Re: kefiili and GF question

[Guest guest]

>I will keep on with the experiment but I may have to be asking you

>for some more kefiil grains. LOL

No problem.

>Being gluten Intolerant, did I read where you said that you were

>bothered by the kefir whereas you weren't with the kefiili? I must

>be getting some gluten or casin from somewhere as my tummy is acting

>up.

I got bothered by kefir the first time I had it ... then no problems.

It does act like a good probiotic. BUT ... when I stopped the kefir,

all my migraines stopped too. Also the " urinary urge " stopped, and

my need to drink lots of water. Kefir and kefiili are about the same

though, for me. Butter is more problematic than either.

My tummy acts up now and then ... the one thing that seems to

work long term is the Pascalite clay. Dunno why. I suspect it

promotes good bacterial growth kind of like the ceramic powder

that is used in EM cultures, or it gets rid of toxins. At any rate,

I take it daily now. No symptoms of vitamin deficiency.

I figure ... our forbears ate a lot of dirt, mostly not on purpose.

Actually a lot of people eat it on purpose, esp. pregnant women

(some places they have dirt-eating parties!). So maybe clay is just

a normal part of our diet. I only eat 1/2 tsp a day though.

>Also this is off topic (kinda sorta) but are ground ginger, ground

>cloves, ground cinnamen, GF? Is there a list somewhere of GF spices?

Anything from McCormick's seems to be ok. And Penzy's. I think the other major

retailers are too. The only one I've had a problem with was some little

outfit where I bought some Epazote, and Jaffe Brothers (I got some

dates from them that were packaged on flour-contaminated equipment ...

they are a good outfit, but order in BIG BULK so they don't repackage it).

>Del

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

How did you decide which clay to use? I am reading where the

Terramin clay is the best external and internal clay. Is there a

reason why you picked Pascalite over the others? Do you get enough

calcium in it without taking another supplement? I would think not,

but just asking. I am going to have to do something. I think I am

completely gluten free. Some casin in my diet but not much. Maybe I

should look at getting casin completely out. Casin is in kefir,

right? I have been okay for about a year but all of a sudden I am

bloating again and can't seem to find what it is.

Thanks,

Del

Heidi Schuppenhauer wrote:

>

> >I will keep on with the experiment but I may have to be asking

you

> >for some more kefiil grains. LOL

>

> No problem.

>

> >Being gluten Intolerant, did I read where you said that you were

> >bothered by the kefir whereas you weren't with the kefiili? I

must

> >be getting some gluten or casin from somewhere as my tummy is

acting

> >up.

>

> I got bothered by kefir the first time I had it ... then no

problems.

> It does act like a good probiotic. BUT ... when I stopped the

kefir,

> all my migraines stopped too. Also the " urinary urge " stopped, and

> my need to drink lots of water. Kefir and kefiili are about the

same

> though, for me. Butter is more problematic than either.

>

> My tummy acts up now and then ... the one thing that seems to

> work long term is the Pascalite clay. Dunno why. I suspect it

> promotes good bacterial growth kind of like the ceramic powder

> that is used in EM cultures, or it gets rid of toxins. At any rate,

> I take it daily now. No symptoms of vitamin deficiency.

>

> I figure ... our forbears ate a lot of dirt, mostly not on purpose.

> Actually a lot of people eat it on purpose, esp. pregnant women

> (some places they have dirt-eating parties!). So maybe clay is just

> a normal part of our diet. I only eat 1/2 tsp a day though.

>

>

> >Also this is off topic (kinda sorta) but are ground ginger,

ground

> >cloves, ground cinnamen, GF? Is there a list somewhere of GF

spices?

>

> Anything from McCormick's seems to be ok. And Penzy's. I think the

other major

> retailers are too. The only one I've had a problem with was some

little

> outfit where I bought some Epazote, and Jaffe Brothers (I got some

> dates from them that were packaged on flour-contaminated

equipment ...

> they are a good outfit, but order in BIG BULK so they don't

repackage it).

>

>

>

> >Del

>

> Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

>>I have been okay for about a year but all of a sudden I am

bloating again and can't seem to find what it is.

