Inability to Orgasm, Anxiety, Nutrition

[Guest guest]

Hi everyone,

A recent e-friend of mine has a problem that prevents her from

orgasming when in sexual relations with someone else. We both

concluded that it was related to anxiety. It isn't a problem

specifically with intercourse (which would be rather common), and it

isn't any kind of mechanical problem. She can bring herself to orgasm

alone, so it must be psychological, and it has always been true for

her.

I asked her if she had any anxiety disorders. She said she gets panic

attacks a couple times a year. I think she also has somewhat

low-level general anxiety.

Fortunately, I may have befriended her at the perfect time for her to

possibly avoid a potentially disastrous encounter with veganism, which

she was considering in the last week. She did replace her chicken

with red meat at my suggestion the other night, which is a step in the

opposite direction :-D

My thoughts, in large part influenced by my own overcoming of anxiety,

include zinc deficiency, EPA-deficienc, B-vitamin deficiency, possible

protein deficiency, vitamin A deficiency, too much phytate from whole

grains like oatmeal, " healthy " wheat snacks. She eats mostly chicken

for meat, 2% milk, ommelettes, oatmeal, boxed macaroni and cheese,

canned vegetables, some snacks like triscuits, yogurt, cottage cheese,

fruit juice, etc. She loves red meat and fish, but always opts for

chicken out of preparation convenience. Her diet is pretty great

relative to the SAD and pretty horrible relative to WAPF. She buys

organic food and shops at Whole Foods.

I recommended that she largely replace her chicken with red meat and

fatty fish like wild salmon, supplement with cod liver oil, make sure

she eats protein at every meal, and avoid whole grains unless they're

properly prepared, and include butter. I also suggested raw cheeses

from Whole Foods in place of some dairy. I mentioned that I benefited

greatly from liver, though I imagine that would be the last thing

she'd try to institute.

Anyone have any more recommendations for this situation? Are there

specific nutrients related to a female's ability to orgasm that might

be helpful?

Chris

[Guest guest]

> A recent e-friend of mine has a problem that prevents her from

> orgasming when in sexual relations with someone else. We both

> concluded that it was related to anxiety. It isn't a problem

> specifically with intercourse (which would be rather common), and it

> isn't any kind of mechanical problem. She can bring herself to orgasm

> alone, so it must be psychological, and it has always been true for

> her.

Great mail! I knew this would be a cool site... Okay, I recommend a

preliminary diet of champagne and strawberries maybe even some chocolate...

Just kidding, (sort of.) It doesn't sound like food is going to matter one

way or another with your e-friend if she can have an orgasm one way but not

another. I assume that she's getting almost all the way " there " and then

can't release, right? She should know that that is very common. Does her

partner know that she is in this state or is this her secret? For example,

if her partner knows about this condition, has she tried to use a vibrator

or something else on her herself while the other person is 1.) watching? 2.)

has their head turned? 3.) in the next room? etc...

I'm guessing that she hasn't shared this info at all because she loves and

feels super-dooper great with her partner. She doesn't want to disappoint or

indicate in some way that he or she is a " failure " . The other reason a woman

won't tell her partner is that she probably knows that he'll want so bad to

help her that they'll try all sorts of different stuff but it may make

things sort of awkward and trying too hard again and so much time and work

and then you just get numb and so on so what's the point. She guesses that

no matter what they try, the same darned thing will probably happen and just

be embarrassing because it's all coming from the same place -- her head. I

doubt it's the food. I'm guessing it's more of blocked channel in some

mysterious region of the brain. And so common!

Here's my idea: Maybe if she can just get up the nerve to say how wow! great

she feels, but add that " I've always done this thing to myself that works in

this certain other orgasmic place and I want to get there with you and I'm

having a hard time and don't need to change anything because everything

you're doing is perfect but, hey, maybe we could start by having me just do

it to myself at the end? " Maybe he could do it to himself at the end. Mess

around with it a little bit. Try to let down some walls.

