What do you get from public school?

[Guest guest]

I've noticed many people looking for " best school district " and I

wondered, " what are we really getting from the school that we weren't

getting before? "

I mean, my son gets " social interaction " AROUND him, but he doesn't

engage and the class is too busy to help him engage. It's easier for

a teacher to allow him to " be good " especially when all the other

children are having tantrum's, etc.

Autistic kids usually don't engage, so it's hard to believe that even

half the time, the teacher stops the busyness of the other children

to " disrupt " my quiet, withdrawn, content child. So maybe once every

30 minutes, she notices him, but on a bad day, she leaves him alone.

At least he's not causing trouble. I realize this would be a horrible

classroom situation but is it that hard to believe. I saw it happen

wth my own eyes when i visited his class.

I still don't know why i have wasted his days sitting alone,

being " good " ?

So, i'm wondering, what is the best anyone is getting at public school

for autistic kids??

I'm open to complete disagreements, but i need some evidence that it's

worth it to send him off and it's not just free babysitting (bad

babysitting).

-

[Guest guest]

I agree with the " free,bad babysitting " . I agree with you. It's not bad

teachers, it's a lack of support for teachers in place by the districts to truly

TEACH autistic kids.

What do you get from public school?

I've noticed many people looking for " best school district " and I

wondered, " what are we really getting from the school that we weren't

getting before? "

I mean, my son gets " social interaction " AROUND him, but he doesn't

engage and the class is too busy to help him engage. It's easier for

a teacher to allow him to " be good " especially when all the other

children are having tantrum's, etc.

Autistic kids usually don't engage, so it's hard to believe that even

half the time, the teacher stops the busyness of the other children

to " disrupt " my quiet, withdrawn, content child. So maybe once every

30 minutes, she notices him, but on a bad day, she leaves him alone.

At least he's not causing trouble. I realize this would be a horrible

classroom situation but is it that hard to believe. I saw it happen

wth my own eyes when i visited his class.

I still don't know why i have wasted his days sitting alone,

being " good " ?

So, i'm wondering, what is the best anyone is getting at public school

for autistic kids??

I'm open to complete disagreements, but i need some evidence that it's

worth it to send him off and it's not just free babysitting (bad

babysitting).

-

[Guest guest]

I am one to go to check on my kids any time during the day..I have on

several occasions walked by and looked in the room and saw my kid sitting

behind a

shelf with scissors cutting paper..while the other children were sitting

listening and doing there work..for hours...and the teacher did nothing..I

don't

believe she even knew my kid was there.

[Guest guest]

--

You put your finger on it!! That's why I have homeschooled my child.

What good is FAPE if it amounts to babysitting?

Personally I've come to believe it's very difficult

to really get anything done with class sizes as large as they are. ALL

chilldren and teachers would benefit from smaller class sizes--teachers

would have more time to do what they need to do, like encourage your

son. The children would get more attention and the teachers would be less

stressed. We need smaller class sizes in Texas, for everyone and for

everyone's sake. If it makes you feel any better, Texas isn't doing so

hot with typical children either--note the high drop out rate still and

comments

that high schools aren't adequately preparing kids for college.

That said, it sounds like you may need to go back to the IEPs and look

to see what social goals your son has (please tell me he has some)

and see whether they are being mastered in the classroom. Also, sounds

like he could use a little 'peer buddy' or 'circle of friends' time.

S.

What do you get from public school?

I've noticed many people looking for " best school district " and I

wondered, " what are we really getting from the school that we weren't

getting before? "

I mean, my son gets " social interaction " AROUND him, but he doesn't

engage and the class is too busy to help him engage. It's easier for

a teacher to allow him to " be good " especially when all the other

children are having tantrum's, etc.

Autistic kids usually don't engage, so it's hard to believe that even

half the time, the teacher stops the busyness of the other children

to " disrupt " my quiet, withdrawn, content child. So maybe once every

30 minutes, she notices him, but on a bad day, she leaves him alone.

At least he's not causing trouble. I realize this would be a horrible

classroom situation but is it that hard to believe. I saw it happen

wth my own eyes when i visited his class.

I still don't know why i have wasted his days sitting alone,

being " good " ?

So, i'm wondering, what is the best anyone is getting at public school

for autistic kids??

I'm open to complete disagreements, but i need some evidence that it's

worth it to send him off and it's not just free babysitting (bad

babysitting).

-

Texas Autism Advocacy

www.TexasAutismAdvocacy.org

Texas Disability Network

Calendar of Events

www.TexasAutismAdvocacy.org

[Guest guest]

Parents:

I have made the joke that the student/teacher ratio is the “hill I’m going

to die on.” I find it completely unacceptable, bordering on criminal, that

there is NOT A STATE-MANDATED teacher/student ratio for classrooms for

children with disabilities. This, when there are state-mandated ratios for

daycare (even in one’s home), preschools, etc. I CANNOT BELIEVE that this

is happening, and would like to figure out to WHOM to complain. Again, I

feel VERY STRONGLY about this issue, and it is one I would like to “take

on.”

Any comments/advice/suggestions as to how to go about getting change to

happen would be most welcomed.

Thank you,

Weber

Dallas (3 y/o ASD son in PPCD)

What do you get from public school?

