Kefir Questions

[Guest guest]

Well, that source for kefir grains that was suggested here was just

superb! Um, but I am completely clueless about storing, fermenting,

rinsing, etc. with kefir. I have searched about it on Dom's site. The

file section for our NN group has a wav file for pronouncing the word -

and that's it! Very surprising. So I will query you fine folks, if I may.

1. My grains came in starter and arrived 2 days after shipping. Now, I

haven't a good local source of raw milk, Texas laws being what they are,

so will use freshly made nut milks, juice etc. mainly. Is this okay? I

had read about different grains on Dom's site; milk grains and

transparent grains (???). Now, I did leave one grain in the starter

milk, which leads me to:

2. How do I keep my grains happy whilst not in use? Should I swap out

the milk? If so, how many days refrigerated is correct? Is pasturized

buttermilk okay to use? Most everything out there on the market is

ultrapasteurized ultra dead. Should I add some honey or something?

(okay, I know, too many questions).

3. I made two batches of apple kefir beer a la Heidi. And being the

artsy cook I am, I added ginger bits to one. This is fine, right?

Heidi did say kefir would grow in just about anything.

4. To rinse or not to rinse, that is the question? I didn't rinse,

btw, going from milk to juice. Dom has much ado about this, but thought

your experience might help here, especially in the milk to juice/nut

medium that I am pursuing with the majority of my grains.

Any answers and suggestions y'all have are most welcome.

Thank you.

Deanna

[Guest guest]

Sorry Deanna, but I missed the place you got your grains from. Would

you mind posting that info?

Thanks in advance,

Del

Deanna wrote:

> Well, that source for kefir grains that was suggested here was

just

> superb! Um, but I am completely clueless about storing,

fermenting,

> rinsing, etc. with kefir. I have searched about it on Dom's

site. The

> file section for our NN group has a wav file for pronouncing the

word -

> and that's it! Very surprising. So I will query you fine folks,

if I may.

>

> 1. My grains came in starter and arrived 2 days after shipping.

Now, I

> haven't a good local source of raw milk, Texas laws being what

they are,

> so will use freshly made nut milks, juice etc. mainly. Is this

okay? I

> had read about different grains on Dom's site; milk grains and

> transparent grains (???). Now, I did leave one grain in the

starter

> milk, which leads me to:

>

> 2. How do I keep my grains happy whilst not in use? Should I

swap out

> the milk? If so, how many days refrigerated is correct? Is

pasturized

> buttermilk okay to use? Most everything out there on the market

is

> ultrapasteurized ultra dead. Should I add some honey or

something?

> (okay, I know, too many questions).

>

> 3. I made two batches of apple kefir beer a la Heidi. And being

the

> artsy cook I am, I added ginger bits to one. This is fine,

right?

> Heidi did say kefir would grow in just about anything.

>

> 4. To rinse or not to rinse, that is the question? I didn't

rinse,

> btw, going from milk to juice. Dom has much ado about this, but

thought

> your experience might help here, especially in the milk to

juice/nut

> medium that I am pursuing with the majority of my grains.

>

> Any answers and suggestions y'all have are most welcome.

>

> Thank you.

>

> Deanna

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dom's Kefir FAQ In-Site

http://users.chariot.net.au/~dna/kefir-faq.html

What you need to know about kefir when you need

to know it.

Darrell

[Guest guest]

Yes Del, it was through this list I found dear Michele at batyhwh@...

She will respond individually to requests, I do believe.

Blessings,

Deanna, who is eating prime rib, with kimchi, sour cream/horseradish and

beet greens in butter, presently ... and organic syrah, of course ...

Del Eaton wrote:

>

> Sorry Deanna, but I missed the place you got your grains from. Would

> you mind posting that info?

>

> Thanks in advance,

> Del

[Guest guest]

> I received Kefir Grains (thanks very much to Rick )Fri.

> afternoon. I washed them

Hi ,

I don't wash, but if you feel the need, don't use tap (poison)

water, pure h2o or milk only. Be gentle.

> and then put them in 2 cups of milk ( just

> regular store bought) and let it set for about 27 hrs. at room

> temp. I tried the product last night, it was slightly curdled, had a

> yeasty smell and wasn't too bad.

Sometimes they are a little stunned by various factors involved

in shipping, being out of milk, temperature, etc. They take a

little while (a few batches), to get up to capacity, soon they

will produce more than you can use. If your milk is sub-par (over

processed or undernourished) they may take a little longer.

Best,

Foley

Lexington, KY

[Guest guest]

I guess I was just too impatient with my 1st batch. I made a 2nd batch right

after the 1st, let sit for about 36 hrs and it turned out great. I believe I've

found a new favorite dairy drink! I put on a 3rd batch directly after, didn't

wash the grains. So we'll see how it turns out. After I strained the 2nd batch I

mixed in about 1 tbs. of organic honey. The only problem was, there wasn't

enough Kefir. :-)

" P. Foley " <formviz@...> wrote: > I received Kefir Grains (thanks

very much to Rick )Fri.

> afternoon. I washed them

Hi ,

I don't wash, but if you feel the need, don't use tap (poison)

water, pure h2o or milk only. Be gentle.

> and then put them in 2 cups of milk ( just

> regular store bought) and let it set for about 27 hrs. at room

> temp. I tried the product last night, it was slightly curdled, had a

> yeasty smell and wasn't too bad.

