Baby care - NT style

[Guest guest]

I have to echo ... though I would add following the Continuum Concept

onto the list that she had. But long term breastfeeding, co-sleeping, slinging,

cloth diapers (we used a diaper service), and organic/natural cleaning

products, homeopathic and natural remedies (like Hyland's Teething Tablets)...

we

use Tushies baby wipes (the green unscented ones, not the blue ones, though once

we stop using a coin laundry we'll probably switch to flannel or terry cloth

squares). We have a reverse osmosis water filter that we love, we plan to

homeschool (and we lean towards unschooling, though I'm always sorting through

Montessori and Waldorf writings and catalouges). We looked at Elimination

Communication, but didn't do that until dd was 14mo, so we're diaper free at

17mo.

My child had meat far younger than most of her agemates. Related, though

indirectly, is that we use natural family planning/ fertility awareness method

to

space our kids (we're not ready for another yet!). Other choices have

included not sending dd to childcare even though I need to work full time and my

husband is a full time PhD student with a part time job -- that's hard, but it

is

worth it! Also, I started having gall stone attacks when dd was 3 weeks old,

and I chose to find a doctor who respected that I was breastfeeding and gave

me alternatives to surgery and vicadin (which my previous doctor had

prescribed, knowing that I was nursing).

One of the big things is what we don't have. We don't have a crib, a

changing table, a walker, a bouncer, a stroller, or any toys that beep or flash.

We

have a TV/VCR combo unit, but we don't have cable or an antenna, and it's

usually unplugged and out of the way most of the time. We don't have Baby

Einstein or a Gymboree membership. We don't have a stockpile of sippy cups --

the 2

that we did have for traveling have since been retired -- dd uses real glasses

(with supervision, but she's completely capable of drinking out of a glass or

using a straw since she was about 9 months old). We've never bought jars of

baby food, or any other food specifically marketed for babies, including rice

cereal. We don't have a food mill to puree dd's food, either... we chose to

go simple and prechew it ourselves like so many other cultures do.

One thing I'd like to add is that we're not as militant about all this as we

might sound. For example, we go out to eat every now and then, and when we're

out we share food with dd. We don't eat fast food or even slower fast food

(like Denny's), first because of my gall stones (they brought on attacks),

second because they stopped being good as we followed NT more and more. We do

eat

a lot of foods from nations other than our own, and dd eats them right along

with us, even though they aren't organic, and may contain things that we would

not otherwise buy. She enjoys Mexican, Indian, Italian, Chinese, and Thai

food as much as we do. I know other families who choose to bring food for their

children to eat when they go to restaurants, but that hasn't been our choice.

favorite websites:

www.westonaprice.org (of course)

www.michaelolaf.net (montessori ideas for infants... great text)

www.preschoolians.com (great shoes for infants & toddlers)

www.diaperpin.com (research those cloth diaper choices)

www.thebabywearer.com (research those sling choices)

www.mamatoto.org (how to turn any piece of fabric into a sling)

www.kangarookorner.com (Adjustable Fleece Pouch -- worth every penny 5 times

over)

www.woomb.org (good info on natural family planning, incl. info on using it

while nursing)

I hope something from our experience has been helpful.

Anabel

[Guest guest]

Lets' see Pratick...

attachment parenting, cloth diapers (I really like Bumkins all-in-ones

for convenience), cloth diaper wipes (small terry cloth squares work

great), we do not vaccinate or use over the counter medicines,

homeopathic remedies or natural herbs when needed, natural and/or

organic cleaning products (dish soap, laundry detergent, shampoo,

soaps, deodorants, toothpaste, fabric softener), filter water if

necessary, homeschool, natural fabrics for clothing (cotton instead of

polyester), natural fabrics for furniture, natural fibers for as much

as possible, Lansinoh lanolin for diaper rash or cuts or dry hands...,

tea tree oil and/or lavender for antiseptic, no chlorine bleach, use

breastmilk to " cure " infections and heal scrapes,...

I know I must be missing things, ut it is just they way that we live,

not something I think about!

Questions are great!

L.

> I want to get the ideas of this group about caring for babies.

> We have a 2 month old daughter, and are breastfeeding her.

>

> Other than diet, what are some of the other things that we should be doing

> NT style.

> I know some of your here have mentioned you don't use commercial diapers,

> wipes, etc.

> What do you use instead?

