RE: Re: Doing My First TLC Assessment: Questions

[Guest guest]

Liz,

http://www.brain-trainer.com/equipment/electrodes_and_supplies.html shows, at the bottom of the page, the Rochester Med electrodes and an earclip. The earclip is simply a double electrode that comes installed in a clip to hold it on the ear.

I showed the jumper in the workshop ( http://www.brain-trainer.com/cgi-bin/shop.pl?shop=get_item & item_id=53 ). It is a little wire with plugs on each end. You plug the bottom of each plug into the reference plug on your DIN extender (one for the reference in each channel) and plug the electrode or earclip into the top of each plug. It combines or links the two signals from the references.

Although 5 is much better than 20, the biggest issue is that ALL the impedances should be in a fairly narrow range. 5 kohms between one pair of electrodes and 20 between another will not give you good signals. Get them all around 5 or all around 10, within a kohm or two of each other, and your signal will improve.

If you send me a sample of the EEG, I may be able to show you what is going on. Go to the Database in Infiniti, select your husband's name on the Client window and choose Export Client. Then e-mail me the zip file.

Pete

thank you so much for all of that ---I guess I have to get jumpers and ear clips. Will review all of this(many times) again.The one thing I noticed in the actual data coming out is that, nomatter where the electrodes were placed, my husband had tons of " busy

brain. " I just wonder how you know if that's real or some kind ofproblem with the signal. If your impedance readings are ok (mine were 20 in some directions andaround 5 or less in others), could the signal still be bad?

.. -- Van Deusen

pvdtlc@...http://www.brain-trainer.com305/433-3160The Learning Curve, Inc.

[Guest guest]

Liz,

The diagrams and the explanation of how to measure them are in your Level 1 manual, the Word document. You can also find them online on the braintrainer list Files section (

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/braintrainer/files/Assessment%20Forms/ ). Remember that this is what I demonstrated and you practiced in Level 1--the hand measuring.

Everything I wrote in the original e-mail is correct. You do use 1 active and 1 reference in each channel. All you do is plug the references into a JUMPER, so they form a single comparitor for both channels instead of plugging them directly into the DIN extender. And, as I wrote, you use ONE ground plugged into the C channel--despite TT's putting a ground plug in each channel, you only need one ground for the system. Remember from Level 1, the ground does not measure EEG. It is just there as a safety protection for the client and the amplifier.

You say that you have trouble picturing things and need them verbally, but you continue to " overthink " the verbal stuff. In my last e-mail about grounds, I wrote " plug the jumper into the two ground inputs " ; you understood " plug a jumper into one ground input (leave the other ground input alone, as just a hole). " I wrote, " place a single mastoid or ear electrode into either end of the jumper. " ; you understood, " attach two

electrodes to the jumper and then onto each ear. " Exactly backwards.

Hope this helps.

Pete

-Pete, can you remind me where I can find diagrams (they were either onyour website or on that CD I bought (?) of the correct hookup youdescribed, because I'm having trouble picturing it.In your original e-mail to me before I went to Milwaukee you said:

" The montage (hookup) is much simpler than you are understanding. Youare using 2 channels instead of 1. You put one electrode over a site(like C3), one ear reference and one ground in the C channel. Then

you do exactly the same thing (over another site like C4) in channelD. That's it. " So that's what I did. Six electrodes, one on each active site, onereference for each site, one ground for each site. I think I need a

review course in all this " jumping " and " linking " of references andgrounds! I don't know if I own a jumper or not. I assume this is notanything to do with the DIN thing, right? Right.

Also, do you buy the earclips separately and attach them to theelectrodes, or are these actually another type of electrode, the " earclip type " ? Because I just bought a whole new set of electrodesfrom Rochester as you suggested,but just the " cup " type.

I would LOVE to see the pictures of these setups, particular how youLINK the references. I think I understood your explanation of how youuse a jumper to use just one ground for the two actives (plug a jumper

into one ground input (leave the other ground input alone, as just ahole), then attach two electrodes to the jumper and then onto each ear-- is that right?Sorry, some things are so hard to understand without the pictures (I'm

a poor visualizer, just a verbal kinda gal here).Thanks again for keeping my momentum alive here

.. -- Van Deusen

pvdtlc@...http://www.brain-trainer.com305/433-3160The Learning Curve, Inc.

[Guest guest]

Liz, I am about in the same situation as

you are.  I took a course at University

of North Texas and we

used a text by Demos – Getting started with neurofeedback.  It does

have the diagrams for the hook ups.  I found the book to be a great purchase. 

