Guest guest Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 Ed, If you're getting too much whey with tough curds, then you are letting the yogurt culture for too long a time. This has happened to me. To fix it, I just watched it more closely and took it out of the warmth sooner, like a few hours sooner...I got a nice smooth gel, like store-bought yogurt. Does this seem like the problem? D. > > My family is threatening a mutiny if I don't figure out how to > consistently make decent yogurt. > > I'm using a large cooler filled with hot water (at the temps called for > in the cultures I'm using). I culture the yogurt from raw Jersey milk > in half gallon mason jars. I keep getting fairly thin and runny > yogurt. The cultures are from the dairy connection. > > Any help is appreciated. Yogurt is a mainstay in our diet (1 to 2 > gallons a week, more in the summer) and I really want to sort this one out. > > Thank you, > > Ed in NJ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 > > Ed, > If you're getting too much whey with tough curds, then you are letting > the yogurt culture for too long a time. > Does this seem like the problem? The excessive whey/tough curd problem was one we had in the past, but not what's happening now (switching to the new cultures helped with this). We're getting yogurt now that is just to thin and runny. It's more like a drink than a firm yogurt. Not a terrible thing, but not exactly what we want. I've read that powdered milk can help, but we're really tring to make as " pure " a porduct here as possible. Does adding extra culture help develop a fimer yogurt? Ed > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 17, 2006 Report Share Posted April 17, 2006 I think adding extra culture would definitely be worth a try. It is the bacteria that cause the yogurt to gel up, and if there's not enough bacteria, either from lack of time or warmth or starter culture, then yes, I could see the end result being runny. It's almost like it hasn't had enough time for all the bacteria to grow properly. Runny yogurt is what you get a the beginning of the erment cycle....then it thickens as time goes on. IOW, if you took the yogurt out after saym aabout 4 hours of fermenting, it would be runny. But if you let the cultures grow, you work more toward a thicker product. Make sense? D. > > The excessive whey/tough curd problem was one we had in the past, but > not what's happening now (switching to the new cultures helped with > this). We're getting yogurt now that is just to thin and runny. It's > more like a drink than a firm yogurt. Not a terrible thing, but not > exactly what we want. I've read that powdered milk can help, but > we're really tring to make as " pure " a porduct here as possible. > > Does adding extra culture help develop a fimer yogurt? > > Ed > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2006 Report Share Posted April 18, 2006 Hi Ed, Well in my Laurel's Kitchen Recipes-she suggest using non-instant milk powder. Fresh milk makes tender yogurt; if you want it firmer, blend in 2 tablespoons of milk powder along with along with the starter. Regular instant milk powder is tricky for making yogurt. Scald and cool it to 120F beforehand. Gently in a double boiler is best. Keep warm between 90o to 120oF not above. Excerpts from her book. You can leave it a bit longer to set also, but watch and taste as to how sour you want it.-Audrey Snippet> > in half gallon mason jars. I keep getting fairly thin and runny > yogurt. The cultures are from the dairy connection. > > Any help is appreciated. Yogurt is a mainstay in our diet (1 to 2 > gallons a week, more in the summer) and I really want to sort this one out. > > Thank you, > > Ed in NJ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2006 Report Share Posted April 18, 2006 Ed, We have dealt with the same problem. In fact we have learned that we can not make a firm yogurt with our raw Jersey milk no matter what method or cultures we use unless we heat the milk to 120 before we make the yogurt.This method makes perfect yogurt. I suspect that there is a bacteria in the milk that messes with the culture (or maybe an enzyme...not a scientist here) that dies at 120 degrees. I have resigned myself, but not completely. I just ordered a new type of culture from cheesemakers and I'll try again. Tina in TX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2006 Report Share Posted April 18, 2006 I am a biologist but not an expert. Here is what I have learned regarding yogurt. In order for the packaged cultures to work at their best all other "wild" bacteria must be eliminated. In order to do this you must heat the milk to 180 degrees Fahrenheit. I know its horrible. Don't beat up the messenger! LOL The various bacilli that make the yogurt will happily grow and make babies if you then cool the milk to 112 F and add them into this bacteria heaven and keep it at this temperature for 4 to 6 hours. However, if you don't want to heat the milk here is what I do with runny yogurt. I use an natural, unbleached coffee filter (fine muslin, cheese cloth, etc.) and a gravity cone shaped drip coffee maker to drain the excess liquid off the yogurt. The longer it drains, the firmer it gets. I make quark cheese this way too, using cultured cream. Enjoy. Ercilia Tina lin wrote: Ed, We have dealt with the same problem. In fact we have learned that we can not make a firm yogurt with our raw Jersey milk no matter what method or cultures we use unless we heat the milk to 120 before we make the yogurt.This method makes perfect yogurt. I suspect that there is a bacteria in the milk that messes with the culture (or maybe an enzyme...not a scientist here) that dies at 120 degrees. I have resigned myself, but not completely. I just ordered a new type of culture from cheesemakers and I'll try again. Tina in TX PLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING! Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/ Archive search: http://onibasu.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2006 Report Share Posted April 18, 2006 Thank you for all of the help on this one. I'll try of few of the suggestions and " report back. " I don't actually mind the runny yogurt myself. We pack it in quart containers with sip tops and take it to the NJ beach all summer long. It provides the main nourishment for my kids all day as we play and fish. it's only a problem when they are at home and want a nice thick eating type yogurt at breakfast. Ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2006 Report Share Posted April 18, 2006 a friend of mine adds gelatin to make her yogurt thicker. add it when you make the yogurt. I don't know the amount to add. > > My family is threatening a mutiny if I don't figure out how to > consistently make decent yogurt. > > I'm using a large cooler filled with hot water (at the temps called for > in the cultures I'm using). I culture the yogurt from raw Jersey milk > in half gallon mason jars. I keep getting fairly thin and runny > yogurt. The cultures are from the dairy connection. > > Any help is appreciated. Yogurt is a mainstay in our diet (1 to 2 > gallons a week, more in the summer) and I really want to sort this one out. > > Thank you, > > Ed in NJ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 18, 2006 Report Share Posted April 18, 2006 I guess that's another reason why I love my Nigerian Dwarf goats - thicker yogurt, naturally - and RAW! : ) Shery Re: Runny Yogurt Ed,We have dealt with the same problem. In fact we have learned that we can not make a firm yogurt with our raw Jersey milk no matter what method or cultures we use unless we heat the milk to 120 before we make the yogurt.This method makes perfect yogurt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2006 Report Share Posted April 19, 2006 Actualy read in Laurel's Kitchen that it is between 90o-120o degrees to be heated and not above. Reads excerpt; But yogurt made from fresh milk is delicious. %o make low-fat or whole milk yogurt, use the same recipe, but scald the milk and cool it to 120oF beforehand. Heat the milk gently because scorching spoils the flavor; a double boiler is best, if you hace one. Fresh milk makes tender yogurt; if you want it firmer, blend in 2 tablespoons of milk powder along with the starter. Plus the note I posted about non instant. I have yet to try the milk powder myself since I just purchased some recently. But find it interesting about the types of cow's for uses. -Audrey <snippet> > cultures we use unless we heat the milk to 120 before we make the > yogurt.This method makes perfect yogurt. > > > Tina in TX > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 19, 2006 Report Share Posted April 19, 2006 Yogurt is runny. For some reason the companies started putting gelatin in it to make it firmer, but the nature of the natural beast is runny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2006 Report Share Posted April 20, 2006 ,Sally Fallon has an informative article differentiating between the 3 types of enzymes which include wet and dry. I think that's probably a key to confusion that most people have over enzymes, is they don't differentiate between wet and dry which are affected by different temperatures: " Enzyme research has revealed the importance of raw foods in the diet. The enzymes in raw food help start the process of digestion and reduce the body's need to produce digestive enzymes. All enzymes are deactivated at a wet-heat temperature of 118 degrees Fahrenheit, and a dry-heat temperature of about 150 degrees. It is one of those happy designs of nature that foods and liquid at 117 degrees can be touched without pain, but liquids over 118 degrees will burn. Thus we have a built-in mechanism for determining whether or not the food we are eating still contains its enzyme content. " http://www.realmilk.com/enzyme.htmlWhen referring to " dry " , think in terms of a dehydrator, or dehydrating foods. " Wet " would refer to heating milk/liquids. As far as killing the enzymes in yogurt, I think someone pointed out earlier that it isn't necessarily the enzymes that are vital to preserve, but instead, you're trying to obtain a fermented food that is higher in beneficial bacteria that wouldn't otherwise be available. It's all about what your goal or purpose is. Personally, we find kefir to be a better alternative to kefir - it doesn't require heat and has a number of additional beneficial bacteria and yeast. HTH. Sharon, NH Someone in a previous post suggested heating the milk to 120 degress before making yogurt. Would this kill the enzymes? I'd like to keep those, but I do want thicker yogurt. I've heard the the dear little enzymes die at 118 degrees, but it seems that there are varying opinions. Could anyone shed some light on this subject? Thanks, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2006 Report Share Posted April 20, 2006 Well, yes...sort of. Breeds of goats are divided