>

> Any other things that you do/not do?

>

> Thanks for any ideas.

>

> -Pratick

[Guest guest]

On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 11:41:23 -0700

Lillig <catzandturtles@...> wrote:

> Lets' see Pratick...

> attachment parenting, cloth diapers (I really like Bumkins all-in-ones

> for convenience), cloth diaper wipes (small terry cloth squares work

> great),

Here is something you might not be aware of:

Natural Infant Hygiene

http://www.natural-wisdom.com/index.htm

" Scholarship is essentially confirming your early paranoia through

a deeper factual analysis. "

Murray Rothbard

" Vegetarians, come away from The Dark Side.

Pork is the other white meat; beef is what’s for dinner;

and a day without pepper-crusted venison tenderloin is

like a day without sunshine. "

Brad Edmonds

[Guest guest]

But long term breastfeeding, co-sleeping, ....

I hope something from our experience has been helpful.

Anabel

-----------

Anabel,

My youngest is now 11, and my age still starts with a 3. I believed,

and still do that younger parents are better suited to raising happy

kids. Nowadays, the 30 somethings start families out of some perceived

financial advantage. No offense to older parents, we all have our

reasons, needs and situations.

But basically, I think the two first things you mentioned are THE most

important for child development. All mammals sleep with their young,

and I feel it is of utmost importance. Of course, my kids have never

watched commercial TV except at friends' houses, which can't hurt either.

Peace to you,

Deanna

[Guest guest]

On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 18:24:49 EST, anabelneri@... <anabelneri@...> wrote:

> I have to echo ... though I would add following the Continuum Concept

> onto the list that she had.

I knew I missed things!

But long term breastfeeding, co-sleeping,

> slinging,

I really thoroughly

> cloth diapers (we used a diaper service), and organic/natural cleaning

> products, homeopathic and natural remedies (like Hyland's Teething

> Tablets)... we

> use Tushies baby wipes (the green unscented ones, not the blue ones, though

> once

> we stop using a coin laundry we'll probably switch to flannel or terry cloth

> squares). We have a reverse osmosis water filter that we love, we plan to

> homeschool (and we lean towards unschooling, though I'm always sorting

> through

> Montessori and Waldorf writings and catalouges). We looked at Elimination

> Communication, but didn't do that until dd was 14mo, so we're diaper free at

> 17mo.

> My child had meat far younger than most of her agemates. Related, though

> indirectly, is that we use natural family planning/ fertility awareness

> method to

> space our kids (we're not ready for another yet!). Other choices have

> included not sending dd to childcare even though I need to work full time

> and my

> husband is a full time PhD student with a part time job -- that's hard, but

> it is

> worth it! Also, I started having gall stone attacks when dd was 3 weeks

> old,

> and I chose to find a doctor who respected that I was breastfeeding and gave

> me alternatives to surgery and vicadin (which my previous doctor had

> prescribed, knowing that I was nursing).

>

> One of the big things is what we don't have. We don't have a crib, a

> changing table, a walker, a bouncer, a stroller, or any toys that beep or

> flash. We

> have a TV/VCR combo unit, but we don't have cable or an antenna, and it's

> usually unplugged and out of the way most of the time. We don't have Baby

> Einstein or a Gymboree membership. We don't have a stockpile of sippy cups

> -- the 2

> that we did have for traveling have since been retired -- dd uses real

> glasses

> (with supervision, but she's completely capable of drinking out of a glass

> or

> using a straw since she was about 9 months old). We've never bought jars of

> baby food, or any other food specifically marketed for babies, including

> rice

> cereal. We don't have a food mill to puree dd's food, either... we chose to

> go simple and prechew it ourselves like so many other cultures do.

>

> One thing I'd like to add is that we're not as militant about all this as we

> might sound. For example, we go out to eat every now and then, and when

> we're

> out we share food with dd. We don't eat fast food or even slower fast food

> (like Denny's), first because of my gall stones (they brought on attacks),

> second because they stopped being good as we followed NT more and more. We

> do eat

> a lot of foods from nations other than our own, and dd eats them right along

> with us, even though they aren't organic, and may contain things that we

> would

> not otherwise buy. She enjoys Mexican, Indian, Italian, Chinese, and Thai

> food as much as we do. I know other families who choose to bring food for

> their

> children to eat when they go to restaurants, but that hasn't been our

> choice.

