Re: Glucose... and relatives

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/24/04 9:45:54 AM Eastern Standard Time, hl@...

writes:

> Yes, infants

> will get enough sugar from breast milk. That should be the first choice

> for them. Introducing other sources of sweets may provide a competition

> to milk, which is just not a good thing from a nutritional standpoint.

____

~~> I agree, certainly, but I was assuming that the feeding of yogurt

indicated that the mom was either incapable or unwilling to provide the breast

milk.

Chris

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/24/04 2:29:41 AM Eastern Standard Time,

catzandturtles@... writes:

>

> What age do you consider an infant? This is a variance that needs to

> be cleared up in this conversation. I realize that the original

> question involved a 4 month old, but since we are now generalizing to

> all infants, can we please specify an age!

_____

~~~> It wasn't necessary to for this discussion, but it is my understanding

that moms can usually breast feed for several years if they choose. I'm not

sure whether exclusive breast feeding is good for several years or not. I

assume that whenever teeth start developing the children need to be chewing.

____

> >~~~~> I don't think there is a significant advantage to the fiber, enough

> >to

> >outweigh all the fructose.

>

> And at this point I have to ask if you consider there to be any reason

> for fruit for anyone? Why don't we all just consume a spoonful of

> maple syrup when we feel the urge for an apple!

____

~~~~> Well, fruits contain a lot of different important nutrients. I imagine

one is better off consuming some of them, especially berries, than none,

although I doubt that they are important for a four-month-old. At the same

time,

I think it would be bad to get the majority of one's carbohydrates from fruit,

and much better to get them from glucose-based carbs.

____

> An infant's diet (breast milk) normally contains

> >glucose (from milk), but does not contain fructose (unless there are small

> >amounts in milk?). The water is of no benefit at all, because if one were

> >to add

> >it to bread, the water would be evaporated during cooking,

>

> which makes it a great sweetner and " oil " !

____

~~~> I don't know what you mean by " oil, " but the evaporation of water

undermines the value of having the water, which was the point I was addressing.

____

> and if one were

> >to

> >add it to yogurt, the yogurt would contain enough water to make the water

> in

> >the applesauce insignificant. While the sugars may be less dense, it is

> >also

> >less sweet, so one would have to add more to get the same sweetness. Or,

> >one

> >could add less maple syrup, or honey, or whatever.

>

>

> Or stick to the fruit and not introduce the concentrated sugar until

> way into the toddler years, or later, or never.

_____

~~~> Your use of the term " concentrated sugar " is obfuscating the fact that

the maple syrup is diluted by the yogurt (or bread).

Chris

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/25/04 8:41:51 PM Eastern Standard Time, hl@...

writes:

> Gosh, I would hope that if that were the case - breast milk is

> discontinued or lacking - that we would have been given a heads up on

> that. I would think in such a case the subject would something like,

> " Help need substitute for breast milk, nt formula!! "

