RE: Help! Armour & T4 - Hashi's

[Guest guest]

Hi Katy,

Did the docs tell you to stop all your Thyroid meds and is that safe? That would be my first concern.

As far as the racing heart, I have read that beta blockers can help a lot with that... Have you discussed that with any of your docs?

Hope you feel better soon....!

Sue

Hello,

I am a Hashi's patient and my levels have been stabilized for a year

or so. However, at my last doctor's appt., my doctor thought my t3

was too high in proportion to my t4 so added a small dose of levoxyl

to my armour. That didn't seem to effect the way I felt and I have

been taking this combo for 6mos now. In Jan, my blood levels were:

Free T4 - 1.01

Free T3 - 2.6

TSH - .5

I'm not exactly sure when it started, but I began waking up at night

with a racing heartbeat and thinking I was having anxiety attacks.

I also started noticing the feeling of a " racing " heartbeat during

the day and sometimes at night. This progressed to a feeling of a

shortness of breath. While I was pushing the cart at the grocery

store, I started to feel light-headed and out-of-breath and felt my

heart racing. I just happened to be in front of blood pressure

machine so I stopped and took my blood pressure. The BP was great,

but my pulse was 140 just from walking around. I called my

cardiologist and the nurse said that she thought it was probably

thyroid related. I was/am afraid to go back to my doctor that

prescribes my thyroid meds because I feel like she's just itching to

get me off of Armour and will use any excuse to do so. I only have

it now because I pleaded with her. I felt horrible years ago on

synthroid and only felt human again with armour. I made an

appointment with an internist I used to see years ago accross town

who has no qualms with using Armour and I will be seeing him today,

but he goes strictly by the numbers and doesn't treat symptoms

alone. I haven't had any thyroid meds since Thursday (almost a

week) and have been feeling much better with no racing pulse.

However, my heartrate is still really high, fluctuating btw 90 and

130bpm just through normal activities.

I'm going to see the doctor today regardless, but I'm wondering if

anyone recognizes these symptoms and what can be done to correct

it. If this doctor wants to keep my tsh higher than I can function

with, I may need to just stay with the other doctor and tweak the

prescriptions she gives me. I just don't know what to do. I

thought this was all under control and that I wouldn't have deal

with again - wrong!! Such is the nature of Hashi's, I guess. I

would appreciate any helpful info or comments as I will be seeing

the other doctor this afternoon.

Take Care,

Katy

[Guest guest]

We need the reference ranges and the exact name of each test, but it appears that both your Free T3 and Free T4 are lower than most of us would like. Hyper-like symptoms with sub-optimal Free Ts would suggest adrenal or ferritin issues. Be aware that on Armour your may need to eliminate caffiene and other stimulants. Katy wrote: Hello,I am a Hashi's patient and my levels have been stabilized for a year or so. However, at my last doctor's appt., my doctor thought my t3 was too high in proportion to my t4 so added a small dose of levoxyl to my armour. That

didn't seem to effect the way I felt and I have been taking this combo for 6mos now. In Jan, my blood levels were:Free T4 - 1.01Free T3 - 2.6TSH - .5I'm not exactly sure when it started, but I began waking up at night with a racing heartbeat and thinking I was having anxiety attacks. I also started noticing the feeling of a "racing" heartbeat during the day and sometimes at night. This progressed to a feeling of a shortness of breath. While I was pushing the cart at the grocery store, I started to feel light-headed and out-of-breath and felt my heart racing. I just happened to be in front of blood pressure machine so I stopped and took my blood pressure. The BP was great, but my pulse was 140 just from walking around. I called my cardiologist and the nurse said that she thought it was probably thyroid related. I was/am afraid to go back to my doctor that prescribes

my thyroid meds because I feel like she's just itching to get me off of Armour and will use any excuse to do so. I only have it now because I pleaded with her. I felt horrible years ago on synthroid and only felt human again with armour. I made an appointment with an internist I used to see years ago accross town who has no qualms with using Armour and I will be seeing him today, but he goes strictly by the numbers and doesn't treat symptoms alone. I haven't had any thyroid meds since Thursday (almost a week) and have been feeling much better with no racing pulse. However, my heartrate is still really high, fluctuating btw 90 and 130bpm just through normal activities.I'm going to see the doctor today regardless, but I'm wondering if anyone recognizes these symptoms and what can be done to correct it. If this doctor wants to keep my tsh higher than I can function with, I may need to just

stay with the other doctor and tweak the prescriptions she gives me. I just don't know what to do. I thought this was all under control and that I wouldn't have deal with again - wrong!! Such is the nature of Hashi's, I guess. I would appreciate any helpful info or comments as I will be seeing the other doctor this afternoon.Take Care,Katy

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[Guest guest]

Jan — where should the T3 and T4 numbers be in relation to the ranges — should they all be “mid range” -- this is all new to me, thanks,

Sue

We need the reference ranges and the exact name of each test, but it appears that both your Free T3 and Free T4 are lower than most of us would like. Hyper-like symptoms with sub-optimal Free Ts would suggest adrenal or ferritin issues.

