Guest guest Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Hello, You are not alone, these personality traits are common with those            that have OCD.  My son who is 25 has OCD and definitely has all           the traits you described. The cause and effect is not just personality but           a processing disorganized in the brain that I had learned in a class several            years ago.  There are 7 or 8 stages the brain must follow to show adequate          processing skills. When one of these stages is interrupted than it is like a          domino effect and disturbs the remainder of the stages to complete the thought          I also have siblings who do not have OCD but are very egocentric and          their world is all about themselves, selfish, they come first, manipulative          and their focus is so restrictive even if it effects other siblings feelings.          When I find my notes from the class I attended I will email the name of the          stages as well as the name of the program. Subject: Personality Traits To: Date: Friday, March 5, 2010, 6:21 AM  Just curious to see if kids or adults have similar personality traits. Aside from the OCD issues our daughter is very complex. Stubborn as a jackass, won't listen to anyone other than herself, but yet can't seem to handle the simplest responsibilities. She's been blowing off school (11th grade) or is late because she's too lazy to get up in the morning, not always because of OCD (procrastinates about homework, then stays up until 2:00 a.m., and wants sympathy because she was up so late) . She's very immature for her age and can't seem to handle basic responsibilities of life, like understanding how to plan her day to leave adequate time to prepare for the day. She's also very selfish and thinks the world revolves around her. Very egocentric, could care less about anyone else's issues, but wants everyone else to cater to her. One issue she has a real problem with is understanding cause-and-effect. For example, even though she treats us like crap, easily sparked, and may do something that warrants severe punishment, she still doesn't understand why we take away privileges as punishment. This is not restricted to her teen years, as she seems to have missed the boat since about 10. Her therapist said it's most likely a maturity issue, and sometimes the brain catches up by late teens, early 20's, but it may never come around. Now, throw OCD in the mix, and it's totally whacked! But I'm wondering if these type traits are common or is it unique to our kid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Yes. Yes to all of it- yes to everything - stubborn- check can't/won't handle simple resp.- check procrastinates--check immature-check egocentric/narcisisstic- check fails to see future consequence- check  add socially inedpt  M Subject: Personality Traits To: Date: Friday, March 5, 2010, 7:21 AM  Just curious to see if kids or adults have similar personality traits. Aside from the OCD issues our daughter is very complex. Stubborn as a jackass, won't listen to anyone other than herself, but yet can't seem to handle the simplest responsibilities. She's been blowing off school (11th grade) or is late because she's too lazy to get up in the morning, not always because of OCD (procrastinates about homework, then stays up until 2:00 a.m., and wants sympathy because she was up so late) . She's very immature for her age and can't seem to handle basic responsibilities of life, like understanding how to plan her day to leave adequate time to prepare for the day. She's also very selfish and thinks the world revolves around her. Very egocentric, could care less about anyone else's issues, but wants everyone else to cater to her. One issue she has a real problem with is understanding cause-and-effect. For example, even though she treats us like crap, easily sparked, and may do something that warrants severe punishment, she still doesn't understand why we take away privileges as punishment. This is not restricted to her teen years, as she seems to have missed the boat since about 10. Her therapist said it's most likely a maturity issue, and sometimes the brain catches up by late teens, early 20's, but it may never come around. Now, throw OCD in the mix, and it's totally whacked! But I'm wondering if these type traits are common or is it unique to our kid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Dear - Â That would be great I'd love to see what's going on in scientific/mediccal terms- maybe some brain retraining can help- I know they do that at Chapel Hill NC- M From: fundudefundad <fd_mooreyahoo (DOT) com> Subject: Personality Traits To: @ yahoogroups. com Date: Friday, March 5, 2010, 6:21 AM Â Just curious to see if kids or adults have similar personality traits. Aside from the OCD issues our daughter is very complex. Stubborn as a jackass, won't listen to anyone other than herself, but yet can't seem to handle the simplest responsibilities. She's been blowing off school (11th grade) or is late because she's too lazy