Thanks,

Del<<

~~~I have just tried kefir again too and gas is a horrible problem for me with

it. I think it is lactose. Kefir is not supposed to have much lactose, but I

can't help but think that's wrong, because it's the lactose in milk that is

supposed to cause bloating and gas, not the casein. (Right?) And, of course,

if we're using 'store' milk to make it, we aren't getting the lactase we would

get in raw milk to help digest the lactose. I have been thinking of travelling

the 50 miles I'd have to go to get raw milk just as a test, but then I think,

'what's the point', since I know I won't want to continue to travel that far

every week to get it, especially this winter in the snow and ice.

Carol

[Guest guest]

- These grains consist of casein and gelatinous colonies of

microorganisms that are

grown together symbiotically. Kefir is fermented in a covered

container, and ...

www.torontoadvisors.com/Kefir/article2_Kris.htm

-- In , " Del Eaton " <deleaton@d...>

wrote:

>

> How did you decide which clay to use? I am reading where the

> Terramin clay is the best external and internal clay. Is there a

> reason why you picked Pascalite over the others? Do you get enough

> calcium in it without taking another supplement? I would think

not,

> but just asking. I am going to have to do something. I think I am

> completely gluten free. Some casin in my diet but not much. Maybe

I

> should look at getting casin completely out. Casin is in kefir,

> right? I have been okay for about a year but all of a sudden I am

> bloating again and can't seem to find what it is.

>

> Thanks,

> Del

>

> Heidi Schuppenhauer wrote:

> >

> > >I will keep on with the experiment but I may have to be asking

> you

> > >for some more kefiil grains. LOL

> >

> > No problem.

> >

> > >Being gluten Intolerant, did I read where you said that you

were

> > >bothered by the kefir whereas you weren't with the kefiili? I

> must

> > >be getting some gluten or casin from somewhere as my tummy is

> acting

> > >up.

> >

> > I got bothered by kefir the first time I had it ... then no

> problems.

> > It does act like a good probiotic. BUT ... when I stopped the

> kefir,

> > all my migraines stopped too. Also the " urinary urge " stopped,

and

> > my need to drink lots of water. Kefir and kefiili are about the

> same

> > though, for me. Butter is more problematic than either.

> >

> > My tummy acts up now and then ... the one thing that seems to

> > work long term is the Pascalite clay. Dunno why. I suspect it

> > promotes good bacterial growth kind of like the ceramic powder

> > that is used in EM cultures, or it gets rid of toxins. At any

rate,

> > I take it daily now. No symptoms of vitamin deficiency.

> >

> > I figure ... our forbears ate a lot of dirt, mostly not on

purpose.

> > Actually a lot of people eat it on purpose, esp. pregnant women

> > (some places they have dirt-eating parties!). So maybe clay is

just

> > a normal part of our diet. I only eat 1/2 tsp a day though.

> >

> >

> > >Also this is off topic (kinda sorta) but are ground ginger,

> ground

> > >cloves, ground cinnamen, GF? Is there a list somewhere of GF

> spices?

> >

> > Anything from McCormick's seems to be ok. And Penzy's. I think

the

> other major

> > retailers are too. The only one I've had a problem with was some

> little

> > outfit where I bought some Epazote, and Jaffe Brothers (I got

some

> > dates from them that were packaged on flour-contaminated

> equipment ...

> > they are a good outfit, but order in BIG BULK so they don't

> repackage it).

> >

> >

> >

> > >Del

> >

> > Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

>How did you decide which clay to use? I am reading where the

>Terramin clay is the best external and internal clay. Is there a

>reason why you picked Pascalite over the others?

Because on the celiac group, someone talked about some folks

who, when they would travel, would go ahead and eat wheat,

but take Pascalite. One time they forgot it ... and were sick for

a week after they got home. That piqued my curiousity ... I wouldn't

eat wheat on purpose, but I don't like suffering for the accidental

amount I do get going out.

But, I haven't compared the different clays.

> Do you get enough

>calcium in it without taking another supplement? I would think not,

>but just asking. I am going to have to do something.

I don't know that the calcium in it is very bioavailable. Folks who

eat too much clay (or cats, for that matter, who eat kitty litter) end

up with deficiencies, it seems. The clays seem to bind to stuff,

esp. toxins but I'd guess they'd bind to some nutrients too (they

are used to " clean up " batches of bad-tasting wine, for instance,

and to get rid of haziness in wine and beer, and in manufacturing

to absorb certain things). But I'm purely guessing ... traditionally

clays have been used, say, to dip potatoes in so they digest better,

but exactly what it does I just don't know.

I take calcium supplements, because if I don't I get tetany pretty

quick, but all the supplements I've tried seem to work just fine.

Calcium carbonate is calcium carbonate (Calcium and magnesium

citrate are both laxatives, at least on me, so I don't use them, though

they are more bioavailable). I think fermented bones would be a better

source, but I haven't gotten to that yet.

>I think I am

>completely gluten free. Some casin in my diet but not much. Maybe I

>should look at getting casin completely out. Casin is in kefir,

>right? I have been okay for about a year but all of a sudden I am

>bloating again and can't seem to find what it is.

Could be casein, could be just bacterial imbalance in general or

too many starches? Too much pumpkin pie? :--) You could try

the ol' Pepto for a few days ... but yeah, I had to more or

less drop the milk kefir, though it is a lot less problematic

than other dairy. One lady I know who has major problems

with dairy though can take goat milk kefir (she uses the goat

milk at the grocery, says it works fine as kefir).

>

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

>~~~I have just tried kefir again too and gas is a horrible problem for me with

it. I think it is lactose. Kefir is not supposed to have much lactose, but I

can't help but think that's wrong, because it's the lactose in milk that is

supposed to cause bloating and gas, not the casein. (Right?) And, of course,

if we're using 'store' milk to make it, we aren't getting the lactase we would

get in raw milk to help digest the lactose. I have been thinking of travelling

the 50 miles I'd have to go to get raw milk just as a test, but then I think,

'what's the point', since I know I won't want to continue to travel that far

every week to get it, especially this winter in the snow and ice.

>Carol

Casein can cause bloating and gas too, if you are intolerant to it. The IgA

reaction to casein is pretty much the same as the one to gluten ... it causes

the villi to not work right, so food isn't digested properly. However, the

bacteria in kefir are also just plain different, and a lot of folks get gas when

they first take it. I get more gas when I drink kefir beer too, though only in

the morning ... I think in that case it has to do with digesting the food more

fully, because my " output " is more compact by a factor of 3 or so, and there is

no bloating involved.

You can test if lactose is the problem by taking the kefir with Lactaid, see if

it makes a difference.

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

>>The clays seem to bind to stuff,

esp. toxins but I'd guess they'd bind to some nutrients too (they

are used to " clean up " batches of bad-tasting wine, for instance,

and to get rid of haziness in wine and beer, and in manufacturing

to absorb certain things).<<