If she knew that relief was at the end one way or the other, she could relax

and not try so hard during the act. (This " coming together " thing is

beautiful but pretty hard to execute.) Also if a woman is proficient at

finding orgasm her own way and has done it that way for years a kind of

shortcut can develop and it is hard to break that link so if there was a way

to include her self-sex with the partner-sex it might get things on a

sharing track and eventually these walls would crumble? It definitely let

down some powerful boundaries that would only make things more cool. My

guess is that her partner would LOVE it if she could be that open with him.

Flat out grateful!

~Robin

[Guest guest]

On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 15:25:00 -0800, Robin Reese <robin.reese@...> wrote:

> Great mail! I knew this would be a cool site... Okay, I recommend a

> preliminary diet of champagne and strawberries maybe even some chocolate...

Ha! Thanks for the advice! :-)

> Just kidding, (sort of.) It doesn't sound like food is going to matter one

> way or another with your e-friend if she can have an orgasm one way but not

> another.

Since she has the capability to orgasm alone, I don't suspect food

will matter with respect to the orgasm itself, but I do suspect it

will be very helpful for her anxiety problems, which, in turn, I

suspect, are contributing to the psychological hangup or whatever at

is that is the issue with the orgasm.

> I assume that she's getting almost all the way " there " and then

> can't release, right? She should know that that is very common.

I'm not sure, we didn't cover that... but common? She's been in

long-term relationships (4 yrs) and casual relationships and has never

orgasmed with someone else. I know she's not the only one, but I

don't think that's common, is it? Not like being unable to orgasm

without clitoral stimulation is common, or not being able to orgasm

easily, etc.

Does her

> partner know that she is in this state or is this her secret? For example,

> if her partner knows about this condition, has she tried to use a vibrator

> or something else on her herself while the other person is 1.) watching?

> 2.)

> has their head turned? 3.) in the next room? etc...

I had similar thoughts. I don't know whether she's tried anything

like this. I got the impression that she doesn't keep it a secret.

Thanks for your thoughts. :-)

Chris

[Guest guest]

Hi

> A recent e-friend of mine has a problem that prevents her from

> orgasming when in sexual relations with someone else. We both

> concluded that it was related to anxiety. It isn't a problem

> specifically with intercourse (which would be rather common), and it

> isn't any kind of mechanical problem. She can bring herself to orgasm

> alone, so it must be psychological, and it has always been true for

> her.

http://www.orgasmicdiet.com/

I encountered this woman in a forum on a website about Male Multiple Orgasm.

She seems to be the real thing and others in the forum suggested that her

diet works.

I am personally beginning to see psychological change in myself over the

past several months that I think is due to my increased intake of good

saturated fats after a couple of years of taking fish oil/clo. I'm not sure

enough yet to get any more specific than that, but the signs are pretty

powerful so far. Your recommendations looked like they were on the right

track.

I liked Robin's response, also, and thought that there may be issues similar

to the ones that she has raised involved. Dietarily removing anxiety may

well open up the lines of communication that Robin alludes to, though.

Ron

[Guest guest]

Masterjohn wrote:

>

>

>

> I asked her if she had any anxiety disorders. She said she gets panic

> attacks a couple times a year. I think she also has somewhat

> low-level general anxiety.

Regarding the panick attacks; this may sound obvious, but if she is

drinking caffeinated beverages tell her to switch to decaffeinated.

I had panic attacks, with heart palpations, dizziness, faintness and

cold sweats. Switching gradually to decaf helped tremendously. Once

every blue moon I feel an attack coming on, but nothing like they used

to be.

Best,

[Guest guest]

> I'm not sure, we didn't cover that... but common? She's been in

> long-term relationships (4 yrs) and casual relationships and has never

> orgasmed with someone else. I know she's not the only one, but I

> don't think that's common, is it? Not like being unable to orgasm

> without clitoral stimulation is common, or not being able to orgasm

> easily, etc.