>

> favorite websites:

> www.westonaprice.org (of course)

> www.michaelolaf.net (montessori ideas for infants... great text)

> www.preschoolians.com (great shoes for infants & toddlers)

> www.diaperpin.com (research those cloth diaper choices)

> www.thebabywearer.com (research those sling choices)

> www.mamatoto.org (how to turn any piece of fabric into a sling)

> www.kangarookorner.com (Adjustable Fleece Pouch -- worth every penny 5 times

> over)

> www.woomb.org (good info on natural family planning, incl. info on using it

> while nursing)

>

> I hope something from our experience has been helpful.

> Anabel

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Let's try that again! Sorry, typing one handed during nap time again!

I wonder what I pushed to do that?!

On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 18:24:49 EST, anabelneri@... <anabelneri@...> wrote:

> I have to echo ... though I would add following the Continuum Concept

> onto the list that she had.

I knew I missed something!

But long term breastfeeding, co-sleeping,

> slinging,

I really thoroughly enjoy the MayaWrap Sling, it was worth the money.

> cloth diapers (we used a diaper service), and organic/natural cleaning

> products, homeopathic and natural remedies (like Hyland's Teething

> Tablets)

They make life easier if the little one has a lot of teething pain,

and work great for other pain too. Like the wipe out running down the

driveway!

.... we

> use Tushies baby wipes (the green unscented ones, not the blue ones,

my babes still broke out in rashes from these.

though

> once

> we stop using a coin laundry we'll probably switch to flannel or terry cloth

> squares).

That's why we went to rent a center! LOL

We have a reverse osmosis water filter that we love, we plan to

> homeschool (and we lean towards unschooling, though I'm always sorting

> through

> Montessori and Waldorf writings and catalouges).

I have looked at, and continue to look at those too. We unschool. I

have been unschooling for 7.5 years, and love it. We seize the moment

and delve into something we want to learn about, and often incorporate

various learning methods at that point! And I am sure that I will

incorporate even more ideas as my boys get older...the 4.5 yr old

decided it was time he knew his alphabet and how to read, while the 22

month old has decided to learn his numbers to 20, although he is

content to know enough letters to recognize the names of people in his

life. They both know the names of every color in the large crayon

box... the have to keep up with their 12 yr old sister at something!

We looked at Elimination

> Communication, but didn't do that until dd was 14mo, so we're diaper free at

> 17mo.

Congratulations! I didn't learn about it until about 2 years ago. At

that point I had too many things distracting me, and have only

recently reintroduced the thought.

> My child had meat far younger than most of her agemates.

I did that with the third, it was actually one of his first foods

(eggs and then meat), and you can see the difference! Size, attitude,

mental acuity, eyesight, energy, balance, etc...

Related, though

> indirectly, is that we use natural family planning/ fertility awareness

> method to

> space our kids (we're not ready for another yet!). Other choices have

> included not sending dd to childcare even though I need to work full time

> and my

> husband is a full time PhD student with a part time job -- that's hard, but

> it is

> worth it!

I echo that... whatever you need to do to keep the children within the

immediate family while they are small. That is not to isolate, only

that the " supervisor " should be immediate family.

Also, I started having gall stone attacks when dd was 3 weeks

> old,

> and I chose to find a doctor who respected that I was breastfeeding and gave

> me alternatives to surgery and vicadin (which my previous doctor had

> prescribed, knowing that I was nursing).

For me, it was the chiropractor that didn't x-ray because I was

nursing, and avoided drugs completely...although I later learned that

she didn't endorse taking any OTCs for any reason ans why.

>

> One of the big things is what we don't have. We don't have a crib, a

> changing table, a walker, a bouncer, a stroller, or any toys that beep or

> flash.

We have a couple of musical light toys that we take out occasionally,

but the basket of rocks, pine cones and sticks is much more fun! Oh,

and an umbrella stroller they share for pushing their babies on

walks...it hard to teach a doll to ride a bike! But the rest of those

items aren't in our house either, and have never been missed.

We

> have a TV/VCR combo unit, but we don't have cable or an antenna, and it's

> usually unplugged and out of the way most of the time. We don't have Baby

> Einstein or a Gymboree membership. We don't have a stockpile of sippy cups

> -- the 2

> that we did have for traveling have since been retired -- dd uses real

> glasses

> (with supervision, but she's completely capable of drinking out of a glass

> or

> using a straw since she was about 9 months old). We've never bought jars of

> baby food, or any other food specifically marketed for babies, including

> rice

> cereal. We don't have a food mill to puree dd's food, either... we chose to

> go simple and prechew it ourselves like so many other cultures do.

