RE: Low carb and Gastric disturbance.............

[Guest guest]

>Anyonbe have any information on the connection between Low-Card diets and

gastrointestinal problems/diarrhea?

>

>-

Usually low-carb diets tend to be associated with constipation at first, but a

lot of folks on low-carb diets end up eating a lot of cheese and eggs, both of

which can be allergenic for some folks. And as others have mentioned, the low

carb fake foods can do nasty things. Also some folks don't digest fats very

well, and the added fat in the diet can set people off. I used to have a real

problem digesting fats, as did my dh, and a high-fat meals were just plain

excruciating.

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

>Heidi Schuppenhauer <heidis@...> wrote:

>Also some folks don't digest fats very well, and the added fat in the

diet can set people >off. I used to have a real problem digesting

fats, as did my dh, and a high-fat meals >were just plain

excruciating.

>

Heidi,

How long did it take you to digest fats without problems?

My wife has the same issue with fatty foods.

[Guest guest]

In addition to what everyone else has said, I cured a lifelong case of

irritable bowel syndrome by going on Atkins 23 months ago. And lost 120

pounds, too. <G>

My digestive system has never been healthier.

Christie

[Guest guest]

>Heidi,

>How long did it take you to digest fats without problems?

>My wife has the same issue with fatty foods.

>

>

I think about a year. First I switched from animal fats (and canola ... yecch ..

THAT is a bad fat for folks with digestive issues! It even gives cows diarrhea)

to coconut oil. Then I started taking HCL and enzymes, which worked fine as long

as I took them with every meal. Then I started eating kimchi with each meal, and

could cut down on enzymes. Then I started doing the warrior diet, not eating

much during the day, which seems to make you " save up " your enzymes til the

evening (I don't know this for a fact, but that's what it seemed like).

After a year or so, the HCL started giving me heartburn, which is a sign you are

taking too much. So I cut it out. Now I can eat a nice fatty steak no problem. I

do tend to have red wine with dinner though, and red wine also helps marvelously

in the digestion department.

Not to belabor the obvious to those who know me, but during this time I also had

gone gluten-free, which in my case was likely the underlying cause of lack of

HCL and enzymes in the first place.

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

>>>>>>>>>>>>> After a year or so, the HCL started giving me heartburn, which

is a sign you are taking too much. So I cut it out. Now I can eat a nice

fatty steak no problem. I do tend to have red wine with dinner though, and

red wine also helps marvelously in the digestion department.

Not to belabor the obvious to those who know me, but during this time I also

had gone gluten-free, which in my case was likely the underlying cause of

lack of HCL and enzymes in the first place.

Heidi >>>>>>>>>>>

Hi Heidi and and all,

When you talk about gastric distress in digesting fats, I was wondering how

the liver fits into this? I'm no science expert but I thought that fats went

through the liver for assimilation (?) and so are necessarily " hard " on the

liver... I ask about fats and the liver because, alas!, I have no stomach

acid and so take HCl and enzymes and so on.. I only dream of having my

stomach someday " burn " :-) My symptoms of " distress " after almost any meal

is extreme fatigue. Maybe the stmach working extra hard? Or the liver? Can

you explain why I would have such almost instant fatigue after eating?

Thanks. ~Robin

Ps. By the way, I have almost identical " issues " as you do with food, Heidi.

Sheesh! Milk protiens, glutin, and now you talk about fats... Let's just say

that I can relate..

[Guest guest]

>Robin:

>

>Hi Heidi and and all,

>When you talk about gastric distress in digesting fats, I was wondering how

>the liver fits into this? I'm no science expert but I thought that fats went

>through the liver for assimilation (?) and so are necessarily " hard " on the

>liver... I ask about fats and the liver because, alas!, I have no stomach

>acid and so take HCl and enzymes and so on.. I only dream of having my

>stomach someday " burn " :-) My symptoms of " distress " after almost any meal

>is extreme fatigue. Maybe the stmach working extra hard? Or the liver? Can

>you explain why I would have such almost instant fatigue after eating?

Your liver produces gall, which goes into the gall bladder. Gall is what

breaks down fats (it acts like a detergent). If you eat more fat,

it needs to produce more gall, but I don't know that this is hard

on the liver. Often the gall bladder gets blocked, or the liver gets

damaged, and then you don't have enough gall and can't digest

the fat.

Mostly though, the liver processes sugar and turns it into fat.

