I feel bad - DS wants to see BP & NP grandparents

[Guest guest]

I just felt so bad this morning. My 2.5 year-old son said really

sadly at the table this morning:

" My Grandma and Papa mean to us. They have a time out. I want to

see them. I want to see my Grandma and Papa. "

UUUGGGH! It just pulled on my heart strings. The only thing I

could tell him was " It makes me sad too. I have to ask you to trust

me that we're doing the right thing and I'll explain more when you

get older. "

He seemed ok with this and moved on to another topic.

My therapist had said that kids under 5 don't remember much about

people, so he wouldn't bee too affected. But this guy is super

smart and he knows.

I feel like a heel because I'm keeping them away like Nada kept

other family members away from me and bad mouthed them. I know that

mine is for a healthy reason, but it still sucks and feels

underhanded.

Blech,

a

[Guest guest]

a,

As a parent (and grandparent) I understand what you are going through.

But you are doing the right thing in protecting your son and your

family. Just like you wouldn't let him eat cake, candy and other treats

as a replacement for the nutritious food he needs to grow and develop,

you have to take care of himself in the area of abusive and toxic people

as well. It is responsible parenting to deny our children the bad

things they think want. We have to do this in a loving and caring way,

and in weighing the consequences, his sadness now is possibly nothing

compared to the sadness he would experience if your parents were to have

an influence in your lives. Know that the pain you are feeling is worth

it in protecting your son.

You are not a heel in this case - you are the protector. I don't know

why you think this is being underhanded. I see you as doing what needs

to be done, in spite of how difficult it may be for you at this time.

Take care,

Sylvia

>

> I just felt so bad this morning. My 2.5 year-old son said really

> sadly at the table this morning:

>

> " My Grandma and Papa mean to us. They have a time out. I want to

> see them. I want to see my Grandma and Papa. "

>

> UUUGGGH! It just pulled on my heart strings. The only thing I

> could tell him was " It makes me sad too. I have to ask you to trust

> me that we're doing the right thing and I'll explain more when you

> get older. "

>

> He seemed ok with this and moved on to another topic.

>

> My therapist had said that kids under 5 don't remember much about

> people, so he wouldn't bee too affected. But this guy is super

> smart and he knows.

>

> I feel like a heel because I'm keeping them away like Nada kept

> other family members away from me and bad mouthed them. I know that

> mine is for a healthy reason, but it still sucks and feels

> underhanded.

>

> Blech,

> a

>

[Guest guest]

--

It sounds like the guilt sound-track is playing you. My son is 3

and also wants to see his grandparents. He asks me if he drive the

car all the time too. I tell him no because it is my job as mommy to

keep him safe. Part of parenting is to help our children develop a

healthy sense of self, which includes setting rules and boundries.

We never had boundreis, or they shifted all the time, what is

acceptable behavior by us or towards us is often hazy. By going N/C,

you are setting healthy boundries for yourself, and defining what

you will and won't accept in your life. Now you are developing the

skills to stop the cycle of abuse. Remember, children learn more by

example. When he is old enough you can explain why you made the

decision you did.

Areil

- In WTOAdultChildren1 , " baast2play "

wrote:

>

> I just felt so bad this morning. My 2.5 year-old son said really

> sadly at the table this morning:

>

> " My Grandma and Papa mean to us. They have a time out. I want to

> see them. I want to see my Grandma and Papa. "

>

> UUUGGGH! It just pulled on my heart strings. The only thing I

> could tell him was " It makes me sad too. I have to ask you to

trust

> me that we're doing the right thing and I'll explain more when you

> get older. "

>

> He seemed ok with this and moved on to another topic.

>

> My therapist had said that kids under 5 don't remember much about

> people, so he wouldn't bee too affected. But this guy is super

> smart and he knows.

>

> I feel like a heel because I'm keeping them away like Nada kept

> other family members away from me and bad mouthed them. I know

that

> mine is for a healthy reason, but it still sucks and feels

> underhanded.

