Re: Autistic Boy Gets Left on Bus/Indiana

[Guest guest]

Wow Cindi,

I agree they should be fired!! I can not believe it, anything could of

happened to that poor boy. I am also not understanding why the mother waited a

full hour before calling, I know I would of been on the phone before an hour

and in fact I have! ~Viola

Group did you hear? Mother called about son when an hour went by and

child was not home. Bus was returned to compound and bus driver and

aid left bus. It would seem they forgot about child. How can this

happen? The aid got fired but the bus driver of (16) years was sorry

so they did not fire him. I think the bus drivers should walk through

the bus when they return the bus to the compound. The only way I can

imagine that this happened would be if this child only rides

occasionally and maybe he fell asleep on the bus.Everyone involved

should be fired.After the year I have had with bus drivers I have no

sympathy for ignorance and these people. What do you think? Cyndi

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/29/2005 7:07:36 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,

ViPorier@... writes:

..Everyone involved

should be fired.After the year I have had with bus drivers I have no

sympathy for ignorance and these people. What do you think?

I know my answer won't be a popular one but to be honest, while it is

something that needs immediate attention to call someone ignorant is not fair

either. I know of parents who forgot their kids was in the car as they were

getting things out and later when the child was not around started to search

and

found them in the car asleep. That does not make them ignorant, that makes

them human. I agree that both the aid and the bus drivers should make a

complete walk through each time before they leave but it does bother me when

people

are labeled because they made a mistake. I also agree that discipline is in

order and training but I " m not so sure firing is the first line to take. If

we fired everyone who made a mistake who would be there for our kids in the

first place. Also, think how we as parents make mistakes along the years as

we care for our children, I know for myself I would not want anyone to " fire "

me or call me " ignorant " instead I would hope they would help me. When they

lost my child at camp this past spring, were they ignorant? No, did they

need major training? YES, did they get training? YES. Was there anyone

fired?

Yes, but it wasn't the person who was in charge of watching my child that

got fired, they fired the director instead. (which I disagreed with and still

do) But I insisted that the person who was watching my child not only be

trained but that she have a buddy with her at all times when with my child. I

took this opportunity to advocate for training, safety features to be

implemented and for staff to have training in sign language. I know how

frustrating

it can be dealing with the schools, I have been doing it a long time and one

of the lessons I have finally learned is that we as parents need to set the

example that we want others to follow. :-)

Carol

Trishasmom

She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

If we always do what we always did,

we'll always get what we've always gotten!

[Guest guest]

I hadn't heard this story, is there a link? Louise

Autistic Boy Gets Left on Bus/Indiana

Group did you hear? Mother called about son when an hour went by and

child was not home. Bus was returned to compound and bus driver and

aid left bus. It would seem they forgot about child. How can this

happen? The aid got fired but the bus driver of (16) years was sorry

so they did not fire him. I think the bus drivers should walk through

the bus when they return the bus to the compound. The only way I can

imagine that this happened would be if this child only rides

occasionally and maybe he fell asleep on the bus.Everyone involved

should be fired.After the year I have had with bus drivers I have no

sympathy for ignorance and these people. What do you think? Cyndi

--

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9/26/2005

[Guest guest]

New school buses now have a key removal system. the bus cannot be locked

without the driver going to the back of the bus and inserting a key .

My son's new bus has this system.

Fight to get this for ALL special buses.

Sara - Choose to make lemonade, not complain about the lemons.

>

>Reply-To:

>To:

>Subject: Autistic Boy Gets Left on Bus/Indiana

>Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 05:49:47 -0000

>

>Group did you hear? Mother called about son when an hour went by and

>child was not home. Bus was returned to compound and bus driver and

>aid left bus. It would seem they forgot about child. How can this

>happen? The aid got fired but the bus driver of (16) years was sorry

>so they did not fire him. I think the bus drivers should walk through

>the bus when they return the bus to the compound. The only way I can

>imagine that this happened would be if this child only rides

>occasionally and maybe he fell asleep on the bus.Everyone involved

>should be fired.After the year I have had with bus drivers I have no

>sympathy for ignorance and these people. What do you think? Cyndi

>

>

>

>

>

>--------------------------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/29/2005 12:02:33 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

dan_canale@... writes:

