Re: OT - Colloidal silver question

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I bought colloidal silver for my son, hoping to address ongoing yeast and

bacterial problems. Before giving it to him, I took a dose. Half an hour

later, I wanted to curl up into a ball and pull a blanket over my head,

feeling flu-like and achy. I imagined this to be some kind of die-off

symptom, but I didn't know I had anything to kill off. To my knowledge, I

have no bacterial or yeast overgrowth. I took another dose the following two

days, and felt exactly the same really yucky feeling afterwards. After the

third day, with no lessening in my symptoms, I began to wonder if it was

really die-off, or if I just wasn't coping with the colloidal silver. I

decided not to give it to my son. And now I wonder if I have some overgrowth

I should be concerned with, or if I was just having a reaction of some sort!

Thoughts? Anyone else here tried colloidal silver?

Thanks,

Debbie

[Guest guest]

I read up on it because I thought about using it with my son. The one thing

I do remember is that it supposedly will kill off all the flora, good and

bad. So, make sure

to replenish with a good probiotic.

Celia

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/6/01 4:45:19 PM Central Standard Time,

alevin@... writes:

> what brand are you using? how many ppm(parts per million) silver is

>

Brand - Innovative Natural Products

PPM - 500 ppm per 1/2 teaspoon

Amt. I took - 1/2 teaspoon per day in 8 oz. glass of water for three days

Also on the bottle were these terms:

Advanced Liquid Technology

True Electro-Colloidal Process

Pure Silver

and of course...Satisfaction Guaranteed!

Thanks for any help,

Debbie

[Guest guest]

My son has had some regression the last 6 months, he has major sinus

problems, had his first surgery at 2. The antibiotics have a terrible effect

on his immune system. I am now feeling the regression is due to the yeast

problem and may actually contributing to his sinus infections. What are the

best way to treat the yeast problem aggressively? He is on a probiotic and

colostrum and been on antiobiotics for the last 30 days. We stopped the

antibiotic on Sunday but he is getting all congested again and complaining of

head aches already! Is the colloidal silver a proven therapy or are there

better? He has also been on nystatin but his yeast seem to be resistant to

that. HELP! We did start Houstons enzymes this week, he has been on

Kirkman's previous to that.

Jill

[Guest guest]

what brand are you using? how many ppm(parts per million) silver is

it? how much have you taken?

all bets are off until you know what you are taking!!!

having said that i have taken it with no immeadiate effects. longer

term the bowels become looser which is what you would expect as the

stomach fauna gets obliterated.

its not a regulated medicne, you have to be careful what brand you

use. some people make it themselves by using generators with silver

anodes which is another way to go.

> Hi,

>

> I bought colloidal silver for my son, hoping to address ongoing

yeast and

> bacterial problems. Before giving it to him, I took a dose. Half an

hour

> later, I wanted to curl up into a ball and pull a blanket over my

head,

> feeling flu-like and achy. I imagined this to be some kind of die-

off

> symptom, but I didn't know I had anything to kill off. To my

knowledge, I

> have no bacterial or yeast overgrowth. I took another dose the

following two

> days, and felt exactly the same really yucky feeling afterwards.

After the

> third day, with no lessening in my symptoms, I began to wonder if

it was

> really die-off, or if I just wasn't coping with the colloidal

silver. I

> decided not to give it to my son. And now I wonder if I have some

overgrowth

> I should be concerned with, or if I was just having a reaction of

some sort!

>

> Thoughts? Anyone else here tried colloidal silver?

>

> Thanks,

> Debbie

[Guest guest]

http://www.inovnatprod.com/catalog/silver.htm

it looks like a standard colloidal silver product, no additives that

i can see, but quite a high concentration at 500ppm so it may well be

you are getting some sort of die off, half an hour is about when the

silver would start to hit the small intestine perhaps. just going on

what i have read on the web it does sound like yeast die off.

it would be real interesting if it was yeast because silver colloid

would be an effective challenge to test for yeast.

i don't think you can rule out some sort of other substance in the

colloidal silver except by trying another brand.

silver itself, because it is in the diet in trace amounts does not

seem a likely scource of reaction.

when storing collidal silver it really should be kept out of sunlight

and there should be no silver precipitate on the bottom. they are

also recommending here that it be bought in a glass container because

plastic container can cause the silver to lose its charge and come

out of suspension.