>

> Blech,

> a

>

[Guest guest]

Going through the same thing. I have two children 4 and 8. They know that

nada and I had an argument and " grandma " said some really bad things to

mommy that she can't take back. I tried to explain that maybe someday they

could visit again, but right now it wasn't possible. My very smart 8 year

old replied, " I have a great idea...why don't you just mail us to nana and

poppies house !! "

How can children understand the heartache we have felt? Can a two year old,

or an 8 year old understand the mental abuse we have had to face? You are

not being like your mother. Your mother restricted others for selfish

reasons. You are doing it to protect your child from the painful life

experiences you had growing up. If your child wants to visit your mother

when he is 18, then he has every right, but right now you determine what he

needs in his life. He is two and the mind has a great way of forgetting.

Warm wishes,

KW

>

>Reply-To: WTOAdultChildren1

>To: WTOAdultChildren1

>Subject: I feel bad - DS wants to see BP & NP

>grandparents

>Date: Thu, 14 Dec 2006 17:32:31 -0000

>

>I just felt so bad this morning. My 2.5 year-old son said really

>sadly at the table this morning:

>

> " My Grandma and Papa mean to us. They have a time out. I want to

>see them. I want to see my Grandma and Papa. "

>

>UUUGGGH! It just pulled on my heart strings. The only thing I

>could tell him was " It makes me sad too. I have to ask you to trust

>me that we're doing the right thing and I'll explain more when you

>get older. "

>

>He seemed ok with this and moved on to another topic.

>

>My therapist had said that kids under 5 don't remember much about

>people, so he wouldn't bee too affected. But this guy is super

>smart and he knows.

>

>I feel like a heel because I'm keeping them away like Nada kept

>other family members away from me and bad mouthed them. I know that

>mine is for a healthy reason, but it still sucks and feels

>underhanded.

>

>Blech,

>a

>

_________________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

a,

Owie!! Yet, you could say in the future that it is a

time out for Grandma and Papa b/c _____________.

something about them not respecting very important

boundaries. Another parent here wrote about doing

that and it worked very well.

Either way, it has got to pull at your heart! Lots of

support here!!!

Greg.

--- baast2play wrote:

> I just felt so bad this morning. My 2.5 year-old

> son said really

> sadly at the table this morning:

>

> " My Grandma and Papa mean to us. They have a time

> out. I want to

> see them. I want to see my Grandma and Papa. "

>

> UUUGGGH! It just pulled on my heart strings. The

> only thing I

> could tell him was " It makes me sad too. I have to

> ask you to trust

> me that we're doing the right thing and I'll explain

> more when you

> get older. "

>

> He seemed ok with this and moved on to another

> topic.

>

> My therapist had said that kids under 5 don't

> remember much about

> people, so he wouldn't bee too affected. But this

> guy is super

> smart and he knows.

>

> I feel like a heel because I'm keeping them away

> like Nada kept

> other family members away from me and bad mouthed

> them. I know that

> mine is for a healthy reason, but it still sucks and

> feels

> underhanded.

>

> Blech,

> a

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

a, the group has told you so many wise things. I agree with all

that they have said. Stay strong again I know this is easier said

than done. But you are the parent and only you along with your

husband can determine what is the best for your children. You are

not like your mother be reminded of this. We all need that reminder

sometimes.

My nada makes comments to me or attempts to make comments to my

older son (by writing him letters or emails that I don't read to him

but I do save them) she insinuates that we are depriving him a

relationship that he really wants but this is far from the truth. To

be honest he has never ever asked for her once. I have talked to him

about this all as much as I could with out crossing the line. Also

during court I told him if he was to see her in the school or

something to run to a teach for help even if she seems nice and has

gifts he should not go by her. Dh even took it a step farther and

told him if he really wants any of those gifts that she parades in

front of them we will get them for him but stay away. At Christmas

nada walked past my kids with a cart of gifts addressed to my kids

and didn`t give them any. It is all so twisted! So needless to say

that Christmas Dh and I went hog wild getting the kids gifts!