I know it has one and two channel hook ups. 

If you want to email me directly you can

at conniewelsh@....

 Maybe we can help each other!!

Connie

From:

braintrainer [mailto:braintrainer ] On Behalf Of neandergal

Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2007

11:02 PM

To: braintrainer

Subject: Re: Doing

My First TLC Assessment: Questions

-

Pete, can you remind me where I can find diagrams (they were either on

your website or on that CD I bought (?) of the correct hookup you

described, because I'm having trouble picturing it.

In your original e-mail to me before I went to Milwaukee you said:

" The montage (hookup) is much simpler than you are understanding. You

are using 2 channels instead of 1. You put one electrode over a site

(like C3), one ear reference and one ground in the C channel. Then

you do exactly the same thing (over another site like C4) in channel

D. That's it. "

So that's what I did. Six electrodes, one on each active site, one

reference for each site, one ground for each site. I think I need a

review course in all this " jumping " and " linking " of

references and

grounds! I don't know if I own a jumper or not. I assume this is not

anything to do with the DIN thing, right? Right.

Also, do you buy the earclips separately and attach them to the

electrodes, or are these actually another type of electrode, the

" earclip type " ? Because I just bought a whole new set of electrodes

from Rochester

as you suggested,but just the " cup " type.

I would LOVE to see the pictures of these setups, particular how you

LINK the references. I think I understood your explanation of how you

use a jumper to use just one ground for the two actives (plug a jumper

into one ground input (leave the other ground input alone, as just a

hole), then attach two electrodes to the jumper and then onto each ear

-- is that right?

Sorry, some things are so hard to understand without the pictures (I'm

a poor visualizer, just a verbal kinda gal here).

Thanks again for keeping my momentum alive here .....

-- In braintrainer ,

" Van Deusen " wrote:

>

> Liz,

>

> Congratulations on pushing on through the confusion.

>

>

> >

> > First of all: while watching the raw EEG data, it ranges from -50 to

> > +50. What unit of measurement is that, and why was most of the data

> > below zero?

> >

> >

> I presume these are microvolts, in which case, given that your

husband is an

> adult, the chances are you had very poor connections or a lot of

artifact.

> Those are very high values for an adult. Remember in Level 1 when I

showed

> the waveforms going above and below the baseline. EEG is an alternating

> current. A full waveform start at the baseline (zero), rises to a

peak and

> drops to cross the baseline again and falls to a trough (largest

negative

> value) before turning again to cross the baseline and start a new

waveform.

> Half of your data should have been below the baseline, if a large

amount was

> below, that suggests that the whole waveform was rising and falling (the

> baseline itself), again an indication of poor connections.

>

> In addition, as for impedance: is there any way to see which

> > electrodes are the culprits, when the signals aren't good? I see

there

> > are pluses and minuses and a chart, but is there any good way to

> > relate those to the actual electrodes?

> >

> >

> I don't use the Infiniti impedance checking, but my recollection is

that the

> display shows three electrodes in each channel with a number (impedance

> value) shown between each pair. You can often triangulate to a single

> electrode, if the values between that one and its two comparitors

are both

> high.

>

> Another question: I got a bunch of electrodes, all with the cups on

> > them, and that's what I used. Should one for each channel have had a

> > clip so I could have clipped them onto the ears as grounds? I just

> > used the cupped ones for the ears too.

> >

> >

> You have to purchase earclips in addition to standard electrodes (head

> leads) to get the earclips. You can find them on the

> brain-trainer.comwebsite by clicking the link for " electrodes " .

They

> come in a pair or can

> be purchased individually. If you use the head leads for reference and

> ground, you need to place them on the mastoid bone (as we did in the

> workshop), not on the earlobes (where they won't stick). Placing

head leads

> on the earlobes will result in a poor signal.

>

> And another! where exactly are we putting the " references " in

relation

> > to the grounds? Am I right in assuming the references are on the

" A's "

> > (just above the ears) whereas the grounds are really ON the earlobes?