> In a message dated 11/6/01 4:45:19 PM Central Standard Time,

> alevin@i... writes:

>

>

> > what brand are you using? how many ppm(parts per million) silver

is

> >

>

> Brand - Innovative Natural Products

> PPM - 500 ppm per 1/2 teaspoon

> Amt. I took - 1/2 teaspoon per day in 8 oz. glass of water for

three days

>

> Also on the bottle were these terms:

> Advanced Liquid Technology

> True Electro-Colloidal Process

> Pure Silver

> and of course...Satisfaction Guaranteed!

>

> Thanks for any help,

> Debbie

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/7/2001 2:25:13 PM Pacific Standard Time,

elegantart2000@... writes:

> We've gone

> with Caprylic acid & Oregano oil. Both of each are

> very nasty but very powerful and do not pressure liver

> so much as Duflican (which was on the drug list).

> It did it along with yeast free diet.

>

>

> Mila,

>

> This is very interesting to me because I have been seriously considering

> doing the antifungal treatments next on Spencer...although the liver stress

> has been a big concern. Can you tellme more about the caprylic acid and

> oregano oil? What side effects are you aware of? Do you still need to have

> liver function tests run while using them? Are they readily available, etc?

> I figures that,as long as Spencer did so well on the probiotics, it is time

> to move up a nothc to antifungals, but I have been dreading the side

> effects. Do you have any recommendations for things to look out for or

> concerns? Thanks for your insights...

Amber

[Guest guest]

Mila,

Thanks for the info, is your son doing better now that you have dealt with

the yeast?

Jill

[Guest guest]

Jill, from my experience with fighting the yeast

overgrowth. We tried Nystatin once after organic acid

test indicated that my son might have yeast overgrowth

- without success.

We did another parasitology test at Great Smokies lab

which would not only show what and how many bad guys

they found but also what drugs or natural alternative

would be effective with each one of them. We've gone

with Caprylic acid & Oregano oil. Both of each are

very nasty but very powerful and do not pressure liver

so much as Duflican (which was on the drug list).

It did it along with yeast free diet.

Mila

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hi Mila, Amphiterican is a good antifungal drug that doesn't affect the

liver - you can get it through a compound pharmacist - it also doesn't

contain any preservatives etc either - needs to be kept in the fridge - our

child was on diflucan which works great - this is better as it doesn't

afect the liver

Cheers H

Re: [ ] Re: OT - Colloidal silver question

In a message dated 11/7/2001 2:25:13 PM Pacific Standard Time,

elegantart2000@... writes:

> We've gone

> with Caprylic acid & Oregano oil. Both of each are

> very nasty but very powerful and do not pressure liver

> so much as Duflican (which was on the drug list).

> It did it along with yeast free diet.

>

>

> Mila,

>

> This is very interesting to me because I have been seriously considering

> doing the antifungal treatments next on Spencer...although the liver

stress

> has been a big concern. Can you tellme more about the caprylic acid and

> oregano oil? What side effects are you aware of? Do you still need to

have

> liver function tests run while using them? Are they readily available,

etc?

> I figures that,as long as Spencer did so well on the probiotics, it is

time

> to move up a nothc to antifungals, but I have been dreading the side

> effects. Do you have any recommendations for things to look out for or

> concerns? Thanks for your insights...

Amber

[Guest guest]

Amber, before you start treating Spencer I would

strongly recommend you to do stool test to see what

you will be dealing with. Some stuff kills both birds

in one stone, some does not. In our case it was not

just candida (fungus) it was also klobsiella

(parasite). It happened that the treatment overlapped

for both of them. But I am aware it is not always a

case.

