Guest guest Posted October 13, 2005 Report Share Posted October 13, 2005 > Why is that the only advise out there in the media? These people who > are supposed to be experts, why do they say this? Imagine my last couple of months--I'm doing the website for McDougall! (http://www.drmcdougall.com/) I know, I feel rotten, but I need the work right now. Lynn S. ------ Lynn Siprelle * web developer, writer, mama, fiber junky http://www.siprelle.com * http://www.thenewhomemaker.com http://www.deanspeaksforme.com * http://www.knitting911.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 13, 2005 Report Share Posted October 13, 2005 Judy, I'm only a year into the W.A.P. lifestyle, and I completely understand how you are feeling. I think that in traditional school, we learn to be " sheep " . We were generally conditioned not to question the Powers-that-be.ie.Government, Dr.s, anyone with money, and the ever elusive " they " . The bottom line is that the truth is too ugly to look at. Industry has spoiled society with addictive fast food, and now we as a nation (US) are so dependant, that we don't know how to feed ourselves, otherwise. I'm one of those wierdo's who wants to be independant, to depend on my own skills, to live and work for myself, and think my own thoughts. I'm very passionate about all the details of nutritional health and prevention, born from experiencing my diabetic mother's decline toward death and the treatment she recieved from the medical industry. Wow, this sounds sooo dark.... anyway... I turn my passion outward, and print out articles constantly from W.A.P. and others who's thoughts run the same lines. I share with anyone who will hear me. Very few are as motivated as I am to make the effort neccesary to bring good health to the dinner table. I'm on the verge of " pushy " about it, but try to remain respectful. ON the up side, My little light is shinging as the few who will listen, spread the word, and I've created a little network of extended family and friends who are finding society's methods aren't the best alternative available. That you CAN CHOOSE to trust your innner guide to care for yourself. YOu don't have to give your power away to some " expert " who doesn't care about you and gains finacially for your ill health. Seems to me, that the " experts " completely disregard the higher choice foods as they are not the norm. So if you were " herded " into believing modern foods are acceptable, then the modern health care industry's advice stands to reason. Enthusiasm is contagious. Being excited about your new finds will make other's curious. When they see you're feeling good and satisfied, the'll know you are on to something wonderful!!! The food industry is BIGG bu$ine$$. They don't want you to eat food that isn't addictive, that they can't manufacture cheaply, for huge profits. > All fired up, Lynda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 Judy, Totally off the cuff and probably won't even edit....on the run... Even my husband, who has seen clear evidence of great improvements in his IBS issues and major improvements in our Autistic son, directly due to Nourishing Traditions (and he brags about it to others) still battles me daily on " are you sure this is healthy " . There are days, of late, I'd like to just whack him with the frying pan, skipping the explaining. So, to exercise my rhetoric skills needed with hubby-pooh, I hunt out what I call " In Denial " articles which try to hang onto their own own biases and beliefs, for whatever reason. I'm especially interested in finding those that try to shred Fallon & Eng, or Weston A. Price articles. An example of a latest " ID " article is here: <http://www.extique.com/askrob/soy-vs-whey.htm> http://www.extique.com/askrob/soy-vs-whey.htm A " Dr. " hangs onto the word " abomination " as used by Fallon/Eng/WAP in relation to the consumption of soy. For pages, " Dr. " attempts to build a case as to why " abomination " is too strong a word, and why soy can't be that bad for you, depending on which form you eat, because, and this is the crux, depth, width of his thinking, because well, there just isn't enough research either way to either disprove or prove soy is good...or is it bad...or is it good....or...he's really not sure either by the time he gets done with a summary. His writing is filled with a lot of " what ifs " and his own thought processes but I see nothing offered refuting anything Fallon/Eng/WAP are saying - there's nothing solid to go on. I consider articles of this nature, or those I might hear through " experts " or the media to be incentives for me to do my own research and that's where I find I build up confidence that I'm going to right way. They never paint the whole picture, you know. They talk about meat and dairy as being the source of cancer, heart disease, etc., but no one ever talks about the fact the meat is filled with chemicals, containing an unhealthy ratio of Omega6:Omega3 fats from soy/corn feed, the milk is ruined by pasteurization and homogenization, the grains are not being properly processed, etc., etc. They'd never stop to consider that maybe it is a cumulative effect over years of consuming dead food, that maybe, just maybe the SAD is at issue. So every time I hear one of the reports from the mainstream parrots...err...I mean " journalists " , and I use that term loosely, I consider it yet another exericse for me to go through my checklist of what it is they did NOT state in their report, and what information could have been presented, etc., etc. That's my long-winded way of saying I can relate to what you're saying but that I think it gives you an opportunity to hone your own thinking and rhetoric. Besides, when the ever-present nagging of WAP friends/family is threatening to wear you down, take an inventory of what they think is good food. Then ask yourself if you could go back to that.....