I don't know that a high-fat diet makes for more work on it. Ingested

fat isn't broken down much ... it goes straight to your cells for storage

or used for energy.

As for fatigue after meals ... it's a lot of work for your body to

break down food. Plus some foods (notably starches) make you

sleepy, as does tryptophan (turkey). Maybe if a person has leaky

gut the proteins or whatever affect your brain more too.

It's one of those OTHER problems we share though! I solved it by

doing the WD ... I just don't eat when I need to be awake. I also

keep in mind that most carnivores crash for a long nap after a

big meal! Actually my goats do too, and they aren't carnivores.

Of course I ALSO like to have wine with my meal, which really

helps in the digestion department, but also puts me to sleep

regardless of the other factors! Interestingly, my dd is now

insisting on kefir cider with her dinner, because she says if

she doesn't drink it she gets a " sore stomach " at night. I make

a lightly fermented brew for the family.

>Thanks. ~Robin

>

>Ps. By the way, I have almost identical " issues " as you do with food, Heidi.

>Sheesh! Milk protiens, glutin, and now you talk about fats... Let's just say

>that I can relate..

Weird how that works, isn't it????

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

> Not to belabor the obvious to those who know me, but during this time

I also had gone gluten-free, which in my case was likely the underlying

cause of lack of HCL and enzymes in the first place.

>

>

> Heidi Jean

Hmmm...so you're saying that being gluten-intolerant caused you to fail

to produce HCl and enzymes?

How does that work?

[Guest guest]

>>> I just don't eat when I need to be awake. I also

keep in mind that most carnivores crash for a long nap after a

big meal! Heidi >>>>>>>

Hi Heidi, Thanks. Just a thought here: Why do I get the idea that you, and

probably most (?) people on this list, are pretty lean types... It's

incredible, really!, how much self-control many of us here have learned to

take for granted. Despite our digestive problems (and probably as a result

of them!,) while the rest of the developed world struggles with controlling

appetites to stop weight gain, we're saying things like " I just don't eat

when I need to be awake " ; I say this because, like you, that's pretty much

how I approach it too -- I don't eat much if I have to work right after. Of

course, I've had to work to modify my schedule to accommodate this resting

requirement -- otherwise I'd be emaciated.. What I'm getting at is that

because of our various afflictions and because of our commitment to real

healing (not just band aids,) we've learned to control our appetites --

well, at least for the most part -- and that's got to be a huge step in the

direction of good health. We are thinking before we eat. In fact, at least

at first, we are processing so much information before we take a bite that

it is dizzying!!!!

And interesting you bring up our animals; Of course they almost all rest

after a meal.

Which made me think of the siesta. I've always admired Latin cultures with

the big meal in the middle of the day and of course the famous siesta after.

I lived in Mexico City one summer when I was 16 and it blew me away! Sure,

there's too much starch in their mainstream diet but the biggest starch meal

(at least in the lower-class family I lived with,) was the late meal at 8 pm

or so? Before bed they'd bring out all these rolls.... In fact, as

elsewhere, more fresh vegetables and proteins were an outcome of being in a

higher class or of having a greater monetary income.

I love wine with my meals too, Heidi, and am lucky to live smack dab in the

middle of California wine country -- although I love your Washington Pinots!

I had to stop drinking wine for a while when I was worried about a possible

fungal overgrowth. (I hated giving up my Pilsner Urquell beer the most

though...) Now I need to keep alcohol to a minimum because I'm still on a

sh-t l--d of parasite medicine -- it's absolute poison!!! I have two weeks

to go and the good news is that since I've never done a huge parasite

cleanse like this (40 days, 12 capsules a day of Worm Squirm) I'm hoping

it'll prove to have eliminated some of these complaints I speak of. You

never know!

Anyway, I think my biggest problem was not just an h. pylori bacterial

infection that went crazy but that I was already every-which-way-messed up

for a long time as I was living in a pretty fast lane (network television in

the 80's?) 'Twas pretty outrageous (but fun!) there for quite awhile. I took

my good health and strong energy for granted. As one doctor told me, " You

have to have had a pretty strong constitution to get yourself this messed

up " and another who said, " You've got to stop letting your will drag your

body around! "

Now, like you and others here, I think, I'm using my will-power to get, not

just well but, better then well! :-)

~Robin

[Guest guest]

>Hmmm...so you're saying that being gluten-intolerant caused you to fail

>to produce HCl and enzymes?