to get up in the morning, not always because of OCD (procrastinates about homework, then stays up until 2:00 a.m., and wants sympathy because she was up so late) . She's very immature for her age and can't seem to handle basic responsibilities of life, like understanding how to plan her day to leave adequate time to prepare for the day. She's also very selfish and thinks the world revolves around her. Very egocentric, could care less about anyone else's issues, but wants everyone else to cater to her. One issue she has a real problem with is understanding cause-and-effect. For example, even though she treats us like crap, easily sparked, and may do something that warrants severe punishment, she still doesn't understand why we take away privileges as punishment. This is not restricted to her teen years, as she seems to have missed the boat since about 10. Her therapist said it's most likely a maturity issue, and sometimes the brain catches up by late teens, early 20's, but it may never come around. Now, throw OCD in the mix, and it's totally whacked! But I'm wondering if these type traits are common or is it unique to our kid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 This is a tough one for me to answer--maybe because I also have OCD. I don't know if these are " personality traits " or results from a very difficult disorder that our kids struggle with. I know from experience that having OCD makes things that really don't matter seem to matter very much. This can cause a person, particularly a person who doesn't know what to do about it, to act in ways that are negative and not easily understood. I know that when my own two girls act in ways that are negative and frustrating that it is almost always because they are having trouble with their OCD. Does this mean they are selfish and egocentric? Is person selfish when they are sick with an illness? Or is it just a temporary " slip " in behavior due to not feeling well? What if our kids " don't feel well " and haven't for a very long time? I am a thoughtful person and very responsible. Even as a teen, when my OCD was untreated and extremely difficult to deal with, I was an " A " student, babysat constantly, cleaned my family's home weekly, worked nights at a local H & R Block and participated in school plays. I was the person who everyone now says was " always nice to everyone. " I had my moments but those moments weren't who I was or am. When my kids are struggling, I know that it is their OCD and not them; that my real child is in there and frustrated and tired from dealing with the OCD. It is hard to not act selfish and angry when your mind is telling you lies about what is good and what is bad; what is safe and what is not. OCD is so tiring and so frustrating--many times our kids are desperate to get away from it and can't. It's no wonder they try to control things and act selfish. I do like to think it is just a side effect and not who they truly are. Just my take on things. Kelley in NV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 With a child with special needs, we find it very complex to be a parent. We all just want to love & respect our children and have it returned in kind. It is just awful when it is not. I know you are already doing a lot as a parent, and just seeking support for her on the OCD side is wonderful parenting. Is she doing ERP therapy? I do wonder if there might be another issue here as well. I notice that you reflect upon how different she is other kids. I was wondering if something like ADHD or even a high functioning Aspergers might be something to evaluate her for. I think it is much harder to catch in a teen, because she likely has very complex compensation tools at this point. But special needs challenges can often manifest in a child seeming lazy, unmotivated, unable to organize themselves, or unable to relate to others, show sympathy, or understand consequences or cause & effect. There are wonderful programs to help teach these skills, and to improve their ability to relate. Perhaps this is personality, but I'd encourage you to continue to explore the cause of many of these disfunctions. I would also say that all of this may be OCD related. We certainly see similar issues, even at age 8, when in an exacerbation. ERP therapy, with a really good therapist, helped us to identify what OCD was doing to her, and what behaviors we were then seeing. In many cases, due to mental rituals or compulsions, we were punishing behaviors that were truely due to OCD. Our daughter has PANDAS, but when it comes, we are incredibly disfunctional & I cannot believe how many areas of her life it effects. I hear this same comment from other parents of children with other types of OCD. When she is healthy, she is a charming smart funny little kid. When she gets PANDAS, the similarities between her challenges & those of our best friends son who has Aspergers - are astonishingly similar & we find ourselves using many of the same services. Because we get to see " both kids " often in the same year, it is easy for us to keep