*gasp*........ -Sharon, NH Deut 11:14 He will put grass in the fields for your cattle, and you will have plenty to eat. > Why is that the only advise out there in the media? These people who > are supposed to be experts, why do they say this? Judy > Ft Wayne IN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 You have my sympathies, for sure. I sometimes skim McDougall's forum to get an idea of the thinking that's the opposite of mine, and it seems to me that so many ultra low fat vegans just plain hate flesh, especially their own. Just my impression. Connie > Imagine my last couple of months--I'm doing the website for > McDougall! (http://www.drmcdougall.com/) I know, I feel rotten, but I > need the work right now. > > Lynn S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 > You have my sympathies, for sure. I sometimes skim McDougall's forum to > get an idea of the thinking that's the opposite of mine, and it seems > to me that so many ultra low fat vegans just plain hate flesh, > especially their own. Just my impression. Interestingly the dr and I agree on a number of issues including over-medication of blood pressure. His information on calcium channel blockers helped me a lot, actually--helped get me off them. He's a good guy and he seriously believes he's helping people--and there's quite a bit of evidence that he has. But I think it's because he's gotten people off the SAD, not because he's right about veganism. ANY diet that gets people off the SAD helps, at least a little. Lynn S. ------ Lynn Siprelle * web developer, writer, mama, fiber junky http://www.siprelle.com * http://www.thenewhomemaker.com http://www.deanspeaksforme.com * http://www.knitting911.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 I totally agree on the over-medication. And, the recommendations for whole food over fractionated foods. Part of the reason I like to read is, I wonder what kind of bodies do well on that regime because I'm pretty sure mine wouldn't. I do read of some happy campers. Connie > Interestingly the dr and I agree on a number of issues including > over-medication of blood pressure. His information on calcium channel > blockers helped me a lot, actually--helped get me off them. He's a good > guy and he seriously believes he's helping people--and there's quite a > bit of evidence that he has. But I think it's because he's gotten > people off the SAD, not because he's right about veganism. ANY diet > that gets people off the SAD helps, at least a little. > > Lynn S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 On 10/14/05, Lynn Siprelle <lynn@...> wrote: > Interestingly the dr and I agree on a number of issues including > over-medication of blood pressure. His information on calcium channel > blockers helped me a lot, actually--helped get me off them. He's a good > guy and he seriously believes he's helping people--and there's quite a > bit of evidence that he has. But I think it's because he's gotten > people off the SAD, not because he's right about veganism. ANY diet > that gets people off the SAD helps, at least a little. > My two cents is SAD and veganism can be interchangeably or increasingly disasterous to the third, the low carber or more carniverous. Vegetable, plant protein and fat is no substitute for animal. If it works for you, you're right. If it works for someone else, you got lucky. If it doesn't work for everyone and you think it will, you're wrong. Wanita Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 14, 2005 Report Share Posted October 14, 2005 > My two cents is SAD and veganism can be interchangeably or > increasingly disasterous to the third, the low carber or more > carniverous. Vegetable, plant protein and fat is no substitute for > animal. I agree totally. One thing I'll say in McDougall's defense is he emphasizes quality plant foods, not junk. One thing I'll say against him is all of his focus is on cholesterol, with not a single thing on inflammation, and he doesn't understand fats at all. > If it works for you, you're right. If it works for someone else, you > got lucky. If it doesn't work for everyone and you think it will, > you're wrong. One man's meat is another man's poison is another man's medicine. Lynn S. ------ Lynn Siprelle * web developer, writer, mama, fiber junky http://www.siprelle.com * http://www.thenewhomemaker.com http://www.deanspeaksforme.com * http://www.knitting911.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 Judy, I agree it is HARD. Since getting into this *real* health habit, I find myself mentally dissecting all the deadly stuff that is in what other people eat, but I don't dare tell them. I know they have very deep emotional ties to that food and changing is just NOT that easy. I don't say anything to them unless they ask and when I do talk I try to emphasize only my experience, to which I'm becoming something of an expert. Being very well-informed and having a very firm understanding of why you're eating the way you are is also very important. Every workday for lunch I eat my organic, homemade veggie/Italian mix with spring mix and half an apple. The people I sit near or with generally comment on how 'healthy' it looks and are even more surprised when they get a whiff of how good it smells (cause I wouldn't eat it if it didn't taste good.) From there they are amazed at my discipline in eating that so often (which isn't always the same cause I vary the recipe) and depending on the circumstance