~~~This is very true, in my experience. I have a tendency to magnesium

deficiency, and if I take bentonite, it causes horrid muscle cramps for me,

because it has absorbed minerals and ushered them out of my body, along with the

toxins, creating a further magnesium deficiency.

>>I take calcium supplements, because if I don't I get tetany pretty

quick, but all the supplements I've tried seem to work just fine.

Calcium carbonate is calcium carbonate (Calcium and magnesium

citrate are both laxatives, at least on me, so I don't use them, though

they are more bioavailable). I think fermented bones would be a better

source, but I haven't gotten to that yet.<<

~~~Taking calcium, however, without magnesium can be mistake. And, magnesium is

the one that relaxes the muscles. (Contrary to popular belief.)

" There are many parallels in clinical manifestations and dysfunctions in the

latent tetany syndrome (LTS) of marginal magnesium (Mg) deficiency.... "

http://www.mgwater.com/clmd.shtml

http://www.bodyandfitness.com/Information/Health/Research/magnesium1.htm

http://www.mcvitamins.com/cramps.htm

>>One lady I know who has major problems

with dairy though can take goat milk kefir (she uses the goat

milk at the grocery, says it works fine as kefir).

Heidi Jean>>

~~~I have major problems with dairy and just made kefir with goat milk from the

grocery store, just to see if the goat milk would be better. I've had terrible

gas from it - every bit as bad as cow's milk. But, my intestinal system is

unusually bad too.

Carol

[Guest guest]

>>You can test if lactose is the problem by taking the kefir with Lactaid, see

if it makes a difference.