No baby food jars here either, but I cut into very small pieces...mine

have always expelled chewed meat rather than swallow until 2 or 3

years old.

>

> One thing I'd like to add is that we're not as militant about all this as we

> might sound. For example, we go out to eat every now and then, and when

> we're

> out we share food with dd. We don't eat fast food or even slower fast food

> (like Denny's), first because of my gall stones (they brought on attacks),

> second because they stopped being good as we followed NT more and more. We

> do eat

> a lot of foods from nations other than our own, and dd eats them right along

> with us, even though they aren't organic, and may contain things that we

> would

> not otherwise buy. She enjoys Mexican, Indian, Italian, Chinese, and Thai

> food as much as we do. I know other families who choose to bring food for

> their

> children to eat when they go to restaurants, but that hasn't been our

> choice.

Us too, although we are very careful about ingredients because of food

allergies.

>

> favorite websites:

> www.westonaprice.org (of course)

> www.michaelolaf.net (montessori ideas for infants... great text)

> www.preschoolians.com (great shoes for infants & toddlers)

> www.diaperpin.com (research those cloth diaper choices)

> www.thebabywearer.com (research those sling choices)

> www.mamatoto.org (how to turn any piece of fabric into a sling)

> www.kangarookorner.com (Adjustable Fleece Pouch -- worth every penny 5 times

> over)

> www.woomb.org (good info on natural family planning, incl. info on using it

> while nursing)

I've only one favorite website... www.google.com

>

> I hope something from our experience has been helpful.

> Anabel

I second that!

L.

[Guest guest]

Deanna,

I am showing my true nature and being terribly nosey and curious....

Would you call me an older parent? My oldest turns 12 next month, so I

started younger... but I have a 4.5 yr old and a 22 month old, and I

just celebrated my 34th b-day?

As for reasons, needs, and situations... second marriage.

And I agree with your thoughts. " Close bonding " makes everything

easier and better.

L.

> My youngest is now 11, and my age still starts with a 3. I believed,

> and still do that younger parents are better suited to raising happy

> kids. Nowadays, the 30 somethings start families out of some perceived

> financial advantage. No offense to older parents, we all have our

> reasons, needs and situations.

>

> But basically, I think the two first things you mentioned are THE most

> important for child development. All mammals sleep with their young,

> and I feel it is of utmost importance. Of course, my kids have never

> watched commercial TV except at friends' houses, which can't hurt either.

>

> Peace to you,

> Deanna

[Guest guest]

So good to see the beat goes on! My oldest is soon 27 and the

youngest 15, but back in the day... We homebirthed, breastfed,

homeschooled, cooked from scratch, etc. Things changed and there

was a divorce forcing the kids into school so I could work, but they

still turned out well - the older two are working on PhDs, the

middle one is married (OMG!!) and the baby is an amazing young woman.

I'm bragging because I want you to know that it works!

Connie old now, but only 36 when the youngest was born!

[Guest guest]

my dear,

I love curiosity. My oldest is 16. So in my case, I am a young parent

all around. And so are you since you were young when you started.

Okay, let me clarify. My sister is 5.5 years my elder, yet she gave

birth for the first time a month before my younger boy was born. And I

have also seen other friends waiting until everything is somehow perfect

in their lives before they even think about kids, as was the case for

this avid career-minded sister of mine. And in some cases, it proves

too late a time to consider, as fertility issues and age become a

biological time bomb and they can't have it when THEY think it is the

right time, so not at all.

Selfishness. When you have a child in your twenties, you can not begin

to think of yourself. But when you think only of yourself until you are

pushing forty, you can not begin to think of another in the same way.

Oh, now, I am going to step on toes, opining thus. Nevertheless, I have

seen it so well with my sister and other women, that I can say candidly

that I play with my kids on OUR level. We are friends. But my sister,

for instance, can not relate on the same level because of her age and

perceived position in corporate life. There is just a separation that

folks used to call a generation gap.

So you are a young mother. You never lived even one decade - let alone

two - where all you REALLY had to be concerned about was YOU. That is

the key difference and I think it is more important in mom than dad.