This just happened in New York to a child who fell asleep and the bus driver

and matron are being brought up on child endangerment charges and could face

a year in prison. I think this is absolutely appropriate as checking the bus

for sleeping children is a fundamental part of the job and required by law

in NY state.

ok this just might get me kicked of this list but I just have to ask. If it

is appropriate to send someone to jail because they did not do a walk

through and causes child endangerment apply to us parents as well? What about

those of us who send our kids to camp or other places and they are lost or

abused

should we not be brought up on charges as well, I mean after all we could

have gone to those places and did a walk through to make sure all was well. We

could have kept our kids home we could have sent a shadow etc, etc. Again

yes, I think discipline is appropriate but the right kind of discipline along

with the right kind of training. It is so easy to sit back and say what

should happen and what should be done about it, but how many of us know both

sides to the story? I'm not making excuses because it just makes sense to

check

but we are all human and as much as we don't want to admit it, we all do make

mistakes. Was this the first time this happened to these people? If so

wouldn't it be more appropriate to re-train them get an aid for the child etc.

If this was the second time, then again, more training and maybe suspended

with no pay for an appropriate amount of time, 3rd time? then yes it's time for

removal. I so wish everyone would take the time to reflect on how they would

feel if they are the person being discussed. How would any of us feel if we

made a mistake and everyone wanted us to be put in prison. If we have

learned nothing else through all of our years of dealing with special needs, I

would hope we have learned the value of tolerance, acceptance, finding

solutions

and advocating to make changes. This is not directed at any one person just

my thoughts in general as I have been reading on several different boards

and when it comes to the schools we expect them to show us tolerance and

acceptance but it appears we aren't quite ready yet to do so ourselves. I

cannot

stress enough how important it is that we come together and work together as a

team to find solutions because until we do this it will continue to be long

battles and frustrations across the board for everyone. I most likely stand

alone in my beliefs but that is ok. I'm not trying to change anyone's

opinions, just stating my own. So don't send flaming emails to me please. :-)

Carol

Trishasmom

She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

If we always do what we always did,

we'll always get what we've always gotten!

[Guest guest]

Viola, Maybe the bus is never comes at the same time or even close.

My son gets out of school at 3:45 and at the old we were 10 minutes

from school most days the bus was here at 4:30, some days 4:00, some

days 5:00,depending on how many children rode the handicapped bus

that day. And this year for the 1st four weeks the bus was late

every morning, some mornings 8:45,8:55, 9:15 and school started at

9:05. I finally got this situation straightened out, thank goodness.

I know I have called in the past if the bus was 30 minutes late

either way. I feel for this mother she must have been frantic. The

boy could have got off the bus and got lost or kidnapped.I would be

after that school district like a " " " " " " " " we'll maybe I should stop

here. Thanks for your imput. Cyndi

>

> Wow Cindi,

> I agree they should be fired!! I can not believe it, anything

could of

> happened to that poor boy. I am also not understanding why the

mother waited a

> full hour before calling, I know I would of been on the phone

before an hour

> and in fact I have! ~Viola

>

> Group did you hear? Mother called about son when an hour went by

and

> child was not home. Bus was returned to compound and bus driver

and

> aid left bus. It would seem they forgot about child. How can this

> happen? The aid got fired but the bus driver of (16) years was

sorry

> so they did not fire him. I think the bus drivers should walk

through

> the bus when they return the bus to the compound. The only way I

can

> imagine that this happened would be if this child only rides

> occasionally and maybe he fell asleep on the bus.Everyone

involved

> should be fired.After the year I have had with bus drivers I have

no

> sympathy for ignorance and these people. What do you think? Cyndi

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Louise, No this was on my local news in Ky. If I see it on a link I

will connect it. Sorry Cyndi

> I hadn't heard this story, is there a link? Louise

>

> Autistic Boy Gets Left on Bus/Indiana

>

> Group did you hear? Mother called about son when an hour went by

and

> child was not home. Bus was returned to compound and bus driver

and

> aid left bus. It would seem they forgot about child. How can this

> happen? The aid got fired but the bus driver of (16) years was

sorry

> so they did not fire him. I think the bus drivers should walk

through

> the bus when they return the bus to the compound. The only way I

can

> imagine that this happened would be if this child only rides

> occasionally and maybe he fell asleep on the bus.Everyone involved

> should be fired.After the year I have had with bus drivers I have

no

> sympathy for ignorance and these people. What do you think? Cyndi

>

>

>

>

>

>

> --

> No virus found in this outgoing message.

> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.

> Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.11.7/112 - Release Date:

> 9/26/2005

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/29/2005 2:30:26 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

dan_canale@... writes:

BUT I think that if you have a job that involves making sure children are

safe, and you neglect to do your job, I think you have to be held accountable.

Ya know, I can't tell you how many times I was supposed to do something

that I have done for years and should be automatic to me but there are the rare

(ok maybe not so rare) occasions I do forget. It is no different for a

parent or teacher or anyone else to forget no matter if they have one or a

hundred to look out for. (please understand I'm not minimizing the situation,

it is

very serious and needs to be dealt with but appropriately and it just

saddens me when I hear people say they should be in prison or fired etc.,

please

understand I'm not defending them as much as I am saying make the punishment

fit the crime so to speak) As I said I agree to discipline but it should be in

stages depending on the first or 3rd offense. And I'm not just talking

about the bus, we have situations where the teacher forgot to send a note home,

and parents have actually said that teacher is incompetent and needs to be

fired. We as parents can be the most fierce at times and all I'm saying is

that

we should set examples and show tolerance because after all that is what we

seek for our kids as well.

Carol

Trishasmom

She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

If we always do what we always did,

we'll always get what we've always gotten!

[Guest guest]

Hi Carol,

No direspect intended toward you, but I will tell you this...if someone left

my son on the bus drove it to the station and left my son there, I certainly

would not stand for that person to just get a warning not to do it again!!

I was a substitute aide for 2 years I could be called to be an aide in the

school office , kindergarten, special ed classroom or on the bus.. believe me

we checked the bus before we left/ Sorry no excuse for this. I feel so sad

for that little boy and his mom. I have no desire to stick up for the aide on

that bus/ sorry i don't get where your coming from!!

Viola

mom to tammy21, tania18, and kyle13 DS AND PDD (ons)

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/29/2005 3:35:05 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

ViPorier@... writes:

have no desire to stick up for the aide on

that bus/ sorry i don't get where your coming from!!

I'm coming from the perspective of a parent who's child has been lost and

could have drowned and yes I was furious and scared and other feeling you can

describe. But insisting on having people fired or condeming them would not

have changed the facts nor would it have made a difference in the future

because even if you fire the aid, what happens if they get a new aid and the

same

thing happens. I never said just give a warning I said and I will say it

again, Training, Training, Training. I advocated training, I advocated safety

implementations, I advocated for lots of things so hopefully what happened to

my child may not happen again at least not at the same place.

Carol

Trishasmom

She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

If we always do what we always did,

we'll always get what we've always gotten!

[Guest guest]

I just talked to our bus driver today when he dropped Trisha off. He said

that every morning and every evening after he drops the last child off he

walks through the bus and not only looks in the seats but under them as well

and

then he fills out a form stating the day and time he checked. Louise, can

you tell I'm learning from my past experiences? lol it's about time wouldn't

ya think. :-)

Carol

Trishasmom

She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

If we always do what we always did,

we'll always get what we've always gotten!

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 9/29/2005 5:35:43 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

momof3oneds@... writes:

Well, that was a good thing you did.. seems we should ALL double

check what our drivers do JUST in case.. you can never be to

careful!!!!