> >

> >

> First, you should by using a Jumper (remember I explained the potential

> problem of different values in the references contaminating all the

other

> readings, so we " link " the references). You can also use just a

single

> ground for the whole system, if you can ignore the " bad "

impedance

readings

> between the active and reference electrodes and the ground in

channels other

> than the one that has the ground plugged into it. Alternatively,

you can

> buy another jumper and use that between the two ground extenders

going to

> the Infiniti. Just plug the jumper into the two ground inputs and

place a

> single mastoid or ear electrode into either end of the jumper, so it

will

> serve as the ground for both channels. If you follow the

instructions in

> the script, you'll see that A1 and A2 (the earlobes--they are NOT

above the

> ears) are the references. The ground can actually be placed anywhere (I

> prefer to put it on the midline) from the middle of the forehead to

the back

> of the neck.

>

> Also -- there are a lot of coherence measures on the lower left, as

> > you collect the data -- how can I get more information about what the

> > significance of those are?

> >

> >

> Go back to your notes from Level 2 and review the section where we

discussed

> Coherence. But also remember that for the first 3-5 assessments you do,

> your primary focus should be on getting the process down so it becomes

> routine and you don't have to think about it. THEN you'll be ready to

> actually watch what the screen is showing during the data gathering.

For

> now, you main " watching " task should just be to look out for

artifacts:

> Large mountain ranges at 60 Hz, spiking activity in the high-beta or

delta

> bands, major differences in the size of the signal between the two

sides in

> all frequencies, or coherences all very high.

>

> **And now, The Big Question: okay so I collected five three-minute

> > sessions, and they seem to be saved and I can see them in the Data

> > area of my Infiniti software. What do I do now, to turn them into an

> > actual TLC assessment that comes out as those nice pages of graphs

and

> > statistics?

> >

> >

> I'm attaching the instructions. Go to the section called Process

Data to

> get a step by step list of how to do this.

>

> (Notice I'm not even asking yet how to INTERPRET those nice pages)

> >

> >

> You don't have to. All you have to do is go back through your Level

2 notes

> and Power Point presentations and you'll remember it all, right? As I

> mentioned, I'll be happy to help you online with the artifacting and

loading

> the first time if you have problems. And many people, if they are

doing a

> client assessment, send the data to me and ask me to develop a

training plan

> the first few times. Keep an eye out, as you get more comfortable

with the

> process, for the Trainers' Practicum online workshops to build your

skills

> in the area of reading the assessment. The online workshops are a

better

> alternative (I believe), because you spend two hours once a week going

> through material and then have a week to process and digest it.

>

> Thanks for any help,

> >

> >

> I'm proud of the progress you've made! Can't hold a New Yorker down!

>

> Pete

>

> >

> > --

> > Van Deusen

> > pvdtlc@...

> > http://www.brain-trainer.com

> > 305/433-3160

> > The Learning Curve, Inc. .

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Listmates,

I work for more than a year now with an electrocap. I prepare the

electrodes with the use of very tiny cotton sticks that I bought in a

shop in Belgium.

a) I put some Nuprep on such a cotton stick and put it into the small

hole of the electrode holder on the cap at the targeted sites (for

example T3 and T4, Cz for ground). This is an easy way to bring the

Nuprep through the hair on the skin, just rubbing it a little bit.

Then I bring in the electrode gel with the seringe.

c) The references on the ears (with clips) I prepare the same way (using

cottong to clean the ear, then inserting the gel in the electrode

cup).

Usually it works very fast (within 5 minutes) with very low impedances as

a result (lower than 2). The automatic impedance checker on the Infiniti

is of great help as well to sabe time.

After use I take of the cap and the ear electrodes. The client just wipes

away the gel with a tissue (it is not sticky) and ready!!

I put the cap and ear electrodes a few minutes in warm water (with

detergent), dry them and... ready for the next as well!

Kind greetings,

Jan Schene

Haarlem

The Netherlands

At 09:35 28-10-2007, you wrote:

Liz,

http://www.brain-trainer.com/equipment/electrodes_and_supplies.html

shows, at the bottom of the page, the Rochester Med electrodes and an

earclip. The earclip is simply a double electrode that comes

installed in a clip to hold it on the ear.

I showed the jumper in the workshop (

http://www.brain-trainer.com/cgi-bin/shop.pl?shop=get_item & item_id=53

). It is a little wire with plugs on each end. You plug the

bottom of each plug into the reference plug on your DIN extender (one for

the reference in each channel) and plug the electrode or earclip into the

top of each plug. It combines or links the two signals from the

references.

Although 5 is much better than 20, the biggest issue is that ALL the

impedances should be in a fairly narrow range. 5 kohms between one

pair of electrodes and 20 between another will not give you good

signals. Get them all around 5 or all around 10, within a kohm or

two of each other, and your signal will improve.

