Re: upset stomach that feels hard to the touch and bloats out

March 8, 2005

Sounds like symptoms similar to IBS - Irritable Bowel Syndrome. Which is a

generic label that could mean anything from unknown cause, endometriosis,

celiac, and other disorders. Has she ever been evaluated for this? What is her

diet like?

Rebekah

upset stomach that feels hard to the touch and bloats out

My daughter has a upset stomach that feels hard to the touch and bloats

out about 10 times per month. Does anyone have a clue what this might

be...she is 21 years old.

Sandy

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March 8, 2005

>My daughter has a upset stomach that feels hard to the touch and bloats

>out about 10 times per month. Does anyone have a clue what this might

>be...she is 21 years old.

>

>Sandy

Dysbiosis is the usual cause ... for me it looks like I'm pregnant. When the

food doesn't get digested fully, the yeast and bacteria have a field day

and that causes the bloating. Anyway, the commonest causes of lack of

digestion are:

-- lack of enzymes

-- lack of HCL

-- IgA food reactions

-- too many carbs of the wrong sort

-- incorrect bacterial mix in general

You can put these in any order you want as to which is most common or which

causes which (this has been the source of many disagreements here!).

It's difficult to tell exactly what is going on though, without some testing.

Some folks do the " pepto bismol " diet which can help settle things down while

you do some experimenting, or you can get lab tests done. My own take

(as everyone knows who has been here any length of time) is that the

most common culprits are gluten and/or casein intolerance. But there are

other foods that bother different people -- lots of sugar can certainly

be bad, as can fructose (corn syrup), and if she lacks an enzyme to a food

she eats 10x a month, that could be it too.

In any event, taking Pepto Bismol (unless she is sensitive to salicylates) can

calm the symptoms. I find pascalite clay works too (about 1/2 tsp, don't

overdo it).

Parasites can also cause this, though I think that is rarer in this country.

Heidi Jean

March 8, 2005

I agree with Heidi as to the possible causes of the bloating. I would only

add to the " incorrect bacterial mix " by suggesting that your daughter may

have an actual bacterial (or fungal) infection or overgrowth.

One example: A friend's high school age daughter had symptoms like your

daughter for over a year. (Her symptoms also included throwing up.) She was

finally helped by Henry Lin, M.D. at Cedars Sinai Clinic at UCLA. He

performed a breath test and determined that she had Small Intestinal

Bacterial Overgrowth (SIBO) so he gave her antibiotics and put her on a sort

of medical food Fast. Afterwards she was counseled on future diet (You can

get all that information here and other great sites that say to avoid

starches and sugars and eat fermented foods... Anyway, after a couple weeks

she was fine!

Here's the link to the article on the SIBO protocol: (It's reprinted from

" Practical Gastroenterology " July 2003)

www.healthsystem.virginia.edu/internet/digestive-health/zaidelarticle.pdf

Another example of bacterial infection is Helicobacter Pylori bacteria. A

simple breath test will determine if your daughter has a problem with this

(many people carry the bacteria around but some, especially those with low

stomach acid) can have real problems with it, especially later. I learned

about H.Pylori after I had a gastric ulcer a year ago. This bacteria, if it

likes you, does not mess around; It's able to colonize the acid environment

of your stomach while feeding on, get this, hydrogen! It has an enzyme that

enables it to digest the hydrogen molecule for food -- isn't that advanced?

Anyway, again, maybe your daughter just needs to avoid starches and sugars

for awhile and try to eat fermented foods at most meals. (I'll bet that'll

help.) But if the problem is more severe you just might want to look into

infection or overgrowth as the potential culprit.

~Robin

March 9, 2005

On Wednesday, March 9, 2005, at 01:38 AM, Robin Reese wrote:

> Anyway, again, maybe your daughter just needs to avoid starches and

> sugars

> for awhile and try to eat fermented foods at most meals.

Would some kombucha tea at each meal be the fermented food. How much

would she need to drink?

Sandy

March 9, 2005

Concerning the mention of H. pylori in a previous post..

H. pylori can colonize the stomach when the acid levels are

very low such as someone frequently using antacids for

example. It then burrows into the stomach tissue lining where

it is protected from the hydrochloric acid. Also, H. pylori is

an aerobic bacteria, so that should dispel the notion people

frequently have that all aerobic bugs must be 'good' for ya.

I was recently having a discussion in the health food store

with someone who implied that ingesting hydrogen peroxide

killed off all the anaerobes in the gut leaving the aerobic bacteria

leaving people healthier. I tried to explain that some of the

worst bacteria such as leprosy, pneumonia, typhoid, and

pylori are all aerobes. We didn't get a chance to finish the

discussion or I would have suggested to him that the reason

the food grade hydrogen peroxide produces beneficial

results in people might be the result of something besides

killing all the anaerobes. After all, there are many beneficial

anaerobes as far as I know.

Darrell

March 9, 2005

>Anyway, again, maybe your daughter just needs to avoid starches and sugars

>for awhile and try to eat fermented foods at most meals. (I'll bet that'll

>help.) But if the problem is more severe you just might want to look into

>infection or overgrowth as the potential culprit.

>~Robin

BTW that is one reason for the Pepto Bismol ... I don't know if it will

help in a really bad case of bacterial infection, but bismuth IS an

antibiotic, albeit localized to the gut (and I think it only attacks

certain classes of bacteria). Kefir bacteria also attack the baddies,

and recolonize at the same time.

But I have heard of some very good results with the " destroy and

recolonize " protocol, which seems to work when nothing else

does.

Heidi Jean

March 9, 2005

On Wednesday, March 9, 2005, at 12:34 PM, Heidi Schuppenhauer wrote:

> BTW that is one reason for the Pepto Bismol ... I don't know if it will

> help in a really bad case of bacterial infection, but bismuth IS an

> antibiotic, albeit localized to the gut (and I think it only attacks

> certain classes of bacteria). Kefir bacteria also attack the baddies,

> and recolonize at the same time.

>

> But I have heard of some very good results with the " destroy and

> recolonize " protocol, which seems to work when nothing else

> does.

>

> Heidi Jean

>

So does the Pepto Bismol destroy bad stuff.

Sandy

March 9, 2005

>So does the Pepto Bismol destroy bad stuff.

>

>Sandy

If that's a question, yeah, it does. I don't know if

it will work in a really bad case, but for mild cases

it is amazing. The " Pepto Bismol Protocol " (or PB diet)

is to take it for 10 days, 3x a day. Preferably avoiding

allergens at the same time ... after 10 days, most people

feel pretty good, then they can experiment with their

diet.

Heidi Jean

March 10, 2005

Hi Heidi,

> If that's a question, yeah, it does. I don't know if

> it will work in a really bad case, but for mild cases

> it is amazing. The " Pepto Bismol Protocol " (or PB diet)

> is to take it for 10 days, 3x a day. Preferably avoiding

> allergens at the same time ... after 10 days, most people

> feel pretty good, then they can experiment with their

> diet.

>

Two questions. First, what is the proper dose? Second, is it worthwhile to

be drinking kefir and eating other probiotic foods while taking the Pepto

Bismol?

I've managed to mangle up my get ecology post surgery and am considering

doing this to set things right.

Thanks,

Ron

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