There is Candida Wellness Center that sends out a

booklet called Candida Yeast Answer Booklet for free.

Gives very good explanation on what and how to deal

with such a beast (can't find a better word for it).

Phone# 800-869-1613 or www.cwchealth.com

They also promote their products which we did not try.

But again very good info on what to have in your

arsenal in case you're ready to start a

" conversation " .

By the way here what they say about Colloidal Silver:

" The greatest misrepresentation is 'particle sizing'.

If any of the silver particles are larger than .001

microns, they can be toxic to the body and remain

within the tissues and cause a graying of the skin,

developing into a condition called Argyria. Products

with silver particles too large are dangerous and

should not be used... " I am going through the pages

right now, and again I would say you might want to

read this booklet first.

Re: Caprylic Acid and Oregano Oil. Both have strong

antifungal/antiparasite properties. Side effects - I

don't know of any. The thing you have to be careful

with Oregano is it must be Oreganum Vulgarus,

otherwise the stuff is good for pizza only. I tried

Oregano on myself as i read it is also an immune

system booster (and who does not need one when being

under stress for quite a long). I mixed it with Orange

juice (3 drops is a max for an adult) and drank it as

a shot. It burned and spread the warmth in whole body.

The reason I am going into such a detail is to give

you some idea whether it would be feasible for Spencer

to take it. Arthur always was an excellent medicine

taker, even when he disliked it he would take it.

Unfortunately he won't swallow capsules, if Spencer

does you can put Oregano in a capsule, but he would

have to swallow it really quick as Oregano disolves

capsule very fast.

Very very powerful. Very very nasty. 2 oz for $60.

Caprylic acid is derived from coconut. You can buy it

in health food stores and it's much cheaper. Comes in

capsules or tablets.

I crushed tablets in martyr, mixed with water in a

medicine spoon and gave something to drink afterwards

immidietely (water or juice). I basically happened to

give anything bad tasting in this fashion to my son.

The thing with fungus is it has a tendency to return.

You never know if the first battle won is the last

one.

I remember my first app with the allergist,he was

asking about symptoms. At the end of my complaints i

said I don't think candida has anything to do with

allergies though. He said " how mistaken you are.

Those are very often go together as immune system is

the one at stake. " Thus, the more attention immune

system has to give out to allergies the less troops

left to deal with fungus, parasites, etc.

Re: liver tests, we did not have to run one as we

decided to go with the natural alternatives. But it is

advised to run liver test if for example you want to

give him Duflican.

Another thing is a diet. You want to give it a best

shot by not feeding fungi. It strives on carbs, sugar,

antibiotics (that was new to me!). So diet plus

medication (natural or heavy duty) gives the best

results. It's tough but totally worth doing.

You are definitely on the right path.

Mila

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

ly, yes. Much better. He still has other things

to be tuned up to function better though. But fighting

yeast if present is really BIG DEAL and it has to be

done aggessively.

Mila

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

, I am sorry I gave a wrong impression, but my son

was not on Diflucan. Diflucan was indicated on the

test results on the list of drugs that would be very

effective with yeast problems. When we did accupunture

a while ago, the practioner had a habit of checking

Arthur's pulses, I was told that Arthur has a " gentle "

liver and we have to be careful on what we give. So

when we heard of possible liver implications, we had

no other thought but to stay away from Diflucan and

others like.

Thank you, for recommendation.

Mila

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hello Ladies,

This came from one of my Soap Lists. I found it amusing and quite possibly

true!

> Take all American women who are within five years of menopause.

> Train us

> for a few weeks, outfit us with automatic weapons, grenades, gas

> masks,

> moisturizer with SPF15, Prozac, hormones, chocolate, and canned tuna.