When I used the word " common " I meant that, from what I hear, your friend

is not alone in her problem. This sort of thing occurs with women who don't

necessarily have anxiety disorders or nutritional deficiencies. My guess is

that on a subconscious level she might be holding some part of her private

self back -- not wanting to share some important personal part. I'm no

psychiatrist I just know enough women to think your friend's " problem " isn't

automatically some kind of disorder. If men had the option of hiding an

orgasm the way that women can they might have similar " disorders " . The mind

works in mysterious ways.....

~Robin

[Guest guest]

Robin-

>It doesn't sound like food is going to matter one

>way or another with your e-friend if she can have an orgasm one way but not

>another.

I don't think that's necessarily true. Orgasming, like most biological

events, is a threshold condition. It could be that poor nutrition makes it

harder for her to achieve orgasm, and therefore she's only been able to in

private -- which of course would also be a psychologically self-reinforcing

condition.

-

[Guest guest]

Ron-

>http://www.orgasmicdiet.com/

>

>I encountered this woman in a forum on a website about Male Multiple Orgasm.

>She seems to be the real thing and others in the forum suggested that her

>diet works.

Oh. My. God.

It really is a small world after all. I've known her for years.

I'll just say that her approach needs to be moderately NN-ized.

-

[Guest guest]

That diet didn't seem terribly off-base, especially as compared with

the SAD diet.

I don't know anything about these products, personally, but they come

to mind:

http://www.optimalnaturalhealth.com/fe/index.php

FWIW, when I'm skinny, I have less libido. When I was pregnant, I

had a lot.

How old is your friend? Hitting 30 did something to me.

It might be a trust issue. If the partner doesn't inspire deep trust

and/or esteem in your friend, she may never find what she seeks,

physically.

Some authorities do recommend that the partner assist the female with

thankless chores like doing the dishes.

--- In , Idol <Idol@c...>

wrote:

> Ron-

>

> >http://www.orgasmicdiet.com/

> >

> >I encountered this woman in a forum on a website about Male

Multiple Orgasm.

> >She seems to be the real thing and others in the forum suggested

that her

> >diet works.

>

> Oh. My. God.

>

> It really is a small world after all. I've known her for years.

>

> I'll just say that her approach needs to be moderately NN-ized.

>

>

>

> -

[Guest guest]

On Wed, 16 Mar 2005 23:20:35 -0000, <toyotaokiec@...> wrote:

> That diet didn't seem terribly off-base, especially as compared with

> the SAD diet.

No, but it is nevertheless deficient in zinc, n-3 fatty acids, etc.

The first thing I noticed was that she's obviously somewhat

health-conscious, but that doesn't mean it's a *good* diet. I had

anxiety problems for 8 years, on SAD, vegetarianism, health-conscious

meat-inclusive diet, etc, but they vanished after WAPifying my diet.

> I don't know anything about these products, personally, but they come

> to mind:

>

> http://www.optimalnaturalhealth.com/fe/index.php

I'll check it out in a moment... thanks.

> FWIW, when I'm skinny, I have less libido. When I was pregnant, I

> had a lot.

That makes some sense. I wonder if it was the fat tissue per se, or

the fact that you were eating more? Pregnancy is excellent birth

control.

> How old is your friend? Hitting 30 did something to me.

She's 20.

> It might be a trust issue. If the partner doesn't inspire deep trust

> and/or esteem in your friend, she may never find what she seeks,

> physically.

Well she had a 4-year relationship with the same problem. She told me

that she generally has anxiety issues over how perfect she looks,

sounds, etc, and that in this very long relationship she had some

anxiety over losing him.

I know what it's like to have obsessive anxiety, and mine was never

relieved through any method I ever tried except changing what I eat.

I don't know that it would be the same for her, but it's certainly

worth a shot.

I'm stuck in the position of, on the one hand, agreeing that it makes

a lot of sense to approach anxiety issues from a cognitive approach,

and on the other hand, knowing that my own experience proved just the

opposite. Nothing cognitive I tried had any effect whatsoever, and

when I changed my diet I was trying to fix my *teeth* and my healing

was entirely inadvertent.

> Some authorities do recommend that the partner assist the female with

> thankless chores like doing the dishes.