Okay, I know, sexist remark. But the nourisher is mom after all in most

families. Only mom can feed properly, right? Even if, like a good

friend of mine, you have kids being born while you are forty, the fact

that you have kids in college as well, makes you who you are today.

But, thank the Lord that is not me!

Was that good, or did I open yet another can of worms?

Happy feasting with your family!

Deanna

Lillig wrote:

> Deanna,

> I am showing my true nature and being terribly nosey and curious....

>

> Would you call me an older parent? My oldest turns 12 next month, so I

> started younger... but I have a 4.5 yr old and a 22 month old, and I

> just celebrated my 34th b-day?

> As for reasons, needs, and situations... second marriage.

>

> And I agree with your thoughts. " Close bonding " makes everything

> easier and better.

> L.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I so agree that as a younger mother you can relate to your children on

their level, but the older you are the more you expect (demand) the

respect that you have become accostomed to. And how many toes am I

stepping on?!

L. - who is standing in the worms with Deanna

>

> Selfishness. When you have a child in your twenties, you can not begin

> to think of yourself. But when you think only of yourself until you are

> pushing forty, you can not begin to think of another in the same way.

> Oh, now, I am going to step on toes, opining thus. Nevertheless, I have

> seen it so well with my sister and other women, that I can say candidly

> that I play with my kids on OUR level. We are friends. But my sister,

> for instance, can not relate on the same level because of her age and

> perceived position in corporate life. There is just a separation that

> folks used to call a generation gap.

>

> So you are a young mother. You never lived even one decade - let alone

> two - where all you REALLY had to be concerned about was YOU. That is

> the key difference and I think it is more important in mom than dad.

> Okay, I know, sexist remark. But the nourisher is mom after all in most

> families. Only mom can feed properly, right? Even if, like a good

> friend of mine, you have kids being born while you are forty, the fact

> that you have kids in college as well, makes you who you are today.

> But, thank the Lord that is not me!

>

> Was that good, or did I open yet another can of worms?

>

> Happy feasting with your family!

> Deanna

[Guest guest]

Girl, I was standing in the worms digging about 100 feet of drainage

trench with DH over the weekend, in the rain and mud! Worms a plenty.

And my boots would get caked with mud, also the shovel, so that I

couldn't move so well. And I felt that were I to fall down, I'd be

mucking in worms for the rest of my life, lol.

But hey, you never know where a good workout might come from now,

right? You still have baby weights to lug, of course. Lucky .

Deanna

Deanna

>

> L. - who is standing in the worms with Deanna

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Define " older " and " younger " parent, would you? I am presently 27, my

husband is 26, and we do not yet have children. Actually, I only know

one person my age who does have children. Maybe it is something with

living in a bigger city (I am in Seattle). I don't know. I know that

I would love to have kids one day, but what is keeping me from it at

the moment isn't so much financial ambitions, but rather a sense that

there are things to be done before kids enter the picture.

Oh wait, I know two people my age with children. One got pregnant

when she was 17 and the other lives about 1,000 miles away.

I think this is a fascinating conversation...

a

>

> > Deanna,

> > I am showing my true nature and being terribly nosey and curious....

> >

> > Would you call me an older parent? My oldest turns 12 next month, so I

> > started younger... but I have a 4.5 yr old and a 22 month old, and I

> > just celebrated my 34th b-day?

> > As for reasons, needs, and situations... second marriage.

> >

> > And I agree with your thoughts. " Close bonding " makes everything

> > easier and better.

> > L.

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

> Define " older " and " younger " parent, would you? I am presently 27, my

> husband is 26, and we do not yet have children. Actually, I only know

> one person my age who does have children. Maybe it is something with

> living in a bigger city (I am in Seattle). I don't know. I know that

> I would love to have kids one day, but what is keeping me from it at

> the moment isn't so much financial ambitions, but rather a sense that

> there are things to be done before kids enter the picture.

> a

>

a,

I guess the native example is what we are all trying to follow here on

NN. Most traditional peoples have followed the rhythms of their bodies,

which dictate when reproduction is most physically desirable. But isn't

birth control the modern way? So that is a big difference right there.

I think that sex as an act has become very removed from the sexual

bonding that produces offspring as a natural result. That is nature, a

nature we are very much removed from presently. But no, I am not the pope.

Now, you say you sense some things need to be done before children

arrive. What things? What things can not be done without a child

resting on your hip, grasping your breast?

