Re: Re: revealing details here

[Guest guest]

It is wonderful that there are so many resources

available now for people like us. I am happy to be on

this list, but I think I will feel more comfortable

getting into the details on a restricted list. But I

will post here about feelings and general ideas.

I already signed up for the oasis4 list and hope it

will be active. Smaller is better for me anyway. I

wouldn't have time to read posts from a list with 70

messages a day. Wow!

Joy

--- Edith wrote:

> Joy wrote:

>

> <<

> I have to admit I get nervous about sharing alot of

> specific details on

> this list. I admire people who go as far as quoting

> interactions.

>

> What if he ever saw these posts? Or what if someone

> who knows us is

> subscribed? I'm not usually a paranoid type of

> person, but for some

> reason this makes me nervous.

> >>

>

> Hi Joy and our other Newbies,

>

> Joy's post reminds me of myself almost six years ago

> when I first went

> on the Internet and found Randi's NonBP email

> support list with a dozen

> NonBPs on board (now there are over 1,000)! There

> were no books then

> titled _Stop Walking On Eggshells_ or _Understanding

> The Borderline

> Mother_. It was a slow painful journey for me since

> then to learn to

> trust others and to recognize and work on ridding

> myself of my BPD

> 'fleas'. My BPD/NPD nada had already been deceased

> for a decade but she

> was still living rent-free in my head. Plus I was

> hypervigilant and had

> PTSD.

>

> What Joy is feeling/expressing is a normal response

> for a newbie KO on

> one of these *open* lists. We KOs have been

> controlled from our earliest

> days by our BPD parent by FOG (Fear, Obligation, and

> Guilt). We

> encourage listmembers here to get a free email box

> under an anonymous

> name from Yahoo.com or Hotmail.com and to also join

> one of our closed

> lists.

>

> Besides ModOasis, NonBP-oasis, WTOsibling, and

> NOnBP-sibling (our open

> 'platform' lists that newbies land on), we also have

> closed (restricted

> membership) lists for those with BPD mothers, for

> those with BPD

> fathers, and for those with BPD siblings. Our

> restricted membership

> lists have numbers after them -- ie:

> NonBP-oasis2

> NonBP-oasis3

> NonBP-oasis4

> NonBP-sibling2

> NonBP-sibling3

>

> We also have other closed Oasis lists that KOs have

> been active on for

> several years -- and that listmembers are still

> posting to at the rate

> of 70 posts/day! These lists have been lifesavers.

> Those who are active

> posters are the ones who profit the most from being

> on these lists.

>

> Also, there have been meetings of KOs in Texas

> (1998), Wisconsin (1999)

> and Austin, TX (2000). We'd hoped to have a meeting

> in PA this past

> October but the 911 'happening' wiped out those

> plans. Maybe next year

> we'll have a meeting in Ohio or Indiana -- somewhere

> more centrally

> located, within driving distance or accessible by

> train.

>

> ModOasis is a very active list and we encourage

> participation here for

> those who are ready but the list that Joy, for

> example, would probably

> feel safer/more comfortable posting on is our

> NonBP-oasis4 list (for

> those with BPD fathers). The membership on that list

> is still low (five

> listmembers at present) but I'd like to invite Joy

> and any other KOs out

> there with a BPD father to join that list. I also

> invite those with a

> BPD mother to join one of our other restricted

> membership lists. Info on

> how to join those lists is in the ModOasis archives

> at:

> http://www.yahoogroups.com/group/ModOasis

> or write to me at my email box, below.

>

> Cheers,

>

> Edith

> - Moderator

> PsyProf@...

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Kathleen, thanks for sharing how your attitude toward

this has evolved over time. It is very inspiring to

hear how others have grown.

I am already not using my real name. My ID expresses

my commitment to respecting myself. It's a kind of

affirmation - I will respect me.

Joy

--- thanksforthisday

wrote:

> when I found this main list, I signed up under a new

> secret name

> " mizwho " and signed it that way too.

>

> After a little while, I felt comfortable enough to

> sign in as

> Kathleen, which is my real name,

>

> after feeling a little more comfortable, I signed in

> as this

> ID...figured a sign in name like " thanksforthisday "

> would help me

> be grateful for the present gifts in my life.

>

> I was VERY scared to start posting, almost as if

> there were

> secret police who would report me.

>

> But gradually I've felt more and more secure and if

> there were a

> KO convention, I would love to go.

>

> If you are afraid that your father might discover

> you, then change

> details and change your name. Anonymity gives you

> freedom.

>

> There is still a little voice that still tells me

> that I will be

> " discovered " but then I think rationally about it

> and say, " So

> What? " . Everything I've posted is true.

>

> Kathleen

>

> -- In ModOasis@y..., Joy <iwillrespectme@y...>

> wrote:

> > I have to admit I get nervous about sharing alot

> of

> > specific details on this list. I admire people

> who go

> > as far as quoting interactions.

> >

> > What if he ever saw these posts? Or what if

> someone

> > who knows us is subscribed? I'm not usually a

> > paranoid type of person, but for some reason this

> > makes me nervous.

> >

> > Joy

> >

> >

> __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

Cyndie,

Thanks for sharing your thoughts about this. It's all

helpful.

