Re: have i totally lost it?

[Guest guest]

Nada will not let anyone come over to her house unless she has

cleaned exactly like she idealizes it in her mind. Keeps all the bed

room doors shut also, so they can't judge her; whoever she thinks they

are. My mother runs water you like would believe; hot scalding water

to clean her dishes until her hands crack and bleed during the

Michigan winter. I think that is how she knows shes doing a good job.

Ruined holidays, graduation, friends coming over, playing etc. I'll

never look at home maintence and cleaning the same way again.

>

> I'm not sure if any of anyone else's nada's are clean freaks....but

my nada

> and her mother (now deceased) have this thing about cleaning...i should

> clarify that her mother....actually DID keep her house very clean...like

> obsessive compulsive type clean...you really and truly wouldn't have a

> problem eating off of her kitchen floor. Nada has always had this

" thing "

> about cleaning....but her house definately doesn't reflect

it....while the

> floors are kept pretty clean, the entire house has always had a chaotic

> theme to it....very cluttered...littered with incomplete

projects...such as

> partially wallpapered rooms. I'm being pretty generous when I

simply refer

> to her house as cluttered. Does she clean? Of course she

does....that being

> said, unlike my grandmother's house, you don't feel the need to kick off

> your shoes before walking in the house...you feel completely comfortable

> plopping down on the sofa. It doesn't have that " museum " feeling to

it.

> Nada has, however been very critical of EVERYONE....i can remember

as a very

> small child, driving past people's homes...i remember the scorn on

her face.

> .her being very animated and insistant on telling me that those

homes were

> filthy on the inside...people like that don't know how to properly

clean.

> She has always had this thing about cleaning....to a point that when my

> husband and i got our first place, I would have anxiety attacks

before nada

> would come over. I was constantly obsessing over my house being clean

> enough....because, let's face it...her visit could really come at

any moment

> At one point I actually packed up my children and left my husband

because

> of how he placed towels in the closet. Despite almost killing myself

> cleaning my home, when nada would visit she would always have this

look on

> her face like she ate something sour...no matter how sanitary i kept my

> house, she was still displeased...making nasty comments about how

she was

> sure i was " hiding " how the house really was.....this after I lost a

child..

> because I cleaned my kitchen floors three times per day with a

> bleach/ammonia/alcohol mixture. It seemed like the more i killed

myself,

> the more displeasure she voiced. Finally, my husband said enough...and

> pointed out that i was setting myself up for failure. My health was

> suffering because of HER obsession....and setting up a very unhealthy

> environment for our children. From that day forward, I had to set

up my own

> goals, for my own reasons. Is my house clean? I have children...so

I do

> what I can...we have a list of chores and most days they get

done....some

> days they don't....but i don't lose sleep over it. and guess

what....nada

> has the SAME displeased look on her face when she used to be allowed

at my

> house. Nothing has changed....except my mental health....instead of

feeling

> like a failure because my house was like an operating room, i fill

my spare

> time spending time with my family....or doing other things that i enjoy.

>

> So here is the deal....last weekend nada and fada went to nada's

sister's

> house to help move her out of her house....my aunt is going through

an very

> ugly divorce...mostly a result of nada's meddling and manipulation.

My aunt

> has temporarily moved in with nada....and her every move has been a

> manipulation of nada....totally sick. When I made a visit to my

mailbox on

> Sunday (hubby and I were out of town Saturday and didn't get the

mail) she

> raced out....she was anxious to tell me about " helping " out my aunt. Of

> course her first words were words of victimization....how fada has been

> real bad " ....critical and monitoring her every move...finally, after

some

> persuasion about wanting to hear how MY AUNT was this was her

comment " well

> HE wasn't there " (meaning my aunt's husband) " and you won't believe

this...

> her house isn't as clean as we always thought....the house was

dusty, and

> there were cobwebs in the corner of the room...so her NICE house is just

> like all the rest of those big houses in those rich

neighborhoods...when you

> really get down to it, they are all just filthy. " She had that sour

look on

> her face she used to have when she used to visit my house. With a

wave of

> my hand, I walked quickly back to my house. While I stood over my sink

> washing dishes that night I couldn't help but break down in

tears....partly

> because I was relieved that my husband pointed out how she was so

many years

> ago...bringing me to the " freedom " from her critical ways so many

years ago.

> ..and partly for my Aunt....she has been so manipulated by so many

people

> for her entire life...and will no doubtedly live the rest of her

life that

> way. How could anyone go into someone's home, help them pack up 12

years of

> their life while they are sobbing, and count spots on dishes? Never

once

> did she reflect on how my aunt was doing....just nasty comments

about spotty

> dishes, and cobwebs.... " you know what? " she spewed.... " i asked her if he

> allowed her to run the dishwasher and she said he did....but i don't

believe

> it...i think they just wiped off the plates and put them back in the

> cupboard. " Have i totally lost it? I mean...i just don't think

that way...

> am i just being critical of nada now?? Picking apart everything she

says??

> Unless someone expects me to eat off of it, i could care less HOW

someone

> washes their dishes...even then, I am grateful first of the

meal....i don't

> insult very easily when i am a guest in someone's home....i may turn

my nose

> up a bit if something is extremely disgusting(i have another aunt

who has

> over 2 dozen cats...and about 4 dogs.....she has ONE litterbox for

all of

> them in the kitchen....she allows the cats to eat straight off the

kitchen

> counter...and finds it charming when the dogs " mark " the furniture....