True, but I look at it as being supportive as well. We want to make sure

their jobs are no harder than they have to be as well so if we can help to

remind them and in such a way that doesn't look like we don't trust them but

more of a can you tell me your procedure so I am familiar then you also avoid

the distrust syndrome. :-) The other thing the bus driver said to me which

made perfect sense was that if your child is not going to be riding the bus to

let the drivers know before hand if possible because sometimes parents take

their kids to school and then let them ride the bus home and while it's true

all buses should be checked daily morning and noon, it just might help prevent

mishaps like this in the future and also if you are going to be picking your

child up early let the driver know because otherwise they are waiting for

that child to come out to get on the bus and can't leave the bus if there

aren't any aids to go find out where the child is and they can't just keep

sitting

there holding all the other kids from getting home. So it's a common

courtesy on our parts as parents to keep the drivers updated as to what is

going

on. I think that is very reasonable request and while I do inform the driver

of when I will be picking her up or taking her to school it was a good

refresher for me as well. :-)

Carol

Trishasmom

She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

If we always do what we always did,

we'll always get what we've always gotten!

[Guest guest]

No flames Carol! :-) I hear what you are saying, and agree to a degree. I don't

think these folks should go to jail (and I don't think they will) BUT I think

that if you have a job that involves making sure children are safe, and you

neglect to do your job, I think you have to be held accountable.

These folks are with our kids in the completely self-contained environment of a

bus for a couple of hours a day. It's not the same as a parent who is on duty

24/7 who doesn't notice a child slipping out the door while he/she is taking

care of a sibling. It's also not the same a school teacher trying to keep an eye

on all 25+ kids in an open classroom. It's not the parent's fault if an autistic

child runs away from a special needs camp, but it most certainly is the fault of

the people the parents trusted to care for that child.

In NYC there are always 2 people on special needs buses to serve at most 8-10

kids. They are only responsible for a few basic tasks. Getting the kids on the

bus safely, making sure no one gets hurt or hurts anyone else while on the bus,

and making sure everyone gets off safely. By law, they must receive training in

doing this task, they are required to check all the seats in the bus, and they

must affix a sign in the rear window every day when they are done checking the

bus that states " I have checked this bus for sleeping children " . We are all

human and we all make mistakes but when you are entrusted with the welfare of

someone else's child, and when the law outlines a simple safety procedure for

you to follow, you are, in my opinion, negligent if you fail to follow it.

Just my 2 cents :-).

Dan

Csvillars@... wrote:

In a message dated 9/29/2005 12:02:33 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

dan_canale@... writes:

This just happened in New York to a child who fell asleep and the bus driver

and matron are being brought up on child endangerment charges and could face

a year in prison. I think this is absolutely appropriate as checking the bus

for sleeping children is a fundamental part of the job and required by law

in NY state.

ok this just might get me kicked of this list but I just have to ask. If it

is appropriate to send someone to jail because they did not do a walk

through and causes child endangerment apply to us parents as well? What about

those of us who send our kids to camp or other places and they are lost or

abused

should we not be brought up on charges as well, I mean after all we could

have gone to those places and did a walk through to make sure all was well. We

could have kept our kids home we could have sent a shadow etc, etc. Again

yes, I think discipline is appropriate but the right kind of discipline along

with the right kind of training. It is so easy to sit back and say what

should happen and what should be done about it, but how many of us know both

sides to the story? I'm not making excuses because it just makes sense to

check

but we are all human and as much as we don't want to admit it, we all do make

mistakes. Was this the first time this happened to these people? If so

wouldn't it be more appropriate to re-train them get an aid for the child etc.

If this was the second time, then again, more training and maybe suspended

with no pay for an appropriate amount of time, 3rd time? then yes it's time for

removal. I so wish everyone would take the time to reflect on how they would

feel if they are the person being discussed. How would any of us feel if we

made a mistake and everyone wanted us to be put in prison. If we have

learned nothing else through all of our years of dealing with special needs, I

would hope we have learned the value of tolerance, acceptance, finding

solutions

and advocating to make changes. This is not directed at any one person just

my thoughts in general as I have been reading on several different boards

and when it comes to the schools we expect them to show us tolerance and

acceptance but it appears we aren't quite ready yet to do so ourselves. I

cannot

stress enough how important it is that we come together and work together as a

team to find solutions because until we do this it will continue to be long

battles and frustrations across the board for everyone. I most likely stand

alone in my beliefs but that is ok. I'm not trying to change anyone's

opinions, just stating my own. So don't send flaming emails to me please. :-)

Carol

Trishasmom

She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

If we always do what we always did,

we'll always get what we've always gotten!