I've noticed many people looking for " best school district " and I

wondered, " what are we really getting from the school that we weren't

getting before? "

I mean, my son gets " social interaction " AROUND him, but he doesn't

engage and the class is too busy to help him engage. It's easier for

a teacher to allow him to " be good " especially when all the other

children are having tantrum's, etc.

Autistic kids usually don't engage, so it's hard to believe that even

half the time, the teacher stops the busyness of the other children

to " disrupt " my quiet, withdrawn, content child. So maybe once every

30 minutes, she notices him, but on a bad day, she leaves him alone.

At least he's not causing trouble. I realize this would be a horrible

classroom situation but is it that hard to believe. I saw it happen

wth my own eyes when i visited his class.

I still don't know why i have wasted his days sitting alone,

being " good " ?

So, i'm wondering, what is the best anyone is getting at public school

for autistic kids??

I'm open to complete disagreements, but i need some evidence that it's

worth it to send him off and it's not just free babysitting (bad

babysitting).

-

Texas Autism Advocacy

www.TexasAutismAdvocacy.org

Texas Disability Network

Calendar of Events

www.TexasAutismAdvocacy.org

[Guest guest]

Wow. That message really resonanted with me. My son

used to be disengaged and ignored. As he ages, he

tries to engage perhaps too much and it is seen as

inappropriate by neurotypical adults/teachers so he's

see more as non-compliant...a behavior case. This past

school year, he was sent to in-school suspension at

least once a week...probably more but they just didn't

tell me...all because the teacher didn't know how to

deal with him or have the time (and he had an

aide...all they would do is say over and over... " come

on, finish, hurry up " ). They say they sent him to DMC

(Detention Management Center) for " cool down " time

because he wouldn't follow instructions and complete

his work in the time alloted...mind you he's only 6yo.

If he didn't remember to turn in his daily folder

(which was always in his backpack) the teacher refused

to remind him to get it out...she just expected him to

do it like all the other kids...no matter what I said.

They would tell me DMC was " working " for him because

he would go to this glorified closet (storage room

with 3-4 desks added next to all shelving units and

cabinets) and he would actually get his work done.

Duh. He was usually the only one in there and he had

one on one instruction. But, as soon as he finished

his work, he was ushered right back to his open

concept classroom with it's myriad of distractions and

stimuli.

They (meaning the school) never got it. To them, it's

all about TAKS and approval ratings. I begged and

pleaded to get him into one of the few classrooms with

walls and a door for this next year. They hem-hawed

and made excuses for months. I wound up withdrawing

him 2 1/2 weeks before the school year ended because

of an incident that proved to me that this was a bad

environment for him and he was just being pushed

through the mill (won't go into specifics but

basically they were treating him as a discipline

problem instead of working on what led to that

behavior or understanding it). It was destroying his

self-esteem and love of learning. He hated

school... " school makes me bad. " That's what he would

say every day while crying that he didn't want to go

to school. So, this year we're going to a private

school that specialized in high functioning autistics.

I'll have to make a lot of personal sacrifices to pay

for this but public just was not working for us. He

fell between the cracks because the teacher didn't

have time for him and had no patience at all.

Now, ironically, they're doing campus-wide autism

training for the whole staff...even the cafeteria

workers. Hooray. A day late and a dollar short but I'd

like to think I had something to do with that. There

kids come into contact with all kinds of staff members

who, by law, can't know that if a child is spec

ed...privacy laws...such a catch-22. So, when they see

unusual behavior, they just treat them like a bad kid

who doesn't know how to act right. I saw it firsthand.

I too would love to know where it works...IF it works.

I wish they'd just create a special campus in our

district (all districts) to make a special class for

these kids who fall between the cracks...they do it

for hearing impaired children and bilingual (and

probably others too)...why not autism? But, no, I was

told again and again that the least restrictive

environment possible was best for him and resource

just wasn't the right place for him so he had no where

to go. We have no school choice at all. So, now I will

drive across town, twice a day, 5 days a week, and pay

a fortune in tuition so he can actually learn

something and feel good about himself. OK, sorry to

vent for so long but it felt good to get it out. I'm

just grateful and hope this new school works for us or

we'll back in the public school system

again...fighting what seems like a losing battle.

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

So, it seems no one has voiced that school is GREAT. This surprises me,

not because of my own experience, but because to me school is the " sure

thing " . I mean every doctor, therapist, government official, and author

I've read says to put them in school. They can't fathom WHY I would

want to Homeschool. Funny how a day in our shoes might make a big

difference in their confident opinions.

The even funnier thing (not really) is that they are the very people I

feel so pressured by to keep my son in school. So much advice, so

little understanding.

It did sound like the Monarch school in Houston is doing a good job.

Would you tell us what they do during the day and what makes it so much

better than your 'bad school' experience???? I'd love to hear some

positive info on school (even if we could never afford that

financially); at least I'd know what everyone is so big on school for.

I think part of the pressure to go to school for many is the old " safety

in numbers " thing....like if it's bad for them, at least we're all in

the same boat. Ridiculous really, but at least we're not alone.

Me, on the other hand, I'm okay with being different, my issue is that I

like the idea of putting the responsibility in someone else's hands.

It's so easy to convince myself that someone ELSE would do better with

the child God gave ME. Of course, when I add up the reality of it, it

isn't logical or smart to pass my child off to someone who doesn't know

them, wouldn't die for them, and is treating him like a job (which he is

to the teacher). I'm reminded again that I must have faith in God's

sovereignty especially when I feel so inadequate.