>

>How does that work?

>

>

I'm not sure of the etiology, but in general, gluten intolerance causes the

body to produce antibodies that attack bodily organs, like the liver, thyroid,

pancreas, etc. When you stop eating gluten, the antibodies stop being

produced. But the antibodies damage the organs and then they don't

function well (which is what happens in T1 diabetes too). The liver is one

organ that commonly gets damaged, along with the pancreas, and those

are your two major enzyme producers.

With HCL it gets more complicated though: there are feedback loops with the

upper intestine that regulate how much HCL gets produced, and gluten

intolerant folks tend to have VERY MESSED UP upper intestines.

Also with the gall bladder, the opening to the gall bladder gets inflamed,

where it opens into the small intestine. That isn't surprising, since the

whole upper intestine gets inflamed. But then the bile can't empty out

into the intestine, so you don't digest fat. Actually the other enzymes

empty into the upper intestine too, so maybe a similar thing holds

for them too.

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

Robin

>Hi Heidi, Thanks. Just a thought here: Why do I get the idea that you, and

>probably most (?) people on this list, are pretty lean types...

Ha! I wish! I WAS lean most of my life, in spite of eating a lot, but that

changed dramatically when I started getting more gluten symptoms, and

I gained about 70 lbs. I've lost a lot of that now.

> It's

>incredible, really!, how much self-control many of us here have learned to

>take for granted. Despite our digestive problems (and probably as a result

>of them!,) while the rest of the developed world struggles with controlling

>appetites to stop weight gain, we're saying things like " I just don't eat

>when I need to be awake " ; I say this because, like you, that's pretty much

>how I approach it too -- I don't eat much if I have to work right after. Of

>course, I've had to work to modify my schedule to accommodate this resting

>requirement -- otherwise I'd be emaciated.. What I'm getting at is that

>because of our various afflictions and because of our commitment to real

>healing (not just band aids,) we've learned to control our appetites --

Actually a lot of my experimenting is because I could NOT control my

appetite! I was ravenously hungry ALWAYS even when I didn't give

in to said hunger. I started experimenting with food, thinking " if I can

just eat a breakfast that will keep me OK til lunch I'll be ok! " . But I'd

crash and really be unable to function without constant snacking. Took

2-3 years to figure out something that would work. The WD is what

finally did it, in combination with avoiding allergenic foods (the WD

doesn't work for me the day after I get a food reaction ... nothing

helps).

But if you are always slim, in our culture, it's a good bet you

aren't absorbing your food right. Some people go the other

direction though: they can't absorb their food so the body

goes into " store every bit of fat I can " mode and they get

outrageously fat, even though they are also horridly malnourished.

>well, at least for the most part -- and that's got to be a huge step in the

>direction of good health. We are thinking before we eat. In fact, at least

>at first, we are processing so much information before we take a bite that

>it is dizzying!!!!

Yeah sister! I admire anyone who can step back and *analyze* their

food and try to get a handle on the whole thing. It is very, very

complicated. More complicated because even the researchers aren't

sure what is " true " yet.

>And interesting you bring up our animals; Of course they almost all rest

>after a meal.

>

>Which made me think of the siesta. I've always admired Latin cultures with

>the big meal in the middle of the day and of course the famous siesta after.

>I lived in Mexico City one summer when I was 16 and it blew me away! Sure,

>there's too much starch in their mainstream diet but the biggest starch meal

>(at least in the lower-class family I lived with,) was the late meal at 8 pm

>or so? Before bed they'd bring out all these rolls.... In fact, as

>elsewhere, more fresh vegetables and proteins were an outcome of being in a

>higher class or of having a greater monetary income.

That's true today because of harvesting machines. In the past 2 centuries,

po' folk lived off cabbage and collard greens and pork fat ... richer folk got

the rolls and sugar, both were luxury items. Also the folks in cities got

them. But any ol' hardscrabble dirt farmer can grow collards and keep

a pig, and talking to some of the old timers, they talk about living

off collards and whatever greens they could gather, plus whatever

they could shoot (squirrels, snakes, possum) and their pork fat

from the yearly pig. This idea of " cheap grains " is fairly new. Try growing

and harvesting some, and doing the same with potatoes and collards,

and you'll see what I mean!

