more on Geiers & testosterone Ruth//Dr. JM?

[Guest guest]

Ruth, , & Dr. JM,

I did view both presentations and it is definitely interesting *in theory*.

Does anyone know of anyone besides Sykes who has used the Geiers'

protocol? Have the Geiers completed their study? If so, is there an update

of their findings? They seem to think that if testosterone testing became an

accepted part of autism testing, we would see MANY with this issue. Maybe

we're not seeing it because most just aren't being tested??? Just as a

side-note: wonder if testosterone could have any effect on the LDN you are

studying? Perhaps it is a factor in why some are having rages/aggression??

In addition, to address what Dr. JM's concerns are (which mirror ours)-

wouldn't there be anything already out there that could show us long-term

effects of Lupron on pre-pubescent boys? I mean, if that's what the product

has always been used for, surely there have been reports...or has it not

been around for long enough?

The DAN doctor we FINALLY got in to see yesterday was very wonderful and

caring, but her only idea on the testosterone was that since testosterone

levels can sometimes be intertwined with hypoglycemia (of which my son shows

clear signs), we should get that well under control & see what happens to

the levels.

She has seen large numbers of kids, but said that my baby is quite a

" puzzle " and doesn't easily fit into any category. His test results weren't

screamimg mercury at her, and if there isn't a mercury issue, it would not

even fit with what the Geiers are saying.

Deep breath....

SO, Dr. JM, what DO we do about the testosterone level? We have seen such

aggression & impulsiveness, and now we have 3 documented possible causes:

high copper, high testosterone, & Candida. We are working on the other 2

now... is there something that you do feel is safe that is worth trying now-

or would you recommend other testing to determine the next course? He has

always been at least average on growth charts.

Sorry this is all so long-winded, but I really do think this may be

applicable to more of you than you might even realize.

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(Ruth):

Check out The Geier' s presentation on Autism Media. While noone wants to

mess with hormone levels, the interview is very compelling.

http://www.autismmedia.org/media4.html

You can also watch the interview with Reverand Sykes, as her son is

being treated by the Geiers.

http://www.autismmedia.org/media10.html

____________________________________________________________________________

():

Your son's differential diagnosis might include 'precocious puberty' as

a possibility.

The google search (don't use quotes)

precocious puberty in males

is very informative

____________________________________________________________________________

(Dr. JM):

My understanding about the testosterone issue is this (but I'm away from my

notes so don't hold me to it): Dr. Deth found out that the mercury

in vaccines destroys or disables the methionine synthase enzyme and injures

the IGF-1, which is growth hormone. This value is very low in many kids,

even though they may not look as if their growth is delayed - in fact, their

growth charts can be normal even though the IGF-1 is low. When checking

these kids for growth hormone, many of the boys were found to have high

testosterone, and apparently Dr. Boyd Haley then did some work that showed

that mercury and testosterone are synergistic, and that the high

testosterone holds on to the mercury and makes it harder to chelate these

kids successfully. They (the Geiers') have some kids they have been giving

Lupron to try to take the testosterone down in hopes that they can get the

mercury chelated out sooner, and they report some success. However, I and

many DAN! doctors feel that too

much is unknown about the future of kids who have this kind of treatment,

especially if they are prepubertal, and may injure their growth in sexual

and other ways too and impair their future masculinity. We have all worked

successfully to chelate many kids without " messing around " with their

hormones, and I would sure have to have more evidence that this would not

harm them before I would be willing to do it. We have invited the Geiers to

tell us more details about it in the Think Tank and I may reconsider, but

for now I and many other DAN! docs are watching and waiting on this one.

Dr. JM

________________________________________________________________________

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