Guest guest Posted December 15, 2006 Report Share Posted December 15, 2006 forgive me for not recalling who it was, but one of our newbies had asked if it was common for nadas to use a split-good sibling to gang up against others? i wanted to offer a grand, sweeping validation on that one. my nada did this to the extreme, and it was one of the core hurts of my life, from which i am still healing. nadas think that everyone is either on their side or against them. my sister was on her side; i was against her, and i was made to pay accordingly. even my dishrag, who usually insists on denial, has admitted to me that he was appalled by the strange worship-festival my nada led when my sister was born, and how i was suddenly cast as the undesirable one. another main theme was that my sister would be given luxury items we couldn't afford, such as mink coats and diamonds, way before she was old enough, and she and nada would literally flaunt it in my face. nada once said to me that my sister got such nice things because i had abandoned her, and my sister stayed with her. but really the mistreatment started way before i left home. so yes, i think many many have experienced this, and please feel free to post any antecdotes about it. i would be interested to hear them, as it would also help validate my own experience. all the best, charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2006 Report Share Posted December 15, 2006 Oh Charlie, when my 'blonde/like nada' sister was born I became the 'other child'. I have vivid memories of being made to care for my siblings, make up for nada's shortcomings ... by age 3 and up. I was the child who was supposed to 'make up to her' for her social shortcomings, her educational failures, her marital immaturity. My little sister became 'her' second life. And it it awful today to see. My sister and her daughters are 'chosen' while me and my sons are outcasts. They have always been given jewels while my sons got sox for xmas... A small insult, but lasting. Hugs, Carol In a message dated 12/15/2006 2:42:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, charlottehoneychurch@... writes: forgive me for not recalling who it was, but one of our newbies had asked if it was common for nadas to use a split-good sibling to gang up against others? i wanted to offer a grand, sweeping validation on that one. my nada did this to the extreme, and it was one of the core hurts of my life, from which i am still healing. nadas think that everyone is either on their side or against them. my sister was on her side; i was against her, and i was made to pay accordingly. even my dishrag, who usually insists on denial, has admitted to me that he was appalled by the strange worship-festival my nada led when my sister was born, and how i was suddenly cast as the undesirable one. another main theme was that my sister would be given luxury items we couldn't afford, such as mink coats and diamonds, way before she was old enough, and she and nada would literally flaunt it in my face. nada once said to me that my sister got such nice things because i had abandoned her, and my sister stayed with her. but really the mistreatment started way before i left home. so yes, i think many many have experienced this, and please feel free to post any antecdotes about it. i would be interested to hear them, as it would also help validate my own experience. all the best, charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 15, 2006 Report Share Posted December 15, 2006 Kristi, Charlie, and All, I sensed the deep frustration about the hypocrisy between how you were treated compared to your siblings. For me, that was one of the toughest things to heal from. I guess that’s because it happened in front of me and at my expense thousands of times. I was still putting two-and-two’s together, comparing my BPD nada and NPD fada behaviors toward my older NPD brother compared to their behaviors toward me, and realizing HUGE differences and completely opposite actions and attitudes, sometimes DECADES after some of those events happened. I used to get very upset about it. In recent years, when I’ve had one of those less and less often realizations, I’ve usually been able to say to myself something like, “There’s another example! Man, were THEY sick!” It seems to shift my focus from my resentful, angry child to my frustrated, irritated adult, and that works better for me. It’s almost like there were parallel universes of the same family enmeshed and existing at the same time: one in which my nada, fada and older brother existed, and one in which they and I existed; my parents seemed willing to deal with ANYthing my brother did, while ignoring, denigrating or punishing most of what I did. I never had an “in” with those people; I was on a permanent “out” with them. Sad. Ouch. I believe that, for me, this is one of those issues which will never be resolved because it never changed. It’s hard to know that most of my life I WASTED MASSIVE amounts of my precious time and energy, and not a little money, trying to have a relationship with those people. However, I know I’m not alone about this and that there are many others like me who continue to let go of all that and slowly heal from it, as time does. This is