Heidi Jean<<

~~~Lactaid has never helped me with milk digestion. I don't know if it's

because the problem is too much for the amount of lactase one gets in Lactaid,

or if it's because of the casein in the milk. I didn't know casein could cause

the same intestinal problems as lactose, so that may be my problem.

Carol

[Guest guest]

Where did you buy the pascalite clay? That is amazing that pascalite

clay works so well for celiac. I can't wait to get my hands on some.

I have checked all my HFS and they all carry benonite clay, which I

already have but it is the type for external only, I think.

I did make pumpkin pie (excellent with the coconut milk) and the

chocolate pecan pie (excellent) and the carrott cake (excellent

also). I made cornbread dressing (not good, need another recipe),

maple yams with pecans, mashed potatos (no milk but lots of butter)

There it is...the butter! I was out of ghee. I also had squash and

ambrosia. Turkey too but I didn't eat any because I wanted to eat

all the other stuff. I only ate a *taste* of the goodies....honest.

I wonder how long it will take me to get over eating all this!

Oh, so I could try to kefir the goats milk from the groc store, that

might work!

I have been taking calcium citrate in liquid form and I am beginning

to think that it also hurts my tummy. It is in liquid form with all

the other minerals needed to balance it.

Thanks,

Del

Heidi Schuppenhauer wrote:

>

> >How did you decide which clay to use? I am reading where the

> >Terramin clay is the best external and internal clay. Is there a

> >reason why you picked Pascalite over the others?

>

> Because on the celiac group, someone talked about some folks

> who, when they would travel, would go ahead and eat wheat,

> but take Pascalite. One time they forgot it ... and were sick for

> a week after they got home. That piqued my curiousity ... I

wouldn't

> eat wheat on purpose, but I don't like suffering for the accidental

> amount I do get going out.

>

> But, I haven't compared the different clays.

>

> > Do you get enough

> >calcium in it without taking another supplement? I would think

not,

> >but just asking. I am going to have to do something.

>

> I don't know that the calcium in it is very bioavailable. Folks who

> eat too much clay (or cats, for that matter, who eat kitty litter)

end

> up with deficiencies, it seems. The clays seem to bind to stuff,

> esp. toxins but I'd guess they'd bind to some nutrients too (they

> are used to " clean up " batches of bad-tasting wine, for instance,

> and to get rid of haziness in wine and beer, and in manufacturing

> to absorb certain things). But I'm purely guessing ...

traditionally

> clays have been used, say, to dip potatoes in so they digest

better,

> but exactly what it does I just don't know.

>

> I take calcium supplements, because if I don't I get tetany pretty

> quick, but all the supplements I've tried seem to work just fine.

> Calcium carbonate is calcium carbonate (Calcium and magnesium

> citrate are both laxatives, at least on me, so I don't use them,

though

> they are more bioavailable). I think fermented bones would be a

better

> source, but I haven't gotten to that yet.

>

> >I think I am

> >completely gluten free. Some casin in my diet but not much. Maybe

I

> >should look at getting casin completely out. Casin is in kefir,

> >right? I have been okay for about a year but all of a sudden I am

> >bloating again and can't seem to find what it is.

>

> Could be casein, could be just bacterial imbalance in general or

> too many starches? Too much pumpkin pie? :--) You could try

> the ol' Pepto for a few days ... but yeah, I had to more or

> less drop the milk kefir, though it is a lot less problematic

> than other dairy. One lady I know who has major problems

> with dairy though can take goat milk kefir (she uses the goat

> milk at the grocery, says it works fine as kefir).

> >

>

> Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

I guess I better research long and hard before taking the clay

because I surly don't want the clay to usher any minerals out of my

body unless I don't need them. I have muscle cramps pretty bad when

I don't take my cal/mag supplements. I even have the cramps when I

take the supplements but not as bad. Still don't know the dif

between tetany and plain old muscle cramps.

So using the goat's milk to make the kefir didn't work for you. I

have heard others say that but not many.

Thanks,

Del

" Carol " wrote:

>

> >>The clays seem to bind to stuff,

> esp. toxins but I'd guess they'd bind to some nutrients too (they

> are used to " clean up " batches of bad-tasting wine, for instance,

> and to get rid of haziness in wine and beer, and in manufacturing

> to absorb certain things).<<

>

> ~~~This is very true, in my experience. I have a tendency to

magnesium deficiency, and if I take bentonite, it causes horrid

muscle cramps for me, because it has absorbed minerals and ushered

them out of my body, along with the toxins, creating a further

magnesium deficiency.

>

>

> >>I take calcium supplements, because if I don't I get tetany

pretty

> quick, but all the supplements I've tried seem to work just fine.

> Calcium carbonate is calcium carbonate (Calcium and magnesium

> citrate are both laxatives, at least on me, so I don't use them,

though

> they are more bioavailable). I think fermented bones would be a

better

> source, but I haven't gotten to that yet.<<

>

> ~~~Taking calcium, however, without magnesium can be mistake.

And, magnesium is the one that relaxes the muscles. (Contrary to

popular belief.)

>

> " There are many parallels in clinical manifestations and

dysfunctions in the latent tetany syndrome (LTS) of marginal

magnesium (Mg) deficiency.... "

> http://www.mgwater.com/clmd.shtml

>

http://www.bodyandfitness.com/Information/Health/Research/magnesium1.

htm

> http://www.mcvitamins.com/cramps.htm

>

>

>

> >>One lady I know who has major problems