and the person, overtime I might start to elaborate about how the alternative (chronic diarrhea /Chron's disease - a condition I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy) is no longer an option for me. Without having to go into the all dirty details of how bad my condition was and for them just seeing how much better I now am, at least one or two people have been open enough to want to know more info about how I've done it. I give them the WP site address and name drop NT by Sally Fallon. The rest is up to them. Leading by example is the best promo there is I think. And I'm not done yet.. I have a ways to go before I'm that 'super-healthy' version of myself but I know I'll get there because I've already decided I will. After that the next challenge will be trying getting the rest of my family into at least some better habits, but one step at a time. I guess I really don't have that fear of being wrong as you have titled. Personal experience has shown me that this way of eating is right.. It's just everyone else who's wrong. lol.. I think others have already said, to which I agree, the reason why it's a secret has to do with the 'almighty' dollar-food production-pharmaceutical-scandal-conspiracy-snow job headed by the " diet dictocrats " who control consumer spending, sad but true. frumpyhead <frumpyhead@...> wrote: Hi, How do you all handle the constant low fat diet mentality that most people, who try to take care of themselves have? I've been happily eating animal fat since reading Weston Price, Nourishing Traditions and other books along those lines and it all makes total since to me. But I also always see doctors in the media and read about how we should be limiting saturated fats, eating lean meats, no butter, drinking low fat or skim milk, using canola oil etc. Why is that the only advise out there in the media? These people who are supposed to be experts, why do they say this? I still love my steak and butter and always will, but it's scary, when I'm the only person that I know who believes this. My friends eyes all grow big and they shake their heads at me when they see me drink full fat milk, I think they would faint if they knew I tried raw liver last week! Why is this way of eating such a secret? Judy Ft Wayne IN --------------------------------- Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 16, 2005 Report Share Posted October 16, 2005 Thank you to all the kind people that replyed to my question. I'll try not to worry so much about what the media is saying about eating lowfat to stay healthy. I know I feel much healthier and happier with my new diet! Judy Ft Wayne, IN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 Judy- >How do you all handle the constant low fat diet mentality that most >people, who try to take care of themselves have? I just plow ahead and do my thing. It's not always easy, but eating any other way would be harmful for me, so there's nothing for it. >Why is that the only advise out there in the media? ... Why is this way >of eating such a secret? Money and institutional inertia. It's not possible for wealth to concentrate to the same degree from cattle ranching as it is from growing wheat, for example, and selling all sorts of grain-based fake foods. And our disease-care industry, which unfortunately encompasses doctors, medical journals, research facilities, and of course pharmaceutical companies, profits from a diseased population. Preventive nutrition isn't profitable to those interests. That doesn't mean this dismal, corrupted state of affairs will last forever, but it is a formidable problem. - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 I can relate to the fear of being wrong. I've been eating the NT way for about 5 months and at times I do wonder if I'm helping myself or killing myself. I figure it would help with lyme disease and I think it is.I have never herxed like I do now by drinking raw goats milk and I do find fermented food just about the best tasting food I'e ever had. . So I guess it may be boosting my immune sytem but when I look in the mirror I look just awful. Maybe the diet is cleansing also? Phil Re: fear of being wrong > My two cents is SAD and veganism can be interchangeably or > increasingly disasterous to the third, the low carber or more > carniverous. Vegetable, plant protein and fat is no substitute for > animal. I agree totally. One thing I'll say in McDougall's defense is he emphasizes quality plant foods, not junk. One thing I'll say against him is all of his focus is on cholesterol, with not a single thing on inflammation, and he doesn't understand fats at all. > If it works for you, you're right. If it works for someone else, you > got lucky. If it doesn't work for everyone and you think it will, > you're wrong. One man's meat is another man's poison is another man's medicine. Lynn S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 On 10/17/05, REMOC <REMOCLIHP@...> wrote: > I can relate to the fear of being wrong. I've been eating the NT way for > about 5 months and at times I do wonder if I'm helping myself or killing > myself. I figure it would help with lyme disease and I think it is.I have > never herxed like I do now by drinking raw goats milk and I do find > fermented food just about the best tasting food I'e ever had. . So I guess > it may be boosting my immune sytem but when I look in the mirror I look just > awful. Maybe the diet is cleansing also? Your dietary changes are inducing the awful look, or did you look awful to yourself before? Chris -- Statin Drugs Kill Your Brain And Cause Transient Global Amnesia: http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/Statin-Drugs-Side-Effects.