Re: Preservative - Antoinette

[Guest guest]

> You know and I know that potassium sorbate is synthetic. But why

do raw material vendors continue to sell potassium sorbate as a

natural presevative?

Maurice, I didn't explain clearly. They do not tell potassium sorbate

is a natural ingredient. They tell it looks good on the label. They

say consumers are less emotional about it than the paraben for

exemple. And this probably because they're used to see it mentioned

on food stuff. They assume if we can eat it, it is OK to use in

cosmetics.

At the same time I was talking about this, I mentioned " naturals " . I

was meaning at that presentation we've been told " naturals " (i.e.

proteins, extracts and so on) when used in a formula make that

particular formula very difficult to preserve. Something yourself

told us several times.

Sorry for the very confusing answer to Antoinette.

Zoubida

[Guest guest]

There are tons of sites stating Potassium Sorbate is natural and some say it is

artificially derived...I suspect that because it can be derived from natural

sources it is marketed as a natural substance.

This is from http://www.soybean.com/ps.htm

Potassium sorbate is a potassium salt version of sorbic acid, a polyunsaturated

fat used to inhibit mold growth. Sorbic acid was first isolated from the oil of

the unripened rowan berry (sorbapple or mountain ash berry) in 1959 by A.W.

Hoffmann. Sorbic acid obtained its name from the scientific name for mountain

ash (i.e. Sorbus aucuparia, Linne), the parent of the rowan berry. The chemical

structure of sorbic acid was determined some time between 1870 and 1890 (see

above), and then chemically synthesized by O. Doebner in 1900.

http://www.nutritionadvisor.com/webdoc10.html

Potassium sorbate and methyl paraben are both extracts from blueberries.

Potassium sorbate is the lactone acid from blueberries and acts as a natural

preservative in Calorad®. Methyl Paraben is a fine, white methyl-compound

(containing no alcohol) which is extracted from blueberries (or may be

artificially synthesized) and acts as a bonding agent as well as an anti-fungal

and natural preservative. It is used widely in foods and pharmaceuticals and is

generally recognized as a safe food additive and preservative. The presence of

these products insures a long shelf-life for your bottle of Calorad®.

There are tons of other sites selling the same story. I actually had a hard time

finding one that said it was synthetic...but then again, Yahoo search hits first

to to the highest bidder.

Rich

You Scent It, LLC

www.youscentit.com

You know and I know that potassium sorbate is synthetic. But why do raw

material vendors continue to sell potassium sorbate as a natural presevative?

Maurice

--------------------------------------------------------

Maurice O. Hevey

Convergent Cosmetics, Inc.

http://www.ConvergentCosmetics.com

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[Guest guest]

Thank you all for the replies and clarifying that

information....this was posted on a site from a supplier I use...

is a naturally occurring fatty acid with anti-microbial and anti-

fungal properties. It is found in the mountain laurel ash (sorbus

species) whose dried berries were used as a traditional food

preservative. It is commonly available as a synthesized product. FDA

regards K sorbate as GRAS (generally regarded as safe).

While they don't claim it to be natural, I guess as was mentioned,

if it originally was FOUND out in nature, and it is in food

products, must be more acceptable in cosmetics.

Now I have another question based on info from this thread!

[Guest guest]

" Maurice O. Hevey " <maurice@C...> wrote:

> You know and I know that potassium sorbate is synthetic. But why

do raw material vendors continue to sell potassium sorbate as a

natural presevative?

Could it be because it is " naturally derived " from berries?

Sherry

Natural Care E-books, booklets, spreadsheets

www.thompsonherbals.com/book.html

[Guest guest]

> There are tons of sites stating Potassium Sorbate is natural and

some say it is artificially derived...I suspect that because it can

be derived from natural sources it is marketed as a natural

substance.

I do think Terminology is the problem.

I think many sellers use the term " natural " when they actually

mean... " Naturally Derived or " Nature Identical " .

The same thing occurs in the soap world where people use the

term " Glycerin soap " [CP soap with sugar, glycerin, alcohol added}

when they are actually selling " Melt and Pour soap " (synthetic soap).

Just for information purposes:

Natural Means: meaning " any material that is harvested, mined or

collected, however it may have subsequently been washed,

decolourised, distilled, fractionated, ground, milled, separated or

concentrated in order to leave a chemical or chemicals that would be

available and detectable in the original source material " .

Naturally derived means: " the use of a natural raw material as the

starting point in a chemical process to produce a new chemical or

chemicals that in themselves may not be available in nature or in the

starting material " .

Nature identical means: " a substance that has been

produced " synthetically " , not usually from a natural starting

material, in order to produce a material that is identical to that

naturally occurring in nature " . Fragrance Oils may be an example.

I assume potassium sorbate falls in the category of Naturall Derived.

Sherry

Natural Care E-books, booklets, spreadsheets

www.thompsonherbals.com/book.html

[Guest guest]

>I assume potassium sorbate falls in the category of Naturall Derived.

Hi Sherry,

Sadly, I think I must disillusion you. I think that in this case a totally

synthetic preparation is cheaper and easier to produce than the natural extract.

Nerys

[Guest guest]

> Sadly, I think I must disillusion you. I think that in this case a

totally > synthetic preparation is cheaper and easier to produce than

the natural extract.

I was under the assimption that PS can be made both totally

synthetically and also from the nautral berry, although both are

actually synthetics ?

Sherry

[Guest guest]

> I was under the assimption that PS can be made both totally

> synthetically and also from the nautral berry, although both are

> actually synthetics ?

>

Sherry, it can be made from the berry, but what is in the marketplace is all

synthetic.

Pat.

Peace, Joy, Serenity

House of Scents tm. Body Oils, Fragrance Oils, Incense, Candles, Soap, Etc.

pat@...

http://www.houseofscents.com/