

>for nursing mom as you would for an adult experiencing acid reflux?

>baby is only 3 weeks old. possible gluten or casein allergy for mom?

>thanks!

>lisa

Reflux in a nursing kid is often due to the mother's diet, and

I've read a lot of accounts of it being gluten or casein. However,

it's also the case that babies don't have a stomach that closes

very well, they throw up a LOT. Usually they don't get " acid "

reflux because their stomach isn't very acidic.

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

,

I'd never thought about it that way, but GERD and spitting up in

infants are really the same thing: a weak sphincter muscle at the

lower end of the esophagus that doesn't seal off the stomach contents

completely. In adults it's usually a result of a poor diet. In infants

you just have to wait until the muscle matures. You can try

eliminating foods that you think might irritate your baby, but don't

be surprised if it doesn't make any difference. Since you're nursing

at least you'll be able to get the spit-up stains out of your clothes

and couch. (I've heard that formula stains are hard to get out.) Chalk

up another reason to breast feed. My three kids spat up A LOT,

especially my oldest son. He didn't stop completely til he was at

least 1 year old - maybe more. Ask the baby's grandmothers, I bet it

runs in the family on at least one side. Bottom line, if the baby

doesn't seem upset when it happens, even if it is a large volume, or

happens frequently (small amounts all day long) it's probably not

anything to worry about.

Hope that helps!

Jan

> anyone w/ experience w/ this? would you recommend same type of diet

> for nursing mom as you would for an adult experiencing acid reflux?

> baby is only 3 weeks old. possible gluten or casein allergy for mom?

> thanks!

> lisa

[Guest guest]

My son had massive reflux problems & after 6 months of hell we

finally figured out he had severe food allergies. Once I modified my

diet (he had not started solids yet at this point) it stopped 100%

and life became easy again.

His first allergy was to egg whites, something I would have never

suspected without an allergist. A month later he developed a whey

allergy, which we are still dealing with 2 years later.

If the baby seems uncomfortable at all, I think that is a sign that

something is amiss. Breastmilk is easily digestible & perfect food,

shouldnt cause any problems unless there is a flaw in the system.

Dont forget not lying baby down right after nursing, slings are

wonderful for this. And if you are looking for allergy in a babe,

their are other tell-tale signs(though not every child might have

them of course). Such as red, flaky patches on the skin(eczema),

watery eyes, a red ring on his bum, diaper rash that just wont quit,

you get the idea!

>

> hi all,

> anyone w/ experience w/ this? would you recommend same type of diet

> for nursing mom as you would for an adult experiencing acid reflux?

> baby is only 3 weeks old. possible gluten or casein allergy for

mom?

> thanks!

> lisa

[Guest guest]

Hi! I haven't posted here yet, but am thoroughly enjoying all the posts.

Thought I'd chime in here because I have a baby with reflux too. My baby is

currently 21 months, but he's had reflux for his whole life - fairly

severely.

Turned out he had multiple food intolerances and had I known then what I

know now, I would have started pulling allergens out of my diet. My son

cannot have casein, gluten, soy, tomatoes, and vinegar. We put him on

Neocate formula (after the doctors told me to stop breastfeeding him - which

I believed, biggest mistake of my life *grumble*)

We also had him sleep in a bouncy chair (not car seat) for the first 8

months of his life. I also never put him flat on his back except to change

his diaper - he vomited every time I did. I carried him around in a carrier

when he wasn't in his bouncy so he wouldn't have to be laying down flat.

He's currently on SCD diet for severe malabsorption problems (not related to

reflux as far as we can tell, parallel problems) and is basically back on

baby food at this point. He's doing quite well on it and we see no spitups,

but I hear a gurgle every now and then so I know the reflux is still there.

Hope that helps.

Alese

_____

From: [mailto:sturnwald@...]

Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2005 9:24 PM

Subject: Re: help for acid reflux in infants?

My son had massive reflux problems & after 6 months of hell we

finally figured out he had severe food allergies. Once I modified my

diet (he had not started solids yet at this point) it stopped 100%

and life became easy again.