I know what you mean by saying it feels like you are doing the same

thing as they are but as a parent we have to do what is mentally

best for our child and physically best for them as well. It is hard

but in the end I hope they will thank us. I know it is not in his

best interest to be with my nada. When he is 18 or no longer living

under my roof he can make his choice to see her but I have a feeling

as soon as she burns him he will be gone just like everybody else in

her life. Maybe by that point we can all go see her together because

I won't have to defend my children anymore. I hope to heaven that

when my kids have kids of their own that they protect them at all

costs and don't ever put them at risk with her or anybody else! Our

kids will never understand what we do and thank God for that. We

just do what we can to protect them. Keep hanging in there. Love

Lizzy

>

> Going through the same thing. I have two children 4 and 8. They

know that

> nada and I had an argument and " grandma " said some really bad

things to

> mommy that she can't take back. I tried to explain that maybe

someday they

> could visit again, but right now it wasn't possible. My very

smart 8 year

> old replied, " I have a great idea...why don't you just mail us to

nana and

> poppies house !! "

>

> How can children understand the heartache we have felt? Can a two

year old,

> or an 8 year old understand the mental abuse we have had to face?

You are

> not being like your mother. Your mother restricted others for

selfish

> reasons. You are doing it to protect your child from the painful

life

> experiences you had growing up. If your child wants to visit your

mother

> when he is 18, then he has every right, but right now you

determine what he

> needs in his life. He is two and the mind has a great way of

forgetting.

>

> Warm wishes,

> KW

>

>

> >

> >Reply-To: WTOAdultChildren1

> >To: WTOAdultChildren1

> >Subject: I feel bad - DS wants to see BP & NP

> >grandparents

> >Date: Thu, 14 Dec 2006 17:32:31 -0000

> >

> >I just felt so bad this morning. My 2.5 year-old son said really

> >sadly at the table this morning:

> >

> > " My Grandma and Papa mean to us. They have a time out. I want to

> >see them. I want to see my Grandma and Papa. "

> >

> >UUUGGGH! It just pulled on my heart strings. The only thing I

> >could tell him was " It makes me sad too. I have to ask you to

trust

> >me that we're doing the right thing and I'll explain more when you

> >get older. "

> >

> >He seemed ok with this and moved on to another topic.

> >

> >My therapist had said that kids under 5 don't remember much about

> >people, so he wouldn't bee too affected. But this guy is super

> >smart and he knows.

> >

> >I feel like a heel because I'm keeping them away like Nada kept

> >other family members away from me and bad mouthed them. I know

that

> >mine is for a healthy reason, but it still sucks and feels

> >underhanded.

> >

> >Blech,

> >a

> >

>

> _________________________________________________________________

> Stay up-to-date with your friends through the Windows Live Spaces

friends

> list.

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>

[Guest guest]

KW,

Your post hit me really hard about what your 8 year

old said from his perspective. There is no way that

they could understand it. And there was NO WAY WE

could understand it. My God. The decks were stacked

so heavily against us when we were kids b/c we were

kids and THAT IS NOT A CRIME. You know what I want

for my Christmas this year ~ A Healthy CHILDHOOD!!

And I am having to give that to myself. We are

blessed to be alive and as sane as we are. b/C we are

smart and if we could have figured out a way that a

child's brain and heart could outsmart insane adults

that most adults can't get their mind around, we

wouldn't have a need for this board, would we?.

Excellent point, KW.

gre.g

--- Willette wrote:

> Going through the same thing. I have two children 4

> and 8. They know that

> nada and I had an argument and " grandma " said some

> really bad things to

> mommy that she can't take back. I tried to explain

> that maybe someday they

> could visit again, but right now it wasn't possible.

> My very smart 8 year

> old replied, " I have a great idea...why don't you

> just mail us to nana and

> poppies house !! "

>

> How can children understand the heartache we have

> felt? Can a two year old,

> or an 8 year old understand the mental abuse we have

> had to face? You are

> not being like your mother. Your mother restricted

> others for selfish

> reasons. You are doing it to protect your child from

> the painful life

> experiences you had growing up. If your child wants

> to visit your mother

> when he is 18, then he has every right, but right

> now you determine what he

> needs in his life. He is two and the mind has a

> great way of forgetting.

>

> Warm wishes,

> KW

>

>

> >

> >Reply-To: WTOAdultChildren1

> >To: WTOAdultChildren1

> >Subject: I feel bad - DS wants

> to see BP & NP

> >grandparents

> >Date: Thu, 14 Dec 2006 17:32:31 -0000

> >

> >I just felt so bad this morning. My 2.5 year-old

> son said really

> >sadly at the table this morning:

> >

> > " My Grandma and Papa mean to us. They have a time

> out. I want to

> >see them. I want to see my Grandma and Papa. "

> >

> >UUUGGGH! It just pulled on my heart strings. The

> only thing I

> >could tell him was " It makes me sad too. I have to

> ask you to trust

> >me that we're doing the right thing and I'll

> explain more when you

> >get older. "

> >

> >He seemed ok with this and moved on to another

> topic.