> little doggie deposits all over the house and cats that eat smelly

canned

> food straight off the kitchen counter....now that churns my stomach

when i

> visit....so i never go there hungry)

>

> So does anyone else think i'm just ripping nada apart here? Sometimes I

> worry now that I find fault in EVERYTHING nada does....unable to

tell the

> difference anymore....afterall....until about 14 years ago, I didn't

realize

> that she was doing ANYTHING sick. Now i feel like EVERYTHING she

does is

> sick.

>

>

> Kisses and Nibbles,

> Bunny

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Beach Bunny,

Anybody would lose it if they lived with or around their nada or fada, who

didn't respect boundaries, and they don't b/c that is the nature of their

disorder and relationship. I guess what I am wondering is what do you expect?

Greg.

have i totally lost it?

I'm not sure if any of anyone else's nada's are clean freaks....but my nada

and her mother (now deceased) have this thing about cleaning...i should

clarify that her mother....actually DID keep her house very clean...like

obsessive compulsive type clean...you really and truly wouldn't have a

problem eating off of her kitchen floor. Nada has always had this " thing "

about cleaning.... but her house definately doesn't reflect it....while the

floors are kept pretty clean, the entire house has always had a chaotic

theme to it....very cluttered... littered with incomplete projects...such as

partially wallpapered rooms. I'm being pretty generous when I simply refer

to her house as cluttered. Does she clean? Of course she does....that being

said, unlike my grandmother' s house, you don't feel the need to kick off

your shoes before walking in the house...you feel completely comfortable

plopping down on the sofa. It doesn't have that " museum " feeling to it.

Nada has, however been very critical of EVERYONE.... i can remember as a very

small child, driving past people's homes...i remember the scorn on her face.

..her being very animated and insistant on telling me that those homes were

filthy on the inside...people like that don't know how to properly clean.

She has always had this thing about cleaning.... to a point that when my

husband and i got our first place, I would have anxiety attacks before nada

would come over. I was constantly obsessing over my house being clean

enough....because, let's face it...her visit could really come at any moment

At one point I actually packed up my children and left my husband because

of how he placed towels in the closet. Despite almost killing myself

cleaning my home, when nada would visit she would always have this look on

her face like she ate something sour...no matter how sanitary i kept my

house, she was still displeased.. .making nasty comments about how she was

sure i was " hiding " how the house really was.....this after I lost a child..

because I cleaned my kitchen floors three times per day with a

bleach/ammonia/ alcohol mixture. It seemed like the more i killed myself,

the more displeasure she voiced. Finally, my husband said enough...and

pointed out that i was setting myself up for failure. My health was

suffering because of HER obsession... .and setting up a very unhealthy

environment for our children. From that day forward, I had to set up my own

goals, for my own reasons. Is my house clean? I have children...so I do

what I can...we have a list of chores and most days they get done....some

days they don't....but i don't lose sleep over it. and guess what....nada

has the SAME displeased look on her face when she used to be allowed at my

house. Nothing has changed....except my mental health....instead of feeling

like a failure because my house was like an operating room, i fill my spare

time spending time with my family....or doing other things that i enjoy.

So here is the deal....last weekend nada and fada went to nada's sister's

house to help move her out of her house....my aunt is going through an very

ugly divorce...mostly a result of nada's meddling and manipulation. My aunt

has temporarily moved in with nada....and her every move has been a

manipulation of nada....totally sick. When I made a visit to my mailbox on

Sunday (hubby and I were out of town Saturday and didn't get the mail) she

raced out....she was anxious to tell me about " helping " out my aunt. Of

course her first words were words of victimization. ...how fada has been

real bad " ....critical and monitoring her every move...finally, after some

persuasion about wanting to hear how MY AUNT was this was her comment " well

HE wasn't there " (meaning my aunt's husband) " and you won't believe this...

her house isn't as clean as we always thought....the house was dusty, and

there were cobwebs in the corner of the room...so her NICE house is just

like all the rest of those big houses in those rich neighborhoods. ..when you

really get down to it, they are all just filthy. " She had that sour look on

her face she used to have when she used to visit my house. With a wave of

my hand, I walked quickly back to my house. While I stood over my sink

washing dishes that night I couldn't help but break down in tears....partly

because I was relieved that my husband pointed out how she was so many years

ago...bringing me to the " freedom " from her critical ways so many years ago.

...and partly for my Aunt....she has been so manipulated by so many people

for her entire life...and will no doubtedly live the rest of her life that

way. How could anyone go into someone's home, help them pack up 12 years of

their life while they are sobbing, and count spots on dishes? Never once

did she reflect on how my aunt was doing....just nasty comments about spotty

dishes, and cobwebs.... " you know what? " she spewed.... " i asked her if he

allowed her to run the dishwasher and she said he did....but i don't believe

it...i think they just wiped off the plates and put them back in the

cupboard. " Have i totally lost it? I mean...i just don't think that way...

am i just being critical of nada now?? Picking apart everything she says??

