Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

[Guest guest]

Or, announce a policy change that full jars can only be exchanged

for empty ones. No Jar, no Milk.

-Blair

> --

>

> If the same people " forget " their containers to replace the

one being taken-- charge $5.00 for the container deposit. It should

wake them up a bit. If it doesn't, then you are not out anything.

Just a suggestion.

>

>

in SC

> -----I have a decent cow-share operation, but it is rather

frustrating at times,

> I feed soy-free rations, try to provide this liquid gold to

people who will

> benefit from it, yet many times have NO JARS to put milk in

because people

> " forget " to return them. They do not understand the inputs and

the needs to

> be successful.

[Guest guest]

Hi KC,

I too make my own cheese finally and Jarlsburg is my ultimate cheese. I am slowly working up to that and cannot wait until I can get it made. I am still working on a storage place for these items so that I can age them all under lock and key <LOL> until ready and fully cured!!

Regards, Bev Miskin Meadows Farm http://www.hawk.igs.net/~emerald/Farm/farmindex.html Owner VankleekHill_Freecycle http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VankleekHill_Freecycle

[Guest guest]

Do you have a recipe? Or, are you just winging it? If you have a recipe, please forward it to me....PLEASE!

K.C.

tinybabe2@...

RE: Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

Hi KC,

I too make my own cheese finally and Jarlsburg is my ultimate cheese. I am slowly working up to that and cannot wait until I can get it made. I am still working on a storage place for these items so that I can age them all under lock and key <LOL> until ready and fully cured!!

Regards, Bev Miskin Meadows Farm http://www.hawk.igs.net/~emerald/Farm/farmindex.html Owner VankleekHill_Freecycle http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VankleekHill_Freecycle PLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com

[Guest guest]

Although WA is close to ID, we have a

very different economy.

I totally sympathize with your

situation. However, what you want to do is on a far larger

scale of what I'm doing.

K.C. - I have 7 goats due to freshen this year; at peak

lactation they will produce about 7 gallons a day. How much larger is

that than what you are doing?

Debbie@Rainhaven in WA

I don't want to be a Grade A dairy

and have to answer to the state. I like being a bit under the

laws and still be able to be as legal as I can, doing what I

do.

Besides, I've already been told that

they WOULD NOT license me because I would be hurting the big dairies,

if you can believe that. So why fight windmills when I know

they will not buckle under to anything I want or pressure I put on

them?

I'm certainly not hurting anyone here

with what I charge because I'm the only one doing this right

now. If someone else wants to have cow shares and charge more,

that's up to them. But, they will have a hard time getting more

for a gallon in this area.

K.C.

--

Debbie Higgins

http://www.rainhaven.com

[Guest guest]

Hi K.C.

here. One of your shareholders who deeply appreciates your fair

prices.

I just wanted to say I am getting tired of Gordon and others'

incessant nagging about how you aren't charging enough. They obviously

don't have a clue as to the economy and the remote " ruralness " of our

area. True, you are the only " game " in town, but you are also very far

away for some of us to get to. Even though you are 50 miles from my

home, which makes my milk run 100 miles round trip, I am willing to

continue buying from you at $3 a gallon, but if your prices got any

higher, I'd definitely be prohibited from doing so--especially with

the high cost of gas and the two hours of driving time involved.

Gordon doesn't realize that Idaho is a " Right To Work " state. That

means we have the right to work alright, but it also means we work for

very low wages compared to most other states because no one has to

join a union to work in Idaho. It is prohibited by law. This law has

kept Idahoan's wages very low even though the cost of living continues

to climb and climb.

If Gordon could see how poor people are in Gem County and the

surrounding counties that you supply milk with, I think he would not

be so quick to judge you or those of us who rely on you for good

wholesome, raw milk.

How fair is it that only the rich should be able to afford to buy raw

milk? It is not fair and I am glad that you, K.C., have a conscience

that goes along with your awesome milk. I, for one, am very

appreciative of your efforts. I am looking forward to hearing from you

as soon as Margie has her calf. I have sure missed my raw milk.

Thanks, K.C.

P.S. And for the record, let's all move on to another subject because

this one is getting REALLY OLD!

[Guest guest]

Hi KC,

I am going to use Margaret 's recipe ( Glengarry cheese making) here recipes have always been bang on if you follow direction properly without any deviations<LOL> I struggle to not deviate though at times!

I am not sure about copywrite laws so will not post it before asking if it would be ok. If she says yes then I will post it for you.

Regards, Bev Miskin Meadows Farm http://www.hawk.igs.net/~emerald/Farm/farmindex.html Owner VankleekHill_Freecycle http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VankleekHill_Freecycle

[Guest guest]

I just put my untreated milk on the countertop and leave it for 1 or two weeks. Covered. when I come back, I think I have "curds and whey". Do I?