into two catagories, meat and dairy, just like cows. Two well known meat goats, for example, are Boers and Kikos. They are heavily muscled with a high percentage of their body weight devoted to muscle (meat). Dairy breeds are Nubians, Alpines, Toggenburgs, Saanens, and a couple of others that escape me at the moment. There are 6 breeds total recognized by the ADGA (American Dairy Goat Assn). Within those breeds, there are one or two that are considered " dual purpose " , that is mainly dairy but with enough meat to be considered a meat goat as well. Nubians are one of those. Among the dairy breeds, some have a richer milk, higher in butterfat, and some are considered high producers. Unfortunately, the two don't mix. Saanens are very high producers, sometimes rivaling mid sized cows in the amount of milk thay give, but their butterfat is low, resulting in a low yeild per gallon of milk of things that need a lot of milk solids like cheese, butter, and yogurt. Other dairy breeds produce a milk that is high in milk solids (butterfat) but these breeds typically are low producers. Nubians are a prime example...they give, in my opinion, the best, richest, creamiest milk you will find, but rarely produce a gallon a day. Their milk produces fantastic cheese and yogurt, but you aren't going to have much milk to work with. I keep a mix of Alpines (high producer, low milk solids), Toggenburgs (medium producer, medium milk solids), and Nubians (low volume but VERY high milk solids) in my herd, resulting in a rich, creamy milk that is good for cheese, yogurt, kefir, etc. There...did I confuse you enough? Bob Hayles Thornberry Village Homestead Jasper, GA 706/692-7004 farm 404/824-5099 cell Thornberry Village Homestead...owned by God, managed by Bob and Helen. Don't tell God how big the storm is. Instead, tell the storm how big your God is. > > Did I read that certain goats are for certain things? milk, meat, > yogurt? > -Adurey > > > <snippet> > > I guess that's another reason why I love my Nigerian Dwarf goats - > thicker yogurt, naturally - and RAW! : ) Shery > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2006 Report Share Posted April 20, 2006 Have you tried not using a culture from a box and using raw plain yogurt from the grocery store shelf as your culture. One tablespoon yogurt per gallon of yogurt to be made. > My family is threatening a mutiny if I don't figure out how to > consistently make decent yogurt. > > I'm using a large cooler filled with hot water (at the temps called for > in the cultures I'm using). I culture the yogurt from raw Jersey milk > in half gallon mason jars. I keep getting fairly thin and runny > yogurt. The cultures are from the dairy connection. > > Any help is appreciated. Yogurt is a mainstay in our diet (1 to 2 > gallons a week, more in the summer) and I really want to sort this one out. > > Thank you, > > Ed in NJ > > > PLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING! > Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information! > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/ > > Archive search: http://onibasu.com > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2006 Report Share Posted April 20, 2006 some of the best "yogurt" I have made is done by letting the milk heated to 72 degrees Farenheit sit on the counter, covered stock pot, till it clabbers. When it is thick I take off as much of it as yogurt that my children want and the rest I use to make cottage cheese. If we want it a bit thicker I let it sit in a butter muslin cheesecloth till enough whey drains out to make it the consistency they want. No expense of starters etc and the family really likes it. I have even let it sit long enough to use it as cream cheese. Debbie ChikouskyManitoba, Canadagdchik@...http://www.winnipegbeach.com/chikouskyfarms/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2006 Report Share Posted April 20, 2006 Hi, Debbie...Cow or goat milk? Probably wouldn't matter, eh? Sounds like a wonderful, healthy method. SharonOn 4/20/06, & Debbie Chikousky wrote: some of the best " yogurt " I have made is done by letting the milk heated to 72 degrees Farenheit sit on the counter, covered stock pot, till it clabbers. When it is thick I take off as much of it as yogurt that my children want and the rest I use to make cottage cheese. If we want it a bit thicker I let it sit in a butter muslin cheesecloth till enough whey drains out to make it the consistency they want. No expense of starters etc and the family really likes it. I have even let it sit long enough to use it as cream cheese. Debbie ChikouskyManitoba, Canadagdchik@... http://www.winnipegbeach.com/chikouskyfarms/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 20, 2006 Report Share Posted April 20, 2006 Actually cow is thicker than goat. That is why I took to straining off some of the whey. I haven't been able to successfully make a good cottage cheese with goat it always stays a bit on the creamy ricotta side. We don't care. My herd of locusts gobble it up anyway. I was baking bread today, not NT style though , but I used the whey from a batch of cooked cottage cheese in it to boost the minerals etc. Children said it makes it softer. Debbie ChikouskyManitoba, Canadagdchik@...http://www.winnipegbeach.com/chikouskyfarms/ Re: Runny Yogurt Hi, Debbie...Cow or goat milk? Probably wouldn't matter, eh? Sounds like a wonderful, healthy method. Sharon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.