Guest guest Posted February 7, 2011 Report Share Posted February 7, 2011 Hi Barb, Boy, you really put your finger right on it, huh? It very hard to deal with those kinds of qualities in anyone, be they kids, teens or other adults. And there are some things you can do, but they aren't pleasant. And I'm guessing it's one of the things that parents and spouses of people with OCd might complain about the most! Of course you want the person to get their OCD under control, because you care about them, and you can see the pain they are in (not to mention the pain YOU'RE in). And for Mom's especially, to be on the sideline watching your child suffer, and feel prevented form doing anything about it, is about the most frustrating thing there is. But one thing we have to remember is that often the person doesn't want to attack it as much as WE want them to is due in part to the fact that they are the ones feeling the anxiety that reduces their motivation, and we only feel the benefits. So we have to ask a question that sounds a lot like " how do I help my kid/spouse/family member INCREASE their motivation to do something unpleasant? We'd like to be able to offer positive reinforcement/rewards to our kids to get them motivated; sometimes that works, but especially in this current generation, our kids are so used to getting lots of things that adding one more " good " seems trivial to them. They don't get motivated by toys, money or permissions like their parents used to. When that's the case, you're only left with one alternative. And that is to make it LESS comfortable for them to stay the way they are. I call this " souring the milk. " Moving them out of their comfort zone might mean just letting them know that the only way you will continue making accommodations for their OCD (and how many of us make SOME kind of accommodations, either by doing their rituals with them, or making excuses at school, etc?) is if they are working their ERP program. But don't make any boundary that you aren't willing to enforce - if your kid finds out that you bluff, the game is over! If they aren't willing to do the work to evict the OCD bully, then you shouldn't have to do the work to provide a home for that bully either. You don't have to change the towel for them every day if they aren't fighting back; you don't have to buy extra paper towels if they aren't doing exposure homework; this kind of contracting is pretty important to help the kid stay on track, and to keep the frustration level in the house to a minimum. Lack of insight is tougher, but it can be dealt with in a similar way. Sometimes getting the therapist to do some cognitive restructuring (helping the OCD sufferer to think about the OCD symptoms in a different way so that they are more willing to fight them) can be helpful. But if that isn't possible, then you can certainly let the kid know that even if SHE doesn't see why she should fight the OCD, YOU need her to in order to continue getting accommodations. Behavioral problems can be all over the map, but one of the hardest ones is Oppositional issues (like ODD). This usually breaks down to a matter of having the parents be very consistent, use lots of structure and using a reward/punishment response to behavior that, to borrow a line from a previous Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, is " swift and sure. " Very often you have to address the oppositional behaviors before you can deal with the OCD. I hope this is helpful. If there are variations of this problem on the list, please call out! Cheers, Jim Hatton > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > I'm Jim from San Diego, and I just found out my email was > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2011 Report Share Posted February 8, 2011 Bravo jim loved your post! Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry Re: Hi all Hi Barb, Boy, you really put your finger right on it, huh? It very hard to deal with those kinds of qualities in anyone, be they kids, teens or other adults. And there are some things you can do, but they aren't pleasant. And I'm guessing it's one of the things that parents and spouses of people with OCd might complain about the most! Of course you want the person to get their OCD under control, because you care about them, and you can see the pain they are in (not to mention the pain YOU'RE in). And for Mom's especially, to be on the sideline watching your child suffer, and feel prevented form doing anything about it, is about the most frustrating thing there is. But one thing we have to remember is that often the person doesn't want to attack it as much as WE want them to is due in part to the fact that they are the ones feeling the anxiety that reduces their motivation, and we only feel the benefits. So we have to ask a question that sounds a lot like " how do I help my kid/spouse/family member INCREASE their motivation to do something unpleasant? We'd like to be able to offer positive reinforcement/rewards to our kids to get them motivated; sometimes that works, but especially in this current generation, our kids are so used to getting lots of things that adding one more " good " seems trivial to them. They don't get motivated by toys, money or permissions like their parents used to. When that's the case, you're only left with one alternative. And that is to make it LESS comfortable for them to stay the way they are. I call this " souring the milk. " Moving them out of their comfort zone might mean just letting them know that the only way you will continue making accommodations for their OCD (and how many of us make SOME kind of accommodations, either by doing their rituals with them, or making excuses at school, etc?) is if they are working their ERP program. But don't make any boundary that you aren't willing to enforce - if your kid finds out that you bluff, the game is over! If they