a SLOW miracle in my life, as valuable to me as the quicker recovery miracles, if not more. One Non-BP Recovering Man --- kchara@... wrote: > > Oh, Charlie, I think you're right on the money!! My > nada has this favorite > story of hers, of driving in a car with Fada > pregnant with my brother, so I > was... less than 1, I'd imagine, when she suddenly > bursts into tears and cries > " I'll never love another child as much as I love > Kristi. " Then she drank > castor oil to induce labor with him aand once he was > born, that was the last > motherly thing she did for me. She tells that story > over and over again to say > what a great mom she was to me, blah blah blah, but > like you, the presents > were out of whack, and the attention was WAY out of > whack. > > My Nada has a thing about looking perfect... I think > I read somewhere a lot > of BP's do. Part of that was us being the > all-American family. And my > brother is the exact part, he's athletic (she loves > sports), he's popular, he got > good grades, very very intelligent. I, on the other > hand, am NOT athletic > (not even a little), was quiet, a little shy, got > decent grades, but nothing > spectacular. He spent his time getting Varsity > letters, and I did choir and > drama. She went to every one of his events, and I > mean every one. With me, > she'd make a curitosy apperance (remember, we had to > look perfect...) and then > ditch. More than once, she ditched me whereever the > performance was, with no > ride. When I confronted her on this, her answer > was " Well I just ENJOY the > things his does more. I really don't care about > singing and that type of > junk. " Nice. > Shortly after that conversation, she made me go be a > manager on the football > team, so she could " go to my stuff too " and then > made me run track in the > fall. Nevermind that I HATED both of them, > nevermind that I worked almost full > time, if I wanted to quit, it had to be one of the > activities I loved. And > nevermind that my brother was the star of both > teams. He was a freshman, I > was a senior. Everybody knew me as " --------'s > sister. " I hated school... > > Oh, then there was the time she didn't let me go on > my spring break with my > best friend's church-going family. These were > really, uniquely GOOD people, > and I couldn't go, b/c you just can't trust girls, > besides, I had to stay and > work. Time I learned responsibility about having a > job (I've held a job > down since the day I turned 14, btw) Brother, on > the other hand, got to go to > Panama City with his girlfriend on his spring break. > Everyone in my family's > tired of hearing me talk about that one, but it > really hurt. More b/c they > implied I couldn't be trusted, I was inately " bad. " > And when it came down to > it, I'm the one who has my life together. He > knocked up his girlfriend > (another one, not the one he went to FL with), he's > living with a third girl, he's > talking about going back to school for the > umpteenth time, he keeps dropping > out. (Now, I don't have a degree, but it's choice. > I stay home with my > children and support Pat's career. If I wanted a > d*** degree I'd get one... > WITHOUT Nada's help!!) That boy can't finish > ANYTHING. And at the time, he was > on drugs (he and Nada used to have joint-rolling > contests. Healthy bonding > there <<rolls eyes>>) and drinking. But I was the > one no one could trust. > > Kristi > > > In a message dated 12/15/2006 2:40:18 PM Eastern > Standard Time, > charlottehoneychurch@... writes: > > orgive me for not recalling who it was, but one of > our newbies had > asked if it was common for nadas to use a > split-good sibling to gang > up against others? i wanted to offer a grand, > sweeping validation on > that one. my nada did this to the extreme, and it > was one of the > core hurts of my life, from which i am still > healing. nadas think > that everyone is either on their side or against > them. my sister was > on her side; i was against her, and i was made to > pay accordingly. > even my dishrag, who usually insists on denial, has > admitted to me > that he was appalled by the strange > worship-festival my nada led when > my sister was born, and how i was suddenly cast as > the undesirable > one. another main theme was that my sister would be > given luxury > items we couldn't afford, such as mink coats and > diamonds, way before > she was old enough, and she and nada would > literally flaunt it in my > face. nada once said to me that my sister got such > nice things > because i had abandoned her, and my sister stayed > with her. but > really the mistreatment started way before i left > home. > > so yes, i think many many have experienced this, > and please feel > free to post any antecdotes about it. i would be > interested to hear > them, as it would also help validate my own > experience. > > all the best, > charlie > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 16, 2006 Report Share Posted December 16, 2006 Carol, Thank you for bring this to light, I thought I was the only one! I can hugely relate to being the outcast or ousted sibling. Its a very bad feeling, its even worse when you accept it as truth and forget yourself along the way, that has come to meet me head on in later relationships. Aweful results... Everyone in my family has Blonde hair and by some rogue gene I have brown hair? From a very early age I was taught by nada that I was inferior and that brunettes were evil/bad people. I can identify with your statement of " being made to care for your siblings.