Sometimes they are a little stunned by various factors involved

in shipping, being out of milk, temperature, etc. They take a

little while (a few batches), to get up to capacity, soon they

will produce more than you can use. If your milk is sub-par (over

processed or undernourished) they may take a little longer.

Best,

Foley

Lexington, KY

[Guest guest]

They are OK. It can take a few (two or three days of milk changes) before they

regain

their health after the shock of being washed.

BTW where did you learn to wash them? I've always wondered who started that

story.

>

>

> I received Kefir Grains (thanks very much to Rick )Fri.

> afternoon. I washed them and then put them in 2 cups of milk ( just

> regular store bought) and let it set for about 27 hrs. at room

> temp. I tried the product last night, it was slightly curdled, had a

> yeasty smell and wasn't too bad. But since I've never had Kefir

> before I don't know if I got it right. My wife had it as a child and

> she says it tasted about right but she remembered it to be alot

> thicker. Any help would be appreciated.

[Guest guest]

[Lark] Is there no way to store kefir that preserves the best taste after

that first day? It seems making it everyday could be time consuming,

especially if I have to fetch the raw milk.

[] If you don't feel like making kefir every day, you can make a

big batch and

keep it in the fridge. It gets more tart the longer you store it, but it

also gets more B. Vitamins and Folic Acid. If you're going to add fruit

and make smoothies anyway, it doesn't matter.

[MikeP] Lark, you can fetch the milk just a few times a month and

store in the fridge, making a new batch of kefir every day or two.

It's incredibly quick and easy. vastly easier than almost anything

else a person might do in their kitchen.

You can store kefir in the fridge for months with no problem. It

often develops fabulous complex cheesy flavors and the increase in

sourness is very gradual.

, as far as I know, the B vitamins (including folic acid, B9) do

*not* increase as it ages. In fact, I believe they reach their peak

within a day or so and then gradually disappear as they are consumed

as a nutrient by the ever-shifting bacterial population in the kefir.

When you look at the traditional bacteria-and-yeast-fermented

fermented beverages in pre-industrial societies that are significant B

vitamin sources, they are brewed and consumed on a fairly short cycle,

maybe one to three days.

[Lark] When I do in vitro fermentations, I do not wash the glass and plastic

ware with soap, is there a similar recommendation for making kefir?

Soap residue could be bacteriocidal.

[MikeP] I don't wash my kefir jars very often, and almost never with

soap, usually just with hot water and a brush. In the rare cases when

I have really nasty jars and I use soap, I rinse strenuously. So it's

nice to hear that my habits make sense given that soap residue could

be a problem! Actually, I use half-gallon mason jars for kefir and

many other things, plain water, fresh milk, teas, etc. They are the

center of my life!

Also, the way I make kefir is to lift out the grains with a wooden

spoon and plop them into a new batch of milk (in other words, I don't

use a strainer or other techniques for separating kefir and kefir

grains), and I actually have a dedicated wooden spoon for this purpose

I let hang above the sink on one of those towel racks thingies I hang

my kitchen towels on. After using it, I simply run it under the

faucet (hot or cold, I don't pay attention) for a few seconds to rinse

off any visible curds and hang it back up. It seems logical to me

because the wood is probably hosting some of the kefir bacteria.

Between this and often not cleaning the jars between batches, I spend

an average of about one-minute for each batch of kefir, including the

time it takes to unscrew the lids, take milk out of the fridge, etc,

but of course not including the time it takes to obtain raw milk (in

my case a ten-minute drive one-way to a local farm plus a few minutes

of friendly chatting and so on).

Mike

SE Pennsylvania

The best way to predict the future is to invent it. --Alan Kay

[Guest guest]

MAP writes:

>, as far as I know, the B vitamins (including folic acid, B9) do

*not* increase as it ages. In fact, I believe they reach their peak

within a day or so and then gradually disappear as they are consumed

as a nutrient by the ever-shifting bacterial population in the kefir.

When you look at the traditional bacteria-and-yeast-fermented

fermented beverages in pre-industrial societies that are significant B

vitamin sources, they are brewed and consumed on a fairly short cycle,

maybe one to three days.

Mike, you are right :-) I wasn't advocating keeping it for months but rather a

few days, and I should have stated that! For those who are interested, here is

what Dom, the kefir guru, has to say on the subject at:

http://users.chariot.net.au/~dna/kefirpage.html

" At day 1 to day 2 of ripening, Folic acid should increase by some 117 % to

possibly 125 % compared to folic acid found in the original fresh milk. There

are other B Vitamins that increase due to ripening, while a few other B Vitamins

are found in slightly less amounts, or remain the same value to that found in

fresh milk. Other benefits of ripening include the reduction of lactose, which

is desirable for both lactose intolerant individuals, or for the low

carbohydrate dieter, be it for reasons other than Diabetes. Other properties of

ripening, is through the evolution of the microflora, as the kefir matures,

encourage certain organisms to proliferate, or to be triggered into propagation,

due to certain conditions and byproducts produced by other specific organisms,

after time. With this, the unique beneficial value of matured kefir, is

different to that of a freshly strained kefir. "

and the K9's

[Guest guest]

and anyone else, on this topic of folic acid concentration in

kefir fermentation, in the MN (and also NN and KM) archives there is a

very lengthy post I wrote about the tricky nuances involved, lots of

citations and stuff... An Onibasu search under " kefir " and " folate "

should get it... It goes into way too much detail for most people's

purposes, but there is some summary material if I recall correctly

(it's been a long while...)

Mike

SE Pennsylvania

The best way to predict the future is to invent it. --Alan Kay