So, as far as I can tell from this string of emails, it's back to the

old homeschooling plan. I'm starting with Joyce Herzog's Scaredy Cat

Reading system for my 4 year old. It's great stuff, and fun too. I

gotta work on self-discipline for me, but that seems more feasible than

fighting the school system. I could spend hours fighting it (and many of

you selfless ladies have...thank you!), but I just don't have it in me

to fight them and give my son what is best for him at the same time.

Especially since these are such critical years for him. Maybe when they

are older, I'll change the world, but for today, I'd be happy to see my

own family changed.

I'd like to pose one more question. Since going to school is clearly

not ideal for our kids, what is??? Is homeschooling??? What are the

pro's and more importantly what are the con's?? I mean, is Homeschool

really the big bad wolf???? Or maybe schooling is.....sending our kids

off the the big bad wolf....i wonder if the little " school makes me bad "

guy sees school this way?

I'd like to hear the strong opinions of those that have actually walked

in my shoes, not the confident opinions of those that influence us all,

but have NO IDEA what we are going through.

Thanks ladies,

[Guest guest]

Teachers and aids have not have the proper skills to deal with Autistic kids

Unfortunally, my son went thru a hell year (last school year) I'm afraid for

next year, he is in a different school but still public. I've being searching

for private schools that have the appropriate setting and know how to handle

Autism.However, the tuition is out of my pocket. Does my son need to suffer

because mom can't afforde a good school for him? He needs to deal with a

" mediocre public school "

Rosie

alicia_lumpkin wrote:

I've noticed many people looking for " best school district " and I

wondered, " what are we really getting from the school that we weren't

getting before? "

I mean, my son gets " social interaction " AROUND him, but he doesn't

engage and the class is too busy to help him engage. It's easier for

a teacher to allow him to " be good " especially when all the other

children are having tantrum's, etc.

Autistic kids usually don't engage, so it's hard to believe that even

half the time, the teacher stops the busyness of the other children

to " disrupt " my quiet, withdrawn, content child. So maybe once every

30 minutes, she notices him, but on a bad day, she leaves him alone.

At least he's not causing trouble. I realize this would be a horrible

classroom situation but is it that hard to believe. I saw it happen

wth my own eyes when i visited his class.

I still don't know why i have wasted his days sitting alone,

being " good " ?

So, i'm wondering, what is the best anyone is getting at public school

for autistic kids??

I'm open to complete disagreements, but i need some evidence that it's

worth it to send him off and it's not just free babysitting (bad

babysitting).

-

---------------------------------

Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates

starting at 1¢/min.

[Guest guest]

Many of our public schools attend trainings on the IDEA laws presented

by staff of the law firm Walsh, , Brown, Schulze & Aldridge P.C.

http://www.wabsa.com, TCASE www.tcase.org, and NELI (National Educator's

Law Institute - no website). Our ESCs also host trainings by Walsh,

, ... I've attended several of these " trainings " where schools

are told the least they can do without getting sued and parents of

children with disabilities are frequently the target of their jokes. I

realize they are playing to their audience, but there has to be a better

way. Both the Walsh and TCASE website's calendar of events gives good

examples of their attitudes right now.

Tonya

[Guest guest]

Thanks, Tammi for the great post on Monarch.

>

> I think the biggest difference between Monarch and our public

school

> experience is that I think these people really care about what

happens to my

> son. I truly felt that the people we dealt with in public school

would not

> have batted an eyelid if my son had dropped dead in front of them.

They were

> either magnificent actors or they were completely indifferent and

bored by

> the necessity of sitting through meetings with us. There was no

compassion,

> no concern for his wellbeing, no interest in his day-to-day

experiences in

> school -- until we started taping meetings. Then, suddenly, there

were loud

> statements into the microphone about how " we value children "

and " we're here

> to serve children. " Until the tape recorder came out no one

expressed any

> interest at all in our son. It was a revolting performance.

>

> The teacher/child ratio is excellent: two teachers and about five

therapists

> for my son's class of 4 kids last year. This next year he'll be in

a class

> of 7 or 8 with two teachers and a bunch of therapists. Plus there

are

> teacher's aides, too.

>

> They know how to handle tantrums without shaming my son or making

him feel

> that he is bad. I cannot imagine anyone we dealt with at the

public school

> having a clue about how to handle his tantrums. (Just to give you

some idea

> -- by the time he was 4 he'd broken three windows in our house and

sent his

> much older sister to urgent care; my husband calculated that we

were

> spending about $6-$7 a day repairing things he broke, sometimes

more.) The

> times the public school people had to deal with his tantrums they

seemed

> completely baffled and resorted to things like telling him he was

bad and

> all the other kids were good and he should just sit down and act

like the

> other kids; then they told us that we should talk to our son and

get him to

> behave. At one point a member of our I.E.P. " team " (what a joke)

explained

> to us that " behavior isn't really an educational issue. "

>

> At the beginning of school each morning each child puts together

his/her

> schedule for the day using pictures (and words, if that student

can do that)

> so they know what they'll be doing that day and who with.

Everything is very

> structured in that the children know what's coming and who they're

going to

> be working with but also allows space and time for individual

interests and

> expression and choice. When a child is feeling upset or just needs

to

> withdraw, they have " safe " spaces where they are allowed to do

that and then

> return to the group as they are ready. No one criticizes them for

leaving

> the group or is annoyed because now they have to have special

attention to

> catch up.

