Guest guest Posted August 2, 1999 Report Share Posted August 2, 1999 Pam, I know that my nsg who did my last surgery (in albuquerque, nm) now is in Cleveland (I'm not sure where). His name is Dr. Benzel & for whatever it is worth, I recommend him. Sorry this post is so late. Been sick & have now gotten around to reading the stuff. Jen > > > >for those who have gone to the Cleveland clinic what Dr's are there and how >was your treatment, the reason I am asking is my sister has an appt there >in early aug, >thanks >pamH > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >WACMA Site: http://www.pressenter.com/~wacma >Your Personal support group member page: >http://www.eGroups.com/group/chiari/ >**Avoid List Congestion: >Unsubscribe from this list: mailto:chiari-unsubscribeegroups >Contact list mgmt: mailto:chiari-owneregroups > _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 2, 1999 Report Share Posted August 2, 1999 Pam, I know that my nsg who did my last surgery (in albuquerque, nm) now is in Cleveland (I'm not sure where). His name is Dr. Benzel & for whatever it is worth, I recommend him. Sorry this post is so late. Been sick & have now gotten around to reading the stuff. Jen > > > >for those who have gone to the Cleveland clinic what Dr's are there and how >was your treatment, the reason I am asking is my sister has an appt there >in early aug, >thanks >pamH > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ >WACMA Site: http://www.pressenter.com/~wacma >Your Personal support group member page: >http://www.eGroups.com/group/chiari/ >**Avoid List Congestion: >Unsubscribe from this list: mailto:chiari-unsubscribeegroups >Contact list mgmt: mailto:chiari-owneregroups > _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 1999 Report Share Posted August 20, 1999 Hi Dee! Must tell you I HAVE to sleep on at least TWO big pillows or I am awakened with a pounding headache. Also, I am having lots of trouble with my hip and when I get up whichever side I have been sleeping on is numb. Another problem is if my leg is in the " wrong position " I am awakened with the most horrible pain in my hip -- sometimes I am frozen in one spot trying just to get rolled over. Not sure if this helps but I can certainly appreciate what Tabitha is going through! Phoenix, AZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 20, 1999 Report Share Posted August 20, 1999 Hi Dee! Must tell you I HAVE to sleep on at least TWO big pillows or I am awakened with a pounding headache. Also, I am having lots of trouble with my hip and when I get up whichever side I have been sleeping on is numb. Another problem is if my leg is in the " wrong position " I am awakened with the most horrible pain in my hip -- sometimes I am frozen in one spot trying just to get rolled over. Not sure if this helps but I can certainly appreciate what Tabitha is going through! Phoenix, AZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 21, 1999 Report Share Posted August 21, 1999 Hi Dee, I sleep on 2 or 3 pillows- if I fall off I get a headache, too. It IS related. The csf pools in the brain if I'm flat and increases the pressure. You may want to try raising the head of her bed a little. I tried, but didn't work too well with a water bed! LOL Blessings, in VA question Hi all, Dee here (Tabitha's mom), i have another question. smile. do you sleep flat or on pillows? Tabitha sleeps on several pillows, if she slides off the pillows, she is up crying with a headache. the ngs said this is not a chiari headache. i was wondering about the rest of you. also, she has been complaining of her hip or where her leg hooks on has been hurting. and her leg has been going numb, she wants me to carry her all the time now . he said this is not from the chiari either and then he said he would see her in a year to redo the mri.... they are so wonderful!!!!! love to all, love dee and tabitha WACMA Site: http://www.pressenter.com/~wacma Your Personal support group member page: http://www.eGroups.com/group/chiari/ **Avoid List Congestion: Unsubscribe from this list: mailto:chiari-unsubscribeegroups Contact list mgmt: mailto:chiari-owneregroups Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 9, 1999 Report Share Posted September 9, 1999 Hi guys.... Pardon my ignorance, but I am stumped on this terminology. A woman that I have been writing to asked about a : fenestration of the 4th ventricle I don't have a clue. Anyone????? Thanks Sally Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 9, 2001 Report Share Posted May 9, 2001 Hi Jan, I test 2 hours after I eat. You are going to spike, but what you want to know is if it is going down after the spike. Some people check more often, before they eat, an hour after they eat and 2 hours after they eat. That way they know