Ha! I like washing other people's dishes, and I'd happily wash hers

if I thought it would help, but given the very large distance between

us, I'm not about to hop on a plane to do so.

Somehow I imagine that a frustrated sexual partner being told my

someone in her position that " Maybe you could bring me to orgasm if

you wash the dishes? " would feel manipulated.

Chris

[Guest guest]

>> Somehow I imagine that a frustrated sexual partner being told my

someone in her position that " Maybe you could bring me to orgasm if

you wash the dishes? " would feel manipulated. >>

Reminds me of a favorite song of mine, by Bragg... . " No amount of

poetry can mend this broken heart, but you can push the Hoover 'round if you

want to make a start. "

Christie

[Guest guest]

> > FWIW, when I'm skinny, I have less libido. When I was pregnant,

I

> > had a lot.

>

> That makes some sense. I wonder if it was the fat tissue per se, or

> the fact that you were eating more? Pregnancy is excellent birth

> control.

I think fat tissue contains estrogen...perhaps the other hormones

like progesterone and testosterone also.

>

> > How old is your friend? Hitting 30 did something to me.

>

> She's 20.

When I was 20, the prospect of the physical part of sex did not turn

me on, per se. I'm saying that thinking and talking about the

physical part of sex was not something that I spent time on, or

wanted to spend time on. I was more inclined to want to be close to

someone who inspired me and whom I admired. The characteristics

needn't necessarily be spiritual, though they could be. I could be

inspired by someone who was adept in some ability that I envied or

aspired to, or who was exceptionally kind to me when he didn't have

to be.

> Well she had a 4-year relationship with the same problem. She told

me

> that she generally has anxiety issues over how perfect she looks,

> sounds, etc, and that in this very long relationship she had some

> anxiety over losing him.

At that age, I can remember feeling that way. I understand that

research shows that American females harbor deep feelings of

insecurity about their physical selves. Perhaps she has watched too

much adult material, and is stressing out when she compares herself

to the people she has seen.

> I know what it's like to have obsessive anxiety, and mine was never

> relieved through any method I ever tried except changing what I

eat.

> I don't know that it would be the same for her, but it's certainly

> worth a shot.

>

> I'm stuck in the position of, on the one hand, agreeing that it

makes

> a lot of sense to approach anxiety issues from a cognitive approach,

> and on the other hand, knowing that my own experience proved just

the

> opposite. Nothing cognitive I tried had any effect whatsoever, and

> when I changed my diet I was trying to fix my *teeth* and my healing

> was entirely inadvertent.

LOL! What a nice surprise! That's not unlike how my heel spurs went

away after I switched to whole milk for my DD5's sake.

>

> > Some authorities do recommend that the partner assist the female

with

> > thankless chores like doing the dishes.

>

> Ha! I like washing other people's dishes, and I'd happily wash hers

> if I thought it would help, but given the very large distance

between

> us, I'm not about to hop on a plane to do so.

>

> Somehow I imagine that a frustrated sexual partner being told my

> someone in her position that " Maybe you could bring me to orgasm if

> you wash the dishes? " would feel manipulated.

LOL! Turn it around. If the partner were the frustrated one and

tried to get the female to do things so he could be satisfied,

wouldn't that be manipulation?

Actually, I think the dish washing thing works best if she doesn't

have to ask. On the other hand, if she has to ask, then it is

something that matters to her. IMHO, It would be worthwhile to try

it.

[Guest guest]

Chris-

>I'm stuck in the position of, on the one hand, agreeing that it makes

>a lot of sense to approach anxiety issues from a cognitive approach,

>and on the other hand, knowing that my own experience proved just the

>opposite. Nothing cognitive I tried had any effect whatsoever, and

>when I changed my diet I was trying to fix my *teeth* and my healing

>was entirely inadvertent.

Same for me. I used to have anxiety problems and attacks of what I called

the " dreads " until I changed my diet and added some digestive aids

(enzymes, specifically). It's important not to ignore the cognitive side

of things, and trying EFT might be worthwhile for her, but diet is more

profound than most people realize.

