Re: Whey Powder For Muscle Building, etc.

[Guest guest]

Hi Tom,

I didn't miss your post. Generally, give me till Saturday to answer a

question, because I have very limited time during the week to read and respond

to

email, and while I do some, I do most of my email reading in the wee hours of

Saturday morning before I go to bed, and the rest over the weekend. Comments

below:

Question for Chris: I've tried whey powder with weight training in the

past and am looking to get back into it. I remember you were using

Designer Whey about a year ago. What have you concluded about whey

powders? Are any healthy? Which is the best brand and why?

______

~~~~~> The best brands are out of my price range. I use DW still when I use

it. Goat-tein looks good, and there are some other low-temp dehydrated

powders available. DW is very high quality, IMO, with respect to the whey

protein.

The questionable ingredient in my eyes is the phenylalanine. Phenylalanine

can be very helpful to maintain energy in a workout, but I don't know how much

is safe to consume or under what conditions it is safe to consume before it

becomes neurotoxic.

______

When should

it be taken in relation to the workout?

______

~~~~~> Before and after the workout. I'd use two servings before, with some

other source of calories at least equal to the amount from the protein,

preferably that does not require much or any digestion. Experiment with carbs.

If

carbs a half hour before is neutral or gives more energy, use raw honey or

maple syrup. If carbs a half hour before gives you a slump in energy, don't use

them. In that case, use coconut oil or MCT oil. Use two servings immediately

after your workout, and use at least two tbsp of raw honey, and, if you like,

add an addition 2 tbsp or quarter cup of maple syrup. I use 1/4 tsp salt and

1/4 tsp cinnamon also to aid the rapidity of the sugar absorption.

________

Does regular use increase

muscle strength and bulk significantly?

_______

~~~~~> It can help, but it is not necessary, depending on your time

constraints, and it is not enough in itself, IMO. I put on a lot of bulk in the

first

half of last year without using any protein powders. I ate raw buffalo steak

marinated over night in raw honey before my workout, with some other food-- I

don't recall what, and my post workout meal was more raw buffalo steak and a

whole mature coconut.

The most important things are to eat before and after your workout, and to

eat a LOT. I think it is very important to have a lot of vitamin A, and I'd

suggest using high vitamin cod liver oil, and, if you can afford it, butter oil.

Don't use the protein powder without supplementing vitamin A as CLO, as high

protein diets rapidly deplete vitamin A. But it is number 1 to eat a lot of

food. At least for me... people who are naturally big and tend to be fat

rather than skinny have a different story, but people like me who need to

deliberately *gain* weight rather than lose it need to eat a LOT of food to put

on

muscle and a LOT of food to simply avoid losing it.

____

Are you using whey now with

your kettlebell routine?

____

~~~~> I'm not currently using my kettlebell. I alternate cycles. I find

that my gym workouts help me put on mass better than my k-bell, but the latter

is

good for various aspects of power training, fat loss, and to increase gym

performance if used for 2 weeks. I am using DW now, but am thinking of going

back to raw meat before and after my workout if I can get my hands on meat fit

for it again.

Good luck,

Chris

[Guest guest]

" I use 1/4 tsp salt and

1/4 tsp cinnamon also to aid the rapidity of the sugar absorption. "

What do you mean by this.....how does that work.....Does this little honey

and maple syrup trick help put on mass? I am a little concerned with a lot of

these simple sugars making an insulin spike, which if it is REALLY good for

increasing mass, I could see a short term pay-off if you desired that (which

I DO) but I am concerned with long-term health....I just turned 40....and

that this could " wear out " my pancreas, I am trying to keep my blood sugar

levels more stable, and hopefully ward off any future " adult-onset diabetes "

problems...I want to put on some mass again....but looking for the healthiest

way

to do it....I know " really raw honey " is very healthy, but could excess cause

trouble down the road?....

.....and raw buffalo steak....hmmmm, sounds like a good idea...do you get it

frozen, then thaw it and eat it? Or do you get it fresh and eat it....I would

probably do it if I had a good source of fresh meat....or is that not that

critical...the nutritionist at Dr. Mercola's office was all into raw

meats....the day I was there....he had a raw buffalo steak on his shelf...I

asked him

" aren't you even going to cook it? " ...and he said " I am....I'm warming it up

to room temperature... " ...at the time I couldn't conceive it....but I've

learned MUCH since then....and I'm open to trying it....does the honey help? I

bet raw buffalo, along with a heavy " squat " program, could definitely add some

quality meat to my body....ever heard of " super squats " ? ...simple, TOUGH,

but I bet effective....and what is " DW " by the way?.....