> with dairy though can take goat milk kefir (she uses the goat

> milk at the grocery, says it works fine as kefir).

> Heidi Jean>>

>

> ~~~I have major problems with dairy and just made kefir with goat

milk from the grocery store, just to see if the goat milk would be

better. I've had terrible gas from it - every bit as bad as cow's

milk. But, my intestinal system is unusually bad too.

> Carol

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Del,

Yes, please do a LOT of research. I can't tell you how many times, I've come to

one conclusion about a food, or particularly a supplement, based on research,

only to later find out the information was wrong......and many things are just

plain unknowns - once you look at both sides, you can see that. It got to be so

frustrating to me that I have quit taking all the many supplements I used to

take. I was like you with the calcium and magnesium and the cramps. (I think

tetany and muscle cramps are basically the same thing.) For a long time, I

couldn't seem to get along without LOTS of magnesium. Then, it got so it seemed

like my cramps were getting worse and worse, until I was taking so much

magnesium to stop them, that it was giving me diarrhea. I had read years ago

that taking minerals was iffy, because it's so easy to cause imbalances between

the various minerals, but particularly between calcium and magnesium. Also,

they used to say you should take twice as much calcium as magnesium. (Boy, do I

have a sad tale of woe about having done that.) Now the cutting edge research

is saying they should be taken in equal amounts. Then, I read at the WAPF site

that calcium chelates will cause mineral imbalances because they bypass the

natural absorption. Between much sad experience and various things I've read,

I'm now thinking I may be better off to get my minerals from foods. So, I'm

juicing high calcium and magnesium veggies, and eating foods as high in minerals

as possible. (Lots of nuts for one.) At least I'm going to try it for awhile.

Good luck with the whole thing. I know how awful the cramps can be. For

awhile, I was waking up at 5:00 or 6:00am with cramps so bad, it felt like my

whole leg would curl up into a tight coil, with as much pain involved as you'd

think for that situation.

Carol

I guess I better research long and hard before taking the clay

because I surly don't want the clay to usher any minerals out of my

body unless I don't need them. I have muscle cramps pretty bad when

I don't take my cal/mag supplements. I even have the cramps when I

take the supplements but not as bad. Still don't know the dif

between tetany and plain old muscle cramps.

So using the goat's milk to make the kefir didn't work for you. I

have heard others say that but not many.

Thanks,

Del

[Guest guest]

Carol

We sound a lot alike. I could have easily written your post! My

cramps come when I stretch my feet, legs, body as I am waking up.

And yes, feels like they have a mind of their own and just start

curling up. Not as bad as they use to be. Trying to eat cal/mag high

veggies. I need to start juicing. I don't think I will stop taking

cal/mag but will change...again. Yes, I have taken lots of

supplements in my lifetime but have stopped.

I meant research on the clays. There are so many different ones,

from different places, that help differently. I would hate to take

one that is going to usher the minerals out of my body!

Good luck to you to Carol,

Del

" Carol " wrote:

>

> Del,

> Yes, please do a LOT of research. I can't tell you how many

times, I've come to one conclusion about a food, or particularly a

supplement, based on research, only to later find out the

information was wrong......and many things are just plain unknowns -

once you look at both sides, you can see that. It got to be so

frustrating to me that I have quit taking all the many supplements I

used to take. I was like you with the calcium and magnesium and the

cramps. (I think tetany and muscle cramps are basically the same

thing.) For a long time, I couldn't seem to get along without LOTS

of magnesium. Then, it got so it seemed like my cramps were getting

worse and worse, until I was taking so much magnesium to stop them,

that it was giving me diarrhea. I had read years ago that taking

minerals was iffy, because it's so easy to cause imbalances between

the various minerals, but particularly between calcium and

magnesium. Also, they used to say you should take twice as much

calcium as magnesium. (Boy, do I have a sad tale of woe about

having done that.) Now the cutting edge research is saying they

should be taken in equal amounts. Then, I read at the WAPF site

that calcium chelates will cause mineral imbalances because they

bypass the natural absorption. Between much sad experience and

various things I've read, I'm now thinking I may be better off to

get my minerals from foods. So, I'm juicing high calcium and

magnesium veggies, and eating foods as high in minerals as

possible. (Lots of nuts for one.) At least I'm going to try it for

awhile.

> Good luck with the whole thing. I know how awful the cramps can

be. For awhile, I was waking up at 5:00 or 6:00am with cramps so

bad, it felt like my whole leg would curl up into a tight coil, with

as much pain involved as you'd think for that situation.

> Carol

>

>

> I guess I better research long and hard before taking the clay

> because I surly don't want the clay to usher any minerals out of

my

> body unless I don't need them. I have muscle cramps pretty bad

when

> I don't take my cal/mag supplements. I even have the cramps when I

> take the supplements but not as bad. Still don't know the dif

> between tetany and plain old muscle cramps.

>

> So using the goat's milk to make the kefir didn't work for you. I

> have heard others say that but not many.

>

> Thanks,

> Del

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>>My

cramps come when I stretch my feet, legs, body as I am waking up.<<