exactly what the food has done to their bg. It is entirely up to the individual and how comfortable they are testing. There is no right or wrong way of doing it. If you are happy with the times you check, then that is right for you. Friends, Co-Moderator Type 2 Question > Hi everyone, I see that most of you know what foods do what to your blood > levels. How do you go about testing to see? I test before every meal and at > bed time. Should I be testing 2 hours after a meal to see what happened? I am > very confused about this. Could someone please give me some advice. I really > want to learn what various foods do to my bag's. Thanks, Jan > > To leave this list please go to diabetes-unsubscribe > Hope you come back soon! > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2001 Report Share Posted July 23, 2001 No I haven't checked my bg yet. I don't have a monitor at home. Money is tight and insurance won't cover it. Dh gets paid Friday, so hopefully we can get one then. The few times I checked it, I borrowed my neighbor's as she is diabetic also. I just don't want to bother her all the time to borrow her monitor. Besides, we've already priced them and the strips alone are very expensive so I don't want to use hers unless it's an emergency. Beth > > I have a question that you all may or may not be able to answer. > When you all were first diagnosed, did you have more bad days than > good? I'm sure it's different for each person. I went from feeling > bad yesterday to being very sick and in the hospital last night. > Today I felt better but now I'm feeling bad again (not as bad as last > night). I didn't think I should feel bad that often. I am going to > look for a new Dr tomorrow as my PCP won't treat my diabetes. He led > me to believe it was no big deal. I hope a new Dr will be able to > help me with this. I hate feeling so out of control. > > > > Beth > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2001 Report Share Posted July 23, 2001 Hi Beth, My husband paid $69.95 for his monitor (TheraSense FreeStyle) and he did receive a $40 rebate. " Competition for scarce human energy is the cause of all conflict between people " - Redfield Re: Question > > > As far as monitors go, I was told that it's a matter of > preference. > > > Hi Beth, > > It is a matter of preference. My doctor recommended the One Touch > Sure Step by Lifescan. I'm happy with it. > > Lots of times, there will be a rebate when buying the monitor. In > fact, the monitor will be free with the purchase of strips. > > Eunice > > > To leave this list please go to diabetes-unsubscribe > Hope you come back soon! > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2001 Report Share Posted July 23, 2001 Hi Beth, My husband paid $69.95 for his monitor (TheraSense FreeStyle) and he did receive a $40 rebate. " Competition for scarce human energy is the cause of all conflict between people " - Redfield Re: Question > > > As far as monitors go, I was told that it's a matter of > preference. > > > Hi Beth, > > It is a matter of preference. My doctor recommended the One Touch > Sure Step by Lifescan. I'm happy with it. > > Lots of times, there will be a rebate when buying the monitor. In > fact, the monitor will be free with the purchase of strips. > > Eunice > > > To leave this list please go to diabetes-unsubscribe > Hope you come back soon! > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2001 Report Share Posted July 23, 2001 Beth--- I have to pay for my own supplies so I looked for the cheapest strips. The monitor is a one time purchase but the strips you must buy over and over, so I figured my cheapest way to go was buying the monitor that used the cheapest strips. I initially bought the AccuCheck and I liked it. Then Walmarts started carrying ReliOn. The monitor was about $10 and the strips are about $20 per 50. The biggest drawback is it doesn't keep record of date, time and result.....but I can do that in a notebook. Debbie Re: Question > No I haven't checked my bg yet. I don't have a monitor at home. > Money is tight and insurance won't cover it. Dh gets paid Friday, so > hopefully we can get one then. The few times I checked it, I > borrowed my neighbor's as she is diabetic also. I just don't want to > bother her all the time to borrow her monitor. Besides, we've > already priced them and the strips alone are very expensive so I > don't want to use hers unless it's an emergency. > > Beth > > > > > I have a question that you all may or may not be able to answer. > > When you all were first diagnosed, did you have more bad days than > > good? I'm sure it's different for each person. I went from > feeling > > bad yesterday to being very sick and in the hospital last night. > > Today I felt better but now I'm feeling bad again (not as bad as > last > > night). I didn't think I should feel bad that often. I am going > to > > look for a new Dr tomorrow as my PCP won't treat my diabetes. He > led > > me to believe it was no big deal. I hope a new Dr will be able to > > help me with this. I hate feeling so out of control. > > > > > > Beth > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2001 Report Share Posted July 23, 2001 Beth--- I have to pay for my own supplies so I looked for the cheapest strips. The monitor is a one time purchase but the strips you must buy over and over, so I figured my cheapest way to go was buying the monitor that used the cheapest strips. I initially bought the AccuCheck and I liked it. Then Walmarts started carrying ReliOn. The monitor was about $10 and the strips are about $20 per 50. The biggest drawback is it doesn't keep record of date, time and result.....but I can do that in a notebook. Debbie Re: Question > No I haven't checked my bg yet. I don't have a monitor at home. > Money is tight and insurance won't cover it. Dh gets paid Friday, so > hopefully we can get one then. The few times I checked it, I > borrowed my neighbor's as she is diabetic also. I just don't want to > bother her all the time to borrow her monitor. Besides, we've > already priced them and the strips alone are very expensive so I > don't want to use hers unless it's an emergency. > > Beth > > > > > I have a question that you all may or may not be able to answer. > > When you all were first diagnosed, did you have more bad days than > > good? I'm sure it's different for each person. I went from > feeling > > bad yesterday to being very sick and in the hospital last night. > > Today I felt better but now I'm feeling bad again (not as bad as > last > > night). I didn't think I should feel bad that often. I am going > to > > look for a new Dr tomorrow as my PCP won't treat my diabetes. He > led > > me to believe it was no big deal. I hope a new Dr will be able to > > help me with this. I hate feeling so out of control. > > > > > > Beth > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2001 Report Share Posted September 1, 2001 Madge: My readings would be the same as yours if I drank OJ and ate a donut, except probably further into outer space! I don't have any answers but I do have several more questions! Is your friend on any medication? If so, what meds is she taking? Also, on what basis was her diagnosis made - fasting bg's, two hour glucose tolerance test, a1c? I'm happy for her but at the same time I'm thinking perhaps the diagnosis, given her responses to ingesting high carbs, may be suspect. Carol Warman _____________________________________________________________ > As some of you know, I have a friend who was recently diagnosed. > Well, sometimes I really get upset!!! because like today, she had > orange juice and a donut at work this morning. Two hours later her > bg was just 4 points higher than when she started. I forget the > readings but they were in the normal range in the low 100's. Perhaps > I am a bit jealous?! Maybe so. > Now my question is: Is only a four point rise normal? Is this > really accurate? Orange juice will send me to the moon and the donut > along with it will fly me probably to Pluto and leave me there. > Thanks for listening to me let off some steam!!! I am happy for her > if this stays normal but am not real happy for me > Madge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2001 Report Share Posted September 1, 2001 In a message dated 9/1/01 7:30:55 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Madge910@... writes: > I have read what Joslin was doing, however I thought the standard for > Hi Madge, The information my doctor gave me was fasting to be between 80-120 and 2 hrs after a meal to be less than 160. She wanted my HbA1c to be less than 7. Very seldom do I have a fasting bg of 80 or above and not too often do I have a reading 160 or more two hrs after eating, but there have been a couple of times I've been as high as 238. One time I ate a slice of apple pie (Company Christmas Dinner and the other when I ate sugar-free yogurt, large portion.) Madge, you will get your numbers down to where you want them. In the meantime, don't worry too much about them, because worrying will cause them to be higher. When do you go for your next HbA1c test? Eunice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2001 Report Share Posted September 1, 2001 Congrats to you Madge. You're doing a great job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2001 Report Share Posted September 2, 2001 ---I am thinking here. I think her two fastings for the dr. were just above normal. However, when I had checked her sugar in between dr. visits after breakfast was in the 200's. After her second fasting test the doctor