> >

> >My therapist had said that kids under 5 don't

> remember much about

> >people, so he wouldn't bee too affected. But this

> guy is super

> >smart and he knows.

> >

> >I feel like a heel because I'm keeping them away

> like Nada kept

> >other family members away from me and bad mouthed

> them. I know that

> >mine is for a healthy reason, but it still sucks

> and feels

> >underhanded.

> >

> >Blech,

> >a

> >

>

>

_________________________________________________________________

> Stay up-to-date with your friends through the

> Windows Live Spaces friends

> list.

>

http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwsp0070000001msn/direct/01/?href=http://spaces.\

live.com/spacesapi.aspx?wx_action=create & wx_url=/friends.aspx & mk

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Thanks, Greg. If you know the Kersey Temperament Sorter...my son, I

strongly believe, is an ESTJ. He loves orders and rules, especially

modeling them back to us and reminding us to " chew slowly, " etc.

etc. Next time it comes up, I'll have a simple discussion about

boundaries and health with him. I think he might get that.

Before I had talked in depth with my therapist about this topic, and

while going through the N/C decision, my son and I had a

conversation.

Me: I'm sad.

Son: Because Grandma and Papa?

Me: Yes.

Son: Tell them no!

Me: I tried to tell them, but they aren't listening to me.

Son: Ok, Mama. I'll write them letter. I'll tell them NO.

He's damn smart for a 2 year-old!

I told my therapist this story and she gave me a face like it was a

red flag and told me to tell him " I'm taking care of this. I will

explain this to you when you get older. Will you trust me that I'm

making the right decision for us? "

I got the underlying msg, don't get into the area of expecting him

to parent me. I so don't want to go there anyway!

a

>

> > I just felt so bad this morning. My 2.5 year-old

> > son said really

> > sadly at the table this morning:

> >

> > " My Grandma and Papa mean to us. They have a time

> > out. I want to

> > see them. I want to see my Grandma and Papa. "

> >

> > UUUGGGH! It just pulled on my heart strings. The

> > only thing I

> > could tell him was " It makes me sad too. I have to

> > ask you to trust

> > me that we're doing the right thing and I'll explain

> > more when you

> > get older. "

> >

> > He seemed ok with this and moved on to another

> > topic.

> >

> > My therapist had said that kids under 5 don't

> > remember much about

> > people, so he wouldn't bee too affected. But this

> > guy is super

> > smart and he knows.

> >

> > I feel like a heel because I'm keeping them away

> > like Nada kept

> > other family members away from me and bad mouthed

> > them. I know that

> > mine is for a healthy reason, but it still sucks and

> > feels

> > underhanded.

> >

> > Blech,

> > a

> >

> >

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

a,

Yea, I am familiar with it and it is truly

interesting. He certainly had very bright comments

for a 2 year old! We're supporting you and you're

doing the right thing!

All my best,

Greg.

--- baast2play wrote:

> Thanks, Greg. If you know the Kersey Temperament

> Sorter...my son, I

> strongly believe, is an ESTJ. He loves orders and

> rules, especially

> modeling them back to us and reminding us to " chew

> slowly, " etc.

> etc. Next time it comes up, I'll have a simple

> discussion about

> boundaries and health with him. I think he might

> get that.

>

> Before I had talked in depth with my therapist about

> this topic, and

> while going through the N/C decision, my son and I

> had a

> conversation.

>

> Me: I'm sad.

> Son: Because Grandma and Papa?

> Me: Yes.

> Son: Tell them no!

> Me: I tried to tell them, but they aren't listening

> to me.

> Son: Ok, Mama. I'll write them letter. I'll tell

> them NO.

>

> He's damn smart for a 2 year-old!