†I gave them all my emotion, time and love. The cost of this was to always be constantly over drawn emotionally and restocked with the entrails of their non- idealized selves. My sister (who was the physical “caretaker†slave of the family) has been NC for three years and me since September 10, so we’ve been healing and jumping out of these roles that were created for us. On Monday I fly home to suburban Detroit to see the foo, according to my sister she just had her hair dyed brown. She didn’t say she did it as support, but her doing so is a loud enough statement in that regard. I know that my brown hair does not make me less than, in the intelligible sense, it more so tangles in the havoc of my subconscious self esteem and the gaze of being. I think my sister is learning to break nada’s rules (which she has defied before only to be marginalized, painted black or labeled a deviant to the foo)with out being subject to nada's voice over that over rides her own judgement; and in doing will allow me to empirically see that although her hair color matches mine, she is still my smart and beautiful sister. I’m hoping little pays great attention to this and observes nada’s truths as false. Kindest regards, > > > Oh Charlie, when my 'blonde/like nada' sister was born I became the 'other > child'. I have vivid memories of being made to care for my siblings, make up > for nada's shortcomings ... by age 3 and up. > > I was the child who was supposed to 'make up to her' for her social > shortcomings, her educational failures, her marital immaturity. My little sister > became 'her' second life. And it it awful today to see. > > My sister and her daughters are 'chosen' while me and my sons are outcasts. > They have always been given jewels while my sons got sox for xmas... A > small insult, but lasting. Hugs, Carol > > > > > In a message dated 12/15/2006 2:42:35 PM Eastern Standard Time, > charlottehoneychurch@... writes: > > forgive me for not recalling who it was, but one of our newbies had > asked if it was common for nadas to use a split-good sibling to gang > up against others? i wanted to offer a grand, sweeping validation on > that one. my nada did this to the extreme, and it was one of the > core hurts of my life, from which i am still healing. nadas think > that everyone is either on their side or against them. my sister was > on her side; i was against her, and i was made to pay accordingly. > even my dishrag, who usually insists on denial, has admitted to me > that he was appalled by the strange worship-festival my nada led when > my sister was born, and how i was suddenly cast as the undesirable > one. another main theme was that my sister would be given luxury > items we couldn't afford, such as mink coats and diamonds, way before > she was old enough, and she and nada would literally flaunt it in my > face. nada once said to me that my sister got such nice things > because i had abandoned her, and my sister stayed with her. but > really the mistreatment started way before i left home. > > so yes, i think many many have experienced this, and please feel > free to post any antecdotes about it. i would be interested to hear > them, as it would also help validate my own experience. > > all the best, > charlie > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 19, 2006 Report Share Posted December 19, 2006 Charlie, Wow that is messed up... flaunting mink coats and stuff? WEIRD. Yes, my nada certainly played us against each other. There were four of us. My stepsister was bad, I was good. My brother was bad, my stepbrother was good. I could (until I got married) do no wrong, I was her " favorite, " and my stepbrother was pretty much the same. Then there was my stepsister. And my brother. Treated like outcasts. I don't know why nadas split people and play them against each other, but they do. Sick. Sorry you had to deal with that crap!!! Take care, Grace > > forgive me for not recalling who it was, but one of our newbies had > asked if it was common for nadas to use a split-good sibling to gang > up against others? i wanted to offer a grand, sweeping validation on > that one. my nada did this to the extreme, and it was one of the > core hurts of my life, from which i am still healing. nadas think > that everyone is either on their side or against them. my sister was > on her side; i was against her, and i was made to pay accordingly. > even my dishrag, who usually insists on denial, has admitted to me > that he was appalled by the strange worship-festival my nada led when > my sister was born, and how i was suddenly cast as the undesirable > one. another main theme was that my sister would be given luxury > items we couldn't afford, such as mink coats and diamonds, way before > she was old enough, and she and nada would literally flaunt it in my > face. nada once said to me that my sister got such nice things > because i had abandoned her, and my sister stayed with her. but > really the