prescribed glucophage XL 500mg once a day in the evening. Ever since her readings have all been normal range except once it was in the 150's after lunch. One day I think it was also up following the thicker crust slice of pizza. She even called the monitor place to make sure it was working properly. Seems to be. Mine seems to be 40 points higher than hers. They also told her different fingers give different readings? This was after she told them she dropped 20 points after taking reading a second time because the first one seemed to high, I think it was in the 170's. I don't understand all this. How can redoing it one after the other change the reading 20 points? It that case I should keep doing mine til I get a reading I like!!!! And isn't it all the same blood, no matter which hand or finger? This is confusing!!!! Today for dinner I tried the Romaine lettuce as " bread " and spread it with tuna/mayo and folded it over to make a sandwich. Not bad!!!! Romaine was never on my top ten list but I rather enjoyed it!!! I can use egg salad, cream cheese or a salad mixture of cucumbers sliced thin, iceburg lettuce and tomato, pepper strips as a filling as well and of course turkey and cheese would be good also!!! The possibilities are endless. Thanks to whoever it was for that suggestion, I forget what list I read it on. I am about done with bread except for french toast which I will have once in a great while. The soy milk I use is called WestSoy and has only 5 carbs in 8 oz. I was surprised at the difference in brand names and the amount of carbs each contained. There is quite a variance. <adge In diabetes@y..., " Carol Warman " <cswarman@l...> wrote: > Madge: > > My readings would be the same as yours if I drank OJ and ate a donut, > except probably further into outer space! > > I don't have any answers but I do have several more questions! Is > your friend on any medication? If so, what meds is she taking? Also, > on what basis was her diagnosis made - fasting bg's, two hour glucose > tolerance test, a1c? I'm happy for her but at the same time I'm > thinking perhaps the diagnosis, given her responses to ingesting > high carbs, may be suspect. > > Carol Warman > _____________________________________________________________ > > As some of you know, I have a friend who was recently diagnosed. > > Well, sometimes I really get upset!!! because like today, she had > > orange juice and a donut at work this morning. Two hours later her > > bg was just 4 points higher than when she started. I forget the > > readings but they were in the normal range in the low 100's. > Perhaps > > I am a bit jealous?! Maybe so. > > Now my question is: Is only a four point rise normal? Is this > > really accurate? Orange juice will send me to the moon and the > donut > > along with it will fly me probably to Pluto and leave me there. > > Thanks for listening to me let off some steam!!! I am happy for > her > > if this stays normal but am not real happy for me > > Madge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2001 Report Share Posted September 2, 2001 ---I am thinking here. I think her two fastings for the dr. were just above normal. However, when I had checked her sugar in between dr. visits after breakfast was in the 200's. After her second fasting test the doctor prescribed glucophage XL 500mg once a day in the evening. Ever since her readings have all been normal range except once it was in the 150's after lunch. One day I think it was also up following the thicker crust slice of pizza. She even called the monitor place to make sure it was working properly. Seems to be. Mine seems to be 40 points higher than hers. They also told her different fingers give different readings? This was after she told them she dropped 20 points after taking reading a second time because the first one seemed to high, I think it was in the 170's. I don't understand all this. How can redoing it one after the other change the reading 20 points? It that case I should keep doing mine til I get a reading I like!!!! And isn't it all the same blood, no matter which hand or finger? This is confusing!!!! Today for dinner I tried the Romaine lettuce as " bread " and spread it with tuna/mayo and folded it over to make a sandwich. Not bad!!!! Romaine was never on my top ten list but I rather enjoyed it!!! I can use egg salad, cream cheese or a salad mixture of cucumbers sliced thin, iceburg lettuce and tomato, pepper strips as a filling as well and of course turkey and cheese would be good also!!! The possibilities are endless. Thanks to whoever it was for that suggestion, I forget what list I read it on. I am about done with bread except for french toast which I will have once in a great while. The soy milk I use is called WestSoy and has only 5 carbs in 8 oz. I was surprised at the difference in brand names and the amount of carbs each contained. There is quite a variance. <adge In diabetes@y..., " Carol Warman " <cswarman@l...