>

> They are open to new techniques and are so cooperative and helpful

that I

> have a hard time sometimes reconciling that with my previous

experience.

> It's hard to get out of the " school is the bad guy " mode after

years of it.

> It seemed every time we told the public school people what was

happening at

> home they just used that as a way to blame our son's difficulties

on our

> home environment or parenting techniques. At Monarch they want to

know

> what's happening at home so they can work on related skills in the

classroom

> or address issues in his therapy. For example, we've been having

trouble

> with our son engaging in sexually inappropriate behavior. When we

told the

> Monarch people about this they spent some time in his therapy

addressing

> this and said to let us know if this continued to be a problem and

they

> would continue to address it; not one word was said to us about

how this was

> the result of our bad parenting or inappropriate exposure to media

(there

> isn't any) or something we'd done wrong. They also didn't brush it

off as

> " just a phase " -- I can't tell you how many times I've heard " it's

just a

> phase; he'll outgrow it " from public school people (and others).

>

> They provide a daily " progress report " -- a written page or two of

notes

> about what my son experienced during the day and what he did and

how things

> went for him in each class/activity; this includes a number system

and

> written comments. They have an academic curriculum: reading, math,

science,

> etc., but it's all presented using concrete, visual methods that my

> not-good-with-abstract-concepts son can relate to. He's two or

three years

> behind grade level academically but he's made huge strides in just

one year.

>

>

> The children spend a lot of time in " play " where they think

they're having

> fun but they're also working on social skills (an area my son

sucks at),

> hand-eye coordination, muscle movement and strengthening, verbal

skills,

> etc. Parents are always welcome to come and observe what their

children are

> doing. Last year we had a therapy session once a week at the

school with the

> speech/occupational therapist and our son. This particular

therapist spent

> about two hours at the beginning of the year observing our son and

came back

> to us with an evaluation and recommended plan of treatment that

was EXACTLY

> what I'd been trying to tell the public school system he needed

for almost

> two years. She also picked up immediately on the fact that he is

NOT making

> real eye contact (he's mastered the

> look-in-the-direction-of-the-face-without-actually-looking-AT-the-

face

> technique) and that most of what people said to him he was not

responding to

> AT ALL -- something else I'd been trying to tell the public school

people

> with no success.

>

> The teachers and therapists all seem extremely patient -- more

than I am

> sometimes. They're always smiling and happy to see my son (NOT

like public

> school) and they're still smiling and happy at the end of the day.

They

> welcome him each morning with " Hi, I'm so glad to see you, we're

going to

> have a great day. " They ask us for regular progress reports on how

he's

> doing at home so if we're having a particular problem they can

coordinate

> their efforts to address it with our efforts. THEY ASK US for

input and then

> provide concrete suggestions for things to try at home that

actually make

> sense. I've NEVER had this happen in public school, except as a

fishing

> expedition for something they can blame his (or my daughter's) bad

behavior

> on.

>

> No one calls my son " weird " or " strange " or ridicules him for his

quirky

> behaviors. They don't get mad at him or ignore him. They don't

leave him

> alone if he's not on task but is being quiet. They redirect him to

something

> more appropriate.

>

> They understand completely about bolting behavior and are careful

to provide

> a safe environment. I had to threaten the public school with a

lawsuit to

> get them to provide an aide to keep track of my son during field

trips

> despite our reporting repeatedly that he was prone to bolting. I

finally

> told them " if you lose my son, I WILL sue you " while our lawyer

was sitting

> next to us. Only then did they give him an aide (and then when the

day of

> the field trip came they " forgot " to actually send an aide so I

got a

> panic-stricken phone call from his teacher who said she " just

couldn't

> handle him " after she'd told the I.E.P. team that she didn't

really think he

> needed an aide).

>

> He doesn't get sent home when there is a problem. Instead, they

call us in

> to explain what's happening and then reiterate to my son that they

care

> about him and want him to stay and work out the problem. The whole

attitude

> is " let's make this work for your son " not " let's find someone to

blame. "

>

> The other thing I like is that they use a variety of methods:

TEACH (sp?),

> ABA, RDI, music therapy, play therapy, speech therapy,

occupational therapy,

> etc. -- they're open to trying a wide range of techniques in an

effort to

> finding those that work best for each child. If they try something

and it

> doesn't help, they'll say " okay that didn't work, so let's move

not " not

> " well, this worked for the last 12 kids so it should work for your

son and

> that's the way we do it. "

>

> My son is VERY moody. There are days when he is a real pill about

going to

> school. (Of course, when there's no school he pesters us to know

when he

> gets to go to school.) He is sweet as anything one minute and the

next

> minute he is raging at you and throwing everything that comes to

hand at you

> for no apparent reason. So far, no one at school takes this

personally and

> gets insulted by his " lack of respect " (another term we've heard

from public

> school people). Instead, they help him work through his emotion,

help him

> identify and label his emotion, and help him figure out why he's

feeling

> that way and what some other ways of handling it would be.