[Guest guest]

Carol you have made some very caring observations and comments in this

thread. I agree that TRAINING is one of the most important aspects

along with the changes some companies have made to check those buses and

let others know that they have checked them and no child was left

behind. As we can see this has happened throughout the country and you

would think that all bus companies would have learned to have very

stringent procedures to follow to check each day. Louise

Re: Autistic Boy Gets Left on Bus/Indiana

In a message dated 9/29/2005 3:35:05 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

ViPorier@... writes:

have no desire to stick up for the aide on

that bus/ sorry i don't get where your coming from!!

I'm coming from the perspective of a parent who's child has been lost

and

could have drowned and yes I was furious and scared and other feeling

you can describe. But insisting on having people fired or condeming

them would not have changed the facts nor would it have made a

difference in the future because even if you fire the aid, what happens

if they get a new aid and the same thing happens. I never said just

give a warning I said and I will say it again, Training, Training,

Training. I advocated training, I advocated safety implementations, I

advocated for lots of things so hopefully what happened to my child may

not happen again at least not at the same place.

Carol

Trishasmom

She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

If we always do what we always did,

we'll always get what we've always gotten!

--

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Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.

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9/26/2005

[Guest guest]

So... did the aide get fired because he/she WASN'T sorry? LOL..

That is just HORRIBLE.. EVERY parents nightmare let alone the ones

with needs! We JUST had this happen in our neighboring district this

past week with a spec needs child.. here in St Louis. SOOOO SCARY!!!!

I thought they all were suppose to walk all the way though the bus to

make sure... I hope this will change some policies at this place!!!

A.

> Group did you hear? Mother called about son when an hour went by and

> child was not home. Bus was returned to compound and bus driver and

> aid left bus. It would seem they forgot about child. How can this

> happen? The aid got fired but the bus driver of (16) years was sorry

> so they did not fire him. I think the bus drivers should walk

through

> the bus when they return the bus to the compound. The only way I can

> imagine that this happened would be if this child only rides

> occasionally and maybe he fell asleep on the bus.Everyone involved

> should be fired.After the year I have had with bus drivers I have no

> sympathy for ignorance and these people. What do you think? Cyndi

[Guest guest]

I have never posted anything here before. I am from Arizona and my

daughter,Carly 11, has Down Syndrome and I have an appointment to

have her evaluated to see if she has autism as well, but I'm not

sure yet, but reading your posts here - I am pretty sure she does.

Anyway, regarding the bus issues. I have a scary story myself.

Carly was probably about 6 years old at the time this happened. The

bus driver dropped her off at her school and there was no one

outside there to meet the bus and the driver left her out and took

off! Her speech is very limited and even more so at that time. I

am amazed that she found her way all the way around the outside of

the school to the playground area and there were some teacher's

aides over there watching the kids playing. I work at a school

right across the street from her school - thank God she didn't try

crossing the street. And you know, no one told me that this

happened until about 6 months later! Can you believe it? Anything

could have happened to her. And the actual bus driver was over at

our school talking to me about stuff and she casually mentioned it.

I was in shock! I don't know what she was thinking. She had been

driving Carly for quite awhile and she had to have known that Carly

needed someone there to get her. And her aide and teacher knew this

happened and no one bothered to let me know. I was furious. And yes

she is still employed by our school district.

>

> Wow Cindi,

> I agree they should be fired!! I can not believe it, anything

could of

> happened to that poor boy. I am also not understanding why the

mother waited a

> full hour before calling, I know I would of been on the phone

before an hour

> and in fact I have! ~Viola

>

> Group did you hear? Mother called about son when an hour went by

and

> child was not home. Bus was returned to compound and bus driver

and

> aid left bus. It would seem they forgot about child. How can this

> happen? The aid got fired but the bus driver of (16) years was

sorry

> so they did not fire him. I think the bus drivers should walk

through

> the bus when they return the bus to the compound. The only way I

can

> imagine that this happened would be if this child only rides

> occasionally and maybe he fell asleep on the bus.Everyone

involved

> should be fired.After the year I have had with bus drivers I have

no

> sympathy for ignorance and these people. What do you think? Cyndi

>

>

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Welcome to the group and WOW for that story about your daughter!!!