Be aware that on Armour your may need to eliminate caffiene and other stimulants.

Katy wrote:

Hello,

I am a Hashi's patient and my levels have been stabilized for a year

or so. However, at my last doctor's appt., my doctor thought my t3

was too high in proportion to my t4 so added a small dose of levoxyl

to my armour. That didn't seem to effect the way I felt and I have

been taking this combo for 6mos now. In Jan, my blood levels were:

Free T4 - 1.01

Free T3 - 2.6

TSH - .5

I'm not exactly sure when it started, but I began waking up at night

with a racing heartbeat and thinking I was having anxiety attacks.

I also started noticing the feeling of a " racing " heartbeat during

the day and sometimes at night. This progressed to a feeling of a

shortness of breath. While I was pushing the cart at the grocery

store, I started to feel light-headed and out-of-breath and felt my

heart racing. I just happened to be in front of blood pressure

machine so I stopped and took my blood pressure. The BP was great,

but my pulse was 140 just from walking around. I called my

cardiologist and the nurse said that she thought it was probably

thyroid related. I was/am afraid to go back to my doctor that

prescribes my thyroid meds because I feel like she's just itching to

get me off of Armour and will use any excuse to do so. I only have

it now because I pleaded with her. I felt horrible years ago on

synthroid and only felt human again with armour. I made an

appointment with an internist I used to see years ago accross town

who has no qualms with using Armour and I will be seeing him today,

but he goes strictly by the numbers and doesn't treat symptoms

alone. I haven't had any thyroid meds since Thursday (almost a

week) and have been feeling much better with no racing pulse.

However, my heartrate is still really high, fluctuating btw 90 and

130bpm just through normal activities.

I'm going to see the doctor today regardless, but I'm wondering if

anyone recognizes these symptoms and what can be done to correct

it. If this doctor wants to keep my tsh higher than I can function

with, I may need to just stay with the other doctor and tweak the

prescriptions she gives me. I just don't know what to do. I

thought this was all under control and that I wouldn't have deal

with again - wrong!! Such is the nature of Hashi's, I guess. I

would appreciate any helpful info or comments as I will be seeing

the other doctor this afternoon.

Take Care,

Katy

Yahoo! Mail

Use Photomail <http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mail_us/taglines/pmall2/*http://photomail.mail.yahoo.com> to share photos without annoying attachments.

[Guest guest]

Jan can you point me in the right direction to learn more about how

caffeine affects us Hashi folks?? I never knew that it would affect

me...I have noticed that if I get really shaky and agitated I can

drink a coke and be fine for hours...maybe I'm just weird - I usually

react 180 degrees different from " the norm " ...

Just curious about the caffeine connection.

Thanks! Tee

> Hello,

>

> I am a Hashi's patient and my levels have been stabilized for a

year

> or so. However, at my last doctor's appt., my doctor thought my t3

> was too high in proportion to my t4 so added a small dose of

levoxyl

> to my armour. That didn't seem to effect the way I felt and I have

> been taking this combo for 6mos now. In Jan, my blood levels were:

>

> Free T4 - 1.01

> Free T3 - 2.6

> TSH - .5

>

> I'm not exactly sure when it started, but I began waking up at

night

> with a racing heartbeat and thinking I was having anxiety attacks.

> I also started noticing the feeling of a " racing " heartbeat during

> the day and sometimes at night. This progressed to a feeling of a

> shortness of breath. While I was pushing the cart at the grocery

> store, I started to feel light-headed and out-of-breath and felt my

> heart racing. I just happened to be in front of blood pressure

> machine so I stopped and took my blood pressure. The BP was great,

> but my pulse was 140 just from walking around. I called my

> cardiologist and the nurse said that she thought it was probably

> thyroid related. I was/am afraid to go back to my doctor that

> prescribes my thyroid meds because I feel like she's just itching

to

> get me off of Armour and will use any excuse to do so. I only have

> it now because I pleaded with her. I felt horrible years ago on

> synthroid and only felt human again with armour. I made an

> appointment with an internist I used to see years ago accross town

> who has no qualms with using Armour and I will be seeing him today,

> but he goes strictly by the numbers and doesn't treat symptoms

> alone. I haven't had any thyroid meds since Thursday (almost a

> week) and have been feeling much better with no racing pulse.