Deanna

[Guest guest]

> >

> a,

> I guess the native example is what we are all trying to follow here on

> NN. Most traditional peoples have followed the rhythms of their

bodies,

> which dictate when reproduction is most physically desirable. But

isn't

> birth control the modern way? So that is a big difference right

there.

> I think that sex as an act has become very removed from the sexual

> bonding that produces offspring as a natural result. That is nature, a

> nature we are very much removed from presently. But no, I am not

the pope.

Right. I agree that there is a separation between sex and

childbearing, as you describe it. But then again, we are rather

removed from our nature and the natural intentions of our bodies in

many ways these days.

>

> Now, you say you sense some things need to be done before children

> arrive. What things? What things can not be done without a child

> resting on your hip, grasping your breast?

Well, I would like to finish my schooling in massage therapy and maybe

even get a year or so of practicing under my belt. Travelling seems

easier without young children. Plus, I keep wishing my mom will move

closer before I have a child. I would like her to be nearer for that,

but then again, I am the one that moved 1,000 miles away to go to

college. And I didn't go back when I was done!

Plus, I suppose it would be good to start ovulating regularly, ahahahah.

But really, I have spoken with women in their mid to late thirties

that tell me to not wait that long to have children. They did

(because of career-stuff usually) and then had a hard time with their

fertility and even getting pregnant.

I want to have kids in a couple of years. I think that 30ish is a

good age for me, though I don't want to wait too long. For one thing,

I heard that your chances of having twins increases around the age of

35 and twins run in both of our families!!

a

>

> Deanna

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Well, I would like to finish my schooling in massage therapy and maybe

> even get a year or so of practicing under my belt. Travelling seems

> easier without young children.

Yes, but traveling when you have older kids is a BLAST! But, when you

are fifty and on the SAD, that kind of education just isn't happening

now, is it? Also, I moved to England with a two year old. I would have

to generalize and say that it is easier to travel with ANY age kid when

YOU are young, lol.

>

> I want to have kids in a couple of years. I think that 30ish is a

> good age for me, though I don't want to wait too long. For one thing,

> I heard that your chances of having twins increases around the age of

> 35 and twins run in both of our families!! a

>

Well, so long as you give yourself a good window of time, I guess. I

have a friend who was going to be all put together in herself before she

had kids. She has had miscarriages and no baby So, from someone for

whom pregnancy was never a trying thing please don't necessarily

think that it will all happen when you want it to. Maybe it will. And

good for you when it does. But you can go to school and all of that

with kids. I took some classes at Purdue not but two years ago with

ease and top grades. But I haven't been " employed " for years. Self

employment is more nourishing anyway. And school has all been dummied

down, sadly. Grade inflation and all of that BS. It is now a joke in

mainstream education. Twenty years ago, one calculus class was

offered. Now? Five classes or more that who knows how to transfer.

Either you know the subject or you don't. Calculus for dummies.

Whatever. But now I am off subject, so:

It is not as if you can't do what you want to with kids. It just

becomes more of a priority to care for them over your desires. Have no

fear. Let it be.

Flowing with the tide,

Deanna

[Guest guest]

I thought I'd chime in here to share my story. I just turned 28 and

my baby is about to turn 4 months. He's my first. I did take

birth control for 5 years before having him and I'm glad I did. It

was nice to have the time along with my husband before starting a

family. And I wanted to really plan having a baby. I've relaxed a

lot since then !! No more hormones for one... and the other child

(ren) won't be as " planned " as this one was. I'm loving being a mom.

I feel like I'm exactly where I wanted to be in my life. I have

been " ready " to have a child since I was about 24. Still, I wouldn't

change a thing. I had a homebirth, I am breastfeeding (and plan to

continue for a long while) and I'm just now adjusting my life to the

NT way. What more could I want???

Love this list BTW.

Magda

[Guest guest]

Yeah I guess that is what you call this fifty-five pounds! 35 on one

side, and 20 on the other... if only i had more hands, or maybe bigger

hips would do it.... hmmmm, you've heard of breast enlargment, I

wonder if they do hip enlargment... to better carry your children with

you...heheee ROFL

Oh and speaking of worms, how enticing! could you send me some? My

compost pile is gaining faster than the microbes can handle... I need

little wormy things that want to eat! PLEASE! I tried digging and

broke my shovel.... Idoubt I would have found any worms in that hard

dirt, huh?

