Re: seeking clarity... Kathy - wait!

[Guest guest]

Kathy

I think Dana is on to something with the MSG and additives. I would

not throw in the towel yet. Why don't you do a challenge with just

soy at home to determine for sure? You could gradually check for

other foods, too. One of our first challenges was at a deli where my

son had a bagel with poppy seeds. Guess what? The enzymes do not

help with poppy seeds. He was one hyper dude. My husband guessed it

was the poppy seeds and Devin confirmed this. My son also cannot

tolerate peanuts. You just have to check things one at a time. I

hope this works out for you. Let us know.

[Guest guest]

Thanks and Dana,

I had thought of the MSG, this restaurant is MSG free though - but maybe

other additives could have caused the problem. Also the wheat issue in the

soy sauce as well may have confused things. I will do a challenge with soy

on its own at home with some wheat free soy sauce - good idea.

I am still not clear in my mind though - how can enzymes help with allergy

issues? If my son is +4 on IGG blood allergy testing for soy and + 3 for

wheat then how can the enzymes help with this? (We also have quite alot of

environmental allergies to deal with) Isn't leaky gut, which I can

understand how enzymes will assist with, quite different from allergies?

Maybe or Devin can advise me on this.

kathy

> Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2001 12:00:03 -0000

> From: ckelley100@...

>Subject: Re: Seeking clarity... Kathy - wait!

>

>Kathy

>

>I think Dana is on to something with the MSG and additives. I would

>not throw in the towel yet. Why don't you do a challenge with just

>soy at home to determine for sure? You could gradually check for

>other foods, too. One of our first challenges was at a deli where my

>son had a bagel with poppy seeds. Guess what? The enzymes do not

>help with poppy seeds. He was one hyper dude. My husband guessed it

>was the poppy seeds and Devin confirmed this. My son also cannot

>tolerate peanuts. You just have to check things one at a time. I

>hope this works out for you. Let us know.

>

>

>

>

_________________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

Enzymes may help allergies by breaking down the undigested protein

fragments (molecular sized) that may result in allergies when they

escape the gut into the systemic circulation. You are correct that it

may not help with environmental or inhaled allergens.

In general, the smaller the molecule, the less likely it will be

recognized as " foreign " and an immune response mounted against it.

Proteases can make proteins " smaller " by chopping them up into

smaller pieces or amino acids. Since soy and wheat have protein

components, the proteases can break them down such that they may not

be allergenic.

Devin

--- In @y..., " kathy walmsley " <kathy_walmsley@h...>

wrote:

> Thanks and Dana,

>

> I am still not clear in my mind though - how can enzymes help with

allergy

> issues? If my son is +4 on IGG blood allergy testing for soy and +

3 for

> wheat then how can the enzymes help with this? (We also have quite

alot of

> environmental allergies to deal with) Isn't leaky gut, which I can

> understand how enzymes will assist with, quite different from

allergies?

>

[Guest guest]

> I am still not clear in my mind though - how can enzymes help with

allergy

> issues? If my son is +4 on IGG blood allergy testing for soy and +

3 for

> wheat then how can the enzymes help with this? (We also have quite

alot of

> environmental allergies to deal with) Isn't leaky gut, which I can

> understand how enzymes will assist with, quite different from

allergies?

> Maybe or Devin can advise me on this.

> kathy

I am not or Devin, but here is my experience.

My #3 son has classic allergy symptoms, hives and etc. They improved

with removal of certain foods. They improved more with enzymes. I

will write more about this when I reply to 's message about my

chelation protocol, but I have to go offline now so will do that one

later today. But yes, it did help my #3 son with his classic allergy

symptoms.

Dana

[Guest guest]

Kathy wrote:

>I had thought of the MSG, this restaurant is MSG free though - but

maybe other additives could >have caused the problem. Also the wheat

issue in the soy sauce as well may have confused >things. I will do

a challenge with soy on its own at home with some wheat free soy

sauce - good >idea.

Hi Kathy,

Wheat-free soy sauce may still not remove all doubts, as soy sauce is

very high in naturally occurring MSG and also in amines (a form of

phenols), which may or may not be a problem - sorry I can't remember

whether you mentioned phenols in a previous post.

A challenge with soy in some other form where there are no other

interfering chemicals would give you a clearer picture. You also need

to make sure he is not eating anything else around that time that

might influence the outcome.

Hope this helps,

regards

Australian, living in Manila, Philippines

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I had no idea that Soy sauce had naturally occurring MSG - what a bummmer!

Thanks for that insight. My family seem to have a real problem with MSG -

all of us have very disturbed sleep after consuming MSG. I used to use alot

of oyster sauce and soy sauce in cooking and really miss the stuff - so sick

of tasteless food. I do use a sweet chili sauce (says no MSG but full of

sugar of course). I don't think phenols are a major problem for us. We used

to live in Thailand and all of us adore spicy Asian food, even the kids.

Do you know of other foods that have naturally occurring MSG?

thanks again,

kathy

Australian living in Washington DC, USA

>Hi Kathy,

>

>Wheat-free soy sauce may still not remove all doubts, as soy sauce is

>very high in naturally occurring MSG and also in amines (a form of

>phenols), which may or may not be a problem - sorry I can't remember

>whether you mentioned phenols in a previous post.

>

>A challenge with soy in some other form where there are no other

>interfering chemicals would give you a clearer picture. You also need

>to make sure he is not eating anything else around that time that

>might influence the outcome.

>

>Hope this helps,

>regards

>

>Australian, living in Manila, Philippines

>

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[Guest guest]

Thanks for this explanation Devin.

Kathy

> From: " D. Houston " <houstonni@...>

>Subject: Re: seeking clarity... Kathy - wait!

>

>Enzymes may help allergies by breaking down the undigested protein

>fragments (molecular sized) that may result in allergies when they

>escape the gut into the systemic circulation. You are correct that it

>may not help with environmental or inhaled allergens.

>In general, the smaller the molecule, the less likely it will be

>recognized as " foreign " and an immune response mounted against it.

>Proteases can make proteins " smaller " by chopping them up into

>smaller pieces or amino acids. Since soy and wheat have protein

>components, the proteases can break them down such that they may not

>be allergenic.

>Devin

_________________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

Kathy wrote:

>My family seem to have a real problem with MSG -

>all of us have very disturbed sleep after consuming MSG. <

MSG does this to me too - I have recurring nightmares and frequent

waking. What I haven't worked out is whether it is only the pure from

of MSG which is an additive that does this or the naturally occurring

variety, which is, unfortunately, pretty common. Most amine rich

foods also contain glutamates, so since I react to amines, and

therefore avoid them, I am also avoiding the naturally occurring

glutamates.

>I used to use alot

>of oyster sauce and soy sauce in cooking and really miss the stuff -

so sick

>of tasteless food. <

You can add a tablespoon or two of golden syrup at the very end of

cooking a stir fry to give a surprisingly soy-sauce kind of a

flavour. It burns very easily, so you have to add it just at the end.

The only golden syrup that I have heard of being available in the

States does contain salicylates, but since phenols don't seem to be a

problem for you/your family, it probably should be OK.

>Do you know of other foods that have naturally occurring MSG?<

It is found in tomatoes, broccoli, champignon, mushroom, spinach,

tasty cheeses, grapes, plums, prunes, raisins, sultanas, miso, soy

sauce and tempeh, meat and yeast extracts, hydrolysed vegetable

protein and probably textured vegetable protein, ... and there are

probably others I've omitted.

Hope this helps

regards

Australian, living in Manila, Philippines