> wrote: > Madge: > > My readings would be the same as yours if I drank OJ and ate a donut, > except probably further into outer space! > > I don't have any answers but I do have several more questions! Is > your friend on any medication? If so, what meds is she taking? Also, > on what basis was her diagnosis made - fasting bg's, two hour glucose > tolerance test, a1c? I'm happy for her but at the same time I'm > thinking perhaps the diagnosis, given her responses to ingesting > high carbs, may be suspect. > > Carol Warman > _____________________________________________________________ > > As some of you know, I have a friend who was recently diagnosed. > > Well, sometimes I really get upset!!! because like today, she had > > orange juice and a donut at work this morning. Two hours later her > > bg was just 4 points higher than when she started. I forget the > > readings but they were in the normal range in the low 100's. > Perhaps > > I am a bit jealous?! Maybe so. > > Now my question is: Is only a four point rise normal? Is this > > really accurate? Orange juice will send me to the moon and the > donut > > along with it will fly me probably to Pluto and leave me there. > > Thanks for listening to me let off some steam!!! I am happy for > her > > if this stays normal but am not real happy for me > > Madge Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2001 Report Share Posted September 2, 2001 ---Hi Carol, I have read what Joslin was doing, however I thought the standard for a 2 hr. diabetic reading was no higher than 140, a number that I don't see!!!! I would have to eat almost zilch to get 140 ! Forget where I read that, here maybe? Actually on my friends goals list that the Dr. gave her, 140 was the highest reading after meals to have. However, since really watching the carbs I have found I am doing much much better and in time may be able to get a really good reading after meals. My husband is calling our dr. to see if she will refer him or us to a diabetic nutrionist. I feel he really needs it and I could benefit as well. He has sodium, cholesterol, protein, potassium, blood sugar to watch and it is about driving us nuts. His sugar is out of control and the Endo. didn't call back yesterday which I thought she should since he called her and asked to speak to her about the insulin dosages and I had faxed all the numbers to her. Enough of my rambling incoherrently here! Madge In diabetes@y..., " Carol Warman " <cswarman@l...> wrote: > Madge: > > The Joslin Diabetes Center guidelines show that two hour post > prandials < 180 are acceptable for diabetics. For non-diabetics, > their two hour post prandial guidline is < 140. Please see the > following URL: > > http://www.joslin.org/education/library/wbggoal.html > > These guidelines are constantly being reevaluated. Several months > ago, their two hour post prandial guideline for diabetics was > < 160 but they raised that to 180 recently. > > It sounds like your friend may be in the " pre diabetic " , or impaired > glucose tolerance, stage. It seems to me that her doctor is treating > her very conservatively. This is not necessarily a bad thing. > > Carol Warman > ____________________________________________________________ > >After her second fasting > > test the doctor prescribed glucophage XL 500mg once a day in the > > evening. Ever since her readings have all been normal range except > > once it was in the 150's after lunch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2001 Report Share Posted September 2, 2001 Madge: I hope that you are able to take a diabetic nutrition class and that you find it to be as valuable as I did. Despite the fact that I lowered the daily allowance they had suggested (they had not accounted for my forced inactivity), the explanation of the effect of carbohydrates on blood sugar really drove the point home, so to speak. Between the class and the food supplements I've been taking, my numbers have really improved over the past six months. My fasting reading this morning was 103. This is an all time low for me. Carol _______________________________________________________________ > My husband is calling our dr. to see if she will refer him or us to a > diabetic nutrionist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2001 Report Share Posted September 2, 2001 Something I don't understand. Why is a reading of 180 2 hours after a meal ok for a diabetic and not a non diabetic. From what I understand any reading above 140 is causing damage to our bodies. Do we as diabetics have to settle for high readings? Two hours after a meal your blood sugar should