> Drop

> us (parachuted, preferably) across the landscape of Afghanistan, and

> let us

> do what comes naturally. Think about it. Our anger quotient alone,

> even

> when doing standard stuff like grocery shopping and paying bills, is

> formidable enough to make even armed men in turbans tremble.

> We've had our children. We would gladly suffer or die to protect

> them and

> their future. We'd like to get away from our husbands, if they

> haven't left

> already. And for those of us who are single, the prospect of finding

> a good

> man with whom to share life is about as likely as being struck by

> lightning.

> We have nothing to lose.

> We've survived the water diet, the protein diet, the carbohydrate

> diet, and

> the grapefruit diet in gyms and saunas across America and never lost a

> pound. We can easily survive months in the hostile terrain of

> Afghanistan

> with no food at all!

> We've spent years tracking down our husbands or lovers in bars,

> hardware

> stores, or sporting events...finding bin Laden in some cave will be no

> problem.

> Uniting all the warring tribes of Afghanistan in a new government?

> Oh,

> please ... we've planned the seating arrangements for in-laws and

> extended

> families at Thanksgiving dinners for years ... we understand tribal

> warfare.

> Between us, we've divorced enough husbands to know every trick there

> is for

> how they hide, launder, or cover up bank accounts and money sources.

> We

> know how to find that money, and we know how to seize it ... with or

> without

> the government's help!

> Let us go and fight. The Taliban hates women. Imagine their terror

> as we

> crawl like ants with hot-flashes over their godforsaken terrain.

----------------------- Headers --------------------------------

Return-Path: <LShipley@...>

Received: fro

[Guest guest]

A word of warning against colloidal silver: It may not be

harmless.

It may cause a highly unpleasant side-effect called " argyria "

where the silver is deposited in the skin and makes the skin

go greyish-black permanently. Silver reacts with sunlight and

turns black. I've seen people with that disease on TV and they

look like monsters. There's no cure for it - buyer beware!

Arthur Hoornweg

[Guest guest]

> A word of warning against colloidal silver: It may not be

> harmless. It may cause a highly unpleasant side-effect

called " argyria " where the silver is deposited in the skin and makes

the skin go greyish-black permanently. Silver reacts with sunlight and

> turns black.

I read this can happen if it is used regularly. However when used for

the 10-days as an antibiotic or occassionally for a flu or cold or

something, this isn't a problem. On another board, someone said there

is a certain product to use if you DO want to use colloidal silver

daily. I can look it up if anyone is interested.

Oh, and someone asked about it being a metal. Apparently the fact

that it is in an ionic form AND the particle size is very small make

it safe. I just typed in " colloidal silver " into the search engine

and got lots of references.

Thanks for posting this.

.

[Guest guest]

> Oh, and someone asked about it being a metal. Apparently the fact

> that it is in an ionic form AND the particle size is very small make

> it safe. I just typed in " colloidal silver " into the search engine

> and got lots of references.

> Thanks for posting this.

> .

I would personally never use colloidal silver because it is a metal.

That is just my own opinion tho. But the American Dental Association,

so far as I know, still believes that " silver fillings " which are

actually mercury fillings, are still okay because they are mixed into

composition which supposedly renders the mercury " non-toxic " , which

obviously I do not agree with. So when you write that " it is in an

ionic form AND the particle size is very small make it safe " , my first

instinct is that you have received the " party line " and not unbiased

information.

Dana

[Guest guest]

I would just be concerned in that I've read that it can make the

skin " gray " -- permanently.

W

---

[Guest guest]

>>my first instinct is that you have received the " party line " and

not unbiased information.

I agree with this. There is a lot of party line stuff going around.

An doing an internet search can bring up anything. And of course,

people wanting to sell stuff will also paint their product in the

best light. I did see some non-commercial stuff and this is the

reason given that it is " safe " (ionic, small size). However, I

wouldn't want to use it regularly. Mike said " Well, yeah, silver will

be a great antibiotic. Heavy metals are highly toxic to life! "

But we used it the 10 days for Jordan and his Clostridia problem

seems to be cleared up. It has been over a week since we stopped and

the smell and bathroom problems are still gone. Halleluia.