track of what is personality and what is illness. Anyway, hope this is helpful and sparks some hope in finding help for your daughter. All my best - in NC > > Just curious to see if kids or adults have similar personality traits. Aside from the OCD issues our daughter is very complex. Stubborn as a jackass, won't listen to anyone other than herself, but yet can't seem to handle the simplest responsibilities. She's been blowing off school (11th grade) or is late because she's too lazy to get up in the morning, not always because of OCD (procrastinates about homework, then stays up until 2:00 a.m., and wants sympathy because she was up so late) . She's very immature for her age and can't seem to handle basic responsibilities of life, like understanding how to plan her day to leave adequate time to prepare for the day. She's also very selfish and thinks the world revolves around her. Very egocentric, could care less about anyone else's issues, but wants everyone else to cater to her. One issue she has a real problem with is understanding cause-and-effect. For example, even though she treats us like crap, easily sparked, and may do something that warrants severe punishment, she still doesn't understand why we take away privileges as punishment. This is not restricted to her teen years, as she seems to have missed the boat since about 10. Her therapist said it's most likely a maturity issue, and sometimes the brain catches up by late teens, early 20's, but it may never come around. Now, throw OCD in the mix, and it's totally whacked! But I'm wondering if these type traits are common or is it unique to our kid? > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 If you are in the piedmont area of NC (UNC reference) then you may find PCAAD in Durham (associated with Duke) very helpful. They do ERP for children & are wonderful at helping both parent & child. in NC > > From: fundudefundad <fd_mooreyahoo (DOT) com> > Subject: Personality Traits > To: @ yahoogroups. com > Date: Friday, March 5, 2010, 6:21 AM > > Â > > Just curious to see if kids or adults have similar personality traits. Aside from the OCD issues our daughter is very complex. Stubborn as a jackass, won't listen to anyone other than herself, but yet can't seem to handle the simplest responsibilities. She's been blowing off school (11th grade) or is late because she's too lazy to get up in the morning, not always because of OCD (procrastinates about homework, then stays up until 2:00 a.m., and wants sympathy because she was up so late) . She's very immature for her age and can't seem to handle basic responsibilities of life, like understanding how to plan her day to leave adequate time to prepare for the day. She's also very selfish and thinks the world revolves around her. Very egocentric, could care less about anyone else's issues, but wants everyone else to cater to her. One issue she has a real problem with is understanding cause-and-effect. For example, even though she treats us like crap, easily > sparked, and may do something that warrants severe punishment, she still doesn't understand why we take away privileges as punishment. This is not restricted to her teen years, as she seems to have missed the boat since about 10. Her therapist said it's most likely a maturity issue, and sometimes the brain catches up by late teens, early 20's, but it may never come around. Now, throw OCD in the mix, and it's totally whacked! But I'm wondering if these type traits are common or is it unique to our kid? > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Thanks BJ - our therapists must have gone to the same school! I know I've mentioned this before too base on our therapists reco - set limits, and stick to your guns. And no, as you've said, it won't be easy. In fact, it's the harder route. Does she get it? Hell no! But that doesn't mean we shouldn't impose the limits or let her get away with irresponsible, disrespectful, obnoxious behavior, or be allowed to have what she wants simply because she doesn't understand it. Hopefully it will pay dividends in the future. I seriously doubt we'll ever get a thank you. In fact, she'll probably be in counseling when she's an adult, blaming all her issues on her mom ;-) Well who cares, as long as I'm not to blame! ;-) It is interesting to see that others have the same or very similar personality traits, and I like the comment that emotional or personality disorders interfere with the normal maturity of the brain. We can only hope the brain catches up at some point! > > > > Just curious to see if kids or adults have similar personality traits. Aside from the OCD issues our daughter is very complex. Stubborn as a jackass, won't listen to anyone other than herself, but yet can't seem to handle the simplest responsibilities. She's been blowing off school (11th grade) or is late because she's too lazy to get up in the morning, not always because of OCD (procrastinates about homework, then stays up until 2:00 a.m., and wants sympathy because she was up so late) . She's very immature for her age and can't