I think heat it a bit (not much, don't want to kill anything) and then I strain it.

I then have cottage cheese and whey???

Not sure what I have?

Am I doing this correctly?

I don't want to use rennet or anything else, just the bacteria in the air floating around from my sauerkraut, kefir, and sourdough.

Am I doing this correctly??

I would like other suggestions for basic, simple cheese making!!

Thanks so much!

Rose Marie

RE: Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

Hi KC,

I too make my own cheese finally and Jarlsburg is my ultimate cheese. I am slowly working up to that and cannot wait until I can get it made. I am still working on a storage place for these items so that I can age them all under lock and key <LOL> until ready and fully cured!!

Regards, Bev Miskin Meadows Farm http://www.hawk.igs.net/~emerald/Farm/farmindex.html Owner VankleekHill_Freecycle http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VankleekHill_Freecycle PLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com PLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com

[Guest guest]

Gallon wise, it's not that much bigger. But animal wise it's 7 times what I have. WOW, your goats give you a gallon each a day? That's great. I've heard people say they were lucky to get 1/2 gallon out of their goats. But, my friend says that real low output. You must be feeding them right for sure.

K.C.

Re: Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

Although WA is close to ID, we have a very different economy.

I totally sympathize with your situation. However, what you want to do is on a far larger scale of what I'm doing.

K.C. - I have 7 goats due to freshen this year; at peak lactation they will produce about 7 gallons a day. How much larger is that than what you are doing?

Debbie@Rainhaven in WA

I don't want to be a Grade A dairy and have to answer to the state. I like being a bit under the laws and still be able to be as legal as I can, doing what I do.

Besides, I've already been told that they WOULD NOT license me because I would be hurting the big dairies, if you can believe that. So why fight windmills when I know they will not buckle under to anything I want or pressure I put on them?

I'm certainly not hurting anyone here with what I charge because I'm the only one doing this right now. If someone else wants to have cow shares and charge more, that's up to them. But, they will have a hard time getting more for a gallon in this area.

K.C.

-- Debbie Higginshttp://www.rainhaven.comPLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com

[Guest guest]

Thanks . I have no plans of raising the price of milk and I know how far you come to get it and am extremely appreciative of that. When and if I ever get to Boise, I would be happy to bring some with me, but I HATE going there (LOL). I also know there are others from Boise that come and we have discussed the possibility of them bringing some out your way as they don't have as far to travel. We are at opposite ends of each county and that makes it hard for you to get out here. You live on the outskirts of Ada County and I'm at the far end of Emmett.

Margie is due 6/3, so please mark your calendar and I will see if anyone coming this way can pick up for you and you can make arrangements to pick up from them.

I get a little tired of those who think it's OK to charge up the Ying Yang for milk as well. Remember the ads that used to say MILK - for EVERY body? It's absolutely not only for the rich and should be priced so everyone can get it. But, I do understand that other states pay higher taxes and more for their property and hay, etc., so like I said before, it's all relative.

By the by, unions aren't illegal here, they just don't want them and make it extremely difficult for them to survive because when you can keep the people down, you maintain the power. That's why the education as well as pay in this state and others SUCKS big time. It's all about keeping the people down, especially the women in this state. Boy, do they hate mouthy broads like me (LOL).

K.C.

Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

Hi K.C. here. One of your shareholders who deeply appreciates your fairprices. I just wanted to say I am getting tired of Gordon and others'incessant nagging about how you aren't charging enough. They obviouslydon't have a clue as to the economy and the remote "ruralness" of ourarea. True, you are the only "game" in town, but you are also very faraway for some of us to get to. Even though you are 50 miles from myhome, which makes my milk run 100 miles round trip, I am willing tocontinue buying from you at $3 a gallon, but if your prices got anyhigher, I'd definitely be prohibited from doing so--especially withthe high cost of gas and the two hours of driving time involved. Gordon doesn't realize that Idaho is a "Right To Work" state. Thatmeans we have the right to work alright, but it also means we work forvery low wages compared to most other states because no one has tojoin a union to work in Idaho. It is prohibited by law. This law haskept Idahoan's wages very low even though the cost of living continuesto climb and climb. If Gordon could see how poor people are in Gem County and thesurrounding counties that you supply milk with, I think he would notbe so quick to judge you or those of us who rely on you for goodwholesome, raw milk. How fair is it that only the rich should be able to afford to buy rawmilk? It is not fair and I am glad that you, K.C., have a consciencethat goes along with your awesome milk. I, for one, am veryappreciative of your efforts. I am looking forward to hearing from youas soon as Margie has her calf. I have sure missed my raw milk.Thanks, K.C.P.S. And for the record, let's all move on to another subject becausethis one is getting REALLY OLD!PLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com

[Guest guest]

Ask if you can send it privately. Maybe she won't mind that as much - HOPEFULLY.

