Re: Ask Dr. Geller - BJ....my $0.2--BONNIE

[Guest guest]

Hi Bonnie,

I've only been skimming posts recently because I'm being stretched too

thin by everything! Anyway, I have a 15 yr. old that is a vomit phobe

OCD'er (diagnosed at 7) and we heard the bipolar thing also. In fact,

her pdoc insisted that we put her on lithium or she would stop treating

her. That lasted a month and nothing changed. I knew she didn't have

bipolar. What she had was OCD thought continually in her head about

vomiting that caused her anxiety to be through the roof and unable to

eat. She also started bolting from the classroom and following me

everywhere at home. She was so afraid of vomiting. Anyway, let me know

if you have any questions--we've been through this for 8 years and she's

doing really well on Prozac currently. (That's always something we have

to tweak occasionally.)

Dina

[Guest guest]

Thanks for you response. responded well to Prozac for a while, but then

later in the year had some kind of agitated depresion that was really difficult

to manage and he had to go off it. He is doing a fraction better on Depakote

just this week, but still very anxious. Not sure what is next. Last night I

was playing a board game with him and he told me that he often has these

aggressive thoughts that he will hurt someone and he gets really nervous about

it. I asked what he does to get rid of those thoughts and he says that he holds

his hamds or tries to do some kind of activity to get his mind off it. Doesn't

sound bipolar to me. I'm just not sure...could be both. Hospitalization has

never solved it either...they just blame me or biology and tell me to keep doing

what I'm doing (that obviously hasn't helped).

Bonnie

Bonnie

>

> Hi Bonnie,

>

> I've only been skimming posts recently because I'm being stretched too

> thin by everything! Anyway, I have a 15 yr. old that is a vomit phobe

> OCD'er (diagnosed at 7) and we heard the bipolar thing also. In fact,

> her pdoc insisted that we put her on lithium or she would stop treating

> her. That lasted a month and nothing changed. I knew she didn't have

> bipolar. What she had was OCD thought continually in her head about

> vomiting that caused her anxiety to be through the roof and unable to

> eat. She also started bolting from the classroom and following me

> everywhere at home. She was so afraid of vomiting. Anyway, let me know

> if you have any questions--we've been through this for 8 years and she's

> doing really well on Prozac currently. (That's always something we have

> to tweak occasionally.)

>

> Dina

>

[Guest guest]

Bonnie, what you mention here doesn't sound bipolar at all to me. The aggressive

thoughts, especially making him feel anxious, can absolutely be part of OCD. Why

does the pdoc think he is bipolar? Have you gotten a 2nd opinion? Stormy

________________________________

To:

Sent: Sat, October 30, 2010 8:40:48 AM

Subject: Re: Ask Dr. Geller - BJ....my $0.2--BONNIE

Thanks for you response. responded well to Prozac for a while, but then

later in the year had some kind of agitated depresion that was really difficult

to manage and he had to go off it. He is doing a fraction better on Depakote

just this week, but still very anxious. Not sure what is next. Last night I

was playing a board game with him and he told me that he often has these

aggressive thoughts that he will hurt someone and he gets really nervous about

it. I asked what he does to get rid of those thoughts and he says that he holds

his hamds or tries to do some kind of activity to get his mind off it. Doesn't

sound bipolar to me. I'm just not sure...could be both. Hospitalization has

never solved it either...they just blame me or biology and tell me to keep doing

what I'm doing (that obviously hasn't helped).

Bonnie

Bonnie

>

> Hi Bonnie,

>

> I've only been skimming posts recently because I'm being stretched too

> thin by everything! Anyway, I have a 15 yr. old that is a vomit phobe

> OCD'er (diagnosed at 7) and we heard the bipolar thing also. In fact,

> her pdoc insisted that we put her on lithium or she would stop treating

> her. That lasted a month and nothing changed. I knew she didn't have

> bipolar. What she had was OCD thought continually in her head about

> vomiting that caused her anxiety to be through the roof and unable to

> eat. She also started bolting from the classroom and following me

> everywhere at home. She was so afraid of vomiting. Anyway, let me know

> if you have any questions--we've been through this for 8 years and she's

> doing really well on Prozac currently. (That's always something we have

> to tweak occasionally.)