> However, my heartrate is still really high, fluctuating btw 90 and

> 130bpm just through normal activities.

>

> I'm going to see the doctor today regardless, but I'm wondering if

> anyone recognizes these symptoms and what can be done to correct

> it. If this doctor wants to keep my tsh higher than I can function

> with, I may need to just stay with the other doctor and tweak the

> prescriptions she gives me. I just don't know what to do. I

> thought this was all under control and that I wouldn't have deal

> with again - wrong!! Such is the nature of Hashi's, I guess. I

> would appreciate any helpful info or comments as I will be seeing

> the other doctor this afternoon.

>

> Take Care,

> Katy

>

> ---------------------------------

> Yahoo! Mail

> Use Photomail to share photos without annoying attachments.

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks Sue J No, the docs didn’t

tell me to stop all thyroid meds and I don’t know if it is safe or not,

but I sure felt a lot better over the weekend because of it. I saw the

doctor this afternoon and he had me start taking the armour again but not the

T4. I get another blood test in a month to see how that’s

working. This doctor doesn’t test t3 or t4 though, only TSH and he

likes to keep it around 2. Grrrrrr…….One doctor that doesn’t

believe in armour and one that only goes by tsh!! I can’t wait to

get my np license, LOL

Take Care,

Katy

From: Texas_Thyroid_Groups

[mailto:Texas_Thyroid_Groups ] On

Behalf Of jytdtp

Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006

9:40 AM

To:

Texas_Thyroid_Groups

Subject: Re:

Help! Armour & T4 - Hashi's

Hi Katy,

Did the docs tell you to stop all your Thyroid meds and is that safe? That

would be my first concern.

As far as the racing heart, I have read that beta blockers can help a lot with

that... Have you discussed that with any of your docs?

Hope you feel better soon....!

Sue

[Guest guest]

Hi Katy,

That is so weird that all these doctors don’t test T3 and T4 - - both mine did and do... I feel so bad for everyone that has a doctor that won’t do it — but just so you all know you CAN test at home – it’s not cheap but you can by lab kits to send off to get your homrones, cholesterol and even TSH T3 and T4 -- I have done them all~!

I am on just T4 now but have never felt it “did anything” but get my numbers in line — so I am asking for T3 to be added since I was still gaining weight on the T4 with “normal” levels — I want my TSH down at 1 or below and am asking for Cytomel when I go on the 7th of March — I talked to my endo on the phone and she says she will try me on it at my request--- ! I feel so fortunate to have found her...

Let me know how you do back on the armour — isn’t that T4 and T3?? So you were taking that PLUS extra T4? Did your doc know your levels before putting you back on the armour and did he say anything about the heart racing? My first endo seemed to feel he was exclusive in treating my thryoid and couldn’t “deal with” any side effects of what his meds did so I did change to the doc I have now and I must say she does listen very carefully and allow for full input...

Sue

Thanks Sue J No, the docs didn’t tell me to stop all thyroid meds and I don’t know if it is safe or not, but I sure felt a lot better over the weekend because of it. I saw the doctor this afternoon and he had me start taking the armour again but not the T4. I get another blood test in a month to see how that’s working. This doctor doesn’t test t3 or t4 though, only TSH and he likes to keep it around 2. Grrrrrr…….One doctor that doesn’t believe in armour and one that only goes by tsh!! I can’t wait to get my np license, LOL

Take Care,

Katy

From: Texas_Thyroid_Groups [mailto:Texas_Thyroid_Groups ] On Behalf Of jytdtp

Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 9:40 AM

To: Texas_Thyroid_Groups

Subject: Re: Help! Armour & T4 - Hashi's

Hi Katy,

Did the docs tell you to stop all your Thyroid meds and is that safe? That would be my first concern.

As far as the racing heart, I have read that beta blockers can help a lot with that... Have you discussed that with any of your docs?

Hope you feel better soon....!

Sue

[Guest guest]

Free T4 (thyroxine) 1.01 NG/DL (.73-1.95)

TSH .5 UIU/ML (.3 – 5.1)

Free T3 2.6 PG/ML (2.3-4.2)

This is all it has on my lab report for

the name of the test. So, would I have to see an endocrinologist for adrenal

or ferritin issues? I have been on Armour for years and have always had my one

cup of coffee per day and no other stimulants so I don’t know what the

issue is L

Thanks so much,

Katy

From: Texas_Thyroid_Groups

[mailto:Texas_Thyroid_Groups ] On

Behalf Of Jan

Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006

12:31 PM

To:

Texas_Thyroid_Groups

Subject: Re:

Help! Armour & T4 - Hashi's

We need the

reference ranges and the exact name of each test, but it appears that both your

Free T3 and Free T4 are lower than most of us would like. Hyper-like symptoms

with sub-optimal Free Ts would suggest adrenal or ferritin issues.