That would concern me!!! And not telling you? MAN OH Man!!! I have

read on boards how parents don't find out their child wandered out

of the building until days, weeks, months later... so scary!!!!

Tell us more about you!

A.

> >

> > Wow Cindi,

> > I agree they should be fired!! I can not believe it, anything

> could of

> > happened to that poor boy. I am also not understanding why the

> mother waited a

> > full hour before calling, I know I would of been on the phone

> before an hour

> > and in fact I have! ~Viola

> >

> > Group did you hear? Mother called about son when an hour went

by

> and

> > child was not home. Bus was returned to compound and bus driver

> and

> > aid left bus. It would seem they forgot about child. How can

this

> > happen? The aid got fired but the bus driver of (16) years was

> sorry

> > so they did not fire him. I think the bus drivers should walk

> through

> > the bus when they return the bus to the compound. The only way

I

> can

> > imagine that this happened would be if this child only rides

> > occasionally and maybe he fell asleep on the bus.Everyone

> involved

> > should be fired.After the year I have had with bus drivers I

have

> no

> > sympathy for ignorance and these people. What do you think?

Cyndi

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Great to check with Trisha's bus driver, good info. All our experiences

and learning is there waiting to help someone. Louise

Re: Autistic Boy Gets Left on Bus/Indiana

I just talked to our bus driver today when he dropped Trisha off. He

said

that every morning and every evening after he drops the last child off

he

walks through the bus and not only looks in the seats but under them as

well and

then he fills out a form stating the day and time he checked. Louise,

can

you tell I'm learning from my past experiences? lol it's about time

wouldn't

ya think. :-)

Carol

Trishasmom

She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

If we always do what we always did,

we'll always get what we've always gotten!

--

No virus found in this outgoing message.

Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.

Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.11.7/112 - Release Date:

9/26/2005

[Guest guest]

Well, that was a good thing you did.. seems we should ALL double

check what our drivers do JUST in case.. you can never be to

careful!!!!

A.

> I just talked to our bus driver today when he dropped Trisha

off. He said

> that every morning and every evening after he drops the last

child off he

> walks through the bus and not only looks in the seats but under

them as well and

> then he fills out a form stating the day and time he checked.

Louise, can

> you tell I'm learning from my past experiences? lol it's about

time wouldn't

> ya think. :-)

>

> Carol

> Trishasmom

> She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

>

> If we always do what we always did,

> we'll always get what we've always gotten!

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Carol, As a boss and an employee the reason the punishment is so

strong is because how much money can you put on a life.When it comes

to our children we hope to enlist them in the safest and most

responsible hands possible, and if people do not have enough common

sense to help keep our children safe, in my opinion they should find

work were lives of innocent children are not involved.

>

> In a message dated 9/29/2005 12:02:33 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

> dan_canale@y... writes:

>

> This just happened in New York to a child who fell asleep and the

bus driver

> and matron are being brought up on child endangerment charges and

could face

> a year in prison. I think this is absolutely appropriate as

checking the bus

> for sleeping children is a fundamental part of the job and

required by law

> in NY state.

>

>

>

> ok this just might get me kicked of this list but I just have to

ask. If it

> is appropriate to send someone to jail because they did not do a

walk

> through and causes child endangerment apply to us parents as

well? What about

> those of us who send our kids to camp or other places and they

are lost or abused

> should we not be brought up on charges as well, I mean after all

we could

> have gone to those places and did a walk through to make sure all

was well. We

> could have kept our kids home we could have sent a shadow etc,

etc. Again

> yes, I think discipline is appropriate but the right kind of

discipline along

> with the right kind of training. It is so easy to sit back and

say what

> should happen and what should be done about it, but how many of

us know both

> sides to the story? I'm not making excuses because it just makes

sense to check

> but we are all human and as much as we don't want to admit it, we

all do make

> mistakes. Was this the first time this happened to these people?