>

> Now, I can't say that we'll always be this satisfied. Who knows

what will

> happen in the future. It's possible that things will change or

that we might

> feel at some point that a different school would be better for our

son. But

> for now I'm really impressed with what I see at the school. My son

likes

> going there, he likes the other kids and has actually formed some

> friendships (and relationships are very difficult for him), and

he's

> learning, and I feel like as his parents, we are treated like

intelligent

> human beings and good parents, instead of being treated like

morons who are

> too stupid to understand what our son needs. The attitude we

always got from

> public school people was " sit down, shut up and let your superiors

explain

> this to you, even though you are probably too dumb to understand. "

If I hear

> one more time about how we're not " professional educators " and

therefore do

> not have the background, experience or training to understand

anything about

> our son or what's best for him, I refuse to be responsible for my

behavior.

> The attitude at Monarch, so far, has been " you are great parents

and we know

> you are working very hard in a difficult situation; hang in there

and we'll

> help. " Couldn't be more different. I guess you could argue that

it's because

> we're paying them, but we pay the public school people, too, and

they still

> figuratively spit on us every time we had interaction.

>

> I really hope we continue to be pleased with the school. If not,

we'll move

> on. Next year the school will begin building a school (right now

they rent

> space). A realtor in Houston has donated several acres to the

school. When

> the new school is built they'll be able to take twice as many

kids, which is

> great. I wish every kid on the spectrum and with other neurological

> differences could have access to this kind of learning environment.

>

> RE: Homeschooling. When we were in Oregon we were part of a

homeschool co-op

> much like some people have been describing. There were 50 kids in

the co-op

> and about 12 parents were teachers. I taught history, science,

reading and

> sewing. This was before our son was born and when he was a baby

before his

> diagnosis. Other teachers taught math, other levels of history and

science,

> language, drama, dance, choir and art. The co-op ran from grade 6

to 12.

> Both my daughters went to the co-op. We participated in the co-op

for five

> years. Although it wasn't perfect and we ended up leaving because

of some

> politics we didn't like, the quality of education was excellent.

My girls

> both entered public school 1 year ahead of the kids in their grade

level,

> and one of them is diagnosed with ADHD and an auditory processing

> disability. It was a huge amount of work, especially when I was

teaching,

> but I loved teaching, especially history which has been a passion

of mine

> for years. It was a joy to see kids learn and have fun learning.

And seeing

> my daughter go from self-destructive behaviors because she was

unable to

> read and frustrated and angry with herself for not being able to

keep up to

> reading way above grade level and growing tremendously in self-

confidence

> and ability, and just blossoming, was worth every second of hard

work.

>

> We also participated in a different preschool co-op for my son. I

went with

> him every day as a shadow and it was a wonderful experience. The

parents

> were great people and very generous with their time and talents and

> resources. The teacher was terrific. He loved it.

>

> I learned a lot from working in two different co-ops. There are

some things

> I would do differently if I were to participate in a homeschool co-

op again,

> but in general it was an excellent experience. The only thing about

> homeschooling in a co-op is that, if I were to put my son in a

homeschool

> environment, I would want to be very careful that the other

teachers really

> understood his diagnosis and were equipped to handle it. One

reason we

> decided against the homeschool co-op in Oregon for our son is that

there

> were teachers there who didn't really understand diagnoses like

ADHD and

> autism, and weren't open to education on the subject. Also,

teaching kids

> who for the most part, were fairly typical kids with a few ADHD

diagnoses

> thrown in (and my daughter's auditory processing), was exhausting.

I ruled

> out homeschooling our son because although I feel competent to

handle the

> academic subjects, I felt there was way too much I didn't know

about working

> with his disabilities. I'm still learning, especially as new

diagnoses are

> added. This requires a level of patience that is almost superhuman

> sometimes. I don't really buy into the whole " it takes a village "

concept (I

> think it is often used to detract from the importance of the role

of

> parents) but both my husband and I felt that in my son's case, we

needed

> outside help.

>

> If anyone is seriously interested in starting a co-op and is

interested in

> how the ones we participated in worked, I'd be happy to provide

details. And

> down the road we would seriously consider that as an option for

our son.

>

> I couldn't agree more about wanting the strong opinions of those

who have

> walked in my shoes!

>

> Tammi

>

>

>

>

>

>

> _____

>

> From: Texas-Autism-Advocacy

> [mailto:Texas-Autism-Advocacy ] On Behalf Of

> Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 7:31 PM

> To: Texas-Autism-Advocacy

> Subject: Re: What do you get from public

school?

>

>

>

> So, it seems no one has voiced that school is GREAT. This

surprises me,

> not because of my own experience, but because to me school is

the " sure

> thing " . I mean every doctor, therapist, government official, and

author

> I've read says to put them in school. They can't fathom WHY I would

> want to Homeschool. Funny how a day in our shoes might make a big

> difference in their confident opinions.

>

> The even funnier thing (not really) is that they are the very

people I

> feel so pressured by to keep my son in school. So much advice, so

> little understanding.

>

> It did sound like the Monarch school in Houston is doing a good

job.

> Would you tell us what they do during the day and what makes it so

much

> better than your 'bad school' experience???? I'd love to hear some

> positive info on school (even if we could never afford that

> financially); at least I'd know what everyone is so big on school

for.

>

> I think part of the pressure to go to school for many is the

old " safety

> in numbers " thing....like if it's bad for them, at least we're all

in

> the same boat. Ridiculous really, but at least we're not alone.