His first allergy was to egg whites, something I would have never

suspected without an allergist. A month later he developed a whey

allergy, which we are still dealing with 2 years later.

If the baby seems uncomfortable at all, I think that is a sign that

something is amiss. Breastmilk is easily digestible & perfect food,

shouldnt cause any problems unless there is a flaw in the system.

Dont forget not lying baby down right after nursing, slings are

wonderful for this. And if you are looking for allergy in a babe,

their are other tell-tale signs(though not every child might have

them of course). Such as red, flaky patches on the skin(eczema),

watery eyes, a red ring on his bum, diaper rash that just wont quit,

you get the idea!

>

> hi all,

> anyone w/ experience w/ this? would you recommend same type of diet

> for nursing mom as you would for an adult experiencing acid reflux?

> baby is only 3 weeks old. possible gluten or casein allergy for

mom?

> thanks!

> lisa

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_____

[Guest guest]

Gluten and/or dairy intolerance can create reflux for baby through Mom's diet.

Definitely recommend going GF/CF and see what happens. But she must give it a

while to work; it won't get all out of her system in only a few days !

Rebekah

help for acid reflux in infants?

hi all,

anyone w/ experience w/ this? would you recommend same type of diet

for nursing mom as you would for an adult experiencing acid reflux?

baby is only 3 weeks old. possible gluten or casein allergy for mom?

thanks!

lisa

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[Guest guest]

As far as I know, casein stays in system for 4 days, gluten can remain in

system for up to 8 months.

Alese

_____

From: Rebekah Dowd [mailto:rmdowd13@...]

Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2005 12:17 PM

Subject: Re: help for acid reflux in infants?

Gluten and/or dairy intolerance can create reflux for baby through Mom's

diet. Definitely recommend going GF/CF and see what happens. But she must

give it a while to work; it won't get all out of her system in only a few

days !

Rebekah

help for acid reflux in infants?

hi all,

anyone w/ experience w/ this? would you recommend same type of diet

for nursing mom as you would for an adult experiencing acid reflux?

baby is only 3 weeks old. possible gluten or casein allergy for mom?

thanks!

lisa

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--

[Guest guest]

> As far as I know, casein stays in system for 4 days, gluten can remain in

> system for up to 8 months.

Does the gluten adhere to the intestinal wall for up to 8 months, or does

it have other hiding places?

Are there specific gluten destroying enzymes a person could take to

speed up elimination of gluten?

Darrell

[Guest guest]

Alese-

>As far as I know, casein stays in system for 4 days, gluten can remain in

>system for up to 8 months.

That seems kind of, well, strange. Where'd you hear it?

-

[Guest guest]

I don't know the specific mechanics of it, but that seems to be the

prevailing theory in the gluten free/casein free diet circles. It's the

reason why they recommend being on the diet for several months before

deciding whether or not it's working.

Alese

_____

From: Darrell [mailto:lazlo75501@...]

Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2005 1:19 PM

@...

Subject: Re: RE: help for acid reflux in infants?

> As far as I know, casein stays in system for 4 days, gluten can remain in

> system for up to 8 months.

Does the gluten adhere to the intestinal wall for up to 8 months, or does

it have other hiding places?

Are there specific gluten destroying enzymes a person could take to

speed up elimination of gluten?

Darrell

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_____

[Guest guest]

HOW DID YOU IDENTIFY WHICH FOODS HE WAS ALLERGIC TO? ARE THERE

SPECIFIC ALLERGY TESTS YOU WOULD RECOMMEND OR DID YOU DO AN

ELIMINATION DIET?

IT'S INTERESTING, BUT WHEN I POSTED THIS MESSAGE YESTERDAY, I WAS

ASKING FOR MY SISTER WHO JUST HAD A BABY, BUT ALAS, IT LOOKS LIKE I AM

STARTING TO SEE SYMPTOMS IN MY NEWBORN JUST IN THE LAST 48 HOURS!