.

[Guest guest]

i think its the silver nitrate form of silver that can give this

problem, pure silver does not react, at least as far as elemental

silver i have seen, all the same i would not store colliodal silver

in sunlight. collidal silver is elemental silver as far as i

understand.

silver nitrate or organic forms of silver have been used up until at

sixites i think so there are people with agrayia around, but none to

my knowledge from colloidal silver.

this is why it pays to be careful of the brand of cololiodal silver

you by, it should be only collidal silver and not have any additives

to keep the silver in suspension.

perhaps you can look through your monster catalogue and give up cases

of agrayia from colliodal silver? i know there are people out there

who take heaps with no reports of agrayia, to me the problems are

more subtle and relate to inibiting enzyme systems, but occasional

internal use as a systemic anti bacterial/ anti fungal and possibly

anti viral may be quite ok.

i don't suppose you use a fluoride toothpaste do you?

> A word of warning against colloidal silver: It may not be

> harmless.

> It may cause a highly unpleasant side-effect called " argyria "

> where the silver is deposited in the skin and makes the skin

> go greyish-black permanently. Silver reacts with sunlight and

> turns black. I've seen people with that disease on TV and they

> look like monsters. There's no cure for it - buyer beware!

>

>

> Arthur Hoornweg

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/14/01 10:05:49 AM Central Standard Time,

arthur.hoornweg@... writes:

> here are a few links about Argyria in connection to colloidal silver.

> Read Rosemary 's story. Is silver really worth the risk?

>

> http://homepages.together.net/~rjstan/

> http://www.rz.uni-frankfurt.de/~deichm/kollo/rose4.html

> http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/PhonyAds/silverad.html

> http://www.clspress.com/silver.html

> http://www.fda.gov/bbs/topics/ANSWERS/ANS00971.html

>

>

> Arthur Hoornweg

>

>

>

>

Oh my! That was an eye-opener!

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I don't use it myself, but the people shown on TV suffering from

argyria were definitely in their thirties, so it's unlikely they contracted

this in the 1960's. I am pretty sure the programme was about colloidal

metallic silver and not the nitrate.

Moreover, if colloidal silver is taken orally, doesn't it react with the

stomach acid and form silver chloride? Silver chloride is very poorly

soluble in water so you don't pee it out easily. If it stays in the body,

I'd certainly stay away from it. But that's my personal opinion.

Arthur Hoornweg

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

here are a few links about Argyria in connection to colloidal silver.

Read Rosemary 's story. Is silver really worth the risk?

http://homepages.together.net/~rjstan/

http://www.rz.uni-frankfurt.de/~deichm/kollo/rose4.html

http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/PhonyAds/silverad.html

http://www.clspress.com/silver.html

http://www.fda.gov/bbs/topics/ANSWERS/ANS00971.html

Arthur Hoornweg

[Guest guest]

what disturbs me about rosemary jacobs story is that she doesn't say

wether the form of silver that gave her agrayia was colliodal silver

of the type that is produced now.

that is, a collodial silver only suspension of a particle size less

than .01 microns or thereabouts. also solutions of say less than

50ppm.

i posted earlier on understanding nonlinearity, splatter gunning with

" all is wrong " is linear thinking and needlessly removes remedies

that are are benefit if used in a way that avoids problems.

i don't know enough about chemistry to comment an the possiblity of

silver colloid being turned to silver chloride by stomach acid.

i'm not going to rework it but i did calculate a comparison of normal

dietary intake compared to using a 40 ppm collo1dal silver solution

taking about 40 ml a day and it was larger by a factor of about 10

which didn't seem too untoward for something taken on an intermittant

basis.

i have seen on the web people who are taking very large amounts

without agrayia, but who in my opinion show some signs of

neurotoxicity, or silver crossing the blood brain barrier.