>

> Me, on the other hand, I'm okay with being different, my issue is

that I

> like the idea of putting the responsibility in someone else's

hands.

> It's so easy to convince myself that someone ELSE would do better

with

> the child God gave ME. Of course, when I add up the reality of it,

it

> isn't logical or smart to pass my child off to someone who doesn't

know

> them, wouldn't die for them, and is treating him like a job (which

he is

> to the teacher). I'm reminded again that I must have faith in God's

> sovereignty especially when I feel so inadequate.

>

> So, as far as I can tell from this string of emails, it's back to

the

> old homeschooling plan. I'm starting with Joyce Herzog's Scaredy

Cat

> Reading system for my 4 year old. It's great stuff, and fun too. I

> gotta work on self-discipline for me, but that seems more feasible

than

> fighting the school system. I could spend hours fighting it (and

many of

> you selfless ladies have...thank you!), but I just don't have it

in me

> to fight them and give my son what is best for him at the same

time.

> Especially since these are such critical years for him. Maybe when

they

> are older, I'll change the world, but for today, I'd be happy to

see my

> own family changed.

>

> I'd like to pose one more question. Since going to school is

clearly

> not ideal for our kids, what is??? Is homeschooling??? What are the

> pro's and more importantly what are the con's?? I mean, is

Homeschool

> really the big bad wolf???? Or maybe schooling is.....sending our

kids

> off the the big bad wolf....i wonder if the little " school makes

me bad "

> guy sees school this way?

>

> I'd like to hear the strong opinions of those that have actually

walked

> in my shoes, not the confident opinions of those that influence us

all,

> but have NO IDEA what we are going through.

>

> Thanks ladies,

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thank you Tammi for sharing about Monarch

>

> I think the biggest difference between Monarch and our public school

> experience is that I think these people really care about what

happens to my

> son. I truly felt that the people we dealt with in public school

would not

> have batted an eyelid if my son had dropped dead in front of them.

They were

> either magnificent actors or they were completely indifferent and

bored by

> the necessity of sitting through meetings with us. There was no

compassion,

> no concern for his wellbeing, no interest in his day-to-day

experiences in

> school -- until we started taping meetings. Then, suddenly, there

were loud

> statements into the microphone about how " we value children "

and " we're here

> to serve children. " Until the tape recorder came out no one

expressed any

> interest at all in our son. It was a revolting performance.

>

> The teacher/child ratio is excellent: two teachers and about five

therapists

> for my son's class of 4 kids last year. This next year he'll be in

a class

> of 7 or 8 with two teachers and a bunch of therapists. Plus there

are

> teacher's aides, too.

>

> They know how to handle tantrums without shaming my son or making

him feel

> that he is bad. I cannot imagine anyone we dealt with at the public

school

> having a clue about how to handle his tantrums. (Just to give you

some idea

> -- by the time he was 4 he'd broken three windows in our house and

sent his

> much older sister to urgent care; my husband calculated that we were

> spending about $6-$7 a day repairing things he broke, sometimes

more.) The

> times the public school people had to deal with his tantrums they

seemed

> completely baffled and resorted to things like telling him he was

bad and

> all the other kids were good and he should just sit down and act

like the

> other kids; then they told us that we should talk to our son and

get him to

> behave. At one point a member of our I.E.P. " team " (what a joke)

explained

> to us that " behavior isn't really an educational issue. "

>

> At the beginning of school each morning each child puts together

his/her

> schedule for the day using pictures (and words, if that student can

do that)

> so they know what they'll be doing that day and who with.

Everything is very

> structured in that the children know what's coming and who they're

going to

> be working with but also allows space and time for individual

interests and

> expression and choice. When a child is feeling upset or just needs

to

> withdraw, they have " safe " spaces where they are allowed to do that

and then

> return to the group as they are ready. No one criticizes them for

leaving

> the group or is annoyed because now they have to have special

attention to

> catch up.

>

> They are open to new techniques and are so cooperative and helpful

that I

> have a hard time sometimes reconciling that with my previous

experience.

> It's hard to get out of the " school is the bad guy " mode after

years of it.

> It seemed every time we told the public school people what was

happening at

> home they just used that as a way to blame our son's difficulties

on our

> home environment or parenting techniques. At Monarch they want to

know

> what's happening at home so they can work on related skills in the

classroom

> or address issues in his therapy. For example, we've been having

trouble

> with our son engaging in sexually inappropriate behavior. When we

told the

> Monarch people about this they spent some time in his therapy

addressing

> this and said to let us know if this continued to be a problem and

they

> would continue to address it; not one word was said to us about how

this was

> the result of our bad parenting or inappropriate exposure to media

(there

> isn't any) or something we'd done wrong. They also didn't brush it

off as

> " just a phase " -- I can't tell you how many times I've heard " it's

just a

> phase; he'll outgrow it " from public school people (and others).

>

> They provide a daily " progress report " -- a written page or two of

notes

> about what my son experienced during the day and what he did and

how things

> went for him in each class/activity; this includes a number system

and

> written comments. They have an academic curriculum: reading, math,

science,

> etc., but it's all presented using concrete, visual methods that my

> not-good-with-abstract-concepts son can relate to. He's two or

three years

> behind grade level academically but he's made huge strides in just

one year.