THANKS,

LISA

My son had massive reflux problems & after 6 months of hell we

finally figured out he had severe food allergies. Once I modified my

diet (he had not started solids yet at this point) it stopped 100%

and life became easy again.

[Guest guest]

Hi Alese,

Thanks for your response--it really helps to get everyone's input.

Sorry to hear about your baby. How did you find out what he was

allergic to?

Thanks,

>

> Hi! I haven't posted here yet, but am thoroughly enjoying all the

posts.

> Thought I'd chime in here because I have a baby with reflux too. My

baby is

> currently 21 months, but he's had reflux for his whole life - fairly

> severely.

>

>

>

> Turned out he had multiple food intolerances and had I known then what I

> know now, I would have started pulling allergens out of my diet. My son

> cannot have casein, gluten, soy, tomatoes, and vinegar. We put him on

> Neocate formula (after the doctors told me to stop breastfeeding him

- which

> I believed, biggest mistake of my life *grumble*)

>

>

>

> We also had him sleep in a bouncy chair (not car seat) for the first 8

> months of his life. I also never put him flat on his back except to

change

> his diaper - he vomited every time I did. I carried him around in a

carrier

> when he wasn't in his bouncy so he wouldn't have to be laying down

flat.

>

>

>

> He's currently on SCD diet for severe malabsorption problems (not

related to

> reflux as far as we can tell, parallel problems) and is basically

back on

> baby food at this point. He's doing quite well on it and we see no

spitups,

> but I hear a gurgle every now and then so I know the reflux is still

there.

>

>

>

> Hope that helps.

>

>

>

> Alese

>

>

>

> _____

>

>

[Guest guest]

He's not actually allergic in the classic sense of the word. He has

multiple food intolerances. The two are often classified as the same, but

they're really not. We didn't actually find out that he had intolerances in

a direct sort of way. We put my autistic 4 year old son on the

gluten/casein/soy free diet as another biomedical intervention due to

observations of regression and various negative reactions after eating

particular things. When we put my oldest son on the GFCFSF diet, my baby

was 14 months. Since he had such a hard time getting onto solid food, he

was still on baby food mostly at that point so we thought it would be very

easy to put him on the diet too and just keep both boys on the same food.

After 2-3 months on the diet, I noticed that Aidan was vomiting less and

less every day, his horrible nasty diarrhea was gone, and he no longer had

body wide rashes. On a hunch, I gave him a little wheat cereal mixed in

with his rice cereal for breakfast one day and within 5 hours he was

vomiting, had bloody diarrhea and had broken out in a horrendous rash. A

month later, he accidentally got a hold of a piece of cheese at grandma's

house and pretty much the same thing happened. Those reactions were violent

enough for us to take gluten and casein out for good. Now, mind you, he has

many other issues, but getting rid of the gluten and casein when a huge way

in controlling the reflux, in fact, as far as the reflux is concerned, that

is the ONLY thing that controlled the reflux. The Ped GI doc had him on

meds for a long time until I told her that the meds were not helping the

reflux at all. What she told me is that the meds weren't supposed to help

the reflux, they were supposed to make it not so uncomfortable - so I

clarified by reiterating that it was akin to a painkiller that covers up the

issue rather than attacking the problem at the source and she said that was

correct. So, I took him off the meds when I noticed the difference the diet

was making and the difference was night and day. Please note though, this

was not done with my doctor's approval or knowledge. I did this all on my

own at the time and I don't recommend this to anyone unless you have

thoroughly researched the issue. My son is now under doctor's care

(chiropractor/nutritionist) because the " normal " doctors do not have a name

for what his problem is and have told me they cannot help me.

Hope that helps.

Alese

_____

From: lisa_mc_connell [mailto:mmlisa2@...]

Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2005 2:51 PM

Subject: Re: help for acid reflux in infants?

Hi Alese,

Thanks for your response--it really helps to get everyone's input.

Sorry to hear about your baby. How did you find out what he was

allergic to?

Thanks,

>

> Hi! I haven't posted here yet, but am thoroughly enjoying all the

posts.