Unless someone expects me to eat off of it, i could care less HOW someone

washes their dishes...even then, I am grateful first of the meal....i don't

insult very easily when i am a guest in someone's home....i may turn my nose

up a bit if something is extremely disgusting(i have another aunt who has

over 2 dozen cats...and about 4 dogs.....she has ONE litterbox for all of

them in the kitchen....she allows the cats to eat straight off the kitchen

counter...and finds it charming when the dogs " mark " the furniture... .

little doggie deposits all over the house and cats that eat smelly canned

food straight off the kitchen counter....now that churns my stomach when i

visit....so i never go there hungry)

So does anyone else think i'm just ripping nada apart here? Sometimes I

worry now that I find fault in EVERYTHING nada does....unable to tell the

difference anymore....afterall ....until about 14 years ago, I didn't realize

that she was doing ANYTHING sick. Now i feel like EVERYTHING she does is

sick.

Kisses and Nibbles,

Bunny

[Guest guest]

YeahYYY, , We are around the 3 month, NO CONTACT with INSANITY Mark!! Yes!

Congratulations to both of us and I am so proud of you and me!!

((((((((((((((((((((((()))))))))))))))))))))

Greg.

Re: have i totally lost it?

Nada will not let anyone come over to her house unless she has

cleaned exactly like she idealizes it in her mind. Keeps all the bed

room doors shut also, so they can't judge her; whoever she thinks they

are. My mother runs water you like would believe; hot scalding water

to clean her dishes until her hands crack and bleed during the

Michigan winter. I think that is how she knows shes doing a good job.

Ruined holidays, graduation, friends coming over, playing etc. I'll

never look at home maintence and cleaning the same way again.

>

> I'm not sure if any of anyone else's nada's are clean freaks....but

my nada

> and her mother (now deceased) have this thing about cleaning...i should

> clarify that her mother....actually DID keep her house very clean...like

> obsessive compulsive type clean...you really and truly wouldn't have a

> problem eating off of her kitchen floor. Nada has always had this

" thing "

> about cleaning.... but her house definately doesn't reflect

it....while the

> floors are kept pretty clean, the entire house has always had a chaotic

> theme to it....very cluttered... littered with incomplete

projects...such as

> partially wallpapered rooms. I'm being pretty generous when I

simply refer

> to her house as cluttered. Does she clean? Of course she

does....that being

> said, unlike my grandmother' s house, you don't feel the need to kick off

> your shoes before walking in the house...you feel completely comfortable

> plopping down on the sofa. It doesn't have that " museum " feeling to

it.

> Nada has, however been very critical of EVERYONE.... i can remember

as a very

> small child, driving past people's homes...i remember the scorn on

her face.

> .her being very animated and insistant on telling me that those

homes were

> filthy on the inside...people like that don't know how to properly

clean.

> She has always had this thing about cleaning.... to a point that when my

> husband and i got our first place, I would have anxiety attacks

before nada

> would come over. I was constantly obsessing over my house being clean

> enough....because, let's face it...her visit could really come at

any moment

> At one point I actually packed up my children and left my husband

because

> of how he placed towels in the closet. Despite almost killing myself

> cleaning my home, when nada would visit she would always have this

look on

> her face like she ate something sour...no matter how sanitary i kept my

> house, she was still displeased.. .making nasty comments about how

she was

> sure i was " hiding " how the house really was.....this after I lost a

child..

> because I cleaned my kitchen floors three times per day with a

> bleach/ammonia/ alcohol mixture. It seemed like the more i killed

myself,

> the more displeasure she voiced. Finally, my husband said enough...and

> pointed out that i was setting myself up for failure. My health was

> suffering because of HER obsession... .and setting up a very unhealthy

> environment for our children. From that day forward, I had to set

up my own

> goals, for my own reasons. Is my house clean? I have children...so

I do

> what I can...we have a list of chores and most days they get

done....some

> days they don't....but i don't lose sleep over it. and guess

what....nada

> has the SAME displeased look on her face when she used to be allowed

at my

> house. Nothing has changed....except my mental health....instead of

feeling

> like a failure because my house was like an operating room, i fill

my spare

> time spending time with my family....or doing other things that i enjoy.

>

> So here is the deal....last weekend nada and fada went to nada's

sister's

> house to help move her out of her house....my aunt is going through

an very

> ugly divorce...mostly a result of nada's meddling and manipulation.

My aunt

> has temporarily moved in with nada....and her every move has been a

> manipulation of nada....totally sick. When I made a visit to my

mailbox on

> Sunday (hubby and I were out of town Saturday and didn't get the

mail) she

> raced out....she was anxious to tell me about " helping " out my aunt. Of

> course her first words were words of victimization. ...how fada has been

> real bad " ....critical and monitoring her every move...finally, after

some

> persuasion about wanting to hear how MY AUNT was this was her

comment " well

> HE wasn't there " (meaning my aunt's husband) " and you won't believe

this...

> her house isn't as clean as we always thought....the house was

dusty, and

> there were cobwebs in the corner of the room...so her NICE house is just

> like all the rest of those big houses in those rich

neighborhoods. ..when you

> really get down to it, they are all just filthy. " She had that sour

look on

> her face she used to have when she used to visit my house. With a

wave of

> my hand, I walked quickly back to my house. While I stood over my sink

> washing dishes that night I couldn't help but break down in

tears....partly

> because I was relieved that my husband pointed out how she was so

many years

> ago...bringing me to the " freedom " from her critical ways so many

years ago.