>

> I told my therapist this story and she gave me a

> face like it was a

> red flag and told me to tell him " I'm taking care of

> this. I will

> explain this to you when you get older. Will you

> trust me that I'm

> making the right decision for us? "

>

> I got the underlying msg, don't get into the area of

> expecting him

> to parent me. I so don't want to go there anyway!

>

> a

>

>

>

> >

> > > I just felt so bad this morning. My 2.5

> year-old

> > > son said really

> > > sadly at the table this morning:

> > >

> > > " My Grandma and Papa mean to us. They have a

> time

> > > out. I want to

> > > see them. I want to see my Grandma and Papa. "

> > >

> > > UUUGGGH! It just pulled on my heart strings.

> The

> > > only thing I

> > > could tell him was " It makes me sad too. I have

> to

> > > ask you to trust

> > > me that we're doing the right thing and I'll

> explain

> > > more when you

> > > get older. "

> > >

> > > He seemed ok with this and moved on to another

> > > topic.

> > >

> > > My therapist had said that kids under 5 don't

> > > remember much about

> > > people, so he wouldn't bee too affected. But

> this

> > > guy is super

> > > smart and he knows.

> > >

> > > I feel like a heel because I'm keeping them away

> > > like Nada kept

> > > other family members away from me and bad

> mouthed

> > > them. I know that

> > > mine is for a healthy reason, but it still sucks

> and

> > > feels

> > > underhanded.

> > >

> > > Blech,

> > > a

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

Greg you wrote " We are blessed to be alive and as sane as we are. " I

was just thinking that the other day. I recently saw in the news a

mother who microwaved her baby to death it was less than a month

old, a day or so later I saw on the news a baby who died from

internal injury caused by the mother. I was thinking the mothers

have to be crazy to do this maybe like the witch? I know we are very

lucky to be alive. There were times my nada told me about how bad of

a baby I was and other mothers who had babies like me just killed

them. I just wonder if that was what she was thinking. I wonder how

many times she contemplated killing me. But thank God we are alive!

We have a chance and we can show the children in our lives real

love. Even kids who are not our own.

For example I went today to the elementary school for an hour to

talk about foreign travel and the kids were all so sweet and cute.

They had fun learning and hope that I can do that more often. I want

to make a difference in the lives of children and talk to them on

their level. I want to listen to what they say and teach them things

especially how to be kind. Even for those who don't have kids

anybody can do things to help out in their own ways. I like your

idea Greg about giving yourself a childhood for Christmas. By doing

this for yourself you are making the world a better place. The world

will see your happiness and be able to take part in it with you!

This not only will benefit you but this will be a benefit to those

around you as well! It is already making a difference in my life. If

we can live by these choices every day imagine the changes we can

all make!

Sorry I am on such a natural high today I just had such a good day

and I feel really good. So please excuse my cheesy thoughts! Merry

Christmas, Love Lizzy

>

> > Going through the same thing. I have two children 4

> > and 8. They know that

> > nada and I had an argument and " grandma " said some

> > really bad things to

> > mommy that she can't take back. I tried to explain

> > that maybe someday they

> > could visit again, but right now it wasn't possible.

> > My very smart 8 year

> > old replied, " I have a great idea...why don't you

> > just mail us to nana and

> > poppies house !! "

> >

> > How can children understand the heartache we have

> > felt? Can a two year old,

> > or an 8 year old understand the mental abuse we have

> > had to face? You are

> > not being like your mother. Your mother restricted

> > others for selfish

> > reasons. You are doing it to protect your child from

> > the painful life

> > experiences you had growing up. If your child wants

> > to visit your mother

> > when he is 18, then he has every right, but right

> > now you determine what he

> > needs in his life. He is two and the mind has a

> > great way of forgetting.

> >

> > Warm wishes,

> > KW

> >

> >

> > >

> > >Reply-To: WTOAdultChildren1

> > >To: WTOAdultChildren1

> > >Subject: I feel bad - DS wants

> > to see BP & NP

> > >grandparents

> > >Date: Thu, 14 Dec 2006 17:32:31 -0000

> > >

> > >I just felt so bad this morning. My 2.5 year-old

> > son said really

> > >sadly at the table this morning:

> > >

> > > " My Grandma and Papa mean to us. They have a time

> > out. I want to

> > >see them. I want to see my Grandma and Papa. "

> > >

> > >UUUGGGH! It just pulled on my heart strings. The

> > only thing I

> > >could tell him was " It makes me sad too. I have to

> > ask you to trust

> > >me that we're doing the right thing and I'll

> > explain more when you

> > >get older. "

> > >

> > >He seemed ok with this and moved on to another

> > topic.