~~~Yes, that's it exactly! (Although, it occasionally wakes me out of a sound

sleep and I don't know if I was stretching or not, but I probably was then too.)

But, you don't have MS, right? I've wondered if it is part of MS, and they tell

me it is, but it's interesting to see that others have this problem too.

Carol

Del

[Guest guest]

Carol:

>~~~Taking calcium, however, without magnesium can be mistake. And, magnesium

is the one that relaxes the muscles. (Contrary to popular belief.)

I agree. The ones I've taken are all Cal-Mag-D combos ... not the best or most

expensive, but they work.

>

>~~~I have major problems with dairy and just made kefir with goat milk from the

grocery store, just to see if the goat milk would be better. I've had terrible

gas from it - every bit as bad as cow's milk. But, my intestinal system is

unusually bad too.

>Carol

Goat milk didn't work for me either, which is too bad because I could actually

GET a goat if I wanted. It gave me the " chills " which is my typical first

reaction to stuff, and brain fog the next day. Conceivably it could be from the

goat eating wheat, but this particular goat I know was not eating grains.

>~~~Lactaid has never helped me with milk digestion. I don't know if it's

because the problem is too much for the amount of lactase one gets in Lactaid,

or if it's because of the casein in the milk. I didn't know casein could cause

the same intestinal problems as lactose, so that may be my problem.

Yeah, then it's likely the casein that's the problem. All the IgA reactions have

similar symptoms, though most of them aren't very well studied except in

children. Soy, corn, eggs, and yeast are also common culprits.

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

>Where did you buy the pascalite clay? That is amazing that pascalite

>clay works so well for celiac. I can't wait to get my hands on some.

>I have checked all my HFS and they all carry benonite clay, which I

>already have but it is the type for external only, I think.

Online ... there were a lot of places that carry it. Red wine seems

to mitigate stuff too, again, I don't know why, but it jibes with

the traditions about wine (one of the few references to wine

in the New Testament is, " take a little wine for the sake of your

stomach " !).

>I did make pumpkin pie (excellent with the coconut milk) and the

>chocolate pecan pie (excellent) and the carrott cake (excellent

>also). I made cornbread dressing (not good, need another recipe),

>maple yams with pecans, mashed potatos (no milk but lots of butter)

>There it is...the butter! I was out of ghee. I also had squash and

>ambrosia. Turkey too but I didn't eat any because I wanted to eat

>all the other stuff. I only ate a *taste* of the goodies....honest.

>I wonder how long it will take me to get over eating all this!

Yeah, I used kefir in the cornbread, which worked really well (this was the best

corn bread EVER and the best stuffing ever ... will post it separately).

I didn't get too sick though (and yeah, I had the clay too, and lots

of wine, so who knows).

>Oh, so I could try to kefir the goats milk from the groc store, that

>might work!

Worth a shot!

>I have been taking calcium citrate in liquid form and I am beginning

>to think that it also hurts my tummy. It is in liquid form with all

>the other minerals needed to balance it.

Yeah, all the citrate forms upset my digestion, so I went back to

the supposedly difficult to digest carbonate forms. Magnesium citrate

is what they prescribe to " clean you out " for a colonoscopy!

As for the clay ... what I decided was to take it when I was NOT

eating any other food (in the morning on the WD) unless I'm eating

out, in which case I take it before the meal. When it comes to eating

out, my goal is mainly to be ok the next day, I figure the food in

restaurants isn't really any good anyway for nutrition.

>

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

Not that I know of, but I do have head tremors. I think mine is

essential tremors. Well, if I stretch in the middle of the night,

the cramps will come and of course wake me up! We should compare

other things about us. Want to go private?

Del

" Carol " wrote:

>

> >>My

> cramps come when I stretch my feet, legs, body as I am waking up.<<

>

> ~~~Yes, that's it exactly! (Although, it occasionally wakes me out

of a sound sleep and I don't know if I was stretching or not, but I

probably was then too.) But, you don't have MS, right? I've

wondered if it is part of MS, and they tell me it is, but it's

interesting to see that others have this problem too.

> Carol

>

> Del

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>>Yeah, then it's likely the casein that's the problem. All the IgA reactions

have similar symptoms, though most of them aren't very well studied except in

children. Soy, corn, eggs, and yeast are also common culprits.