--

Steve

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 10/9/04 1:20:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

phishin340@... writes:

" I use 1/4 tsp salt and

1/4 tsp cinnamon also to aid the rapidity of the sugar absorption. "

What do you mean by this.....how does that work.....

________

~~~~~~> Sodium is required for the transport of glucose across the intestinal

lining. Someone, I think Heidi, posted some information once that cinnamon

has a compound that acts as insulin by increasing the absorption of glucose

into cells.

_______

Does this little honey

and maple syrup trick help put on mass?

_______

~~~~~> Yes, I think so, for two reasons: first, because the hormones that

cause muscle growth are products of a cascade initiated by insulin, and second,

because the intense workout is likely to break down muscle mass for a while

afterward, unless a blood sugar/insulin spike suppresses the cortisol.

_________

I am a little concerned with a lot of

these simple sugars making an insulin spike,

_________

~~~~~> I don't think there is anything wrong with insulin spikes per se, in

any way. What is problematic in my view is insulin resistance. I think that

if you are eating insulin-stimulating foods continuously, you are likely to

develop insulin resistance, and thus raise your total insulin levels required

for

food and your fasting levels, and *that* I think might burn out your

pancreas, but I don't think the judicious use of large amounts of simple sugars

would

do this itself. This can probably be best managed by cycling what you eat or

when you eat. Such as intermittent fasting, intermittent calorie restriction,

cycling carbs with fats as primary energy sources, etc.

______

.....and raw buffalo steak....hmmmm, sounds like a good idea...do you get it

frozen, then thaw it and eat it? Or do you get it fresh and eat it....

______

~~~~~~> I was freezing it at the time. I'm not sure whether I should be

concerned about the parasite issue or not. I lean towards not, but was playing

it

safe. Funny story about the guy in Mercola's office!

_______

ever heard of " super squats " ? ...simple, TOUGH,

but I bet effective....

______

~~~~> I'm not sure. What are they? I'm doing stop squats right now, which

are like Olympic full squats, but you pause for one full second at the lowest

point.

_____

and what is " DW " by the way?.....

____

~~~~~> Designer Whey.

Chris

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 10/10/04 12:04:08 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

t.l.jeanne@... writes:

If cost and labor were not issues, would you pick something besides

whey powder for around-workout consumption? E.g., fresh whey, raw

meat, egg yolks and/or whites? IOW, is there a whole food that is as

good or better than whey powder for building muscle?

______

~~~~~> If cost were not an issue, I'd certainly pick a whey powder without

the questionable additives. (Including flavors-- I don't understand the

obsession with making things intended for purely functional use to be downed in

three

seconds taste " good, " which is never accomplished by the flavoring anyway...)

Fresh whey is out, because it isn't high in protein. Raw eggs are ok, but

they are mostly fat, and while fat is important for putting on muscle, it's not

a good post-workout choice because mixing fat with protein and carbs slows the

digestion. Same goes for raw milk, with the added concern of the

digestibility of the lactose.

Raw grass-fed steak is probably the way to go. It's my understanding that

raw meat is digested quicker than cooked meat, but I haven't checked this or

looked for quantitative information. I haven't read Pottenger's Cats, but I

believe Idol said once before that his studies indicated that protein from

raw animal foods was utilized better for structural purposes. I suspect that

hydrolyzed whey protein would be digested and absorbed quicker than any food,

but this can probably be gotten around by consuming the steak *before* the

workout, and after, rather than just before, so that way there is already some

protein level elevation during and immediately after your workout.

Chris

[Guest guest]

Thanks so much for the info, Chris. I think I will buy some DW and

give it a try, although the phenylalanine bothers me too.

If cost and labor were not issues, would you pick something besides

whey powder for around-workout consumption? E.g., fresh whey, raw

meat, egg yolks and/or whites? IOW, is there a whole food that is as

good or better than whey powder for building muscle?

Tom

> Hi Tom,

>

> I didn't miss your post. Generally, give me till Saturday to answer a

> question, because I have very limited time during the week to read

and respond to

<snip>