K.C.

RE: Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

Hi KC,

I am going to use Margaret 's recipe ( Glengarry cheese making) here recipes have always been bang on if you follow direction properly without any deviations<LOL> I struggle to not deviate though at times!

I am not sure about copywrite laws so will not post it before asking if it would be ok. If she says yes then I will post it for you.

Regards, Bev Miskin Meadows Farm http://www.hawk.igs.net/~emerald/Farm/farmindex.html Owner VankleekHill_Freecycle http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VankleekHill_Freecycle

PLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com

[Guest guest]

One to two weeks is much longer then anyone I know who makes cottage cheese. I would think you just have curdled, spoiled milk.

Normally, I think people leave it for 1 or 2 days. That should get it to clabber and then when you strain it, you will have your cottage cheese.

Personally, it's way to sour for me that way.

K.C.

RE: Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

Hi KC,

I too make my own cheese finally and Jarlsburg is my ultimate cheese. I am slowly working up to that and cannot wait until I can get it made. I am still working on a storage place for these items so that I can age them all under lock and key <LOL> until ready and fully cured!!

Regards, Bev Miskin Meadows Farm http://www.hawk.igs.net/~emerald/Farm/farmindex.html Owner VankleekHill_Freecycle http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VankleekHill_Freecycle PLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com PLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com PLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com

[Guest guest]

Thanks K.C., but my milk will not clabber in 2 days. I have tried that. It really does nothing until about a week has past. And is it really "spoiled"? I do eat it and I do not get sick!

Thanks, Rose Marie

[Guest guest]

Rose Marie; I suiggest that youi get some keifir grains and clabberit that way!

Re: Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

Thanks K.C., but my milk will not clabber in 2 days. I have tried that. It really does nothing until about a week has past. And is it really "spoiled"? I do eat it and I do not get sick!

Thanks, Rose Marie

[Guest guest]

I have kefir grains, but then I will be just making kefir, since it's the same milk I use in the kefir as in the jar full of nothing but milk that sits there for a week!!

I read the book called "keeping a family cow" and she says it could take up to two days as well. wonder why mine is not working! Hmmm, well thanks for the help! But is it ok do you think to use it after this long?

Rose Marie

[Guest guest]

Must have some really good enzymes in there. Well, if that's how long it takes, then you are doing the best you can without a culture and rennet. If it tastes good to you and you aren't getting sick, GO FOR IT!

Enjoy,

K.C.

Re: Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

Thanks K.C., but my milk will not clabber in 2 days. I have tried that. It really does nothing until about a week has past. And is it really "spoiled"? I do eat it and I do not get sick!

Thanks, Rose MariePLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com

[Guest guest]

Gordon S. writes:

>the perennial communist fiery dart, that anyone who makes

>a fair return is " gouging "

I was previously unaware that accusations of price-gouging are a sign of

communism. I thought accusations of price-gouging occurred for thousands

of years. Were these prehistoric accusers of price-gougers communists

thousands of years before communism was conceived?

>C'mon up to Canada

Maybe we should trade places, since you seem to find Canada such an

inhospitable place. I'm surprised you would still live there.

>Point being : that the only hope for America is the

>yeoman farmer.

Now that I can agree with.

Tom

SD

[Guest guest]

Gordon--

For a man with obvious intelligence, you sure do not have your people skills lined up....If you will ever bother to take the time to LISTEN ( I know this is a new concept for you, but hang in there ) to other people-- you will find valid points in all directions. You CANNOT force your opinions on people Gordon. My granddaughter figured that out already -- and she's only 7.

Chris

Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

Thank you H. Harbold for exemplifying one of my favourite maxims "there is nothing so useless it cannot at least be used as a bad example". Your post will do as the standing textbook example of what an ad hominem argument looks like. If your "back gets up" at me "bashing people" - your term - you must have missed the part where those in favour of farmers operating as charities, sneered at those of us at the high end of the price-range, as "gougers". Have you ever

[Guest guest]

Is this milk from your animals or are you getting it from someone else? I would wonder what they are feeding the cows/goats. Sometimes that has an effect on how the milk clabbers.

When I put kefir grains into milk, everything thickens up with in a few hours if the milk is room temp. A bit longer if it has been refrigerated. Taking a week really seems like a long time. You sure it isn't pasteurized?

K.C.

Re: Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

I have kefir grains, but then I will be just making kefir, since it's the same milk I use in the kefir as in the jar full of nothing but milk that sits there for a week!!

I read the book called "keeping a family cow" and she says it could take up to two days as well. wonder why mine is not working! Hmmm, well thanks for the help! But is it ok do you think to use it after this long?

Rose MariePLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com

[Guest guest]

I'm partly to blame with my last post as he really REALLY pissed me off.