> Thought I'd chime in here because I have a baby with reflux too. My

baby is

> currently 21 months, but he's had reflux for his whole life - fairly

> severely.

>

>

>

> Turned out he had multiple food intolerances and had I known then what I

> know now, I would have started pulling allergens out of my diet. My son

> cannot have casein, gluten, soy, tomatoes, and vinegar. We put him on

> Neocate formula (after the doctors told me to stop breastfeeding him

- which

> I believed, biggest mistake of my life *grumble*)

>

>

>

> We also had him sleep in a bouncy chair (not car seat) for the first 8

> months of his life. I also never put him flat on his back except to

change

> his diaper - he vomited every time I did. I carried him around in a

carrier

> when he wasn't in his bouncy so he wouldn't have to be laying down

flat.

>

>

>

> He's currently on SCD diet for severe malabsorption problems (not

related to

> reflux as far as we can tell, parallel problems) and is basically

back on

> baby food at this point. He's doing quite well on it and we see no

spitups,

> but I hear a gurgle every now and then so I know the reflux is still

there.

>

>

>

> Hope that helps.

>

>

>

> Alese

>

>

>

> _____

>

>

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_____

[Guest guest]

Alese,

I want to chime in because I see some familiar allergens on your son's

list, and I wanted to share what I know with you.

Some of my most severe " allergies " at birth were tomatoes, eggs, and

milk. I had seemed to " outgrow " the allergies, until I started having

problems with the same foods in my twenties. With a little bit closer

examination, I found that I can not have conventional milk or eggs,

only organic. I still can't have very much of those foods or they

cause problems. The tomatoes gave me the missing link...I can only eat

raw tomatoes. And I have found that I can consume all of the RAW,

organic eggs and milk that I want. Maybe something you want to look

into after the SCD diet.

Catz

> Turned out he had multiple food intolerances and had I known then what I

> know now, I would have started pulling allergens out of my diet. My son

> cannot have casein, gluten, soy, tomatoes, and vinegar. We put him on

> Neocate formula (after the doctors told me to stop breastfeeding him - which

> I believed, biggest mistake of my life *grumble*)

> He's currently on SCD diet for severe malabsorption problems (not related to

> reflux as far as we can tell, parallel problems) and is basically back on

> baby food at this point. He's doing quite well on it and we see no spitups,

> but I hear a gurgle every now and then so I know the reflux is still there.

> Alese

[Guest guest]

Thanks for sharing! Definitely interesting information. I have heard of

people seemingly reacting to a certain food only to find out that they don't

react to the organic version of that same food. We've been eating organic

since before the boys were born so I'm thinking what they're reacting is

actually the food itself, unfortunately. Aidan CAN have a little of

tomatoes and tomato products, but if he eats too much of tomatoes or any

vinegar, his stool literally causes chemical burns in his diaper area and

upper thighs. We plan to continue to try to reintroduce foods about once

every 6 months, but we've learned how to eat this way by now so it's really

not difficult at all if certain foods cannot every be tolerated. Naturally,

both boys have intolerances of their own that the other doesn't have - makes

meal planning and preparation a blast, let me tell you. Most nights I feel

like a short order cook - lol

Thanks!

Alese

_____

From: Lillig [mailto:catzandturtles@...]

Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2005 3:38 PM

Subject: Re: Re: help for acid reflux in infants?

Alese,

I want to chime in because I see some familiar allergens on your son's

list, and I wanted to share what I know with you.

Some of my most severe " allergies " at birth were tomatoes, eggs, and

milk. I had seemed to " outgrow " the allergies, until I started having

problems with the same foods in my twenties. With a little bit closer

examination, I found that I can not have conventional milk or eggs,

only organic. I still can't have very much of those foods or they

cause problems. The tomatoes gave me the missing link...I can only eat

raw tomatoes. And I have found that I can consume all of the RAW,

organic eggs and milk that I want. Maybe something you want to look

into after the SCD diet.