Are you in TX? I hear that southeastern portion is really getting flooded.

L.

On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 20:41:00 -0600, Deanna <hl@...> wrote:

> Girl, I was standing in the worms digging about 100 feet of drainage

> trench with DH over the weekend, in the rain and mud! Worms a plenty.

> And my boots would get caked with mud, also the shovel, so that I

> couldn't move so well. And I felt that were I to fall down, I'd be

> mucking in worms for the rest of my life, lol.

>

> But hey, you never know where a good workout might come from now,

> right? You still have baby weights to lug, of course. Lucky .

>

> Deanna

[Guest guest]

> Well, so long as you give yourself a good window of time, I guess. I

> have a friend who was going to be all put together in herself before

she

> had kids. She has had miscarriages and no baby So, from someone

for

> whom pregnancy was never a trying thing please don't necessarily

> think that it will all happen when you want it to. Maybe it will.

I am aware of that, sure. I also am trying to not avoid *planning*

too much for what will be the perfect time to have a baby, you know?

I know that it will happen when it happens. I don't want to schedule

it into my life. Really, the great stuff never happens on schedule.

And

> good for you when it does. But you can go to school and all of that

> with kids. I took some classes at Purdue not but two years ago with

> ease and top grades. But I haven't been " employed " for years. Self

> employment is more nourishing anyway.

Yep! I am hoping that doing massage therapy will allow me the freedom

to make my own hours, be self-employed, etc.

And school has all been dummied

> down, sadly. Grade inflation and all of that BS. It is now a joke in

> mainstream education. Twenty years ago, one calculus class was

> offered. Now? Five classes or more that who knows how to transfer.

> Either you know the subject or you don't. Calculus for dummies.

> Whatever.

Oh, I agree! Plus, a college education is a dime a dozen these days.

I graduated four years ago with *two* bachelor degrees, and where has

that got me? Back in school, learning something that will provide me

with applicable skills.

> It is not as if you can't do what you want to with kids. It just

> becomes more of a priority to care for them over your desires. Have no

> fear. Let it be.

>

> Flowing with the tide,

> Deanna

Thanks, Deanna. I know that children will come into my life when it

is time.

~a

[Guest guest]

On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 21:19:16 -0600

Deanna,

Quite a perspective you have on children, family, work, etc. Did you

grow into this or was this the page you were already on when you got

married?

" Scholarship is essentially confirming your early paranoia through

a deeper factual analysis. "

Murray Rothbard

" Vegetarians, come away from The Dark Side.

Pork is the other white meat; beef is what’s for dinner;

and a day without pepper-crusted venison tenderloin is

like a day without sunshine. "

Brad Edmonds

[Guest guest]

I follow most of what has been said so far. One thing that we do that everyone

thinks is strange is that we have never used soap, shampoo or baby wipes on our

son who is almost 4 yrs old. We just washed his little bottom off with warm

water when he was little and now he gets a bath in filtered water every other

day or so. We use a Shower Cleen carbon filter that is supposed to take out

more than chlorine. We attached it to the shower head and got an extra long

hose so we can fill up his bath with it. Of course with the extra long hose you

want to find a way to wrap it up high so they can't get to it when not being

used. His head still has that sweet baby smell. His friends' heads smell

dirty like grown up heads even when " clean. "

Also, speaking of heads, if I ever had another child I would take them right

away to a good D.O. who does manipulation (and specializes in children) to make

sure their head plates are in the right place. I think this is called a sacral

cranial adjustment. When they are newborns it is very easy to do. It did

wonders for my son but I didn't find out about it until he was 2 yrs old and it

took many sessions.

And to the woman who posted about age of parenting, come on, those kinds of

generalizations are just silly. There are some really good young parents and

some really bad young parents. Just because your older sister doesn't connect

(in your opinion) with her child doesn't mean that all older parents don't. My

younger sister started having kids when she was 19. She just had her 5th at 34.

Her first two she barely parented at all. She just dropped them off at my mom's

house as often as possible. Her fifth is the first one she has breastfed and,

in my opinion, the first she has really connected with. This is just one

example. I like to think we are all doing our best. Hope this doesn't sound

negative. Guess I just take issue because I had my son at 34.

Parenting is such a blessing.