> > >

> > >My therapist had said that kids under 5 don't

> > remember much about

> > >people, so he wouldn't bee too affected. But this

> > guy is super

> > >smart and he knows.

> > >

> > >I feel like a heel because I'm keeping them away

> > like Nada kept

> > >other family members away from me and bad mouthed

> > them. I know that

> > >mine is for a healthy reason, but it still sucks

> > and feels

> > >underhanded.

> > >

> > >Blech,

> > >a

> > >

> >

> >

> _________________________________________________________________

> > Stay up-to-date with your friends through the

> > Windows Live Spaces friends

> > list.

> >

> http://clk.atdmt.com/MSN/go/msnnkwsp0070000001msn/direct/01/?

href=http://spaces.live.com/spacesapi.aspx?

wx_action=create & wx_url=/friends.aspx & mk

> >

> >

>

>

> __________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

a,

Just a thought. I have three kids four and under. We have moved

twice since my first was born. The second move was a year ago, and

long term is a great thing for our family, but short term was

unexpected and pretty stressful. I had a lot of guilt about uprooting

them, especially over the holidays, as we spent Christmas in a

temporary furnished apartment without even a tree. Not long after we

moved from our temporary apartment here to our home my kids said in a

moment of anger " I want to go back to 163 (the apartment number). I

was shocked. Then they said they wanted to go " home " to our old house.

I offered explanations for why this place is better, and tried to

" reason " with them. I think they picked up on my emotions, as they

then said it more often after that. And even now, almost a year later

they will sometimes say " I want to go back to our old house! " . If I

question them, they don't remember much at all about the old house, and

very little about the apartment. The statement has become a symbol of

" I'm angry/sad/frustrated and want to get your attention. " It's kind

of funny at this point because I think that because of my initial

emotional reaction, they latched onto the phrase and will not let it

go. I met another mom at the preschool whose older kids (elementary

age) still say the same thing almost 2 years after they moved locally

into a bigger house with a bigger yard and individual bedrooms for each

kid. If she asks why the old house is better, they have no answer.

Is it possible that your son is picking up on your emotions regarding

NC? If so he may continue to ask this question long after he really

remembers them or misses them just to get a reaction from you. If

that is a possibility, a very unemotional matter of fact answer and

demeanor might help. " They are still in timeout for grownups and will

be until they can say they are sorry and fix what they did wrong. " (I'm

basing this on what we say about kid timeouts in my house.) or " Grandma

and Papa aren't ready to be nice yet. " or " We probably won't see them

for a very long time. " and then move on to something else. As he gets

older and asks genuine questions about what happened, you can give him

age appropriate answers, but at this age you may be feeding the fire by

showing your emotions and giving him a specific phrase to use to get a

reaction from you. For a toddler/preschooler that is pretty powerful

stuff, at least to the ones living in my house.

Just thought I'd offer my 2 cents in case it might help. I still

haven't stopped the " I want the old house " stuff here, but now I just

smile and say " Hmmm..... interesting! " and move on. They are starting

to realize that I have their number as they then often burst out

laughing and drop the subject.

Fresabird

> I just felt so bad this morning. My 2.5 year-old son said really

> sadly at the table this morning:

>

> " My Grandma and Papa mean to us. They have a time out. I want to

> see them. I want to see my Grandma and Papa. "

>

> UUUGGGH! It just pulled on my heart strings. The only thing I

> could tell him was " It makes me sad too. I have to ask you to trust

> me that we're doing the right thing and I'll explain more when you

> get older. "

>

> He seemed ok with this and moved on to another topic.

>

> My therapist had said that kids under 5 don't remember much about

> people, so he wouldn't bee too affected. But this guy is super

> smart and he knows.

>

> I feel like a heel because I'm keeping them away like Nada kept

> other family members away from me and bad mouthed them. I know that

> mine is for a healthy reason, but it still sucks and feels

> underhanded.

>

> Blech,

> a

>

>

>