> ..and partly for my Aunt....she has been so manipulated by so many

people

> for her entire life...and will no doubtedly live the rest of her

life that

> way. How could anyone go into someone's home, help them pack up 12

years of

> their life while they are sobbing, and count spots on dishes? Never

once

> did she reflect on how my aunt was doing....just nasty comments

about spotty

> dishes, and cobwebs.... " you know what? " she spewed.... " i asked her if he

> allowed her to run the dishwasher and she said he did....but i don't

believe

> it...i think they just wiped off the plates and put them back in the

> cupboard. " Have i totally lost it? I mean...i just don't think

that way...

> am i just being critical of nada now?? Picking apart everything she

says??

> Unless someone expects me to eat off of it, i could care less HOW

someone

> washes their dishes...even then, I am grateful first of the

meal....i don't

> insult very easily when i am a guest in someone's home....i may turn

my nose

> up a bit if something is extremely disgusting(i have another aunt

who has

> over 2 dozen cats...and about 4 dogs.....she has ONE litterbox for

all of

> them in the kitchen....she allows the cats to eat straight off the

kitchen

> counter...and finds it charming when the dogs " mark " the furniture... .

> little doggie deposits all over the house and cats that eat smelly

canned

> food straight off the kitchen counter....now that churns my stomach

when i

> visit....so i never go there hungry)

>

> So does anyone else think i'm just ripping nada apart here? Sometimes I

> worry now that I find fault in EVERYTHING nada does....unable to

tell the

> difference anymore....afterall ....until about 14 years ago, I didn't

realize

> that she was doing ANYTHING sick. Now i feel like EVERYTHING she

does is

> sick.

>

>

> Kisses and Nibbles,

> Bunny

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

By the way my place rightnow, is messy. I might clean this weekend if

I find the time, its not gonna be like the end of the world or

anyting, right?

>

> Beach Bunny,

>

> Anybody would lose it if they lived with or around their nada or

fada, who didn't respect boundaries, and they don't b/c that is the

nature of their disorder and relationship. I guess what I am

wondering is what do you expect?

>

> Greg.

>

>

> have i totally lost it?

>

> I'm not sure if any of anyone else's nada's are clean freaks....but

my nada

> and her mother (now deceased) have this thing about cleaning...i should

> clarify that her mother....actually DID keep her house very clean...like

> obsessive compulsive type clean...you really and truly wouldn't have a

> problem eating off of her kitchen floor. Nada has always had this

" thing "

> about cleaning.... but her house definately doesn't reflect

it....while the

> floors are kept pretty clean, the entire house has always had a chaotic

> theme to it....very cluttered... littered with incomplete

projects...such as

> partially wallpapered rooms. I'm being pretty generous when I simply

refer

> to her house as cluttered. Does she clean? Of course she

does....that being

> said, unlike my grandmother' s house, you don't feel the need to

kick off

> your shoes before walking in the house...you feel completely comfortable

> plopping down on the sofa. It doesn't have that " museum " feeling to it.

> Nada has, however been very critical of EVERYONE.... i can remember

as a very

> small child, driving past people's homes...i remember the scorn on

her face.

> .her being very animated and insistant on telling me that those

homes were

> filthy on the inside...people like that don't know how to properly

clean.

> She has always had this thing about cleaning.... to a point that when my

> husband and i got our first place, I would have anxiety attacks

before nada

> would come over. I was constantly obsessing over my house being clean

> enough....because, let's face it...her visit could really come at

any moment

> At one point I actually packed up my children and left my husband

because

> of how he placed towels in the closet. Despite almost killing myself

> cleaning my home, when nada would visit she would always have this

look on

> her face like she ate something sour...no matter how sanitary i kept my

> house, she was still displeased.. .making nasty comments about how

she was

> sure i was " hiding " how the house really was.....this after I lost a

child..

> because I cleaned my kitchen floors three times per day with a

> bleach/ammonia/ alcohol mixture. It seemed like the more i killed

myself,

> the more displeasure she voiced. Finally, my husband said enough...and

> pointed out that i was setting myself up for failure. My health was

> suffering because of HER obsession... .and setting up a very unhealthy

> environment for our children. From that day forward, I had to set up

my own

> goals, for my own reasons. Is my house clean? I have children...so I do

> what I can...we have a list of chores and most days they get

done....some

> days they don't....but i don't lose sleep over it. and guess

what....nada

> has the SAME displeased look on her face when she used to be allowed

at my

> house. Nothing has changed....except my mental health....instead of

feeling

> like a failure because my house was like an operating room, i fill

my spare

> time spending time with my family....or doing other things that i

enjoy.

>

> So here is the deal....last weekend nada and fada went to nada's

sister's

> house to help move her out of her house....my aunt is going through

an very

> ugly divorce...mostly a result of nada's meddling and manipulation.

My aunt

> has temporarily moved in with nada....and her every move has been a

> manipulation of nada....totally sick. When I made a visit to my

mailbox on

> Sunday (hubby and I were out of town Saturday and didn't get the

mail) she

> raced out....she was anxious to tell me about " helping " out my aunt. Of

> course her first words were words of victimization. ...how fada has

been

> real bad " ....critical and monitoring her every move...finally, after

some

> persuasion about wanting to hear how MY AUNT was this was her

comment " well

> HE wasn't there " (meaning my aunt's husband) " and you won't believe

this...