>Ha! I like washing other people's dishes,

Hmm, looking to move to NYC? <g>

>Somehow I imagine that a frustrated sexual partner being told my

>someone in her position that " Maybe you could bring me to orgasm if

>you wash the dishes? " would feel manipulated.

Yeah, that would be a hard sell for sure.

-

[Guest guest]

> >I encountered this woman in a forum on a website about Male

> Multiple Orgasm.

> >She seems to be the real thing and others in the forum

> suggested that her

> >diet works.

>

> Oh. My. God.

>

> It really is a small world after all. I've known her for years.

Yes, it is all too bizarre.

Who would have thought that I'd encounter a bunch of bodybuilders and

Pavelized kettlebell users on a native nutrition website? Next thing you

know a bunch of Tantric Ken Wilber fans discussing Heinlein,

Psycho-Cybernetics, Ayn Rand and Anton all while using

Clearing processes and Holosync will appear on this list and I'll then

absolutely know for sure that the universe is my own mental creation and

it's all a big dream.

Ron

[Guest guest]

Ron-

>Who would have thought that I'd encounter a bunch of bodybuilders and

>Pavelized kettlebell users on a native nutrition website?

I don't know, it makes sense to me (with the exception that I don't think

anyone on this list with the possible exception of you would use the term

" bodybuilders " ).

> Next thing you

>know a bunch of Tantric Ken Wilber fans discussing Heinlein,

>Psycho-Cybernetics, Ayn Rand and Anton all while using

>Clearing processes and Holosync will appear on this list and I'll then

>absolutely know for sure that the universe is my own mental creation and

>it's all a big dream.

Hmm, 's described himself as an objectivist, I've read Anton

and Ayn Rand and I use Awakened Minds, which is similar to

Holosync... but I think what it really means is that the universe is MY own

mental creation. <g>

-

[Guest guest]

At 12:51 PM 3/18/05 -0500, you wrote:

>> Next thing you

>>know a bunch of Tantric Ken Wilber fans discussing Heinlein,

>>Psycho-Cybernetics, Ayn Rand and Anton all while using

>>Clearing processes and Holosync will appear on this list and I'll then

>>absolutely know for sure that the universe is my own mental creation and

>>it's all a big dream.

>

>Hmm, 's described himself as an objectivist, I've read Anton

> and Ayn Rand and I use Awakened Minds, which is similar to

>Holosync... but I think what it really means is that the universe is MY own

>mental creation. <g>

I only dream in Heinlein, and even then it usually involves electric sheep.

MFJ

If I have to be a grownup, can I at least be telekinetic too?

[Guest guest]

-

>I only dream in Heinlein, and even then it usually involves electric sheep.

You're mixing up your authors. _Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?_ was

Philip K. Dick (and the inspiration for the movie " Blade Runner " ).

-

[Guest guest]

At 01:19 PM 3/18/05 -0500, you wrote:

>>I only dream in Heinlein, and even then it usually involves electric sheep.

>

>You're mixing up your authors. _Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?_ was

>Philip K. Dick (and the inspiration for the movie " Blade Runner " ).

>

I know. That's why I said " even then " .

MFJ

If I have to be a grownup, can I at least be telekinetic too?

[Guest guest]

> but I think what it really means is that the

> universe is MY own

> mental creation. <g>

>

_Multiperson Solipsism_ RAH, I can't remember which book.

Ron

[Guest guest]

On Date: Fri, 18 Mar 2005 12:45:25 -0500 " RBJR " wrote

> Next thing you

> know a bunch of Tantric Ken Wilber fans discussing Heinlein,

> Psycho-Cybernetics, Ayn Rand and Anton all while using

> Clearing processes and Holosync will appear on this list and I'll then

> absolutely know for sure that the universe is my own mental creation and

> it's all a big dream.

>

> Ron

>

OK, but if you say you are a Stuart fan too I think the universe may

implode (or at least my reality tunnel).