Heidi Jean<<

~~~Ok, now if that's it, would that mean that raw milk would be of no help? I

keep reading that people who are lactose intolerant will do great with raw milk,

because it contains lactase, which is destroyed in pasteurization. I wonder if

it's possible that the same is true of casein and raw milk? Does anyone know?

Guess I may just have to try it, if I can find some.

Carol

[Guest guest]

Del,

Yes, let's do, as I have tremors too, but mine are in my right hand, of all

places!

My email is cah@...

Carol

Re: kefiili and GF question

Not that I know of, but I do have head tremors. I think mine is

essential tremors. Well, if I stretch in the middle of the night,

the cramps will come and of course wake me up! We should compare

other things about us. Want to go private?

Del

" Carol " wrote:

>

> >>My

> cramps come when I stretch my feet, legs, body as I am waking up.<<

>

> ~~~Yes, that's it exactly! (Although, it occasionally wakes me out

of a sound sleep and I don't know if I was stretching or not, but I

probably was then too.) But, you don't have MS, right? I've

wondered if it is part of MS, and they tell me it is, but it's

interesting to see that others have this problem too.

> Carol

>

> Del

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>~~~Ok, now if that's it, would that mean that raw milk would be of no help? I

keep reading that people who are lactose intolerant will do great with raw milk,

because it contains lactase, which is destroyed in pasteurization. I wonder if

it's possible that the same is true of casein and raw milk? Does anyone know?

Guess I may just have to try it, if I can find some.

>Carol

It seems to be different for different people: I've heard all kinds of differing

stories. I can say for me, raw milk doesn't help at all, I've tried it several

times. However, I also don't much LIKE milk so I'm not very motivated. (The

foods I love include anchovies and garlic and good kimchi, which don't seem to

be problematic, fortunately). It took me a year and a half to figure out I

really didn't tolerate dairy well though, so I'd encourage you to experiment.

Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

Heidi Wrote:

Red wine seems

> to mitigate stuff too, again, I don't know why, but it jibes with

> the traditions about wine (one of the few references to wine

> in the New Testament is, " take a little wine for the sake of your

> stomach " !).

---In the past red wine has given be headaches so I have avoided it

for many years. Maybe it's time to try it again. Can you recommend

one that works for you?----

> Yeah, I used kefir in the cornbread,

---Didn't know you had both kefir and kefiili?---

which worked really well (this was the best

> corn bread EVER and the best stuffing ever ... will post it

separately).

---Can't wait to read that!---

> I didn't get too sick though (and yeah, I had the clay too, and

lots

> of wine, so who knows).

---Wish, I had read that before Thanksgiving!---

> >Oh, so I could try to kefir the goats milk from the groc store,

that

> >might work!

>

> Worth a shot!

--Didn't work for you, Didn't work for Carol, it probably won't work

for me.--

>

> >I have been taking calcium citrate in liquid form and I am

beginning

> >to think that it also hurts my tummy. It is in liquid form with

all

> >the other minerals needed to balance it.

---Haven't had any kefir, filmjolk, or viili for a couple of days

and my tummy is almost back to where it was before

thanksgiving...feeling good! Had my cal/mag and it didn't bother me

so it must be the kefir!---

>

> Yeah, all the citrate forms upset my digestion, so I went back to

> the supposedly difficult to digest carbonate forms. Magnesium

citrate

> is what they prescribe to " clean you out " for a colonoscopy!

---The one I am taking seems to be working okay for me, now that I

think it is the kefir causing me the problem. Had it this morning

with no problem. I will surly keep an eye on it though.---

>

> As for the clay ... what I decided was to take it when I was NOT

> eating any other food (in the morning on the WD) unless I'm eating

> out, in which case I take it before the meal. When it comes to

eating

> out, my goal is mainly to be ok the next day, I figure the food in

> restaurants isn't really any good anyway for nutrition.

---Eating out is a real pain! It has been awhile since I have done

that. When I do, it will be to the best steak house I can find and

have steak and salad and take my own dressing. We have been invited

out to a Japanese steak house. You know, one of those places where

they prepare the food on the large grill in front of you. I am

stressing out about it.---

Here I go online to find the clay.....

Thanks,

Del

> Heidi Jean

[Guest guest]

Carol,

Raw milk didn't make a difference for me. We were making 5 hour

round trips once a month for it but stopped because it was hurting

my tummy. Cheese seems to be okay. Do you find that you can have