> her house isn't as clean as we always thought....the house was

dusty, and

> there were cobwebs in the corner of the room...so her NICE house is just

> like all the rest of those big houses in those rich neighborhoods.

...when you

> really get down to it, they are all just filthy. " She had that sour

look on

> her face she used to have when she used to visit my house. With a

wave of

> my hand, I walked quickly back to my house. While I stood over my sink

> washing dishes that night I couldn't help but break down in

tears....partly

> because I was relieved that my husband pointed out how she was so

many years

> ago...bringing me to the " freedom " from her critical ways so many

years ago.

> ..and partly for my Aunt....she has been so manipulated by so many

people

> for her entire life...and will no doubtedly live the rest of her

life that

> way. How could anyone go into someone's home, help them pack up 12

years of

> their life while they are sobbing, and count spots on dishes? Never once

> did she reflect on how my aunt was doing....just nasty comments

about spotty

> dishes, and cobwebs.... " you know what? " she spewed.... " i asked her

if he

> allowed her to run the dishwasher and she said he did....but i don't

believe

> it...i think they just wiped off the plates and put them back in the

> cupboard. " Have i totally lost it? I mean...i just don't think that

way...

> am i just being critical of nada now?? Picking apart everything she

says??

> Unless someone expects me to eat off of it, i could care less HOW

someone

> washes their dishes...even then, I am grateful first of the

meal....i don't

> insult very easily when i am a guest in someone's home....i may turn

my nose

> up a bit if something is extremely disgusting(i have another aunt

who has

> over 2 dozen cats...and about 4 dogs.....she has ONE litterbox for

all of

> them in the kitchen....she allows the cats to eat straight off the

kitchen

> counter...and finds it charming when the dogs " mark " the furniture... .

> little doggie deposits all over the house and cats that eat smelly

canned

> food straight off the kitchen counter....now that churns my stomach

when i

> visit....so i never go there hungry)

>

> So does anyone else think i'm just ripping nada apart here? Sometimes I

> worry now that I find fault in EVERYTHING nada does....unable to

tell the

> difference anymore....afterall ....until about 14 years ago, I

didn't realize

> that she was doing ANYTHING sick. Now i feel like EVERYTHING she does is

> sick.

>

>

> Kisses and Nibbles,

> Bunny

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

By the way my place rightnow, is messy. I might clean this weekend if

I find the time, its not gonna be like the end of the world or

anyting, right?

>

> Beach Bunny,

>

> Anybody would lose it if they lived with or around their nada or

fada, who didn't respect boundaries, and they don't b/c that is the

nature of their disorder and relationship. I guess what I am

wondering is what do you expect?

>

> Greg.

>

>

> have i totally lost it?

>

> I'm not sure if any of anyone else's nada's are clean freaks....but

my nada

> and her mother (now deceased) have this thing about cleaning...i should

> clarify that her mother....actually DID keep her house very clean...like

> obsessive compulsive type clean...you really and truly wouldn't have a

> problem eating off of her kitchen floor. Nada has always had this

" thing "

> about cleaning.... but her house definately doesn't reflect

it....while the

> floors are kept pretty clean, the entire house has always had a chaotic

> theme to it....very cluttered... littered with incomplete

projects...such as

> partially wallpapered rooms. I'm being pretty generous when I simply

refer

> to her house as cluttered. Does she clean? Of course she

does....that being

> said, unlike my grandmother' s house, you don't feel the need to

kick off

> your shoes before walking in the house...you feel completely comfortable

> plopping down on the sofa. It doesn't have that " museum " feeling to it.

> Nada has, however been very critical of EVERYONE.... i can remember

as a very

> small child, driving past people's homes...i remember the scorn on

her face.

> .her being very animated and insistant on telling me that those

homes were

> filthy on the inside...people like that don't know how to properly

clean.

> She has always had this thing about cleaning.... to a point that when my

> husband and i got our first place, I would have anxiety attacks

before nada

> would come over. I was constantly obsessing over my house being clean

> enough....because, let's face it...her visit could really come at

any moment

> At one point I actually packed up my children and left my husband

because

> of how he placed towels in the closet. Despite almost killing myself

> cleaning my home, when nada would visit she would always have this

look on

> her face like she ate something sour...no matter how sanitary i kept my

> house, she was still displeased.. .making nasty comments about how

she was

> sure i was " hiding " how the house really was.....this after I lost a

child..

> because I cleaned my kitchen floors three times per day with a

> bleach/ammonia/ alcohol mixture. It seemed like the more i killed

myself,

> the more displeasure she voiced. Finally, my husband said enough...and

> pointed out that i was setting myself up for failure. My health was

> suffering because of HER obsession... .and setting up a very unhealthy

> environment for our children. From that day forward, I had to set up

my own

> goals, for my own reasons. Is my house clean? I have children...so I do

> what I can...we have a list of chores and most days they get

done....some

> days they don't....but i don't lose sleep over it. and guess

what....nada

> has the SAME displeased look on her face when she used to be allowed

at my

> house. Nothing has changed....except my mental health....instead of

feeling

> like a failure because my house was like an operating room, i fill

my spare

> time spending time with my family....or doing other things that i

enjoy.