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

> When I was 20, the prospect of the physical part of sex did not turn

> me on, per se. I'm saying that thinking and talking about the

> physical part of sex was not something that I spent time on, or

> wanted to spend time on. I was more inclined to want to be close to

> someone who inspired me and whom I admired. The characteristics

> needn't necessarily be spiritual, though they could be. I could be

> inspired by someone who was adept in some ability that I envied or

> aspired to, or who was exceptionally kind to me when he didn't have

> to be.

>

That was one of the most informative things that I have ever read.

Explained much that I had not previously understood.

Thanks,

Ron

[Guest guest]

> (with the exception that I

> don't think

> anyone on this list with the possible exception of you would

> use the term

> " bodybuilders " ).

>

Hmm. Being afraid to detox because you might lose a few pounds of muscle

mass puts people squarely in the bodybuilder world as far I am concerned.

I read a fantastic paragraph in Dave Draper's (Mr. America, 1967) latest

newsletter that really summed up the pure bodybuilder mindset to me.

" Here's something I learned the hard way, a

personally appointed fact that's neither common nor uncommon; it's simply

a part of my training understanding and training mechanics. And

recognizing and appreciating the phenomenon enables me to accept my

emerging limitations and carry on with gusto and high hopes. Muscle

building is not dependent upon how much weight one lifts, but upon how

much muscle exertion one achieves and endures throughout the lift. Seek

maximum muscle contraction. Due to pain, often tendonitis, I can press a

fraction of the weight I could years ago, but the healthy muscle

contraction and exertion I undergo exceeds that which I experienced when

younger. The lad next to me is using 45s on his bar and I'm using 10s, yet

I'm expending greater intensity in muscle activity than he. Call it

determination. I overcome a lighter resistance with more muscle exertion.

Frustrating if your ego is counting; rewarding when you appreciate the

muscle-building overload. Overload determines growth. "

Old Dave couldn't care less about actually getting stronger or better able

to use his muscle, all he cares is about is getting and keeping those

muscles BIG.

Ron

[Guest guest]

Ron-

>Hmm. Being afraid to detox because you might lose a few pounds of muscle

>mass puts people squarely in the bodybuilder world as far I am concerned.

If I had tons and tons of LBM and no worries about excess fat I wouldn't be

so worried, but my concerns aren't cosmetic. I lost a lot of LBM due to

digestive problems which lasted several years, and due to metabolic

problems (caused partly by those digestive issues) I have stubborn fat. So

I can't afford to lose more LBM and gain more stubborn fat when I'm doing

everything I can to gain muscle and lose fat in order to feel better and

have more energy. It's not a cosmetic issue. Nor am I convinced that any

of these " detoxes " actually accomplish much of anything. A liver flush...

maybe, maybe not. But fasting? It seems to cause clear and definite harm,

and I've seen no evidence of real benefits.

>Old Dave couldn't care less about actually getting stronger or better able

>to use his muscle, all he cares is about is getting and keeping those

>muscles BIG.

I really don't care about " big " at all except to the degree that I strongly

suspect that increasing my LBM a fair amount (to replace what was lost and

then some) will yield substantial metabolic benefits. I'm much more

interested in functional muscle.

-

[Guest guest]

Ron-

>Hmm. Being afraid to detox because you might lose a few pounds of muscle

>mass puts people squarely in the bodybuilder world as far I am concerned.

I should also add that I strongly suspect that the modern " cut " look of

bodybuilders, achieved by dropping bodyfat percentages down well into the

single digits, is a very bad idea. I'm not sure where the border between

healthy and unhealthy is, but I expect the healthy floor for men is

probably in the 8-12% range, and most likely not in the single digits at all.

-

[Guest guest]

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Idol [mailto:Idol@...]

> > Next thing you

> >know a bunch of Tantric Ken Wilber fans discussing Heinlein,

> >Psycho-Cybernetics, Ayn Rand and Anton all while using

> >Clearing processes and Holosync will appear on this list and

> I'll then

> >absolutely know for sure that the universe is my own mental creation

> >and it's all a big dream.

>

> Hmm, 's described himself as an objectivist...

I also brought up Heinlein a while back, specifically the abysmal " I Will

Fear No Evil. " I can't remember why, though.