If you send me a sample of the EEG, I may be able to show you what is

going on. Go to the Database in Infiniti, select your husband's

name on the Client window and choose Export Client. Then e-mail me

the zip file.

Pete

On 10/27/07, neandergal

<drmargoshes@...

> wrote:

thank you so much for all of that ---

I guess I have to get jumpers and ear clips. Will review all of

this

(many times) again.

The one thing I noticed in the actual data coming out is that,

no

matter where the electrodes were placed, my husband had tons of

" busy

brain. " I just wonder how you know if that's real or some kind

of

problem with the signal.

If your impedance readings are ok (mine were 20 in some directions

and

around 5 or less in others), could the signal still be bad?

..

--

Van Deusen

pvdtlc@...

http://www.brain-trainer.com

305/433-3160

The Learning Curve, Inc.

[Guest guest]

There is a file in the braintrainer Files section ( http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/braintrainer/files/Assessment%20Forms/

) called Hookup Help which contains the maps and information on how to find sites.

Pete

Liz, I am about in the same situation as you are. I took a course at University of North Texas and we used a text by Demos – Getting started with neurofeedback. It does have the diagrams for the hook ups. I found the book to be a great purchase. I know it has one and two channel hook ups.

If you want to email me directly you can at

conniewelsh@.... Maybe we can help each other!!

Connie

From:

braintrainer [mailto:braintrainer ]

On Behalf Of neandergalSent: Saturday, October 27, 2007 11:02 PMTo:

braintrainer Subject: Re: Doing My First TLC Assessment: Questions

-Pete, can you remind me where I can find diagrams (they were either onyour website or on that CD I bought (?) of the correct hookup youdescribed, because I'm having trouble picturing it.

In your original e-mail to me before I went to Milwaukee you said: " The montage (hookup) is much simpler than you are understanding. Youare using 2 channels instead of 1. You put one electrode over a site

(like C3), one ear reference and one ground in the C channel. Thenyou do exactly the same thing (over another site like C4) in channelD. That's it. " So that's what I did. Six electrodes, one on each active site, one

reference for each site, one ground for each site. I think I need areview course in all this " jumping " and " linking " of references andgrounds! I don't know if I own a jumper or not. I assume this is not

anything to do with the DIN thing, right? Right.Also, do you buy the earclips separately and attach them to theelectrodes, or are these actually another type of electrode, the " earclip type " ? Because I just bought a whole new set of electrodes

from Rochester as you suggested,but just the " cup " type.I would LOVE to see the pictures of these setups, particular how youLINK the references. I think I understood your explanation of how you

use a jumper to use just one ground for the two actives (plug a jumperinto one ground input (leave the other ground input alone, as just ahole), then attach two electrodes to the jumper and then onto each ear-- is that right?

Sorry, some things are so hard to understand without the pictures (I'ma poor visualizer, just a verbal kinda gal here).Thanks again for keeping my momentum alive here .....-- In

braintrainer , " Van Deusen " wrote:>> Liz,> > Congratulations on pushing on through the confusion.> >

> >> > First of all: while watching the raw EEG data, it ranges from -50 to> > +50. What unit of measurement is that, and why was most of the data> > below zero?> >> >

> I presume these are microvolts, in which case, given that yourhusband is an> adult, the chances are you had very poor connections or a lot ofartifact.> Those are very high values for an adult. Remember in Level 1 when I

showed> the waveforms going above and below the baseline. EEG is an alternating> current. A full waveform start at the baseline (zero), rises to apeak and> drops to cross the baseline again and falls to a trough (largest

negative> value) before turning again to cross the baseline and start a newwaveform.> Half of your data should have been below the baseline, if a largeamount was> below, that suggests that the whole waveform was rising and falling (the

> baseline itself), again an indication of poor connections.> > In addition, as for impedance: is there any way to see which> > electrodes are the culprits, when the signals aren't good? I see there

> > are pluses and minuses and a chart, but is there any good way to> > relate those to the actual electrodes?> >> >> I don't use the Infiniti impedance checking, but my recollection is

that the> display shows three electrodes in each channel with a number (impedance> value) shown between each pair. You can often triangulate to a single> electrode, if the values between that one and its two comparitors

are both> high.> > Another question: I got a bunch of electrodes, all with the cups on> > them, and that's what I used. Should one for each channel have had a> > clip so I could have clipped them onto the ears as grounds? I just