I can not imagine anyone who lives in another country telling people here in the U.S. to tell their employers to pay them what they deserve. Moreover, I really dislike the tone and the "go watch Oprah" thing as well.

As I have always been told, "walk a mile in my shoes, then tell me what you think". Until then, no one knows what anyone has to go through to make a profit or be able to pay high prices for milk or any product. Not to mention, if there is no compassion for our fellow man in this life of ours, we might as well just toss it all in right now. I would love to make lots of money and be wealthy and able to do, go and buy anything I want. But, I've been in and still am walking in those broken down shoes so I feel for my shareholders that are having a hard time of it right now. If that makes me a bad guy/gal, then I want to be really BAD.

K.C.

Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

But I have to say that I'm deeply offended by the tone (and a good bit of the content) of this post. I don't care for holier-than-thou attitudes, and I don't care for someone coming in and telling anyone else that they're not selling THEIR milk for the "right" price. I surely don't care for the implication that someone who thinks this discussion has gone far enough should go watch Oprah! That's way the heck over-the-top.

[Guest guest]

I have been providing raw milk for $6.00 and now am faced with remodling the milking barn and creating a new milk processing area to meet Washington State code. When you put a pencil to it you either half to milk more cows are decide to get out of it. Cash outlay will be from $8000. to $12000., thats only if the EPA dosent get involved.

[Guest guest]

How many cows are you currently milking? How many gallons of milk

do they give?

Would you mind breaking down what your various expected costs

are - maybe there are alternatives that could be suggested that would

work as well and pass inspection.

I found that my local hardware store was willing to trade me

concrete mix for future cheese and they recommended a local guy

(farmer, so again, supporting a farmer) who did a great job on

pouring the parlor slab.

Friends wanting to trade for future milk and cheese have applied

" elbow grease " to my project.

Others knew where to get used / free things like windows and

doors and sinks etc.

I have acquired a 40' semitrailer to be my dairycreamery (where

I will make cheese and bottle milk). MUCH less $$ than if I had to

build a building.

Have you visited Mother Therese and seen her Grade A cow dairy

that is WSDA licensed to sell raw milk for human consumption? Our

Lady of the Rock Monastery is on Shaw Island.

Debbie Higgins

Rainhaven Goat Dairy

Duvall WA

I have been

providing raw milk for $6.00 and now am faced with remodling the

milking barn and creating a new milk processing area to meet

Washington State code. When you put a pencil to it you either half to

milk more cows are decide to get out of it. Cash outlay will be from

$8000. to $12000., thats only if the EPA dosent get involved.

--

Debbie Higgins

http://www.rainhaven.com

[Guest guest]

Oh, don't worry ... all the fine people who get their raw milk for

around $3 per gallon will all c'mon over and help you out for nuttin',

just cause they're so nice, and all.. Let us know when they show up.

> I have been providing raw milk for $6.00 and now am faced with

remodling the

> milking barn and creating a new milk processing area to meet

Washington State

> code. When you put a pencil to it you either half to milk more cows

are decide

> to get out of it. Cash outlay will be from $8000. to $12000., thats

only if

> the EPA dosent get involved.

[Guest guest]

Thanks Blair, my nose tells me it is sour, but not bad. Can raw milk go bad???

Rose Marie

Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

Rose Marie,Don't worry, your milk is fine. I've seen it take up to 6 days to clabber; it depends on the temperature, and the bacteria. And it's not spoiled unless your nose tells you so.:-)-Blair> Thanks K.C., but my milk will not clabber in 2 days. I have tried that. It really does nothing until about a week has past. And is it really "spoiled"? I do eat it and I do not get sick!> Thanks, Rose MariePLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com

[Guest guest]

K.C.

My milk is from my own little dual purpose high butterfat contented Dexter cow!!!!

What do you think?

Rose Marie

Re: Re: Price versus value of REAL MILK

I have kefir grains, but then I will be just making kefir, since it's the same milk I use in the kefir as in the jar full of nothing but milk that sits there for a week!!

I read the book called "keeping a family cow" and she says it could take up to two days as well. wonder why mine is not working! Hmmm, well thanks for the help! But is it ok do you think to use it after this long?

Rose MariePLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com PLEASE BE KIND AND TRIM YOUR POSTS WHEN REPLYING!Visit our Raw Dairy Files for a wealth of information!http://groups.yahoo.com/group/RawDairy/files/Archive search: http://onibasu.com

[Guest guest]

Have you checked with your state to see if there are any grant

programs?

http://www.planning.org/legislation/ruralfactsheet.htm

This may not be for you, but, it could be a start.

> I have been providing raw milk for $6.00 and now am faced with

remodling the

> milking barn and creating a new milk processing area to meet

Washington State

> code. When you put a pencil to it you either half to milk more cows

are decide

> to get out of it. Cash outlay will be from $8000. to $12000., thats

only if

> the EPA dosent get involved.