seem to handle basic responsibilities of life, like understanding how to plan her day to leave adequate time to prepare for the day. She's also very selfish and thinks the world revolves around her. Very egocentric, could care less about anyone else's issues, but wants everyone else to cater to her. One issue she has a real problem with is understanding cause-and-effect. For example, even though she treats us like crap, easily sparked, and may do something that warrants severe punishment, she still doesn't understand why we take away privileges as punishment. This is not restricted to her teen years, as she seems to have missed the boat since about 10. Her therapist said it's most likely a maturity issue, and sometimes the brain catches up by late teens, early 20's, but it may never come around. Now, throw OCD in the mix, and it's totally whacked! But I'm wondering if these type traits are common or is it unique to our kid? > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Yes , I too am very interested in the reference you mention! FD > > From: fundudefundad <fd_mooreyahoo (DOT) com> > Subject: Personality Traits > To: @ yahoogroups. com > Date: Friday, March 5, 2010, 6:21 AM > > Â > > Just curious to see if kids or adults have similar personality traits. Aside from the OCD issues our daughter is very complex. Stubborn as a jackass, won't listen to anyone other than herself, but yet can't seem to handle the simplest responsibilities. She's been blowing off school (11th grade) or is late because she's too lazy to get up in the morning, not always because of OCD (procrastinates about homework, then stays up until 2:00 a.m., and wants sympathy because she was up so late) . She's very immature for her age and can't seem to handle basic responsibilities of life, like understanding how to plan her day to leave adequate time to prepare for the day. She's also very selfish and thinks the world revolves around her. Very egocentric, could care less about anyone else's issues, but wants everyone else to cater to her. One issue she has a real problem with is understanding cause-and-effect. For example, even though she treats us like crap, easily > sparked, and may do something that warrants severe punishment, she still doesn't understand why we take away privileges as punishment. This is not restricted to her teen years, as she seems to have missed the boat since about 10. Her therapist said it's most likely a maturity issue, and sometimes the brain catches up by late teens, early 20's, but it may never come around. Now, throw OCD in the mix, and it's totally whacked! But I'm wondering if these type traits are common or is it unique to our kid? > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Hi, I have two with ocd, and my youngest is only 8, so he doesn't do that, but my 13 yr old does!! You described her perfectly!!!!!! Hugs Judy ________________________________ To: Sent: Fri, March 5, 2010 7:21:48 AM Subject: Personality Traits  Just curious to see if kids or adults have similar personality traits. Aside from the OCD issues our daughter is very complex. Stubborn as a jackass, won't listen to anyone other than herself, but yet can't seem to handle the simplest responsibilities. She's been blowing off school (11th grade) or is late because she's too lazy to get up in the morning, not always because of OCD (procrastinates about homework, then stays up until 2:00 a.m., and wants sympathy because she was up so late) . She's very immature for her age and can't seem to handle basic responsibilities of life, like understanding how to plan her day to leave adequate time to prepare for the day. She's also very selfish and thinks the world revolves around her. Very egocentric, could care less about anyone else's issues, but wants everyone else to cater to her. One issue she has a real problem with is understanding cause-and-effect. For example, even though she treats us like crap, easily sparked, and may do something that warrants severe punishment, she still doesn't understand why we take away privileges as punishment. This is not restricted to her teen years, as she seems to have missed the boat since about 10. Her therapist said it's most likely a maturity issue, and sometimes the brain catches up by late teens, early 20's, but it may never come around. Now, throw OCD in the mix, and it's totally whacked! But I'm wondering if these type traits are common or is it unique to our kid? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 BJ and all, Just wanted to add my two cents. Procrastination can be a sign of perfectionism related to OCD. As a high school student, I never started my papers until I had to because I knew they would expand to occupy the time available; there was always something to correct, something new to add, so procrastination was a way to avoid dealing with this. At the time, I did not know that I had OCD, but I do think this was related in retrospect. Also, not wanting to go to bed can involve fear of prebedtime rituals or lying awake in bed anxiously. Not wanting to get up can be a transition issue or fear of facing it all over again in the upcoming day. Some of the rest of it sounds like typical teen issues, although I can't say much about that because our oldest is 9. (mom w/OCD, 9 yo dd w/OCD) > > Subject: Re: Personality Traits > To: > Date: Friday, March 5, 2010, 2:21 PM > I've talked to many parents of teens, > because our son is an only child and I've had nothing to > compare his behavior to. Most have the same issues you > are describing. . Lack of motivation, procrastination, not > wanting to go to bed or get up in the morning, > irresponsible, self involved, somewhat of a know-it-all > attitude (won't listen), etc. I've also seen it in > some of our son's friends. Some are even worse than > him, and he has OCD!!! > > But, I suspect the OCD could cause her (and our son) to be > more rigid and stubborn at times, if it is interfering in > certain situations where OCD is involved. > > I also recall reading (and our son's therapist confirmed > it) that kids with anxiety disorders tend to mature > later. He said it is because the anxiety holds them > back from experiences that others go through sooner, so > others work it out earlier than anxiety ridden kids. > Made sense. > > The fact that your daughter has been experiencing this > since she was 10 makes me wonder if she was hitting puberty > then. Kids are developing sooner, than from when we > were kids. I've read that some suspect the hormones > that are in our food. I don't know. . Hard to say, but > it does seem to appear they are hitting puberty > sooner. I don't know if that was part of it for her, > but it's a thought. > > The best advice our son's therapist gave me was to set > limits, but don't engage when he doesn't agree with > them. Is it easy??? No. But, when I walk away, > instead of engaging in a war or words (which never resolve > anything), it's more peaceful. > > BJ > > > > > > > > > > Just curious to see if kids or adults have similar > personality traits. Aside from the OCD issues our > daughter is very complex. Stubborn as a jackass, won't > listen to anyone other than herself, but yet can't seem to > handle the simplest responsibilities. She's been > blowing off school (11th grade) or is late because she's too > lazy to get up in the morning, not always because of OCD > (procrastinates about homework, then stays up until 2:00 > a.m., and wants sympathy because she was up so late) . > She's very immature for her age and can't seem to handle > basic responsibilities of life, like understanding how to > plan her day to leave adequate time to prepare for the > day. She's also very selfish and thinks the world > revolves around her. Very egocentric, could care less > about anyone else's issues, but wants everyone else to cater > to her. One issue she has a real problem with is > understanding cause-and-effect. For example, even > though she treats us like crap, easily sparked, and may do > something that warrants severe punishment, she still > doesn't understand why we take away privileges as > punishment. This is not restricted to her teen years, > as she seems to have missed the boat since about 10. > Her therapist said it's most likely a maturity issue, and > sometimes the brain catches up by late teens, early 20's, > but it may never come around. Now, throw OCD in the > mix, and it's totally whacked! But I'm wondering if > these type traits are common or is it unique to our kid? > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Our list archives feature may be accessed at: http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group// > by scrolling down to the archives calendar . Our links > may be accessed at http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group//links > . Our files may be accessed at > http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group//files > . > Our list advisors are Gail B. , Ed.D.(http://www.ocdawareness.com ), Tamar Chansky, Ph.D.( http://www.worrywisekids.org ), and Dan Geller, M.D. ( > http://www.massgeneral.org/doctors/doctor.aspx?ID=18068 > ). You may ask a question of any of these mental health > professionals by inserting the words " Ask Dr.(insert name) " > in the subject line of a post to the list. Our list > moderators are Castle, Judy Chabot, BJ Closner, and > Barb Nesrallah. You may contact the moderators at -owner > . Our group and related groups are listed at http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/ocdsupportgroups/links > . IOCDF treatment providers list may be viewed at http://www.ocfoundation.info/treatment-providers-list.php > . > NLM-NIH Drug Information Portal may be viewed at > http://druginfo.nlm.nih.gov/drugportal/drugportal.jsp?APPLICATION_NAME=drugporta\ l > . IOCDF recommended reading list may be accessed at http://www.ocfoundation.org/Books.aspx . IOCDF > glossary of terms may be accessed at http://www.ocfoundation.org/glossary.aspx > . IOCDF membership link may be accessed at http://www.ocfoundation.net/membership/ . Drugs.com > pill identification wizard may be accessed at http://www.drugs.com/imprints.php . Mayo Clinic > Drug and Herb Index may be accessed at http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/drug-information/DrugHerbIndex > . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 5, 2010 Report Share Posted March 5, 2010 Hi - It depends on the types of issues a child has - but I'll elaborate on some of the things that we did. Pam might also want to weigh in, as she uses the Yale Parenting program to help develop her daughter's skills - which is similar, but not the same as what we did. I always find her posts to be interesting and helpful. I think the testing that may be helpful to identifying challenges is called executive functioning (maybe someone else can weigh in, as this was a while ago for testing). However, the specific programs that we worked through were Occupational Therapy and ERP Therapy. We started the occupational therapy due to a sensory integration issue that became very clear during a PANDAS exacerbation. Our daughter gets both extreme OCD, sensory issues, and some other things that are harder to put a label on. She often cannot focus, seems not to see things that are right in front of her, loses some types of vision (midline, etc), handwriting goes to heck, has a very hard time with sensitivity and overreaction to any kind of discipline, issues with loud noises, tastes, Bright lights, strobes, distraction from task, filtering, etc. At OT, they did a complete analysis of her challenges and then did all kinds of things with her on a weekly basis, and then taught us how to adapt them at home. We found this by calling our local Autism advocacy office. They do work with a lot of kids with Autism & other neurological issues. They did a ton on handwriting, helped her work through some issues with how to deal with conflict while she was so stressed, helped us with sensory techniques such as brushing & squashing, taught us about swinging and other calming techniques, gave us ideas that would likely help with ADD/ADHD issues, etc. We also taught some of these to her teachers - she got to do any kind of physical work that the teacher had, had a special bubble seat she could sit on, etc. We also worked on social skills (which are normally fine, but are an issue during an exacerbation), using tools like scripting, role playing, scheduling specific playdates with activities carefully planned, journaling, rating a situation, etc. But the biggest help was ERP therapy at PCAAD in Durham NC. I can't say enough about them. Our daughter had SO many mental compulsions, that they were taking up most of her day. We had to identify what was happening & what was related to OCD. She could spend a hour upstairs strugging to open a drawer or put on socks - either due to sensory or due to OCD issues. It looked like she was not trying - but with both kinds of challenges, it was impossible for a time, for her to get ready on her own. I often felt that she regressed by 3-4 years during an attack, and we would use tools that seemed below her age level - but really helped the OCD. She has SO much to process everyday, every minute. She was working so much harder than a normal child needs to, just to do basic functions. When everything seems life threatening in your mind, when you are " being lied to by your own brain " , it is very hard not to be rude, rebellious against what you are being asked to do, even when the request is logical. OCD is illogical at it's best, and just plain scary at its worst. So we had to fight back minute by minute - literally. It was not easy, but it helped her survive some very bad times, and now with the addition of an antibiotic, she lives a very normal happy life - she is full of joy. I don't mean to sound like it is too hard - while OCD is always hard, for mild to moderate OCD, a good therapist can really make a great partnership. And even for severe OCD, while it takes a while, ERP therapy is a wonderful tool to unwind the OCD. I don't really know how anyone could tell what is personality and what is OCD until well into therapy. I would like to add that my daughter, with PANDAS OCD is a delightful little person, as are both my nephews with traditional OCD. The phrase we say in our house is that " people with OCD are some of the nicest people in the world " . I will say that untreated, however, it is really hard to be nice - we just use that phrase to always keep in mind who she is beneath the pain and fear, and who we always know she can be. Some days are harder than ever, but we find it is easier when we keep a clear goal in mind about what we believe in for her. For children with other challenges, here is a simple website: http://www.specialed.us/autism/asper/asper11.html. You can also google " executive function " and " tools " or " interventions " . Another google term is " Asberger interventions " . While my daughter does not have Aspergers, the overlap in symptoms was pretty amazing during an exacerbation. Hope this is helpful - in NC > > , > Would you elaborate on the " programs " available to teach skills of organization, motivation etc. What types of things do they implement to help kids develop these things. Thanks. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 7, 2010 Report Share Posted March 7, 2010 BJ, I'm not sure how or if you could separate them. I guess if it is teen procrastination (without anxiety), then he should be able to complete the project in a normal amount of time whether he starts early or late. I think the answer may be the same in both cases. Let him deal with the consequences and find out what he would do differently the next time and how/if he would like help with it. Good luck, > > Subject: Re: Personality Traits > To: > Date: Saturday, March 6, 2010, 1:54 PM > , having OCD yourself, can you > shed any light on how I would be able to tell if it's OCD > procrastination, or teen procrastination? I supsect he > is dealing with both. He's not as forthcoming with > information as he was when he was young to help me have a > clue, and it's a fine line sometimes to figure out how to > respond to it. > > Thanks, > BJ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just curious to see if kids or adults have > similar > > > personality traits. Aside from the OCD issues > our > > > daughter is very complex. Stubborn as a > jackass, won't > > > listen to anyone other than herself, but yet > can't seem to > > > handle the simplest responsibilities. She's > been > > > blowing off school (11th grade) or is late > because she's too > > > lazy to get up in the morning, not always because > of OCD > > > (procrastinates about homework, then stays up > until 2:00 > > > a.m., and wants sympathy because she was up so > late) . > > > She's very immature for her age and can't seem to > handle > > > basic responsibilities of life, like > understanding how to > > > plan her day to leave adequate time to prepare > for the > > > day. She's also very selfish and thinks the > world > > > revolves around her. Very egocentric, could > care less > > > about anyone else's issues, but wants everyone > else to cater > > > to her. One issue she has a real problem with > is > > > understanding cause-and-effect. For example, > even > > > though she treats us like crap, easily sparked, > and may do > > > something that warrants severe punishment, > she still > > > doesn't understand why we take away privileges > as > > > punishment. This is not restricted to her teen > years, > > > as she seems to have missed the boat since about > 10. > > > Her therapist said it's most likely a maturity > issue, and > > > sometimes the brain catches up by late teens, > early 20's, > > > but it may never come around. Now, throw OCD in > the > > > mix, and it's totally whacked! But I'm > wondering if > > > these type traits are common or is it unique to > our kid? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > > > Our list archives feature may be accessed at: > http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group// > > > by scrolling down to the archives calendar . > Our links > > > may be accessed at http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group//links > > > . Our files may be accessed at > > > http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group//files > > > . > > > Our list advisors are Gail B. , Ed.D.(http://www.ocdawareness.com ), Tamar Chansky, Ph.D.( http://www.worrywisekids.org ), and Dan Geller, M.D. ( > > > http://www.massgeneral.org/doctors/doctor.aspx?ID=18068 > > > ). You may ask a question of any of these mental > health > > > professionals by inserting the words " Ask > Dr.(insert name) " > > > in the subject line of a post to the list. Our > list > > > moderators are Castle, Judy Chabot, BJ > Closner, and > > > Barb Nesrallah. You may contact the moderators > at -owner > > > . Our group and related groups are listed at http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/ocdsupportgroups/links > > > . IOCDF treatment providers list may be viewed > at http://www.ocfoundation.info/treatment-providers-list.php > > > . > > > NLM-NIH Drug Information Portal may be viewed at > > > http://druginfo.nlm.nih.gov/drugportal/drugportal.jsp?APPLICATION_NAME=drugporta\ l > > > . IOCDF recommended reading list may be > accessed at http://www.ocfoundation.org/Books.aspx > . IOCDF > > > glossary of terms may be accessed at http://www.ocfoundation.org/glossary.aspx > > > . IOCDF membership link may be accessed at http://www.ocfoundation.net/membership/ . Drugs.com > > > pill identification wizard may be accessed at http://www.drugs.com/imprints.php . Mayo Clinic > > > Drug and Herb Index may be accessed at http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/drug-information/DrugHerbIndex > > > . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 7, 2010 Report Share Posted March 7, 2010 Thank you for your reply. I did rethink OT as a possibility but it gets harder as they get to be older, 16yrs. of age. He had it when he was 10-12. I'll need to do a bit more research on OT " s in my area. I also need to investigate more about executive functioning. Thanks for your time. Subject: Re: Personality Traits To: Date: Friday, March 5, 2010, 4:13 PM Â Hi - It depends on the types of issues a child has - but I'll elaborate on some of the things that we did. Pam might also want to weigh in, as she uses the Yale Parenting program to help develop her daughter's skills - which is similar, but not the same as what we did. I always find her posts to be interesting and helpful. I think the testing that may be helpful to identifying challenges is called executive functioning (maybe someone else can weigh in, as this was a while ago for testing). However, the specific programs that we worked through were Occupational Therapy and ERP Therapy. We started the occupational therapy due to a sensory integration issue that became very clear during a PANDAS exacerbation. Our daughter gets both extreme OCD, sensory issues, and some other things that are harder to put a label on. She often cannot focus, seems not to see things that are right in front of her, loses some types of vision (midline, etc), handwriting goes to heck, has a very hard time with sensitivity and overreaction to any kind of discipline, issues with loud noises, tastes, Bright lights, strobes, distraction from task, filtering, etc. At OT, they did a complete analysis of her challenges and then did all kinds of things with her on a weekly basis, and then taught us how to adapt them at home. We found this by calling our local Autism advocacy office. They do work with a lot of kids with Autism & other neurological issues. They did a ton on handwriting, helped her work through some issues with how to deal with conflict while she was so stressed, helped us with sensory techniques such as brushing & squashing, taught us about swinging and other calming techniques, gave us ideas that would likely help with ADD/ADHD issues, etc. We also taught some of these to her teachers - she got to do any kind of physical work that the teacher had, had a special bubble seat she could sit on, etc. We also worked on social skills (which are normally fine, but are an issue during an exacerbation) , using tools like scripting, role playing, scheduling specific playdates with activities carefully planned, journaling, rating a situation, etc. But the biggest help was ERP therapy at PCAAD in Durham NC. I can't say enough about them. Our daughter had SO many mental compulsions, that they were taking up most of her day. We had to identify what was happening & what was related to OCD. She could spend a hour upstairs strugging to open a drawer or put on socks - either due to sensory or due to OCD issues. It looked like she was not trying - but with both kinds of challenges, it was impossible for a time, for her to get ready on her own. I often felt that she regressed by 3-4 years during an attack, and we would use tools that seemed below her age level - but really helped the OCD. She has SO much to process everyday, every minute. She was working so much harder than a normal child needs to, just to do basic functions. When everything seems life threatening in your mind, when you are " being lied to by your own brain " , it is very hard not to be rude, rebellious against what you are being asked to do, even when the request is logical. OCD is illogical at it's best, and just plain scary at its worst. So we had to fight back minute by minute - literally. It was not easy, but it helped her survive some very bad times, and now with the addition of an antibiotic, she lives a very normal happy life - she is full of joy. I don't mean to sound like it is too hard - while OCD is always hard, for mild to moderate OCD, a good therapist can really make a great partnership. And even for severe OCD, while it takes a while, ERP therapy is a wonderful tool to unwind the OCD. I don't really know how anyone could tell what is personality and what is OCD until well into therapy. I would like to add that my daughter, with PANDAS OCD is a delightful little person, as are both my nephews with traditional OCD. The phrase we say in our house is that " people with OCD are some of the nicest people in the world " . I will say that untreated, however, it is really hard to be nice - we just use that phrase to always keep in mind who she is beneath the pain and fear, and who we always know she can be. Some days are harder than ever, but we find it is easier when we keep a clear goal in mind about what we believe in for her. For children with other challenges, here is a simple website: http://www.speciale d.us/autism/ asper/asper11. html. You can also google " executive function " and " tools " or " interventions " . Another google term is " Asberger interventions " . While my daughter does not have Aspergers, the overlap in symptoms was pretty amazing during an exacerbation. Hope this is helpful - in NC > > , > Would you elaborate on the " programs " available to teach skills of organization, motivation etc. What types of things do they implement to help kids develop these things. Thanks. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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