>

> So here is the deal....last weekend nada and fada went to nada's

sister's

> house to help move her out of her house....my aunt is going through

an very

> ugly divorce...mostly a result of nada's meddling and manipulation.

My aunt

> has temporarily moved in with nada....and her every move has been a

> manipulation of nada....totally sick. When I made a visit to my

mailbox on

> Sunday (hubby and I were out of town Saturday and didn't get the

mail) she

> raced out....she was anxious to tell me about " helping " out my aunt. Of

> course her first words were words of victimization. ...how fada has

been

> real bad " ....critical and monitoring her every move...finally, after

some

> persuasion about wanting to hear how MY AUNT was this was her

comment " well

> HE wasn't there " (meaning my aunt's husband) " and you won't believe

this...

> her house isn't as clean as we always thought....the house was

dusty, and

> there were cobwebs in the corner of the room...so her NICE house is just

> like all the rest of those big houses in those rich neighborhoods.

...when you

> really get down to it, they are all just filthy. " She had that sour

look on

> her face she used to have when she used to visit my house. With a

wave of

> my hand, I walked quickly back to my house. While I stood over my sink

> washing dishes that night I couldn't help but break down in

tears....partly

> because I was relieved that my husband pointed out how she was so

many years

> ago...bringing me to the " freedom " from her critical ways so many

years ago.

> ..and partly for my Aunt....she has been so manipulated by so many

people

> for her entire life...and will no doubtedly live the rest of her

life that

> way. How could anyone go into someone's home, help them pack up 12

years of

> their life while they are sobbing, and count spots on dishes? Never once

> did she reflect on how my aunt was doing....just nasty comments

about spotty

> dishes, and cobwebs.... " you know what? " she spewed.... " i asked her

if he

> allowed her to run the dishwasher and she said he did....but i don't

believe

> it...i think they just wiped off the plates and put them back in the

> cupboard. " Have i totally lost it? I mean...i just don't think that

way...

> am i just being critical of nada now?? Picking apart everything she

says??

> Unless someone expects me to eat off of it, i could care less HOW

someone

> washes their dishes...even then, I am grateful first of the

meal....i don't

> insult very easily when i am a guest in someone's home....i may turn

my nose

> up a bit if something is extremely disgusting(i have another aunt

who has

> over 2 dozen cats...and about 4 dogs.....she has ONE litterbox for

all of

> them in the kitchen....she allows the cats to eat straight off the

kitchen

> counter...and finds it charming when the dogs " mark " the furniture... .

> little doggie deposits all over the house and cats that eat smelly

canned

> food straight off the kitchen counter....now that churns my stomach

when i

> visit....so i never go there hungry)

>

> So does anyone else think i'm just ripping nada apart here? Sometimes I

> worry now that I find fault in EVERYTHING nada does....unable to

tell the

> difference anymore....afterall ....until about 14 years ago, I

didn't realize

> that she was doing ANYTHING sick. Now i feel like EVERYTHING she does is

> sick.

>

>

> Kisses and Nibbles,

> Bunny

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

It becomes their substitute for interacting with people -- and order

outside makes them feel secure inside.

I'll bet if somebody messed with her order -- say, someone was over

and messed something up, there would be hell to pay -- right?

Eventually they nurture things more than people.

I remember a BPD I worked with who kept her house neat as a pin --

she wouldn't even sleep inside the covers of her own bed. It was

like she was observing her own life. Her tidy house represented the

perfection she DIDN'T feel.

And she lived alone! It's not like she was constantly cleaning up

messes!

-Kyla

>

> I'm not sure if any of anyone else's nada's are clean

freaks....but my nada

> and her mother (now deceased) have this thing about cleaning...i

should

> clarify that her mother....actually DID keep her house very

clean...like

> obsessive compulsive type clean...you really and truly wouldn't

have a

> problem eating off of her kitchen floor. Nada has always had

this " thing "

> about cleaning....but her house definately doesn't reflect

it....while the

> floors are kept pretty clean, the entire house has always had a

chaotic

> theme to it....very cluttered...littered with incomplete

projects...such as

> partially wallpapered rooms. I'm being pretty generous when I

simply refer

> to her house as cluttered. Does she clean? Of course she

does....that being

> said, unlike my grandmother's house, you don't feel the need to

kick off

> your shoes before walking in the house...you feel completely

comfortable

> plopping down on the sofa. It doesn't have that " museum " feeling

to it.

> Nada has, however been very critical of EVERYONE....i can remember

as a very

> small child, driving past people's homes...i remember the scorn on

her face.

> .her being very animated and insistant on telling me that those

homes were

> filthy on the inside...people like that don't know how to properly

clean.

> She has always had this thing about cleaning....to a point that

when my

> husband and i got our first place, I would have anxiety attacks

before nada

> would come over. I was constantly obsessing over my house being

clean

> enough....because, let's face it...her visit could really come at

any moment

> At one point I actually packed up my children and left my

husband because

> of how he placed towels in the closet. Despite almost killing

myself

> cleaning my home, when nada would visit she would always have this

look on

> her face like she ate something sour...no matter how sanitary i

kept my

> house, she was still displeased...making nasty comments about how

she was

> sure i was " hiding " how the house really was.....this after I lost

a child..