>

>

> The children spend a lot of time in " play " where they think they're

having

> fun but they're also working on social skills (an area my son sucks

at),

> hand-eye coordination, muscle movement and strengthening, verbal

skills,

> etc. Parents are always welcome to come and observe what their

children are

> doing. Last year we had a therapy session once a week at the school

with the

> speech/occupational therapist and our son. This particular

therapist spent

> about two hours at the beginning of the year observing our son and

came back

> to us with an evaluation and recommended plan of treatment that was

EXACTLY

> what I'd been trying to tell the public school system he needed for

almost

> two years. She also picked up immediately on the fact that he is

NOT making

> real eye contact (he's mastered the

> look-in-the-direction-of-the-face-without-actually-looking-AT-the-

face

> technique) and that most of what people said to him he was not

responding to

> AT ALL -- something else I'd been trying to tell the public school

people

> with no success.

>

> The teachers and therapists all seem extremely patient -- more than

I am

> sometimes. They're always smiling and happy to see my son (NOT like

public

> school) and they're still smiling and happy at the end of the day.

They

> welcome him each morning with " Hi, I'm so glad to see you, we're

going to

> have a great day. " They ask us for regular progress reports on how

he's

> doing at home so if we're having a particular problem they can

coordinate

> their efforts to address it with our efforts. THEY ASK US for input

and then

> provide concrete suggestions for things to try at home that

actually make

> sense. I've NEVER had this happen in public school, except as a

fishing

> expedition for something they can blame his (or my daughter's) bad

behavior

> on.

>

> No one calls my son " weird " or " strange " or ridicules him for his

quirky

> behaviors. They don't get mad at him or ignore him. They don't

leave him

> alone if he's not on task but is being quiet. They redirect him to

something

> more appropriate.

>

> They understand completely about bolting behavior and are careful

to provide

> a safe environment. I had to threaten the public school with a

lawsuit to

> get them to provide an aide to keep track of my son during field

trips

> despite our reporting repeatedly that he was prone to bolting. I

finally

> told them " if you lose my son, I WILL sue you " while our lawyer was

sitting

> next to us. Only then did they give him an aide (and then when the

day of

> the field trip came they " forgot " to actually send an aide so I got

a

> panic-stricken phone call from his teacher who said she " just

couldn't

> handle him " after she'd told the I.E.P. team that she didn't really

think he

> needed an aide).

>

> He doesn't get sent home when there is a problem. Instead, they

call us in

> to explain what's happening and then reiterate to my son that they

care

> about him and want him to stay and work out the problem. The whole

attitude

> is " let's make this work for your son " not " let's find someone to

blame. "

>

> The other thing I like is that they use a variety of methods: TEACH

(sp?),

> ABA, RDI, music therapy, play therapy, speech therapy, occupational

therapy,

> etc. -- they're open to trying a wide range of techniques in an

effort to

> finding those that work best for each child. If they try something

and it

> doesn't help, they'll say " okay that didn't work, so let's move

not " not

> " well, this worked for the last 12 kids so it should work for your

son and

> that's the way we do it. "

>

> My son is VERY moody. There are days when he is a real pill about

going to

> school. (Of course, when there's no school he pesters us to know

when he

> gets to go to school.) He is sweet as anything one minute and the

next

> minute he is raging at you and throwing everything that comes to

hand at you

> for no apparent reason. So far, no one at school takes this

personally and

> gets insulted by his " lack of respect " (another term we've heard

from public

> school people). Instead, they help him work through his emotion,

help him

> identify and label his emotion, and help him figure out why he's

feeling

> that way and what some other ways of handling it would be.

>

> Now, I can't say that we'll always be this satisfied. Who knows

what will

> happen in the future. It's possible that things will change or that

we might

> feel at some point that a different school would be better for our

son. But

> for now I'm really impressed with what I see at the school. My son

likes

> going there, he likes the other kids and has actually formed some

> friendships (and relationships are very difficult for him), and he's

> learning, and I feel like as his parents, we are treated like

intelligent

> human beings and good parents, instead of being treated like morons

who are

> too stupid to understand what our son needs. The attitude we always

got from

> public school people was " sit down, shut up and let your superiors

explain

> this to you, even though you are probably too dumb to understand. "

If I hear

> one more time about how we're not " professional educators " and

therefore do

> not have the background, experience or training to understand

anything about

> our son or what's best for him, I refuse to be responsible for my

behavior.

> The attitude at Monarch, so far, has been " you are great parents

and we know

> you are working very hard in a difficult situation; hang in there

and we'll

> help. " Couldn't be more different. I guess you could argue that

it's because

> we're paying them, but we pay the public school people, too, and

they still

> figuratively spit on us every time we had interaction.

>

> I really hope we continue to be pleased with the school. If not,

we'll move

> on. Next year the school will begin building a school (right now

they rent

> space). A realtor in Houston has donated several acres to the

school. When

> the new school is built they'll be able to take twice as many kids,

which is

> great. I wish every kid on the spectrum and with other neurological

> differences could have access to this kind of learning environment.

>

> RE: Homeschooling. When we were in Oregon we were part of a

homeschool co-op

> much like some people have been describing. There were 50 kids in

the co-op

> and about 12 parents were teachers. I taught history, science,

reading and

> sewing. This was before our son was born and when he was a baby

before his

> diagnosis. Other teachers taught math, other levels of history and

science,

> language, drama, dance, choir and art. The co-op ran from grade 6

to 12.