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 17, 2005 Report Share Posted October 17, 2005 eating raw animal products is just about the most cleansing diet that exists. i'm surprised more people don't talk about the cleansing reactions. aajonus vonderplanitz has some expertise with raw animal diet and how to navigate the cleansing reactions. for starters add some raw butter to everything. he also has a lubrication formula with raw butter, raw egg, raw honey and lemon. there's a whole lot more to it, but you can check out the primal diet which is very similar to the sally fallon diet anway. i had to stop going all raw because the cleansing was intolerable, i was passing ungodly amounts of intestinal waste, the more i ate the more cleansing occurred into a vicious cycle. i had to eat over a pound a day of butter to keep the stuff moving out of me. Re: fear of being wrong > My two cents is SAD and veganism can be interchangeably or > increasingly disasterous to the third, the low carber or more > carniverous. Vegetable, plant protein and fat is no substitute for > animal. I agree totally. One thing I'll say in McDougall's defense is he emphasizes quality plant foods, not junk. One thing I'll say against him is all of his focus is on cholesterol, with not a single thing on inflammation, and he doesn't understand fats at all. > If it works for you, you're right. If it works for someone else, you > got lucky. If it doesn't work for everyone and you think it will, > you're wrong. One man's meat is another man's poison is another man's medicine. Lynn S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 18, 2005 Report Share Posted October 18, 2005 The look happened after the dietary changes. From what I've read the diet should help me and my body seems to want the food. I just figured that the look as due to all the herxing and junk being detoxed from my system. I've had lyme and who knows what else for about 20 years and prior to being diasbled for the past 11 I ate junky and listened to the " experts " on diet. So this is a big change. Before I looked better but the die off was not nearly as great so maybe I settle for looking crappy and feeling better one day instead of looking great and feeling crappy. Phil Phil Re: fear of being wrong On 10/17/05, REMOC <REMOCLIHP@...> wrote: > I can relate to the fear of being wrong. I've been eating the NT way for > about 5 months and at times I do wonder if I'm helping myself or killing > myself. I figure it would help with lyme disease and I think it is.I have > never herxed like I do now by drinking raw goats milk and I do find > fermented food just about the best tasting food I'e ever had. . So I guess > it may be boosting my immune sytem but when I look in the mirror I look just > awful. Maybe the diet is cleansing also? Your dietary changes are inducing the awful look, or did you look awful to yourself before? Chris -- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 18, 2005 Report Share Posted October 18, 2005 That's interesting. My body really desires huge amounts of butter and coconut oil. I confess at times it seems a little frightening how much butter I eat but it tastes so good so I'm going for it. Phil Re: fear of being wrong </HTML> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 18, 2005 Report Share Posted October 18, 2005 Seriously! I get extremely detoxifying reactions (I'm in the middle of a mercury detox as well) after eating a good amount of raw grassfed liver. I ate 3-4 oz of pureed raw liver in extra spicy chili on Sunday and I can still feel it today. The more nutrition I get, the more my body tries to detoxify it seems. I tried to stop detoxing from mercury for a little break so I stopped drinking kombucha, but all that happened after 4 days was I starting breaking out in eczema on the back of my hands...I feel like a Mad Hatter at times, but being crazy can be enjoyable if you don't get angry and just laugh a lot, LOL! I do know the vicious cycle you speak of, and will checkout Aajonus Vonderplantitz . > > eating raw animal products is just about the most cleansing diet that exists. i'm surprised more people don't talk about the cleansing reactions. aajonus vonderplanitz has some expertise with raw animal diet and how to navigate the cleansing reactions. for starters add some raw butter to everything. he also has a lubrication formula with raw butter, raw egg, raw honey and lemon. there's a whole lot more to it, but you can check out the primal diet which is very similar to the sally fallon diet anway. i had to stop going all raw because the cleansing was intolerable, i was passing ungodly amounts of intestinal waste, the more i ate the more cleansing occurred into a vicious cycle. i had to eat over a pound a day of butter to keep the stuff moving out of me. > Re: fear of being wrong > > > > My two cents is SAD and veganism can be interchangeably or > > increasingly disasterous to the third, the low carber or more > > carniverous. Vegetable, plant protein and fat is no substitute for > > animal. > > I agree totally. One thing I'll say in McDougall's defense is he > emphasizes quality plant foods, not junk. One thing I'll say against > him is all of his focus is on cholesterol, with not a single thing on > inflammation, and he doesn't understand fats at all. > > > If it works for you, you're right. If it works for someone else, you > > got lucky. If it doesn't work for everyone and you think it will, > > you're wrong. > > One man's meat is another man's poison is another man's medicine. > > Lynn S. > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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