Catz

> Turned out he had multiple food intolerances and had I known then what I

> know now, I would have started pulling allergens out of my diet. My son

> cannot have casein, gluten, soy, tomatoes, and vinegar. We put him on

> Neocate formula (after the doctors told me to stop breastfeeding him -

which

> I believed, biggest mistake of my life *grumble*)

> He's currently on SCD diet for severe malabsorption problems (not related

to

> reflux as far as we can tell, parallel problems) and is basically back on

> baby food at this point. He's doing quite well on it and we see no

spitups,

> but I hear a gurgle every now and then so I know the reflux is still

there.

> Alese

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_____

[Guest guest]

HOW DID YOU IDENTIFY WHICH FOODS HE WAS ALLERGIC TO? ARE THERE

> SPECIFIC ALLERGY TESTS YOU WOULD RECOMMEND OR DID YOU DO AN

> ELIMINATION DIET?

After trying numerous elimination diets (including a total

elimination diet eating only 5 foods-which worked) I could not

pinpoint on my own what he was reacting to. I opted to have him

allergy tested conventionally. It seemed a better option than

waiting longer during a critical time in his life when he was

suffering. We had a simple scratch test done & walked out of the

office the same day with answers. We saw improvement within 24 hours

and a complete cessation of symptoms after 1 week. The symptoms

returned a month later, upon further testing we found he had

developed a severe cows whey allergy, 6 months later it was

tomatoes. As another parent said, we were advised to quit nursing &

prescribed Neocate. I put if off until he was 11 months old & then

made the switch out of frustration, what a mistake! He instantly

started losing weight & all kinds of other major issues. He still

had problems on the Neocate and we spent a ton of money to boot!

Ironic after reading some of the others with egg, dairy & tomato.

(that those are our problems too) Aidan is allergic in the

conventional way and we even tried raw cow & raw goat milk, only to

end up with massive hives (just from touching his skin!) across his

entire body that would not go away. He only ate tomatoes fresh from

our garden...still hives. We discovered his gluten intolerance at

age 2 after chronic diarrhea & developmental delays. We are finally

on the up side of things, as he can now have eggs!! dairy, tomato &

gluten are still holding on though.

I recently purchased the Eat Fat, Lose Fat book, simply because it

has alot of ideas without dairy. The recipes seem very usable by

those of us with food restrictions. The Fourfold Path to Healing has

some great info on healing allergies as well as digestive disorders,

worth the money!!

>

> HOW DID YOU IDENTIFY WHICH FOODS HE WAS ALLERGIC TO? ARE THERE

> SPECIFIC ALLERGY TESTS YOU WOULD RECOMMEND OR DID YOU DO AN

> ELIMINATION DIET?

>

> IT'S INTERESTING, BUT WHEN I POSTED THIS MESSAGE YESTERDAY, I WAS

> ASKING FOR MY SISTER WHO JUST HAD A BABY, BUT ALAS, IT LOOKS LIKE

I AM

> STARTING TO SEE SYMPTOMS IN MY NEWBORN JUST IN THE LAST 48 HOURS!

>

> THANKS,

> LISA

>

>

> My son had massive reflux problems & after 6 months of hell we

> finally figured out he had severe food allergies. Once I modified

my

> diet (he had not started solids yet at this point) it stopped 100%

> and life became easy again.

[Guest guest]

Just one other personal experience: I started ingesting lots of raw,

organic dairy (milk, cream and butter) after years of staying away from the

pasteurized stuff. Loving it, and needing to add weight, I probably overdid

the amounts, but anyway--after six months or so I started getting symptoms

again. I went off the milk and the cream. Staying on butter seemed okay (I

ate less then I had been), but today I tried a little bit of sour cream and

immediately got back a burning stomach and gas. So, for me, the raw,

organic was easier on me, but in the long run, still not okay. And for all

I know the butter may have to go eventually.

[Guest guest]

I know the feeling! I've got three children, who each have their own

food quirks, which are of course different from dh and

I...Geesh... " Order up! "

Catz

> Naturally,

> both boys have intolerances of their own that the other doesn't have - makes

> meal planning and preparation a blast, let me tell you. Most nights I feel

> like a short order cook - lol

>

>

>

> Thanks!