If so

> wouldn't it be more appropriate to re-train them get an aid for

the child etc.

> If this was the second time, then again, more training and maybe

suspended

> with no pay for an appropriate amount of time, 3rd time? then yes

it's time for

> removal. I so wish everyone would take the time to reflect on

how they would

> feel if they are the person being discussed. How would any of us

feel if we

> made a mistake and everyone wanted us to be put in prison. If we

have

> learned nothing else through all of our years of dealing with

special needs, I

> would hope we have learned the value of tolerance, acceptance,

finding solutions

> and advocating to make changes. This is not directed at any one

person just

> my thoughts in general as I have been reading on several

different boards

> and when it comes to the schools we expect them to show us

tolerance and

> acceptance but it appears we aren't quite ready yet to do so

ourselves. I cannot

> stress enough how important it is that we come together and work

together as a

> team to find solutions because until we do this it will continue

to be long

> battles and frustrations across the board for everyone. I most

likely stand

> alone in my beliefs but that is ok. I'm not trying to change

anyone's

> opinions, just stating my own. So don't send flaming emails to

me please. :-)

>

> Carol

> Trishasmom

> She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

>

> If we always do what we always did,

> we'll always get what we've always gotten!

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Carol and all. I sort of think everyone is saying the same thing

here. Yes, this is a hard job and Carol is just saying we all make

mistakes, even as much as we love our children with all our hearts,

and mistakes are different than acts done on purpose.(I worked as a

sub. often in s class so I guess I am coming from both

directions)maybe these laws about bus checking really need to be

inforced more than they have been. I really think all you great

folks are saying similar things but just in different ways. this is

a great group and we all have different opinions but at the same

time feel the same about what is really important, our children,

love all you guys. Dawn

>

> In a message dated 9/29/2005 12:02:33 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

> dan_canale@y... writes:

>

> This just happened in New York to a child who fell asleep and the

bus driver

> and matron are being brought up on child endangerment charges and

could face

> a year in prison. I think this is absolutely appropriate as

checking the bus

> for sleeping children is a fundamental part of the job and

required by law

> in NY state.

>

>

>

> ok this just might get me kicked of this list but I just have to

ask. If it

> is appropriate to send someone to jail because they did not do a

walk

> through and causes child endangerment apply to us parents as

well? What about

> those of us who send our kids to camp or other places and they

are lost or abused

> should we not be brought up on charges as well, I mean after all

we could

> have gone to those places and did a walk through to make sure all

was well. We

> could have kept our kids home we could have sent a shadow etc,

etc. Again

> yes, I think discipline is appropriate but the right kind of

discipline along

> with the right kind of training. It is so easy to sit back and

say what

> should happen and what should be done about it, but how many of

us know both

> sides to the story? I'm not making excuses because it just makes

sense to check

> but we are all human and as much as we don't want to admit it, we

all do make

> mistakes. Was this the first time this happened to these people?

If so

> wouldn't it be more appropriate to re-train them get an aid for

the child etc.

> If this was the second time, then again, more training and maybe

suspended

> with no pay for an appropriate amount of time, 3rd time? then yes

it's time for

> removal. I so wish everyone would take the time to reflect on

how they would

> feel if they are the person being discussed. How would any of us

feel if we

> made a mistake and everyone wanted us to be put in prison. If we

have

> learned nothing else through all of our years of dealing with

special needs, I

> would hope we have learned the value of tolerance, acceptance,

finding solutions

> and advocating to make changes. This is not directed at any one

person just

> my thoughts in general as I have been reading on several

different boards

> and when it comes to the schools we expect them to show us

tolerance and

> acceptance but it appears we aren't quite ready yet to do so

ourselves. I cannot

> stress enough how important it is that we come together and work

together as a

> team to find solutions because until we do this it will continue

to be long

> battles and frustrations across the board for everyone. I most

likely stand

> alone in my beliefs but that is ok. I'm not trying to change

anyone's

> opinions, just stating my own. So don't send flaming emails to

me please. :-)

>

> Carol

> Trishasmom

> She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

>

> If we always do what we always did,

> we'll always get what we've always gotten!