be back down to within normal range, which is below 120. Why would I ever let a Doctor or anyone else tell me a reading of 180 is ok when it's causing damage, isn't that something we are fighting to avoid in the long run? Just my point of view Ali Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2001 Report Share Posted September 2, 2001 In a message dated 9/2/01 2:10:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time, katiebearalicat2@... writes: > Do we as diabetics have to settle > for high readings? > Hi Ali, I don't think any person with diabetes wants a high reading, but sometimes, no matter what a person does, they still get high readings. After someone has been diagnosed, it takes a while to get medicines adjusted, to learn what they can and cannot eat, etc. Some people with diabetes can exercise more than others. Also, there are people with diabetes that have other medical problems and/or on other medications that prevent them from having a normal reading. It is also true that a non-diabetic can have a reading of over 200 for several days. It happened to a friend of mine. She was in the hospital and the doctor was going to start her on insulin when she came home. He decided to do another test after a few days and her sugars were normal. My mom fell last year and had a concussion. When we got her to the hospital, her BG was 43. She does not have diabetes. We all try to control our BG's by doing the best that we can. For some people it is easier than for others. Eunice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 2, 2001 Report Share Posted September 2, 2001 In a message dated 9/2/01 2:10:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time, katiebearalicat2@... writes: > Do we as diabetics have to settle > for high readings? > Hi Ali, I don't think any person with diabetes wants a high reading, but sometimes, no matter what a person does, they still get high readings. After someone has been diagnosed, it takes a while to get medicines adjusted, to learn what they can and cannot eat, etc. Some people with diabetes can exercise more than others. Also, there are people with diabetes that have other medical problems and/or on other medications that prevent them from having a normal reading. It is also true that a non-diabetic can have a reading of over 200 for several days. It happened to a friend of mine. She was in the hospital and the doctor was going to start her on insulin when she came home. He decided to do another test after a few days and her sugars were normal. My mom fell last year and had a concussion. When we got her to the hospital, her BG was 43. She does not have diabetes. We all try to control our BG's by doing the best that we can. For some people it is easier than for others. Eunice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 3, 2001 Report Share Posted September 3, 2001 I totally agree. Shoot for non diabetic numbers. E dx'd 2/16/01-T2 hbA1c 2/16/01= 11.7 hbA1c 4/20/01=6.7 hbA1c 6/26/01= 5.0 44 yrs old,diet & exercise Something I don't understand. Why is a reading of 180 2 hours after a meal ok for a diabetic and not a non diabetic. From what I understand any reading above 140 is causing damage to our bodies. Do we as diabetics have to settle for high readings? Two hours after a meal your blood sugar should be back down to within normal range, which is below 120. Why would I ever let a Doctor or anyone else tell me a reading of 180 is ok when it's causing damage, isn't that something we are fighting to avoid in the long run? Just my point of view Ali Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 3, 2001 Report Share Posted September 3, 2001 I totally agree. Shoot for non diabetic numbers. E dx'd 2/16/01-T2 hbA1c 2/16/01= 11.7 hbA1c 4/20/01=6.7 hbA1c 6/26/01= 5.0 44 yrs old,diet & exercise Something I don't understand. Why is a reading of 180 2 hours after a meal ok for a diabetic and not a non diabetic. From what I understand any reading above 140 is causing damage to our bodies. Do we as diabetics have to settle for high readings? Two hours after a meal your blood sugar should be back down to within normal range, which is below 120. Why would I ever let a Doctor or anyone else tell me a reading of 180 is ok when it's causing damage, isn't that something we are fighting to avoid in the long run? Just my point of view Ali Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 3, 2001 Report Share Posted September 3, 2001 In a message dated 09/02/2001 9:04:08 PM Central Daylight Time, ERWachter@... writes: << I just lost a dear friend to cancer this morning. >> Sure sorry to hear this Eunice. My prayers are with you and your friends family. linda/kc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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