Since this is the first time in my life I am starting

to really speak about this, I will try not to be hard

on myself for feeling scared.

Joy

--- Cyndie McCoy wrote:

>

> --- thanksforthisday

> wrote:

> >

> > There is still a little voice that still tells me

> > that I will be

> > " discovered " but then I think rationally about it

> > and say, " So

> > What? " . Everything I've posted is true.

>

> And the more you post the more confidence and

> insight

> you gain into everything that is troubling you *and*

> causing you this fear.

>

> I had those initial feelings, " What if my FOO

> discovers me through what I post? " I was nervous as

> heck posting about my brother & SIL. I could change

> my

> name, (which I have,) I could change theirs - but I

> can't change the details. They speak for themselves.

> I

> mean who else could possibly have 3 brothers and two

> of those who have since died from AIDS?

>

> I risk being discovered. That's a risk I took and am

> glad I did. I've gained much more - lost that grip

> that fear had over me. Keeping secrets is what kept

> us

> in our pain. Telling the truth will set you free.

>

> Then for some of us, we fear being disloyal. It's

> that

> obligation and guilt thing. Are we being disloyal,

> the

> bad girl for talking about Dad this way? Shame on

> me?

> What will my father think if he knew I felt this way

> and actually told other people about him? I felt

> this

> way about my exh. So I kept his secret and it wound

> up

> eating me alive. I became isolated in my marriage.

> Couldn't have any friends that I could tell the

> truth

> to. I kept myself a virtual prisoner by keeping the

> *secrets.*

>

> Then I feared this too. What if my sibling come onto

> this list and said, " But let me tell you what *she*

> did. " Which is fine. I've got fleas, I know it. I'd

> engaged and said and done things in the throws of

> enmeshment and engagement just like anyone else who

> first comes here. So what's to discover? I've got

> nothing to hide.

>

> Then, if you find a post where you think it's a FOO

> member who's gotten through to your support network

> -

> advise the moderators.

>

> Then too, are you afraid your father will beat you

> up

> over it? Disown you? Maybe it's something you need

> anyway! Sometimes my prolonged decisions (or lack of

> making them,) have been made for me. I've been left

> w/no other choice. So what if my FOO did discover me

> here? Just gives me all the more reason to stand my

> own ground. That's it, decision done and over with.

> No

> more brother and SIL in life. Period. Accept it and

> move on...

>

> Then there are those other lists that Edith

> mentions.

> On the smaller lists it's more confidential. Of

> course

> there are risks there too. I've often found in my

> life

> that I can meet someone from thousands of miles away

> who may know someone I know. That's fine too.

> Hopefully, they are my friend and won't hurt me. If

> it

> does happen that someone would hurt me, that's a

> risk

> I took and something I'd hopefully learn some

> valuable

> lessons from. But I don't think not posting would be

> one of them.

>

> Taking the risk of posting here releases you from

> these fears. It sets you free. You learn to detach

> from all that FOG spell that you under & you don't

> care anymore. You learn to rely on yourSelf and

> stand

> firmly on your own two feet. This is a place where I

> can release my fears, distrust, and powerlessness so

> that I can go through the rest of my day feeling

> better... This where I dump and learn. From here I

> go

> out into the world and take what I have here with me

> -

> inside. It's not worn on my shirtsleeve anymore.

>

> The longer you allow your father to control you

> through fear, the longer you will remain where you

> are. Of course, you need to do what you feel

> comfortable with doing. If there's too much to risk,

> and you don't feel comfortable - that's your choice.

> Maybe take smaller risks at first. Post as

> anonomously

> as possible without devulging many details. As time

> goes by you may find that you feel that fear easing

> up.

>

> I hope I made some sense and put some of that fear

> in

> perspective.

>

> Cyndie

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

--- Joy wrote:

> Since this is the first time in my life I am

> starting

> to really speak about this, I will try not to be

> hard

> on myself for feeling scared.

First thing you do is turn off that fada tape. That's

fada talking, telling you that you are weak. You are

not weak! You are getting healthy and he doesn't like

it! It takes great strength to get healthy! Strength

and courage! He'll say things to you to at the cost of

your own well-being if it means he remains on the

pedastal of your life. The pedastal he put there.

What you're feeling is normal. I've been through it, I

think it's safe to say that when we first step on the

road of recovery, we're all scared... we're letting

out family secrets... it is a scary thing. It's scary

to get in touch with the feelings, some of them are

huge!

It's scary to *tell on* our parent/s - I mean, what if

we're wrong??? We were always told we were wrong by

our abusive parent so somewhere deep down, we're not

so sure of ourSelves b/c of it. We don't feel

comfortable about saying what we really think b/c our

nada/fada told us our thoughts were wrong... And those

high functioning people, oh boy - they really do such

a psychological job on us. It's even tougher... b/c

sometimes they appear so darned normal! Boy do we

doubt ourselves, so much so that we think it's us!

But the more knowledge you get about it, the more you

see the peices fall into place - the less scary it

becomes - the less emotionally and mentally crazy you

feel. You gain insight and things start to make sense.

You begin to see your nada/fadas crazy

rationalizations. Those are the things they say that

*try* to make sense out of something you know deep

down make no sense at all. Knowledge is flowing in as

the confusion ebbs out...

Cyndie

__________________________________________________