> > used the cupped ones for the ears too.> >> >> You have to purchase earclips in addition to standard electrodes (head> leads) to get the earclips. You can find them on the

> brain-trainer.comwebsite by clicking the link for " electrodes " . They> come in a pair or can> be purchased individually. If you use the head leads for reference and> ground, you need to place them on the mastoid bone (as we did in the

> workshop), not on the earlobes (where they won't stick). Placinghead leads> on the earlobes will result in a poor signal.> > And another! where exactly are we putting the " references " in

relation> > to the grounds? Am I right in assuming the references are on the " A's " > > (just above the ears) whereas the grounds are really ON the earlobes?> >> >

> First, you should by using a Jumper (remember I explained the potential> problem of different values in the references contaminating all theother> readings, so we " link " the references). You can also use just a single

> ground for the whole system, if you can ignore the " bad " impedancereadings> between the active and reference electrodes and the ground inchannels other> than the one that has the ground plugged into it. Alternatively,

you can> buy another jumper and use that between the two ground extendersgoing to> the Infiniti. Just plug the jumper into the two ground inputs andplace a> single mastoid or ear electrode into either end of the jumper, so it

will> serve as the ground for both channels. If you follow theinstructions in> the script, you'll see that A1 and A2 (the earlobes--they are NOTabove the> ears) are the references. The ground can actually be placed anywhere (I

> prefer to put it on the midline) from the middle of the forehead tothe back> of the neck.> > Also -- there are a lot of coherence measures on the lower left, as> > you collect the data -- how can I get more information about what the

> > significance of those are?> >> >> Go back to your notes from Level 2 and review the section where wediscussed> Coherence. But also remember that for the first 3-5 assessments you do,

> your primary focus should be on getting the process down so it becomes> routine and you don't have to think about it. THEN you'll be ready to> actually watch what the screen is showing during the data gathering.

For> now, you main " watching " task should just be to look out for artifacts:> Large mountain ranges at 60 Hz, spiking activity in the high-beta ordelta> bands, major differences in the size of the signal between the two

sides in> all frequencies, or coherences all very high.> > **And now, The Big Question: okay so I collected five three-minute> > sessions, and they seem to be saved and I can see them in the Data

> > area of my Infiniti software. What do I do now, to turn them into an> > actual TLC assessment that comes out as those nice pages of graphs and> > statistics?> >> >

> I'm attaching the instructions. Go to the section called ProcessData to> get a step by step list of how to do this.> > (Notice I'm not even asking yet how to INTERPRET those nice pages)

> >> >> You don't have to. All you have to do is go back through your Level2 notes> and Power Point presentations and you'll remember it all, right? As I> mentioned, I'll be happy to help you online with the artifacting and

loading> the first time if you have problems. And many people, if they aredoing a> client assessment, send the data to me and ask me to develop atraining plan> the first few times. Keep an eye out, as you get more comfortable

with the> process, for the Trainers' Practicum online workshops to build yourskills> in the area of reading the assessment. The online workshops are abetter> alternative (I believe), because you spend two hours once a week going

> through material and then have a week to process and digest it.> > Thanks for any help,> >> >> I'm proud of the progress you've made! Can't hold a New Yorker down!

> > Pete> > >> > --> > Van Deusen> > pvdtlc@...> >

http://www.brain-trainer.com> > 305/433-3160> > The Learning Curve, Inc. .> >>

-- Van Deusen

pvdtlc@...http://www.brain-trainer.com305/433-3160The Learning Curve, Inc.

[Guest guest]

Hi

(1) There are several sizes, althought a medium sized cap will most of

the people... For children you need a smaller one of course. I also

bought some cheap lycra swimming caps on a Portugese supermarket and

clipped electrode holders (withv integrated electrodes) on them. It works

fine as well.

With regard to the placement, we should nog exagerate the precision of

placements, unless you are doing scienctific research.

Measuring the potential diferences on the scalp is like measuring city

sounds with very sensitive microphones above the biosphere.

(2) with tiny cotton sticks it is easy to contact the skin of the scalp,

bypassing the hair. The special electrode gel which comes with the cap,

makes the contact between the electrode and the skin.

(3) So far not, but of course some people might find it irritating. I

think one gets used to it. But there is always the pasted electrode

option...

I make jokes with my clients about how weird they look with the cap.

Maybe we are a 'shameless' people, but no problems so far...