mistreatment started way before i left home. > > so yes, i think many many have experienced this, and please feel > free to post any antecdotes about it. i would be interested to hear > them, as it would also help validate my own experience. > > all the best, > charlie > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 22, 2006 Report Share Posted December 22, 2006 Did they ever forget any of you? I mean, literally. This thread has been awesome for me. It's made me remember a lot of times, incidents I think that really helped shape the issues, the " invisibility complex, " for lack of a better term, that I feel. I still, when I see people i knew in High School, (Mind you, I see these people EVERY summer) ask them if they remember me, assume they don't. This year would've been my 10 year HS reunion, I didn't go b/c I didn't want to be embarassed in front of my husband when no one knew who I was. The reason I ask about the forgetting... there was an icindent when I was in, let's see, 4th grade? Nada was the Golden Child's den mother for Scouts. (For MY scouts, I ended up having to constantly leave the troop b/c the leaders were all " crazy. " Go figure.) Anyway, the Golden Child's troop was going to Pizza Hut to learn how to make pizzas. They were getting out of school early, Nada adn Fada were picking them all up (supposed to be me too) and taking them. Supposed to be this really awesome day. Except hours (and I mean HOURS) later, like 6:30 that night, Fada looks at Nada and goes, " Where's Kristi? " Nada goes, " I don't know, thought you had her. " This was at least... 5 hours AFTER they forgot to pick me up. Meanwhile I was stuck at the school by myself with the creepy janitor. They laugh about it now. Golden Child doesn't even remember. (He's repressed a lot of stuff before he hit puberty, I think. Doesn't " remember " a lot, like has big blank spaces that last years.) Anyway, the fact that it even HAPPENED, and that it didn't bother them really shot me to the heart, I think. And there are a million more, I know. The added weight of all of those made me feel invisible, like I'm not worth being noticed, so why in the world would anyone? Anyone else feel like this??? Kristi In a message dated 12/22/2006 3:29:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, nnbp4rcvy@... writes: Walking, Kristi, and All, When my FOO would do something together, I was always the tag-a-long when they did something my NPD older brudda or our parents wanted to do, and BPD nada and NPD fada acted like nothing was wrong. Even when I was old enough to understand if I’d been told, many times I had little or no idea where I was being taken, what we would do, or how long we’d be gone. Regarding my older brudda, it would’ve been natural for me to feel jealous of the amount and quality of time spent on doing what he wanted compared to anything I wanted, but I mainly thought, “What about me? Don’t we get to do ANYthing that I want to do?†It almost NEVER happened. I just wanted some reasonable amount of time spent doing something I wanted, or I ALSO wanted to do. But, who was I to think or know of anything reasonable? My role with them wasn’t to think, it was to do – what they wanted. Now, I want to end this post by wishing all of you happy holidays. One Non-BP Recovering Man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 22, 2006 Report Share Posted December 22, 2006 Walking, Kristi, and All, When my FOO would do something together, I was always the tag-a-long when they did something my NPD older brudda or our parents wanted to do, and BPD nada and NPD fada acted like nothing was wrong. Even when I was old enough to understand if I’d been told, many times I had little or no idea where I was being taken, what we would do, or how long we’d be gone. Regarding my older brudda, it would’ve been natural for me to feel jealous of the amount and quality of time spent on doing what he wanted compared to anything I wanted, but I mainly thought, “What about me? Don’t we get to do ANYthing that I want to do?” It almost NEVER happened. I just wanted some reasonable amount of time spent doing something I wanted, or I ALSO wanted to do. But, who was I to think or know of anything reasonable? My role with them wasn’t to think, it was to do – what they wanted. Now, I want to end this post by wishing all of you happy holidays. One Non-BP Recovering Man --- walkingto happiness wrote: > Kristi, > > I am a little behind on this thread, but i have > to respond. Kristi, did you grow up in the same > family I did? > > Everything you describe is so similar to what > happened to me, my jaw has dropped, I can't believe > it!! > > Nada was in LOVE with my sibling, and then I was > like this ogre in the corner she threw food at > sometimes. One of the ways that has helped me so > much in my healing, is that there is an art form I > completely love, and had I had better parents, my > love and talent for that art form would have been > discovered and encouraged early on, and I would have > excelled at it and made it my career. INSTEAD, just > like you describe, I was always " ____'s sister " and > had to do the activities my sibling did. Things > that I can do because I am versatile and smart, but > not things I loved. In