> Both my daughters went to the co-op. We participated in the co-op

for five

> years. Although it wasn't perfect and we ended up leaving because

of some

> politics we didn't like, the quality of education was excellent. My

girls

> both entered public school 1 year ahead of the kids in their grade

level,

> and one of them is diagnosed with ADHD and an auditory processing

> disability. It was a huge amount of work, especially when I was

teaching,

> but I loved teaching, especially history which has been a passion

of mine

> for years. It was a joy to see kids learn and have fun learning.

And seeing

> my daughter go from self-destructive behaviors because she was

unable to

> read and frustrated and angry with herself for not being able to

keep up to

> reading way above grade level and growing tremendously in self-

confidence

> and ability, and just blossoming, was worth every second of hard

work.

>

> We also participated in a different preschool co-op for my son. I

went with

> him every day as a shadow and it was a wonderful experience. The

parents

> were great people and very generous with their time and talents and

> resources. The teacher was terrific. He loved it.

>

> I learned a lot from working in two different co-ops. There are

some things

> I would do differently if I were to participate in a homeschool co-

op again,

> but in general it was an excellent experience. The only thing about

> homeschooling in a co-op is that, if I were to put my son in a

homeschool

> environment, I would want to be very careful that the other

teachers really

> understood his diagnosis and were equipped to handle it. One reason

we

> decided against the homeschool co-op in Oregon for our son is that

there

> were teachers there who didn't really understand diagnoses like

ADHD and

> autism, and weren't open to education on the subject. Also,

teaching kids

> who for the most part, were fairly typical kids with a few ADHD

diagnoses

> thrown in (and my daughter's auditory processing), was exhausting.

I ruled

> out homeschooling our son because although I feel competent to

handle the

> academic subjects, I felt there was way too much I didn't know

about working

> with his disabilities. I'm still learning, especially as new

diagnoses are

> added. This requires a level of patience that is almost superhuman

> sometimes. I don't really buy into the whole " it takes a village "

concept (I

> think it is often used to detract from the importance of the role of

> parents) but both my husband and I felt that in my son's case, we

needed

> outside help.

>

> If anyone is seriously interested in starting a co-op and is

interested in

> how the ones we participated in worked, I'd be happy to provide

details. And

> down the road we would seriously consider that as an option for our

son.

>

> I couldn't agree more about wanting the strong opinions of those

who have

> walked in my shoes!

>

> Tammi

>

>

>

>

>

>

> _____

>

> From: Texas-Autism-Advocacy

> [mailto:Texas-Autism-Advocacy ] On Behalf Of

> Sent: Tuesday, July 18, 2006 7:31 PM

> To: Texas-Autism-Advocacy

> Subject: Re: What do you get from public

school?

>

>

>

> So, it seems no one has voiced that school is GREAT. This surprises

me,

> not because of my own experience, but because to me school is

the " sure

> thing " . I mean every doctor, therapist, government official, and

author

> I've read says to put them in school. They can't fathom WHY I would

> want to Homeschool. Funny how a day in our shoes might make a big

> difference in their confident opinions.

>

> The even funnier thing (not really) is that they are the very

people I

> feel so pressured by to keep my son in school. So much advice, so

> little understanding.

>

> It did sound like the Monarch school in Houston is doing a good job.

> Would you tell us what they do during the day and what makes it so

much

> better than your 'bad school' experience???? I'd love to hear some

> positive info on school (even if we could never afford that

> financially); at least I'd know what everyone is so big on school

for.

>

> I think part of the pressure to go to school for many is the

old " safety

> in numbers " thing....like if it's bad for them, at least we're all

in

> the same boat. Ridiculous really, but at least we're not alone.

>

> Me, on the other hand, I'm okay with being different, my issue is

that I

> like the idea of putting the responsibility in someone else's hands.

> It's so easy to convince myself that someone ELSE would do better

with

> the child God gave ME. Of course, when I add up the reality of it,

it

> isn't logical or smart to pass my child off to someone who doesn't

know

> them, wouldn't die for them, and is treating him like a job (which

he is

> to the teacher). I'm reminded again that I must have faith in God's

> sovereignty especially when I feel so inadequate.

>

> So, as far as I can tell from this string of emails, it's back to

the

> old homeschooling plan. I'm starting with Joyce Herzog's Scaredy Cat

> Reading system for my 4 year old. It's great stuff, and fun too. I

> gotta work on self-discipline for me, but that seems more feasible

than

> fighting the school system. I could spend hours fighting it (and

many of

> you selfless ladies have...thank you!), but I just don't have it in

me

> to fight them and give my son what is best for him at the same time.

> Especially since these are such critical years for him. Maybe when

they

> are older, I'll change the world, but for today, I'd be happy to

see my

> own family changed.

>

> I'd like to pose one more question. Since going to school is clearly

> not ideal for our kids, what is??? Is homeschooling??? What are the

> pro's and more importantly what are the con's?? I mean, is

Homeschool

> really the big bad wolf???? Or maybe schooling is.....sending our

kids

> off the the big bad wolf....i wonder if the little " school makes me

bad "

> guy sees school this way?

>

> I'd like to hear the strong opinions of those that have actually

walked

> in my shoes, not the confident opinions of those that influence us

all,

> but have NO IDEA what we are going through.

>

> Thanks ladies,

>

>

>

>