aren't willing to do the work to evict the OCD bully, then you shouldn't have to do the work to provide a home for that bully either. You don't have to change the towel for them every day if they aren't fighting back; you don't have to buy extra paper towels if they aren't doing exposure homework; this kind of contracting is pretty important to help the kid stay on track, and to keep the frustration level in the house to a minimum. Lack of insight is tougher, but it can be dealt with in a similar way. Sometimes getting the therapist to do some cognitive restructuring (helping the OCD sufferer to think about the OCD symptoms in a different way so that they are more willing to fight them) can be helpful. But if that isn't possible, then you can certainly let the kid know that even if SHE doesn't see why she should fight the OCD, YOU need her to in order to continue getting accommodations. Behavioral problems can be all over the map, but one of the hardest ones is Oppositional issues (like ODD). This usually breaks down to a matter of having the parents be very consistent, use lots of structure and using a reward/punishment response to behavior that, to borrow a line from a previous Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, is " swift and sure. " Very often you have to address the oppositional behaviors before you can deal with the OCD. I hope this is helpful. If there are variations of this problem on the list, please call out! Cheers, Jim Hatton > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > I'm Jim from San Diego, and I just found out my email was > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2011 Report Share Posted February 8, 2011 Doe anyone know of a support group for parents of children with ocd. My 8yr old daughter has ocd.I just found out las year. life has been a living hell.thanks Subject: Re: Re: Hi all To: Date: Tuesday, February 8, 2011, 12:59 PM  Bravo jim loved your post! Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry Re: Hi all Hi Barb, Boy, you really put your finger right on it, huh? It very hard to deal with those kinds of qualities in anyone, be they kids, teens or other adults. And there are some things you can do, but they aren't pleasant. And I'm guessing it's one of the things that parents and spouses of people with OCd might complain about the most! Of course you want the person to get their OCD under control, because you care about them, and you can see the pain they are in (not to mention the pain YOU'RE in). And for Mom's especially, to be on the sideline watching your child suffer, and feel prevented form doing anything about it, is about the most frustrating thing there is. But one thing we have to remember is that often the person doesn't want to attack it as much as WE want them to is due in part to the fact that they are the ones feeling the anxiety that reduces their motivation, and we only feel the benefits. So we have to ask a question that sounds a lot like " how do I help my kid/spouse/family member INCREASE their motivation to do something unpleasant? We'd like to be able to offer positive reinforcement/rewards to our kids to get them motivated; sometimes that works, but especially in this current generation, our kids are so used to getting lots of things that adding one more " good " seems trivial to them. They don't get motivated by toys, money or permissions like their parents used to. When that's the case, you're only left with one alternative. And that is to make it LESS comfortable for them to stay the way they are. I call this " souring the milk. " Moving them out of their comfort zone might mean just letting them know that the only way you will continue making accommodations for their OCD (and how many of us make SOME kind of accommodations, either by doing their rituals with them, or making excuses at school, etc?) is if they are working their ERP program. But don't make any boundary that you aren't willing to enforce - if your kid finds out that you bluff, the game is over! If they aren't willing to do the work to evict the OCD bully, then you shouldn't have to do the work to provide a home for that bully either. You don't have to change the towel for them every day if they aren't fighting back; you don't have to buy extra paper towels if they aren't doing exposure homework; this kind of contracting is pretty important to help the kid stay on track, and to keep the frustration level in the house to a minimum. Lack of insight is tougher, but it can be dealt with in a similar way. Sometimes getting the therapist to do some cognitive restructuring (helping the OCD sufferer to think about the OCD symptoms in a different way so that they are more willing to fight them) can be helpful. But if that isn't possible, then you can certainly let the kid know that even if SHE doesn't see why she should fight the OCD, YOU need her to in order to continue getting accommodations. Behavioral problems can be all over the map, but one of the hardest ones is Oppositional issues (like ODD). This usually breaks down to a matter of having the parents be very consistent, use lots of structure and using a reward/punishment response to behavior that, to borrow a line from a previous Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, is " swift and sure. " Very often you have to address the oppositional behaviors before you can deal with the OCD. I hope this is helpful. If there are variations of this problem on the list, please call out! Cheers, Jim Hatton > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > I'm Jim from San Diego, and I just found out my email was > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2011 Report Share Posted February 8, 2011 You are in the best support group right here! Welcome Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry Re: Hi all Hi Barb, Boy, you really put your finger right on it, huh? It