cheese?

Del

>

>

> >>Yeah, then it's likely the casein that's the problem. All the

IgA reactions have similar symptoms, though most of them aren't very

well studied except in children. Soy, corn, eggs, and yeast are also

common culprits.

> Heidi Jean<<

>

> ~~~Ok, now if that's it, would that mean that raw milk would be of

no help? I keep reading that people who are lactose intolerant will

do great with raw milk, because it contains lactase, which is

destroyed in pasteurization. I wonder if it's possible that the

same is true of casein and raw milk? Does anyone know? Guess I may

just have to try it, if I can find some.

> Carol

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Carol and Heidi (anyone else that wants to answer),

I just closed the computer and walked into the kitchen to find

something that I can eat and these thoughts came to my mind so here

I am back asking. My whole schedule is disrupted!

How do you guys do with Yoghurt, commercial or homemade? Raw versus

pasteurised cheese? Cottage cheese, commercial versus made from

filmjolk, yoghurt, kefiili. Raw versus commercial butter? Eggs?

Del

" Del Eaton " wrote:

>

> Carol,

> Raw milk didn't make a difference for me. We were making 5 hour

> round trips once a month for it but stopped because it was hurting

> my tummy. Cheese seems to be okay. Do you find that you can have

> cheese?

>

> Del

>

>

> >

> >

> > >>Yeah, then it's likely the casein that's the problem. All the

> IgA reactions have similar symptoms, though most of them aren't

very

> well studied except in children. Soy, corn, eggs, and yeast are

also

> common culprits.

> > Heidi Jean<<

> >

> > ~~~Ok, now if that's it, would that mean that raw milk would be

of

> no help? I keep reading that people who are lactose intolerant

will

> do great with raw milk, because it contains lactase, which is

> destroyed in pasteurization. I wonder if it's possible that the

> same is true of casein and raw milk? Does anyone know? Guess I

may

> just have to try it, if I can find some.

> > Carol

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Del,

It came to my mind reading your response to Carol that the Specific

Carbohydrate Diet (SCD) allows cheese, butter and yoghurt, but not some

other dairy.

http://www.breakingtheviciouscycle.info/

I don't know if this will help you or not, just a thought.

Deanna

Del Eaton wrote:

>

> Carol and Heidi (anyone else that wants to answer),

> I just closed the computer and walked into the kitchen to find

> something that I can eat and these thoughts came to my mind so here

> I am back asking. My whole schedule is disrupted!

> How do you guys do with Yoghurt, commercial or homemade? Raw versus

> pasteurised cheese? Cottage cheese, commercial versus made from

> filmjolk, yoghurt, kefiili. Raw versus commercial butter? Eggs?

>

> Del

>

> " Del Eaton " wrote:

> >

> > Carol,

> > Raw milk didn't make a difference for me. We were making 5 hour

> > round trips once a month for it but stopped because it was hurting

> > my tummy. Cheese seems to be okay. Do you find that you can have

> > cheese?

> >

> > Del

>

[Guest guest]

Del,

It's odd about raw milk. I've read over and over that it won't bother a person

who can't tolerate pasteurized milk, but I don't know anyone, (who I've spoken

to myself), who did well on raw, as opposed to pasteurized. I have a friend who

also has MS, (and seems to have a lot of things in common with me health-wise),

and she has tried very hard to be able to use raw goat's milk, because she was

raised on it and loves it, but she just can't tolerate it.

Cheese in fairly small amounts doesn't seem to bother me. Well, I should

qualify that by saying I'm not as good with some cheeses as others. The more

aged cheeses seem to be the best.

Carol

Carol,

Raw milk didn't make a difference for me. We were making 5 hour

round trips once a month for it but stopped because it was hurting

my tummy. Cheese seems to be okay. Do you find that you can have

cheese?

Del

[Guest guest]

Del,

I do better with home made yogurt than commercial, but that's only because I

culture it SO long, and then I don't like it, because it's SO sour. :-)

I've never had raw cheese, but would love to try it. Mercola has it for sale,

but it's so expensive that I haven't ordered any yet..... and it's probably

doubtful that I will.The only cottage cheese I've had, other than commercial,

was what I made from kefir, and that's not very tolerable for me, so I'm not

much help! :-)

Carol

Carol and Heidi (anyone else that wants to answer),

I just closed the computer and walked into the kitchen to find

something that I can eat and these thoughts came to my mind so here

I am back asking. My whole schedule is disrupted!

How do you guys do with Yoghurt, commercial or homemade? Raw versus

pasteurised cheese? Cottage cheese, commercial versus made from

filmjolk, yoghurt, kefiili. Raw versus commercial butter? Eggs?

Del