>

> Dina

>

[Guest guest]

I have some Ativan and it didn't help much so I gave him 2 once the other day

(total of 1 mg) and he got really weird on it....hyper and was saying things

like " I'm not sure where I am " (he was at home) or " I don't feel like I'm here "

(depersonaliation/dissociation????) - he was almost activate on it. I got a

letter from his old therapist today who moved to another state last spring. She

told me to call anytime and let her know how he was doing.... maybe she could

just answer some questions for me? I wish I knew of a program where they would

take a day - even an afternoon for example and observe him. Not sure I would

hospitalize him again. It's bad enough to see him suffer, but to know he was

suffering in a place where he didn't get comfort/medicine when he was afraid is

just too much to ask of him and me.

I don't think he'll go out for candy tomorrow. I get so angry at the world when

I think about how much he's missed and how he has been robbed of the things even

I loved as a child. Mental illness is so cruel.

Bonnie

> >

> > Thanks for you response. responded well to Prozac for a while, but

then later in the year had some kind of agitated depresion that was really

difficult to manage and he had to go off it. He is doing a fraction better on

Depakote just this week, but still very anxious. Not sure what is next. Last

night I was playing a board game with him and he told me that he often has these

aggressive thoughts that he will hurt someone and he gets really nervous about

it. I asked what he does to get rid of those thoughts and he says that he holds

his hamds or tries to do some kind of activity to get his mind off it. Doesn't

sound bipolar to me. I'm just not sure...could be both. Hospitalization has

never solved it either...they just blame me or biology and tell me to keep doing

what I'm doing (that obviously hasn't helped).

> >

> > Bonnie

> >

> > Bonnie

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I am thinking about day hospitalization, but I have to find a place where

they're good at anxiety and not just interested in stabilizing (zoning them out

on meds or taking them off everything). That's the hard part. I am also

thinking about homebound studies. His school has been very good this year, ut

he can't seem to get anything done right now - just paces and cries and panics.

I have been getting him to do work bits at a time so he's not too far behind.

Bonnie

> >

> > I have some Ativan and it didn't help much so I gave him 2 once the other

day (total of 1 mg) and he got really weird on it....hyper and was saying things

like " I'm not sure where I am " (he was at home) or " I don't feel like I'm here "

(depersonaliation/dissociation????) - he was almost activate on it. I got a

letter from his old therapist today who moved to another state last spring. She

told me to call anytime and let her know how he was doing.... maybe she could

just answer some questions for me? I wish I knew of a program where they would

take a day - even an afternoon for example and observe him. Not sure I would

hospitalize him again. It's bad enough to see him suffer, but to know he was

suffering in a place where he didn't get comfort/medicine when he was afraid is

just too much to ask of him and me.

> >

> > I don't think he'll go out for candy tomorrow. I get so angry at the world

when I think about how much he's missed and how he has been robbed of the things

even I loved as a child. Mental illness is so cruel.

> >

> > Bonnie

> >

> > -

>

[Guest guest]

He has had episodes of being irritable and aggressive and these bouts always

start with anxiety. He acts like he has a kind of agitated depression

sometimes. Meanwhile, the pdoc says bipolar ilness begins with anxiety and

begins treating that. He's going on the notion that because he was hospitalized

on SSRI's, that he is bipolar. I know there is some evidence that points to

that, but I am starting to think that since he was also on benzo's and

antipsychotics, perhaps that wasn't the case. He was hospitalized when he

wasn't on SSRI's either. I think that he is extremely sensitive to meds and so

when his symptoms begin, the pdoc increses the antipsychotics or mood

stabilizers and he gets worse. He has been hospitalized on mood stabilizers and

SSRI's given with AP's. The only reason he hasn't been hospitalized since he

was 9 is because I have learned to manage his behavior or understand it rather

than have him committed.

We tried Zoloft and he was more anxious, but those are out of his system now.

He is more anxious than ever off the Zoloft. I think he was already headed

toward a breakdown (ever increasing anxiety), perhaps he should've stayed on the

Zoloft. His doctor felt that the SSRI was aggravating him, but if that's the

case, then I am wondering why he can't even get through a tv show in his own

family room without panic....I just don't know.