Be aware

that on Armour your may need to eliminate caffiene and other

stimulants.

[Guest guest]

Ferritin is run with a normal blood test, just ask your doctor. Salvia

test are best for adrenal test. You can order saliva test yourself. Have

you read Adrenal Fatigue: 21 Century Stress Syndrome?

Kate

At 03:03 PM 2/22/2006, you wrote:

>Free T4 (thyroxine) 1.01 NG/DL (.73-1.95)

>TSH .5 UIU/ML (.3 – 5.1)

>Free T3 2.6 PG/ML (2.3-4.2)

>

>This is all it has on my lab report for the name of the test. So, would I

>have to see an endocrinologist for adrenal or ferritin issues? I have

>been on Armour for years and have always had my one cup of coffee per day

>and no other stimulants so I don’t know what the issue is L

>

>Thanks so much,

>Katy

>

>

>----------

>From: Texas_Thyroid_Groups

>[mailto:Texas_Thyroid_Groups ] On Behalf Of Jan

>Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 12:31 PM

>To: Texas_Thyroid_Groups

>Subject: Re: Help! Armour & T4 - Hashi's

>

>We need the reference ranges and the exact name of each test, but it

>appears that both your Free T3 and Free T4 are lower than most of us would

>like. Hyper-like symptoms with sub-optimal Free Ts would suggest adrenal

>or ferritin issues.

>

>Be aware that on Armour your may need to eliminate caffiene and other

>stimulants.

[Guest guest]

Your T3 is low, but, for a person who takes ALL Armour, it doesn't look proportionately higher a ratio to the T4, so I've got to wonder whether you are converting much of your T4 to T3. Most of the people that I've seen on the thyroid sites who take Armour only have this proportionately higher comparison of T3 to T4, being as pigs produce much more T3 than we do. I know mine was that way when I was on all Armour also. But yours does not look so. Your tests themselves look like you've got more wiggle room for a raise, but I don't know what Endo you would be able to get that from. I don't do well on a very HIGH T3, but one time (while on Armour) it did go up just over the top of normal. I didn't feel any effects from it, that is, until I upped the dose to 2 grains and stayed on that for between 3 to 4 months. Evidently, I was on "delayed reaction", because that's when the heart rate went up to 160 bpm, and I had to go off of all thyroid meds for about a week or so, to use some of it up. My heart rate was up like that, with the sweats and all, for over 2 days. That's when I changed to mostly T4, with a little Armour added.

RE: Help! Armour & T4 - Hashi's

Free T4 (thyroxine) 1.01 NG/DL (.73-1.95)

TSH .5 UIU/ML (.3 – 5.1)

Free T3 2.6 PG/ML (2.3-4.2)

This is all it has on my lab report for the name of the test. So, would I have to see an endocrinologist for adrenal or ferritin issues? I have been on Armour for years and have always had my one cup of coffee per day and no other stimulants so I don’t know what the issue is L

Thanks so much,

Katy

[Guest guest]

Hi Kate,

Nope, I've never heard of that book but I will be looking for it at my

library. Seems to me I read one of Schwartzbein's books that had quite a

bit to say about adrenal fatigue, but I don't remember what it was, LOL.

Thanks for the info.

Take Care,

Katy

RE: Help! Armour & T4 - Hashi's

Have

you read Adrenal Fatigue: 21 Century Stress Syndrome?

Kate

[Guest guest]

Hi Sue,

I think it’s a good idea to add the

T3. If your anything like me, you start feeling it within a couple of days of

adding it. I’m trying to find another doctor. I really feel that it’s

the armour giving me the racing heart and palpitations. At the moment, I’m

only on Synthroid and I’m already feeling it. I need some armour or

cytomel to go with it. My muscles are already starting to ache. I have some

armour left (5months worth of 60mg), but I have no idea how much I would add to

the synthroid to get my T3. I’m really hoping I can find another doctor

soon. You’re not near Houston,

are you? I’d love to have a doc that let me try things on my request J

Take Care,

Katy

From:

Texas_Thyroid_Groups

[mailto:Texas_Thyroid_Groups ] On

Behalf Of jytdtp

Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006

3:00 PM

To: Texas_Thyroid_Groups

Subject: Re:

Help! Armour & T4 - Hashi's

I am on just T4 now but have never felt it “did

anything” but get my numbers in line — so I am asking for T3

to be added since I was still gaining weight on the T4 with

“normal” levels — I want my TSH down at 1 or below and

am asking for Cytomel when I go on the 7th of March — I talked to my endo

on the phone and she says she will try me on it at my request--- ! I feel so

fortunate to have found her...