When folks started moving to the cities though, it became too expensive

to transport vegies and meat (esp. without refrigeration) so grains became

more of a mainstay. The same thing happened to the Maya and other

crowded cultures: once people start living close together, they have

to rely more and more on grains, and their health goes downhill.

>I love wine with my meals too, Heidi, and am lucky to live smack dab in the

>middle of California wine country -- although I love your Washington Pinots!

>I had to stop drinking wine for a while when I was worried about a possible

>fungal overgrowth. (I hated giving up my Pilsner Urquell beer the most

>though...) Now I need to keep alcohol to a minimum because I'm still on a

>sh-t l--d of parasite medicine -- it's absolute poison!!! I have two weeks

>to go and the good news is that since I've never done a huge parasite

>cleanse like this (40 days, 12 capsules a day of Worm Squirm) I'm hoping

>it'll prove to have eliminated some of these complaints I speak of. You

>never know!

Maybe someday you should try the Pascalite for parasites. I have no

idea if it works, but it might. It seems to do a nice job on fungi, and

even if it blocks some nutrients (maybe) it isn't toxic at all. I started

taking it with my evening meal as an experiment. No side effects

except the meal goes down REALLY easy.

>Anyway, I think my biggest problem was not just an h. pylori bacterial

>infection that went crazy but that I was already every-which-way-messed up

>for a long time as I was living in a pretty fast lane (network television in

>the 80's?) 'Twas pretty outrageous (but fun!) there for quite awhile. I took

>my good health and strong energy for granted. As one doctor told me, " You

>have to have had a pretty strong constitution to get yourself this messed

>up " and another who said, " You've got to stop letting your will drag your

>body around! "

I like that quote! Yeah, I was determined when I was younger NOT to

let my body control my life! My WILL would conquer all. Not!

>Now, like you and others here, I think, I'm using my will-power to get, not

>just well but, better then well! :-)

Hey, and with all that network-television brainpower you'll be

able to do good research and teach others!

>

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

>>>>>>>>>> Actually a lot of my experimenting is because I could NOT control

my

appetite! I was ravenously hungry ALWAYS even when I didn't give

in to said hunger. Heidi >>>>>>>>>>

That is exactly how I was before I got sick and then started to get well.

Always hungry. Always eating. Especially good French bread, cheese and beer

-- all things I now (darn!) can't really tolerate..

>>>>>>>>> But if you are always slim, in our culture, it's a good bet you

aren't absorbing your food right. Heidi >>>>>>>>>>>>>

And that was me too. No one could believe how I could consume 3000+ calories

or more a day and was always slim. Always the same Size 6 at 5'6 " no matter

what. People thought it was because of my musculature.

When I was hospitalized with the bacteria-caused ulcer and got even sicker

due to the messed up treatment, no matter what I ate, it wouldn't stay on. I

lost 20 pounds, down to 105, in a month and looked Very Scary. I started

researching like a Banshee and once I started using the information, my body

started responding and not only did I " miraculously " gain the weight back

quickly, I noticed that I was only eating about 1300 calories a day and

staying my same size. If I ate a calorie over that, it seemed, it would go

on as body fat and it was clear that Very Soon my clothes weren't going to

fit me at all -- Amazing! This had never happened to me. When I realized

that it was probably because I was finally absorbing my food, that got me

even more interested in all this NN stuff. I was so dumb I didn't even

notice how thin my hair was getting or that I was a nervous wreck. I was out

of balance big-time. It all seems so obvious in retrospect but when you're

" In It " I guess you can't see the proverbial forest for the trees..

But I was lucky that I didn't have to worry about the old appetite thing

getting me too far into trouble because, when I quit the carbs, I started

eating a LOT more saturated fat and because of the fat, I simply wasn't

hungry (for hours!!!) which was a new concept. In the old days, i wasn't

someone who wanted the food for taste or emotional reasons -- I didn't LOVE

food for example. My huge appetite and amazing food intake was based on the

fact that I was just darned hungry and weak and wanted more fuel like you

were saying, Heidi. (I also must confess that I met someone with my same

health condition when I was sick who was horrified after being 20 Pounds

Underweight to suddenly find herself 35 Pounds Overweight. I wasn't going to

let that happen to me. Buy all new clothes?! Ack!!

~Robin

Ps. While writing this post I ate a bowl of fabulous ham-hock stock with

lots of garlic and onions and two egg yolks thrown in at the last minute so

they're warm but still raw. This is a Very Big Change for me.... :-)