> because I cleaned my kitchen floors three times per day with a

> bleach/ammonia/alcohol mixture. It seemed like the more i killed

myself,

> the more displeasure she voiced. Finally, my husband said

enough...and

> pointed out that i was setting myself up for failure. My health

was

> suffering because of HER obsession....and setting up a very

unhealthy

> environment for our children. From that day forward, I had to set

up my own

> goals, for my own reasons. Is my house clean? I have

children...so I do

> what I can...we have a list of chores and most days they get

done....some

> days they don't....but i don't lose sleep over it. and guess

what....nada

> has the SAME displeased look on her face when she used to be

allowed at my

> house. Nothing has changed....except my mental health....instead

of feeling

> like a failure because my house was like an operating room, i fill

my spare

> time spending time with my family....or doing other things that i

enjoy.

>

> So here is the deal....last weekend nada and fada went to nada's

sister's

> house to help move her out of her house....my aunt is going

through an very

> ugly divorce...mostly a result of nada's meddling and

manipulation. My aunt

> has temporarily moved in with nada....and her every move has been a

> manipulation of nada....totally sick. When I made a visit to my

mailbox on

> Sunday (hubby and I were out of town Saturday and didn't get the

mail) she

> raced out....she was anxious to tell me about " helping " out my

aunt. Of

> course her first words were words of victimization....how fada has

been

> real bad " ....critical and monitoring her every move...finally,

after some

> persuasion about wanting to hear how MY AUNT was this was her

comment " well

> HE wasn't there " (meaning my aunt's husband) " and you won't

believe this...

> her house isn't as clean as we always thought....the house was

dusty, and

> there were cobwebs in the corner of the room...so her NICE house

is just

> like all the rest of those big houses in those rich

neighborhoods...when you

> really get down to it, they are all just filthy. " She had that

sour look on

> her face she used to have when she used to visit my house. With a

wave of

> my hand, I walked quickly back to my house. While I stood over my

sink

> washing dishes that night I couldn't help but break down in

tears....partly

> because I was relieved that my husband pointed out how she was so

many years

> ago...bringing me to the " freedom " from her critical ways so many

years ago.

> ..and partly for my Aunt....she has been so manipulated by so many

people

> for her entire life...and will no doubtedly live the rest of her

life that

> way. How could anyone go into someone's home, help them pack up

12 years of

> their life while they are sobbing, and count spots on dishes?

Never once

> did she reflect on how my aunt was doing....just nasty comments

about spotty

> dishes, and cobwebs.... " you know what? " she spewed.... " i asked her

if he

> allowed her to run the dishwasher and she said he did....but i

don't believe

> it...i think they just wiped off the plates and put them back in

the

> cupboard. " Have i totally lost it? I mean...i just don't think

that way...

> am i just being critical of nada now?? Picking apart everything

she says??

> Unless someone expects me to eat off of it, i could care less HOW

someone

> washes their dishes...even then, I am grateful first of the

meal....i don't

> insult very easily when i am a guest in someone's home....i may

turn my nose

> up a bit if something is extremely disgusting(i have another aunt

who has

> over 2 dozen cats...and about 4 dogs.....she has ONE litterbox for

all of

> them in the kitchen....she allows the cats to eat straight off

the kitchen

> counter...and finds it charming when the dogs " mark " the

furniture....

> little doggie deposits all over the house and cats that eat smelly

canned

> food straight off the kitchen counter....now that churns my

stomach when i

> visit....so i never go there hungry)

>

> So does anyone else think i'm just ripping nada apart here?

Sometimes I

> worry now that I find fault in EVERYTHING nada does....unable to

tell the

> difference anymore....afterall....until about 14 years ago, I

didn't realize

> that she was doing ANYTHING sick. Now i feel like EVERYTHING she

does is

> sick.

>

>

> Kisses and Nibbles,

> Bunny

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

“Nada has, however been very critical of EVERYONE.... I can remember as a very

small child, driving past people's homes.......I remember the scorn on her

face”……………………dear Bunny, we share the same nada; I recognize the critical

comments and the ugly face of scorn.

“Despite almost killing myself cleaning my home, when nada would visit she

would always have this look on her face like she ate something sour...no matter

how sanitary I kept my house, she was still displeased”.. …………”making nasty

comments” …………......................I reached my breaking point ten years ago

and advised nada and stepfather that they would have to stay in a motel when

they came to visit. Nada nearly passed out she was in such a rage. I stuck to

my guns and she has not been inside my home for ten years.

....”just nasty comments about” ……………….about everything and everyone………..my

nada goes on and on and on and on and on and on with negative talk. I remember

going to lunch with nada and feeling like I would throw up on the table while I

listened to her tirade of negative crap.

“Now I feel like EVERYTHING she does is sick. Kisses and Nibbles,

Bunny”……….honey, she is sick, just like my nada. Blessings, mg

[Guest guest]

, It MIght. If you don't clean your place, I may be forced to never write

to you again. The world's axis may shift, which would be disasterous. ;o)

Greg.

have i totally lost it?