>

> I think yoghurt was a choice of foods for introduction to the real world

> of culinary pleasures. But I don't know. 'twasn't my kid

_____

~~~> Either way, for whatever reason the yogurt is chosen to displace breast

milk. I guess the motivation is irrelevant, although the criticism would be

valid to say that if it is possible to feed breast milk, it should be done,

rather than displacing it with inferior foods. However, I'm taking it as a

given

that the yogurt is displacing the breast milk, regardless of why.

In that case, how closely the foods approximate the nutritional complex of

breast milk would seem to be a primary concern. And, again, my point was that

maple syrup offers sugars that are contained in breast milk (or, at least, once

they are digested), whereas apple sauce offers sugars that are not contained

in breast milk and that a baby would normally not be consuming.

Chris

[Guest guest]

Gosh, I would hope that if that were the case - breast milk is

discontinued or lacking - that we would have been given a heads up on

that. I would think in such a case the subject would something like,

" Help need substitute for breast milk, nt formula!! "

I think yoghurt was a choice of foods for introduction to the real world

of culinary pleasures. But I don't know. 'twasn't my kid

Deanna

>

> ~~~~> I'm assuming that if yogurt is being fed, it is because the baby

> for

> some reason cannot have breast milk, or the mother at least for some

> reason

> cannot produce breast milk, rather. I doubt that yogurt is the best

> replacement,

> but I don't see how creamed spinach and butter would replace the

> milk. Egg

> yolks probably offer a *partial* replacement, but the sugars are

> important to

> the baby's development, and egg yolks don't have any. I think that

> the sugar

> portion of whatever is offered should contain galactose, and yogurt

> would have

> some, but I imagine the baby is probably best off with a source of

> glucose

> rather than without, and the maple syrup can offer this while the

> other options

> you suggest cannot. Yogurt would have the disadvantage of fermenting

> some of

> the galactose, but I imagine that added sugar would act as a galactose

> sparer,

> so that less can be used for energy in the blood making the galactose

> available

> for whatever its role is in the developing brain.

>

> Chris

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

wrote:

> ~~~> Either way, for whatever reason the yogurt is chosen to displace

> breast

> milk. I guess the motivation is irrelevant, although the criticism would

> be

> valid to say that if it is possible to feed breast milk, it should be done,

> rather than displacing it with inferior foods. However, I'm taking it as a

> given

> that the yogurt is displacing the breast milk, regardless of why.

Breast milk does at some point need to be displaced!! Ideally, it is done on

a gradual basis with good foods, but displacement is a given.

~~ Jocelyne

[Guest guest]

Okay, I bow down to Suzanne! Wow!

I know it is something that a lot of people take for granted. I know

it is something that a lot of us have fought friends and family about,

and then done what we thought was right anyways. For some others, it

may have been acceptable and never questioned. It is something that we

have chosen for our children because we believe it is the best for

them.

I guess I did just want to make everyone stop and think about it. It

is something that we do, and never get any appreciation for (not that

we need it). But maybe we should appreciate ourselves for it, maybe we

should give ourselves a pat on the back or a hug. Maybe a quiet, " You

Go Girl! " Whatever you need...

I know I needed something just now as the current one stands on his

head to nurse, or decides to see if he can spin while nursing, or

falls asleep and clenches.... Just trying to remember why I endure

this... and in another minute, I'll forget I needed a reason.

I'm ranting off into nothingness.... L.

>

> This thread made me sit down and calculate how long I've been nursing: 90

> months. Non-stop. And my third is 20 months and has plans to nurse

> while at college.

>

> --s

[Guest guest]

Congrats!

I nursed my second for 31 months... through the third pregnancy. I

nursed both for almost a month, but I just didn't feel like I could

keep it up... I was soooo tired. Still nursing the third at 22 months,

and no sign of him giving it up anytime soon.

L.

On Thu, 25 Nov 2004 14:54:01 -0500, KerryAnn

<krankedyann@...> wrote:

> ,

>

> I've been nursing for 25 months, am pregnant and due to deliver any minute

> now, have nursed through the pregnancy, and plan to keep going strong once

> this baby is born. Once this baby is born I will being studying to become a

> lactation consultant and midwife.

>

> KerryAnn

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

From: " Lillig "

> Congrats!

> I nursed my second for 31 months... through the third pregnancy. I

> nursed both for almost a month, but I just didn't feel like I could

> keep it up... I was soooo tired. Still nursing the third at 22 months,

> and no sign of him giving it up anytime soon.

> L.

This thread made me sit down and calculate how long I've been nursing: 90

months. Non-stop. And my third is 20 months and has plans to nurse

while at college.

--s

[Guest guest]

> Okay, I bow down to Suzanne! Wow!

> I know it is something that a lot of people take for granted. I

know

> it is something that a lot of us have fought friends and family

about,

> and then done what we thought was right anyways. For some others,

it

> may have been acceptable and never questioned. It is something

that we

> have chosen for our children because we believe it is the best for

> them.

> I guess I did just want to make everyone stop and think about it.

It

> is something that we do, and never get any appreciation for (not

that

> we need it). But maybe we should appreciate ourselves for it,

maybe we

> should give ourselves a pat on the back or a hug. Maybe a

quiet, " You

> Go Girl! " Whatever you need...

######### You know that is soooo true. My mom only breastfed for 3

months since she had no real knowledge about breastfeeding and no

support. She then switched to formula and eventually to real food.

My brother and I both turned out fine. Because if her experience I

was afraid I wouldn't have enough milk or I would " lose " milk....

Then engorgement came and all my insecurities flew out the window.

Still, it's an uphill battle with my mom because she believes a

child should be introduced to real food quickly, 4 or 5 months....

Well, I've decided that won't be so. I'm taking really good care of

myself, eating really well so my milk will be good and I'm not about

to give up the closeness I'm able to experience with because of

nursing. He'll be eating real food for the rest of his life so there

is no reason to rush. It's just so hard when all you hear is " I did

(or used) [fill in the blank] and you turned out fine !!! " Oh well,

there is more than one way to skin a cat (or raise a child in this

case).

I'm really glad for posts like these because they give silent

encouragement to many across the country. Like me

YOU GO GIRLS!!!!

Magda (happily breastfeeding for 4 months and will be pumping while

at work)

[Guest guest]

Dr. Pottenger's research proves that it takes a few generations before

you start to notice the effects of diet (environment), and then they

just get worse... and it takes a bit to reverse those effects (a

lifetime, a few generations).

L.

> ######### You know that is soooo true. My mom only breastfed for 3

> months since she had no real knowledge about breastfeeding and no

> support. She then switched to formula and eventually to real food.

> My brother and I both turned out fine. Because if her experience I

> was afraid I wouldn't have enough milk or I would " lose " milk....

> Then engorgement came and all my insecurities flew out the window.

> Still, it's an uphill battle with my mom because she believes a

> child should be introduced to real food quickly, 4 or 5 months....

> Well, I've decided that won't be so. I'm taking really good care of

> myself, eating really well so my milk will be good and I'm not about

> to give up the closeness I'm able to experience with because of

> nursing. He'll be eating real food for the rest of his life so there

> is no reason to rush. It's just so hard when all you hear is " I did

> (or used) [fill in the blank] and you turned out fine !!! " Oh well,

> there is more than one way to skin a cat (or raise a child in this

> case).

> I'm really glad for posts like these because they give silent

> encouragement to many across the country. Like me

> YOU GO GIRLS!!!!

> Magda (happily breastfeeding for 4 months and will be pumping while

> at work)

>

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