also this post

http://www.google.com/search?

q=cache:ilJ5tvq9LWo:www.healthyawareness.com/archives/_can_gen13/00000

1d2.htm+colloidal+silver+agyria & hl=en

however from experience collidal silver can be effective for some

skin conditions that nothing else is effective for.

also it is a good broad spectrum antibiotic/antifungal that may

be suitable for intermitant use for gut fauna issues.

these are not mild advantages and theerfore i would not eliminate

colliodal silver across the board.

its a question of degree and the relative non-toxicity of colloiodal

silver shown by long term users of collidal silver creates in my

opinion a window of safety for intermitant nasal or ingestive use

or topical application.

however it does appear imortant that the form is a true collidal

silver suspension becuase as far as i can see there are no cases of

agrayia from the form of collidal silver as specifyed above.

however agrayia is a secondary problem compared to silvers inherent

toxicty, but with collidal silver solutions of say up to 40ppm, maybe

preferably 20ppm you are looking at a medicinal use comparable to

other medications. toxicity is in the nature of medications and

application is essentially non linear in the sense of being a window

dose in the sense of too much being toxic and too little not having

any effect.

you didn't respond to my question about fluoride in your toothpaste,

fluoride is extremely neurotoxic, much much more so than silver, i

haven't noticed silver being used in nerve gas, but fluorine is.

it is present in town water supplies at a rate of one ppm.

the quanties in toothpaste are much larger and some is absorbed

through the gums.

nystatin also is toxic if it penetrates the gut wall and as gut

permiability is an issue with autistic spectrum there can be a

problem here as well.

> Hi ,

>

> here are a few links about Argyria in connection to colloidal

silver.

> Read Rosemary 's story. Is silver really worth the risk?

>

> http://homepages.together.net/~rjstan/

> http://www.rz.uni-frankfurt.de/~deichm/kollo/rose4.html

>

http://www.quackwatch.com/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/PhonyAds/silverad.ht

ml

> http://www.clspress.com/silver.html

> http://www.fda.gov/bbs/topics/ANSWERS/ANS00971.html

>

>

> Arthur Hoornweg

[Guest guest]

Hi Arthur;

They're fooling with us on the argyria issue.

What Rosemary s - the FDA's blue Show Pony - does not come out and say

is that she never even used colloidal silver. That's right, Rose and the

rest have fallen victim to FDA-approved high-potency silver compounds, which

are known to cause problems.

Then with typical FDA finesse, they carefully condemn all silver compounds,

and colloidal silver as well, which is neither a compound nor nearly the

potency the compounds were. This kind of disinformation is a clever part of

the FDA push for drugs and against what they have labelled 'alternative'

therapies, which they're trying their damndest to sweep under the rug, even

if they have to lie.

Really, when you think about it, allopathic medicine IS the alternative. The

REAL orthodox and natural methods however have been used for centuries, or

in the case of silver, millenia, to good effect.

The new medical paradigm is approaching quickly. It will incorporate all

that works of allopathic medicine, which is about 1/10 of the drugs and

perhaps most of the diagnostics, and all that works in natural medicine,

which is about 7/8 of it, and nearly ALL the preventive methods and

substances. There are no viable options, and resistance is futile. Fact is

that in 70 years Pharma Medicine has failed to improve on what we already

had.

OK, back to colloidal silver : Colloidal silver in common use is 12-15 PPM

(parts per million). The stuff I make, use, and give way is about 35 PPM.

The silver compounds that people are having problems with are 1300 PPM-3500

PPM.

Because a person has to accumulate several GRAMS of silver under their skin

before the beginning effects of argyria occur, and because silver is

excreted, primarily in the feces, with very little remaining, in about 3

days, you can see that you'd be drinking 100-200 GALLONS a day to be

remotely in danger.

More info on the silver list.

http://escribe.com/health/thesilverlist/index.html

This has been discussed at length. Searchable archive.

Duncan Crow

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