>

> I'm not sure if any of anyone else's nada's are clean freaks....but

my nada

> and her mother (now deceased) have this thing about cleaning...i should

> clarify that her mother....actually DID keep her house very clean...like

> obsessive compulsive type clean...you really and truly wouldn't have a

> problem eating off of her kitchen floor. Nada has always had this

" thing "

> about cleaning.... but her house definately doesn't reflect

it....while the

> floors are kept pretty clean, the entire house has always had a chaotic

> theme to it....very cluttered... littered with incomplete

projects...such as

> partially wallpapered rooms. I'm being pretty generous when I simply

refer

> to her house as cluttered. Does she clean? Of course she

does....that being

> said, unlike my grandmother' s house, you don't feel the need to

kick off

> your shoes before walking in the house...you feel completely comfortable

> plopping down on the sofa. It doesn't have that " museum " feeling to it.

> Nada has, however been very critical of EVERYONE.... i can remember

as a very

> small child, driving past people's homes...i remember the scorn on

her face.

> .her being very animated and insistant on telling me that those

homes were

> filthy on the inside...people like that don't know how to properly

clean.

> She has always had this thing about cleaning.... to a point that when my

> husband and i got our first place, I would have anxiety attacks

before nada

> would come over. I was constantly obsessing over my house being clean

> enough....because, let's face it...her visit could really come at

any moment

> At one point I actually packed up my children and left my husband

because

> of how he placed towels in the closet. Despite almost killing myself

> cleaning my home, when nada would visit she would always have this

look on

> her face like she ate something sour...no matter how sanitary i kept my

> house, she was still displeased.. .making nasty comments about how

she was

> sure i was " hiding " how the house really was.....this after I lost a

child..

> because I cleaned my kitchen floors three times per day with a

> bleach/ammonia/ alcohol mixture. It seemed like the more i killed

myself,

> the more displeasure she voiced. Finally, my husband said enough...and

> pointed out that i was setting myself up for failure. My health was

> suffering because of HER obsession... .and setting up a very unhealthy

> environment for our children. From that day forward, I had to set up

my own

> goals, for my own reasons. Is my house clean? I have children...so I do

> what I can...we have a list of chores and most days they get

done....some

> days they don't....but i don't lose sleep over it. and guess

what....nada

> has the SAME displeased look on her face when she used to be allowed

at my

> house. Nothing has changed....except my mental health....instead of

feeling

> like a failure because my house was like an operating room, i fill

my spare

> time spending time with my family....or doing other things that i

enjoy.

>

> So here is the deal....last weekend nada and fada went to nada's

sister's

> house to help move her out of her house....my aunt is going through

an very

> ugly divorce...mostly a result of nada's meddling and manipulation.

My aunt

> has temporarily moved in with nada....and her every move has been a

> manipulation of nada....totally sick. When I made a visit to my

mailbox on

> Sunday (hubby and I were out of town Saturday and didn't get the

mail) she

> raced out....she was anxious to tell me about " helping " out my aunt. Of

> course her first words were words of victimization. ...how fada has

been

> real bad " ....critical and monitoring her every move...finally, after

some

> persuasion about wanting to hear how MY AUNT was this was her

comment " well

> HE wasn't there " (meaning my aunt's husband) " and you won't believe

this...

> her house isn't as clean as we always thought....the house was

dusty, and

> there were cobwebs in the corner of the room...so her NICE house is just

> like all the rest of those big houses in those rich neighborhoods.

...when you

> really get down to it, they are all just filthy. " She had that sour

look on

> her face she used to have when she used to visit my house. With a

wave of

> my hand, I walked quickly back to my house. While I stood over my sink

> washing dishes that night I couldn't help but break down in

tears....partly

> because I was relieved that my husband pointed out how she was so

many years

> ago...bringing me to the " freedom " from her critical ways so many

years ago.

> ..and partly for my Aunt....she has been so manipulated by so many

people

> for her entire life...and will no doubtedly live the rest of her

life that

> way. How could anyone go into someone's home, help them pack up 12

years of

> their life while they are sobbing, and count spots on dishes? Never once

> did she reflect on how my aunt was doing....just nasty comments

about spotty

> dishes, and cobwebs.... " you know what? " she spewed.... " i asked her

if he

> allowed her to run the dishwasher and she said he did....but i don't

believe

> it...i think they just wiped off the plates and put them back in the

> cupboard. " Have i totally lost it? I mean...i just don't think that

way...

> am i just being critical of nada now?? Picking apart everything she

says??

> Unless someone expects me to eat off of it, i could care less HOW

someone

> washes their dishes...even then, I am grateful first of the

meal....i don't

> insult very easily when i am a guest in someone's home....i may turn

my nose

> up a bit if something is extremely disgusting(i have another aunt

who has

> over 2 dozen cats...and about 4 dogs.....she has ONE litterbox for

all of

> them in the kitchen....she allows the cats to eat straight off the

kitchen

> counter...and finds it charming when the dogs " mark " the furniture... .

> little doggie deposits all over the house and cats that eat smelly

canned

> food straight off the kitchen counter....now that churns my stomach

when i

> visit....so i never go there hungry)

>

> So does anyone else think i'm just ripping nada apart here? Sometimes I

> worry now that I find fault in EVERYTHING nada does....unable to

tell the

> difference anymore....afterall ....until about 14 years ago, I

didn't realize

> that she was doing ANYTHING sick. Now i feel like EVERYTHING she does is

> sick.

>

>

> Kisses and Nibbles,

> Bunny

>

>

>

>