Bonnie

> >

> > Hi Bonnie,

> >

> > I've only been skimming posts recently because I'm being stretched too

> > thin by everything! Anyway, I have a 15 yr. old that is a vomit phobe

> > OCD'er (diagnosed at 7) and we heard the bipolar thing also. In fact,

> > her pdoc insisted that we put her on lithium or she would stop treating

> > her. That lasted a month and nothing changed. I knew she didn't have

> > bipolar. What she had was OCD thought continually in her head about

> > vomiting that caused her anxiety to be through the roof and unable to

> > eat. She also started bolting from the classroom and following me

> > everywhere at home. She was so afraid of vomiting. Anyway, let me know

> > if you have any questions--we've been through this for 8 years and she's

> > doing really well on Prozac currently. (That's always something we have

> > to tweak occasionally.)

> >

> > Dina

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Bonnie, are you saying that the bipolar symptoms have always been while on meds?

My dd'spdoc actually wouldn't diagnose her with bipolar originally because he

said you have to be off of SSRIs for 6 months and then have a bipolar episode

before they can be diagnosed. My dd really is bipolar but she was not officially

diagnosed until she became manic after SSRIs were completely gone for that

length of time. People do react to meds that are not bipolar but look that way

due to the med reaction. I am curious about the pdoc saying bipolar begins with

anxiety. I have never heard that. My dd has always had anxiety issues but I have

always heard it is depression that precedes bipolar, which was also true for my

dd. Again, the depression can't be a reaction to meds. Stormy

________________________________

To:

Sent: Sat, October 30, 2010 4:48:18 PM

Subject: Re: Ask Dr. Geller - BJ....my $0.2--BONNIE

He has had episodes of being irritable and aggressive and these bouts always

start with anxiety. He acts like he has a kind of agitated depression

sometimes. Meanwhile, the pdoc says bipolar ilness begins with anxiety and

begins treating that. He's going on the notion that because he was hospitalized

on SSRI's, that he is bipolar. I know there is some evidence that points to

that, but I am starting to think that since he was also on benzo's and

antipsychotics, perhaps that wasn't the case. He was hospitalized when he

wasn't on SSRI's either. I think that he is extremely sensitive to meds and so

when his symptoms begin, the pdocincreses the antipsychotics or mood stabilizers

and he gets worse. He has been hospitalized on mood stabilizers and SSRI's

given with AP's. The only reason he hasn't been hospitalized since he was 9 is

because I have learned to manage his behavior or understand it rather than have

him committed.

We tried Zoloft and he was more anxious, but those are out of his system now.

He is more anxious than ever off the Zoloft. I think he was already headed

toward a breakdown (ever increasing anxiety), perhaps he should've stayed on the

Zoloft. His doctor felt that the SSRI was aggravating him, but if that's the

case, then I am wondering why he can't even get through a tv show in his own

family room without panic....I just don't know.

Bonnie

>

> Bonnie, what you mention here doesn't sound bipolar at all to me. The

>aggressive

>

> thoughts, especially making him feel anxious, can absolutely be part of OCD.

>Why

>

> does the pdoc think he is bipolar? Have you gotten a 2nd opinion? Stormy

[Guest guest]

I have been told by other doctors that he either is activated by SSRI's or has a

bipolar disorder (no one in the fam has it though). Our doctor thinks it's

bipolar. My position is that regardless of whether he has depression (who

wouldn't after what he's been through) or something else, he definitely has a

distinct anxiety disorder as well and it may be that one thing drives the other,

but there have been no mood stabilizers that help and that kind of tells me that

that is because it isn't a mood disorder primarily. I do want a second opinion,

but I have to find someone good else, I'm in the same boat.

Bonnie

> >

> > Bonnie, what you mention here doesn't sound bipolar at all to me. The

> >aggressive

> >

> > thoughts, especially making him feel anxious, can absolutely be part of OCD.

> >Why

> >

> > does the pdoc think he is bipolar? Have you gotten a 2nd opinion? Stormy

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I am considering an anxiety clinic, but that would be NYC and I can barely get

him out the door. I am going to look into it further this week.

Bonnie