very hard to deal with those kinds of qualities in anyone, be they kids, teens or other adults. And there are some things you can do, but they aren't pleasant. And I'm guessing it's one of the things that parents and spouses of people with OCd might complain about the most! Of course you want the person to get their OCD under control, because you care about them, and you can see the pain they are in (not to mention the pain YOU'RE in). And for Mom's especially, to be on the sideline watching your child suffer, and feel prevented form doing anything about it, is about the most frustrating thing there is. But one thing we have to remember is that often the person doesn't want to attack it as much as WE want them to is due in part to the fact that they are the ones feeling the anxiety that reduces their motivation, and we only feel the benefits. So we have to ask a question that sounds a lot like " how do I help my kid/spouse/family member INCREASE their motivation to do something unpleasant? We'd like to be able to offer positive reinforcement/rewards to our kids to get them motivated; sometimes that works, but especially in this current generation, our kids are so used to getting lots of things that adding one more " good " seems trivial to them. They don't get motivated by toys, money or permissions like their parents used to. When that's the case, you're only left with one alternative. And that is to make it LESS comfortable for them to stay the way they are. I call this " souring the milk. " Moving them out of their comfort zone might mean just letting them know that the only way you will continue making accommodations for their OCD (and how many of us make SOME kind of accommodations, either by doing their rituals with them, or making excuses at school, etc?) is if they are working their ERP program. But don't make any boundary that you aren't willing to enforce - if your kid finds out that you bluff, the game is over! If they aren't willing to do the work to evict the OCD bully, then you shouldn't have to do the work to provide a home for that bully either. You don't have to change the towel for them every day if they aren't fighting back; you don't have to buy extra paper towels if they aren't doing exposure homework; this kind of contracting is pretty important to help the kid stay on track, and to keep the frustration level in the house to a minimum. Lack of insight is tougher, but it can be dealt with in a similar way. Sometimes getting the therapist to do some cognitive restructuring (helping the OCD sufferer to think about the OCD symptoms in a different way so that they are more willing to fight them) can be helpful. But if that isn't possible, then you can certainly let the kid know that even if SHE doesn't see why she should fight the OCD, YOU need her to in order to continue getting accommodations. Behavioral problems can be all over the map, but one of the hardest ones is Oppositional issues (like ODD). This usually breaks down to a matter of having the parents be very consistent, use lots of structure and using a reward/punishment response to behavior that, to borrow a line from a previous Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, is " swift and sure. " Very often you have to address the oppositional behaviors before you can deal with the OCD. I hope this is helpful. If there are variations of this problem on the list, please call out! Cheers, Jim Hatton > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > I'm Jim from San Diego, and I just found out my email was > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 9, 2011 Report Share Posted February 9, 2011 Wow, Jim!! Â What GREAT info.! The only problem is...sometimes it seems like mychildren(ocd or not) have learned to play this game WAY better than I already! :0) Milissa in NC Subject: Re: Re: Hi all To: Date: Tuesday, February 8, 2011, 12:59 PM Â Bravo jim loved your post! Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry Re: Hi all Hi Barb, Boy, you really put your finger right on it, huh? It very hard to deal with those kinds of qualities in anyone, be they kids, teens or other adults. And there are some things you can do, but they aren't pleasant. And I'm guessing it's one of the things that parents and spouses of people with OCd might complain about the most! Of course you want the person to get their OCD under control, because you care about them, and you can see the pain they are in (not to mention the pain YOU'RE in). And for Mom's especially, to be on the sideline watching your child suffer, and feel prevented form doing anything about it, is about the most frustrating thing there is. But one thing we have to remember is that often the person doesn't want to attack it as much as WE want them to is due in part to the fact that they are the ones feeling the anxiety that reduces their motivation, and we only feel the benefits. So we have to ask a question that sounds a lot like " how do I help my kid/spouse/family member INCREASE their motivation to do something unpleasant? We'd like to be able to offer positive reinforcement/rewards to our kids to get them motivated; sometimes that works, but especially in this current generation, our kids are so used to getting lots of things that adding one more " good " seems trivial to them. They don't get motivated by toys, money or permissions like their parents used to. When that's the case, you're only left with one alternative. And that is to make it LESS comfortable for them to stay the way they are. I call this " souring the milk. " Moving them out of their comfort zone might mean just letting them know that the only way you will continue making accommodations for their OCD (and how many of us make SOME kind of accommodations, either by doing their rituals with them, or making excuses at school, etc?) is if they are working their ERP program. But don't make