Greetings,

Jan Schene, health care psychologist

Haarlem

The Netherlands

At 17:51 28-10-2007, you wrote:

Hi, that sounds

interesting!

I just looked up an Electrocap company on the web. Some questions for

you:

(1) do you use a " medium " size for everybody? how do you deal

with the

fact that everybody's head is different? (we learned to find

individual locations by person, because everybody has different

measurements). Does it really matter?

(2) How do you deal with separating the hair under the electrodes so

you get as much hairless skin to put the electrodes on?

(3) Do your clients ever feel " weird " because you're putting

that cap

on their heads?

(4) Where I live, in New York City, I bet the parents would become

hysterical that you are transmitting head lice!!!

(5) Still.... an interesting idea, " thanks for

sharing "

[Guest guest]

Jan,Could you say more about the "clipped electrode holders"  What exactly are they, were could I get some more information on them?Thanks Hi (1) There are several sizes, althought a medium sized cap will most of the people... For children you need a smaller one of course. I also bought some cheap lycra swimming caps on a Portugese supermarket and clipped electrode holders (withv integrated electrodes) on them. It works fine as well. With regard to the placement, we should nog exagerate the precision of placements, unless you are doing scienctific research. Measuring the potential diferences on the scalp is like measuring city sounds with very sensitive microphones above the biosphere. (2) with tiny cotton sticks it is easy to contact the skin of the scalp, bypassing the hair. The special electrode gel which comes with the cap, makes the contact between the electrode and the skin. (3) So far not, but of course some people might find it irritating. I think one gets used to it. But there is always the pasted electrode option... I make jokes with my clients about how weird they look with the cap. Maybe we are a 'shameless' people, but no problems so far... Greetings, Jan Schene, health care psychologist Haarlem The Netherlands At 17:51 28-10-2007, you wrote: Hi, that sounds interesting! I just looked up an Electrocap company on the web. Some questions for you: (1) do you use a "medium" size for everybody? how do you deal with the fact that everybody's head is different? (we learned to find individual locations by person, because everybody has different measurements). Does it really matter? (2) How do you deal with separating the hair under the electrodes so you get as much hairless skin to put the electrodes on? (3) Do your clients ever feel "weird" because you're putting that cap on their heads? (4) Where I live, in New York City, I bet the parents would become hysterical that you are transmitting head lice!!! (5) Still.... an interesting idea, "thanks for sharing"  

[Guest guest]

m

The electrode holders with integrated electrodes come with the cap (see

for example

www.electrocap.com). In The Netherlands they sell them separate as

well

(

www.electrocap.nl), for example for replacement or to extend the

number of electrodes in the cap.

It is a simple click system, you can attach them to the lycra cap at any

place.

Jan

At 21:43 28-10-2007, you wrote:

Jan,

Could you say more about the " clipped electrode holders "

What exactly are they, were could I get some more information on

them?

Thanks

Hi

(1) There are several sizes, althought a medium sized cap will most of

the people... For children you need a smaller one of course. I also

bought some cheap lycra swimming caps on a Portugese supermarket and

clipped electrode holders (withv integrated electrodes) on them. It works

fine as well.

With regard to the placement, we should nog exagerate the precision of

placements, unless you are doing scienctific research.

Measuring the potential diferences on the scalp is like measuring city

sounds with very sensitive microphones above the biosphere.

(2) with tiny cotton sticks it is easy to contact the skin of the scalp,

bypassing the hair. The special electrode gel which comes with the cap,

makes the contact between the electrode and the skin.

(3) So far not, but of course some people might find it irritating. I

think one gets used to it. But there is always the pasted electrode

option...

I make jokes with my clients about how weird they look with the cap.

Maybe we are a 'shameless' people, but no problems so far...

Greetings,

Jan Schene, health care psychologist

Haarlem

The Netherlands

At 17:51 28-10-2007, you wrote:

Hi, that sounds

interesting!

I just looked up an Electrocap company on the web. Some questions for

you:

(1) do you use a " medium " size for everybody? how do you deal

with the

fact that everybody's head is different? (we learned to find

individual locations by person, because everybody has different

measurements). Does it really matter?

(2) How do you deal with separating the hair under the electrodes so

you get as much hairless skin to put the electrodes on?

(3) Do your clients ever feel " weird " because you're putting

that cap

on their heads?

(4) Where I live, in New York City, I bet the parents would become

hysterical that you are transmitting head lice!!!

(5) Still.... an interesting idea, " thanks for

sharing "