retrospect, I think I was > depressed all of high school because no one bothered > to recognize and encourage my talents. > > My T tells me every week to go and do this art > form that I like. I have found informal groups and > venues to do it in, and I wish I was 15 again > because then this art form would be my career. Too > bad my life took another direction, and I never > received the training I should have. My talent is > lost to the world, because of neglect. But it has > been a large part of my healing to participate in > creating this art form informally, and getting more > training, I have taken a few weekend seminars in > that art form. > > It is a shame, I wonder how much talent has been > wasted because the BP would neglect us and did not > allow us to shine in our true selves. A good parent > would encourage their child to pursue that which > they love and are interested in. > > I asked nada about it in my twenties; " you knew I > was interested in ____; why didn't you let me take > classes in that? " Nada's reply was that there were > no classes available where we lived. That's not > entirely true. Arrangements could have been > made. > > Nada's excuses when I asked her WHY, were so > blatantly just disregarding of me. Like I wasn't > worth the effort, to provide me with classes that > would have given me a much more fulfilling career > and life. Instead, i spent most of life being > clinically depressed and riddled with anxiety and > PTSD. > > So much talent has been wasted! It is a loss to > society! > > Walkingto happiness. > > > > __________________________________________________ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 23, 2006 Report Share Posted December 23, 2006 Kristi, Yes, I was " forgotten " a number of times by both my nada and fada. It was always traumatic. It may have started the " invisibility complex " I also had. I got through that by realizing that I had a right to exist, too. One Non-BP Recovering Man --- kchara@... wrote: > > Did they ever forget any of you? I mean, literally. > This thread has been > awesome for me. It's made me remember a lot of > times, incidents I think that > really helped shape the issues, the " invisibility > complex, " for lack of a > better term, that I feel. I still, when I see > people i knew in High School, > (Mind you, I see these people EVERY summer) ask them > if they remember me, assume > they don't. This year would've been my 10 year HS > reunion, I didn't go b/c > I didn't want to be embarassed in front of my > husband when no one knew who I > was. > > The reason I ask about the forgetting... there was > an icindent when I was > in, let's see, 4th grade? Nada was the Golden > Child's den mother for Scouts. > (For MY scouts, I ended up having to constantly > leave the troop b/c the > leaders were all " crazy. " Go figure.) Anyway, the > Golden Child's troop was going > to Pizza Hut to learn how to make pizzas. They > were getting out of school > early, Nada adn Fada were picking them all up > (supposed to be me too) and > taking them. Supposed to be this really awesome > day. Except hours (and I mean > HOURS) later, like 6:30 that night, Fada looks at > Nada and goes, " Where's > Kristi? " Nada goes, " I don't know, thought you had > her. " This was at least... 5 > hours AFTER they forgot to pick me up. Meanwhile I > was stuck at the school > by myself with the creepy janitor. They laugh > about it now. Golden Child > doesn't even remember. (He's repressed a lot of > stuff before he hit puberty, I > think. Doesn't " remember " a lot, like has big > blank spaces that last > years.) Anyway, the fact that it even HAPPENED, and > that it didn't bother them > really shot me to the heart, I think. And there are > a million more, I know. > The added weight of all of those made me feel > invisible, like I'm not worth > being noticed, so why in the world would anyone? > Anyone else feel like this??? > > Kristi > > In a message dated 12/22/2006 3:29:23 PM Eastern > Standard Time, > nnbp4rcvy@... writes: > > Walking, Kristi, and All, > > When my FOO would do something together, I was > always > the tag-a-long when they did something my NPD older > brudda or our parents wanted to do, and BPD nada and > NPD fada acted like nothing was wrong. Even when I > was old enough to understand if I’d been told, > many > times I had little or no idea where I was being > taken, > what we would do, or how long we’d be gone. > Regarding > my older brudda, it would’ve been natural for me > to > feel jealous of the amount and quality of time > spent > on doing what he wanted compared to anything I > wanted, > but I mainly thought, “What about me? Don’t we > get to > do ANYthing that I want to do?†It almost NEVER > happened. I just wanted some reasonable amount of > time spent doing something I wanted, or I ALSO > wanted > to do. But, who was I to think or know of anything > reasonable? My role with them wasn’t to think, it > was > to do – what they wanted. > > Now, I want to end this post by wishing all of you > happy holidays. > > One Non-BP Recovering Man > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been > removed] > > __________________________________________________ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.