any boundary that you aren't willing to enforce - if your kid finds out that you bluff, the game is over! If they aren't willing to do the work to evict the OCD bully, then you shouldn't have to do the work to provide a home for that bully either. You don't have to change the towel for them every day if they aren't fighting back; you don't have to buy extra paper towels if they aren't doing exposure homework; this kind of contracting is pretty important to help the kid stay on track, and to keep the frustration level in the house to a minimum. Lack of insight is tougher, but it can be dealt with in a similar way. Sometimes getting the therapist to do some cognitive restructuring (helping the OCD sufferer to think about the OCD symptoms in a different way so that they are more willing to fight them) can be helpful. But if that isn't possible, then you can certainly let the kid know that even if SHE doesn't see why she should fight the OCD, YOU need her to in order to continue getting accommodations. Behavioral problems can be all over the map, but one of the hardest ones is Oppositional issues (like ODD). This usually breaks down to a matter of having the parents be very consistent, use lots of structure and using a reward/punishment response to behavior that, to borrow a line from a previous Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, is " swift and sure. " Very often you have to address the oppositional behaviors before you can deal with the OCD. I hope this is helpful. If there are variations of this problem on the list, please call out! Cheers, Jim Hatton > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > I'm Jim from San Diego, and I just found out my email was > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 9, 2011 Report Share Posted February 9, 2011 Thanks Milissa, For those of you dealing with teens and tweens, there's a great book on the struggle they have to individuate (become independent while still needing your support and guidance). It's also full of great information about teens. The title says it all: " Get Out of My Life! (But first, can you drive me and Cheryl to the mall?) " Remember that you're the Mom (or Dad), and that 'Because I'm the Mom " is all the reason they need. They might WANT more, but that doesn't mean you have to give it to them! Cheers, Jim > > > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > > > I'm Jim from San Diego, and I just found out my email was > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 9, 2011 Report Share Posted February 9, 2011 Thanks for the book recommendation, Jim. My teen is at that point. . Pushing me away, while trying to be semi-independent, yet needy at the same time. It's a hard line to walk, trying to figure out how much to help while trying to keep them stable, yet not enabling the OCD. I also have a hard time, at times, figuring out if it's teen behavior, OCD, or both. It can be complicated. Very much appreciate your input. BJ > > Thanks Milissa, > > For those of you dealing with teens and tweens, there's a great book on the struggle they have to individuate (become independent while still needing your support and guidance). It's also full of great information about teens. The title says it all: > > " Get Out of My Life! (But first, can you drive me and Cheryl to the mall?) " > > Remember that you're the Mom (or Dad), and that 'Because I'm the Mom " is all the reason they need. They might WANT more, but that doesn't mean you have to give it to them! > > Cheers, > > Jim > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 9, 2011 Report Share Posted February 9, 2011 HI, Jim! The book SOUNDS perfect! & I find myself laughing hilariously at the title! I'm looking to order it on line just now,and I'm having a hard time finding it..Do you know the author?By the way, My 16 yr old was reading over my shoulder as I was going over your last of posts,...and she made the off-handed comment, " he sounds like a kids' worse nightmare! " ----LOL  :0) Milissa in NC  2/9/11, drhatocd wrote: Subject: Re: Hi all To: Date: Wednesday, February 9, 2011, 8:51 PM Thanks Milissa, For those of you dealing with teens and tweens, there's a great book on the struggle they have to individuate (become independent while still needing your support and guidance). It's also full of great information about teens. The title says it all: " Get Out of My Life! (But first, can you drive me and Cheryl to the mall?) " Remember that you're the Mom (or Dad), and that 'Because I'm the Mom " is all the reason they need. They might WANT more, but that doesn't mean you have to give it to them! Cheers, Jim > > > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > > > I'm Jim from San Diego, and I just found out my email was > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 9, 2011 Report Share Posted February 9, 2011 Milissa, I found this title: Get Out of My Life, but First Could You Drive Me and Cheryl to the Mall?: A Parent's Guide to the New Teenager by E. Wolf Quick search had it at & Noble and Amazon. > > > > > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > > > > > I'm Jim from San Diego, and I just found out my email was > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 10, 2011 Report Share Posted February 10, 2011 As a parent of two 15-year-olds and a 12-year-old, I found this book to be extremely helpful. It really helped me to understand what is going on in my girls' heads, and it gives great information on how to respond to different situations. I highly recommend it. Easy to read, not overwhelming. in Canada > > Milissa, I found this title: > > Get Out of My Life, but First Could You Drive Me and Cheryl to the Mall?: A Parent's Guide to the New Teenager > by E. Wolf > > Quick search had it at & Noble and Amazon. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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