>

>

>

> Alese

[Guest guest]

RE: help for acid reflux in infants?

> Alese-

>

> >As far as I know, casein stays in system for 4 days, gluten can remain in

> >system for up to 8 months.

>

> That seems kind of, well, strange.

Why?

Where'd you hear it?

>

http://www.princeton.edu/~serge/ll/gfpak.html recommends a trial period for

3 months to a year, when evaluating the necessity of going gf/cf. " The

effects of the diet, if useful, tend to be cumulative. Must be tried for

one year. "

Also:

http://www.panix.com/~donwiss/reichelt.html#one

Due to epidemiology Prof Dohan, Philadelphia proposed that there was a

clearcut connection of gluten to schizophrenia (Dohan et al (1984) Biol

Psychiat 19:385-399; Dohan (1983) Biol psychiat 18:561-564). See also Lorenz

K (1990) Adv in Cereal Sci and Technol X:435-469.

*******The effect of diet takes a long time because the kidneys are very

well adapted to preserve peptides and proteins. We found that it took 28

weeks of strict diet to normalize the urinary excretion of peptides in a

double blind study of diet followed with urine analysis and rating scales

(Reichelt et al (1990) J Orthomol Med 5:223-239).****** <emphasis mine>

Most experiments on diet have been far too short in time, but even then all

admit to individuals being much improved on diet although not statistically

for the group (Rice JR et al (1978) Amer J psychiat 135:1417-1148; Storms LH

et al (1982) Arch Gen Psychiat 39:323-327; NB: Vlissides DN et al (1986)

Brit J Psychiat 148:441-452)

Hope this clarifies things for you.

--s

[Guest guest]

Neat info! Thanks! Both kids were off gluten, casein and soy for 8 months.

I took the boys off corn 5 months into the diet and now they're really not

on any specific diet. It's a cross between the SCD and the gluten, casein,

soy, corn free because my youngest tolerates so few foods we have to pull in

what we can for them to eat.

Both boys have done beautifully with dietary intervention and Aidan's (21

months) is firmly under control. I always tell people to look very closely

at food issues when dealing with reflux - I feel food intolerances/allergies

are the core cause of most cases of refulx.

Alese

_____

From: Suzanne Noakes [mailto:snoakes@...]

Sent: Monday, January 31, 2005 6:23 PM

Subject: Re: help for acid reflux in infants?

RE: help for acid reflux in infants?

> Alese-

>

> >As far as I know, casein stays in system for 4 days, gluten can remain in

> >system for up to 8 months.

>

> That seems kind of, well, strange.

Why?

Where'd you hear it?

>

http://www.princeton.edu/~serge/ll/gfpak.html recommends a trial period for

3 months to a year, when evaluating the necessity of going gf/cf. " The

effects of the diet, if useful, tend to be cumulative. Must be tried for

one year. "

Also:

http://www.panix.com/~donwiss/reichelt.html#one

Due to epidemiology Prof Dohan, Philadelphia proposed that there was a

clearcut connection of gluten to schizophrenia (Dohan et al (1984) Biol

Psychiat 19:385-399; Dohan (1983) Biol psychiat 18:561-564). See also Lorenz

K (1990) Adv in Cereal Sci and Technol X:435-469.

*******The effect of diet takes a long time because the kidneys are very

well adapted to preserve peptides and proteins. We found that it took 28

weeks of strict diet to normalize the urinary excretion of peptides in a

double blind study of diet followed with urine analysis and rating scales

(Reichelt et al (1990) J Orthomol Med 5:223-239).****** <emphasis mine>

Most experiments on diet have been far too short in time, but even then all

admit to individuals being much improved on diet although not statistically

for the group (Rice JR et al (1978) Amer J psychiat 135:1417-1148; Storms LH

et al (1982) Arch Gen Psychiat 39:323-327; NB: Vlissides DN et al (1986)

Brit J Psychiat 148:441-452)

Hope this clarifies things for you.

--s

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