[Guest guest]

Hi Sue,

Hi Katy,

I am so fortunate to have found this endo — she is here in San — Dianne Fetchick — and at first she was just gonna up my levoxyl but I asked if we could try some T3 since I still couldn’t get my metabolism to kick in no matter how low in fat I went and how much I exercised, etc. My cholesterol also rose the same year I got diagnosed with hashis/hypo.

I really am looking forward to trying the T3 and wonder why few doctors WILL EVEN TEST for it let alone prescribe it... How do we know so much more? Not being facetious, I really have to wonder how they determine what is best for us even if we don’t feel better. My first endo was like that — strictly a numbers man and I switched the first year to the doc I have now.

Thanks,

Sue

I think it’s a good idea to add the T3. If your anything like me, you start feeling it within a couple of days of adding it. I’m trying to find another doctor. I really feel that it’s the armour giving me the racing heart and palpitations. At the moment, I’m only on Synthroid and I’m already feeling it. I need some armour or cytomel to go with it. My muscles are already starting to ache. I have some armour left (5months worth of 60mg), but I have no idea how much I would add to the synthroid to get my T3. I’m really hoping I can find another doctor soon. You’re not near Houston, are you? I’d love to have a doc that let me try things on my request J

Take Care,

Katy

From: Texas_Thyroid_Groups [mailto:Texas_Thyroid_Groups ] On Behalf Of jytdtp

Sent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 3:00 PM

To: Texas_Thyroid_Groups

Subject: Re: Help! Armour & T4 - Hashi's

I am on just T4 now but have never felt it “did anything” but get my numbers in line — so I am asking for T3 to be added since I was still gaining weight on the T4 with “normal” levels — I want my TSH down at 1 or below and am asking for Cytomel when I go on the 7th of March — I talked to my endo on the phone and she says she will try me on it at my request--- ! I feel so fortunate to have found her...

[Guest guest]

The docs are brainwashed and indoctrinated into the T4-TSH religion by BigPharm, starting in medical school. BigPharm does not want thyroid patients to be well, because we are their cash cow. If we were well, we would not be buying their statins, antidepressants, blood pressure meds, anti-anxiety meds, proton pump inhibitors, antibiotics, and other expensive toxic waste drugs in the quantities that they would like. We see a major conversion happen when these docs become hypo themselves and find out that they do not do well on $ynthroid alone. Our very best thyroid docs are hypo themselves along with their entire families, and they all take Armour. jytdtp wrote: Hi Sue, Hi Katy,I am so fortunate to have found this endo — she is here in San — Dianne Fetchick — and at first she was just gonna up my levoxyl but I asked if we could try some T3 since I still couldn’t get my metabolism to kick in no matter how low in fat I went and how much I exercised, etc. My cholesterol also rose the same year I got diagnosed with hashis/hypo.I really am looking forward to trying the T3 and wonder why few doctors WILL EVEN TEST for it let alone prescribe it... How do we know so much more? Not being facetious, I really have to wonder

how they determine what is best for us even if we don’t feel better. My first endo was like that — strictly a numbers man and I switched the first year to the doc I have now.Thanks,SueI think it’s a good idea to add the T3. If your anything like me, you start feeling it within a couple of days of adding it. I’m trying to find another doctor. I really feel that it’s the armour giving me the racing heart and palpitations. At the moment, I’m only on Synthroid and I’m already feeling it. I need some armour or cytomel to go with it. My muscles are already starting to ache. I have some armour left (5months worth of 60mg), but I have no idea how much I would add to the synthroid to get my T3. I’m really hoping I can find another doctor soon. You’re not near Houston, are you? I’d love to have a doc that let me try

things on my request JTake Care,Katy From: Texas_Thyroid_Groups [mailto:Texas_Thyroid_Groups ] On Behalf Of jytdtpSent: Wednesday, February 22, 2006 3:00 PMTo: Texas_Thyroid_Groups Subject: Re: Help! Armour & T4 - Hashi'sI am on just T4 now but have never felt it “did anything” but get my numbers in line — so I am asking for T3 to be added since I was still gaining weight on the T4 with “normal” levels — I want my TSH down at 1 or below and am asking for Cytomel when I go on the 7th of March — I talked to my endo on the phone and she says she will try me on it at my request--- ! I feel so fortunate to have found her...

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