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

very good idea Carol!!! Dawn

>

>

> In a message dated 9/29/2005 5:35:43 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,

> momof3oneds@s... writes:

>

> Well, that was a good thing you did.. seems we should ALL double

> check what our drivers do JUST in case.. you can never be to

> careful!!!!

>

>

>

> True, but I look at it as being supportive as well. We want to

make sure

> their jobs are no harder than they have to be as well so if we

can help to

> remind them and in such a way that doesn't look like we don't

trust them but

> more of a can you tell me your procedure so I am familiar then

you also avoid

> the distrust syndrome. :-) The other thing the bus driver said

to me which

> made perfect sense was that if your child is not going to be

riding the bus to

> let the drivers know before hand if possible because sometimes

parents take

> their kids to school and then let them ride the bus home and

while it's true

> all buses should be checked daily morning and noon, it just might

help prevent

> mishaps like this in the future and also if you are going to be

picking your

> child up early let the driver know because otherwise they are

waiting for

> that child to come out to get on the bus and can't leave the bus

if there

> aren't any aids to go find out where the child is and they can't

just keep sitting

> there holding all the other kids from getting home. So it's a

common

> courtesy on our parts as parents to keep the drivers updated as

to what is going

> on. I think that is very reasonable request and while I do

inform the driver

> of when I will be picking her up or taking her to school it was

a good

> refresher for me as well. :-)

>

> Carol

> Trishasmom

> She isn't typical, She's Trisha!

>

> If we always do what we always did,

> we'll always get what we've always gotten!

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

HI, I haven't posted in a long long time but I had to comment on this one. I am

an attendant on a special ed bus and I do not see how a child can be forgotten.

I always make sure all the children get off safely. That being said, I cetainly

do not think prison is the answer for punishment.

Pam mom to identical twins Hannah (DS) and (DS-ASD) age 10

ViPorier@... wrote:

Hi Carol,

No direspect intended toward you, but I will tell you this...if someone left

my son on the bus drove it to the station and left my son there, I certainly

would not stand for that person to just get a warning not to do it again!!

I was a substitute aide for 2 years I could be called to be an aide in the

school office , kindergarten, special ed classroom or on the bus.. believe me

we checked the bus before we left/ Sorry no excuse for this. I feel so sad

for that little boy and his mom. I have no desire to stick up for the aide on

that bus/ sorry i don't get where your coming from!!

Viola

mom to tammy21, tania18, and kyle13 DS AND PDD (ons)

[Guest guest]

Pam, Glad to know there are people out there that really care about

mine and your kids.I do not see how they could unless the child does

only ride like once a week and maybe the child feel asleep.I never

make excuses for people that don't make sure they do their job well

but maybe this happened??No I think prison is a bit harsh but they

are really lucky the boy did not turn up missing. Let them be more

cautious in the future and maybe this was their warning to pay

better attention.Cyndi

> HI, I haven't posted in a long long time but I had to comment on

this one. I am an attendant on a special ed bus and I do not see how

a child can be forgotten. I always make sure all the children get

off safely. That being said, I cetainly do not think prison is the

answer for punishment.

>

> Pam mom to identical twins Hannah (DS) and (DS-ASD) age 10

>

> ViPorier@a... wrote:

> Hi Carol,

>

> No direspect intended toward you, but I will tell you this...if

someone left

> my son on the bus drove it to the station and left my son there, I

certainly

> would not stand for that person to just get a warning not to do it

again!!

> I was a substitute aide for 2 years I could be called to be an

aide in the

> school office , kindergarten, special ed classroom or on the bus..

believe me

> we checked the bus before we left/ Sorry no excuse for this. I

feel so sad

> for that little boy and his mom. I have no desire to stick up for

the aide on

> that bus/ sorry i don't get where your coming from!!

>

> Viola

> mom to tammy21, tania18, and kyle13 DS AND PDD (ons)

>

>

>