Kim

[Guest guest]

,

I gave up working when I was 6 months pregnant with my first child and

have never looked back to full time employment. I have some definite

ideas for raising children, but only my own deal with them. What I mean

is: people are unique and need to find the way to their own wisdom. Not

everyone should homeschool, not everyone thrives being homeschooled.

Both of my sons want it, as we discuss high school, and they are given

choices at this stage of their maturity. So I may generalize about this

or that, but each person must find what works best for her.

Anyway, to answer your question. In some ways I have grown into the

role of parent, blindly stumbling around. In other ways I have had

clear convictions from the get go that I have not abandoned.

Peace,

Deanna

>

[Guest guest]

Pratick,

> but we have also

> been using regular commercial baby oil for the hair, baby powder to keep her

dry and baby

> lotion at night.

I don't have children, but NOBODY should use mineral oil-based

products on their skin as they rob the body of important fat soluble

vitamins. Also, most commercial powders are filled with nasty

chemicals. Use pure coconut oil and perhaps cornstarch instead.

Babies don't need perfumes and dyes either!

check it out:

http://www.jorbins.com/baby-nursery-magazine/articles/mineral-oil-fact.php

[Guest guest]

> And to the woman who posted about age of parenting, come on, those

kinds of generalizations are just silly. There are some really good

young parents and some really bad young parents. - Kim

Hi Kim,

That would be me. Biology is not silly. And biologically, the really

young moms - 12 to 16 - and moms over 30 are indeed at risk for

problems. So are the kids they produce. Of course, some have healthy

babies after 40, but not always.

http://www.musckids.com/health_library/hrpregnant/over30.htm

http://www.marchofdimes.com/professionals/681_1155.asp

The risk of down syndrome, complications in pregnancy and miscarriage

all increase with maternal age. Mostly, chromosomal changes are to

blame, and they are directly related to age.

Regards,

Deanna

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

From: " Pratick Mukherjee "

> Here's a more specific question --

>

> What do you guys use instead of the usual baby lotions, baby powder and

baby oils?

>

I personally never used any of that for any of my children--the oldest is

now 7.5. Baby powder is an inhalant irritant and, despite being used to

absorb moisture, doesn't prevent the skin irritation it is intended for. At

best, the perfumes mask diaper odors that most find objectionable. I've

never seen the need for oils and lotions, either.

> Also, what do you use to wash her clothes?

> We have been using a few drops of disinfectent (Dettol) in warm water to

wash her

> clothes.

>

> What do you do?

I've always washed the baby's clothes with our clothes. I always use

significantly less detergent than the manufacturer recommends (they do,

after all, have a vested interest in you using *more* than less and never

had a problem with skin irritation.

--s, who heartily seconds all the other family bed, breastfeeding, delayed

solids, slinging, cloth diapering suggestions.....worked well for us so far!

[Guest guest]

Thanks for sticking up for us. I had my DD at 36 - Gee,

I *thought* I loved her, but I guess after so many years

of being totally self-centered, I couldn't possibly *love*

anyone! I guess I'm doing all this for myself, somehow -

the breastfeeding, the co-sleeping, the homeschooling,

the careful attention to nutrition. Sheesh.

I was engaged at 18 to an abusive man, and I often

wonder how my life would be now if I'd married him

and had children. It's not a pretty picture. It took me

a while to find the right man for me. I wish we could have

more than one, but I'm happy knowing that my one has

a wonderful dad.

I hang out with moms *much* younger than myself.

One of my young aquaintances got married,

had three kids, and got divorced fast enough

to make your head spin. I think a stable, loving

marriage is so, so important to kids. Even the

most loving mom can't be a dad, and a good, loving

dad is one of the great treasures of life. Waiting

for a really good man is a way of loving your kids

before they're born.

Aven

> And to the woman who posted about age of parenting, come on, those kinds

of generalizations are just silly. There are some really good young parents

and some really bad young parents. Just because your older sister doesn't

connect (in your opinion) with her child doesn't mean that all older parents

don't. My younger sister started having kids when she was 19. She just had

her 5th at 34. Her first two she barely parented at all. She just dropped them

off at my mom's house as often as possible. Her fifth is the first one she has

breastfed and, in my opinion, the first she has really connected with. This is

just one example. I like to think we are all doing our best. Hope this doesn't

sound negative. Guess I just take issue because I had my son at 34.

>

> Parenting is such a blessing.

> Kim

>

>