Guest guest Posted November 29, 2011 Report Share Posted November 29, 2011 In epilepsy, parts of the brain are in an irritable or hypersensitive state, and can be set off into a chain reaction by some trigger. Sometimes this is a recognised external stimulus, and this might be more common than supposed since it is rarely suspected or looked for. In some breeds of animals convulsions can be induced by loud sound, eg jangling keys. Audiogenic Epilepsy is a major animal model used for testing anticonvulsants. These animals have hyperactive cochleae due to incipient hearing loss, and can be acoustically sensitised or primed with loud sound at a critical early period of life. Autistic children have mysterious late onset epilepsy inexplicable bv congenital or acquired brain damage, but sensitisation of higher parts of the auditory system in audiosensitive children, as in these animals, now provides a simple mechanism for this. ********************************************************************** > > > > > > C, > > > > > > Is it possible to have 4S and also have other sounds that can be muddled? Very > > > acute hearing as well as muddled hearing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > From: C <venojim@> > > > To: " Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > > > > Sent: Thu, November 24, 2011 8:19:58 AM > > > Subject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > >  > > > As a hearing professional and someone who has suffered from 4S for 45 years I > > > can assure you Otoscerlosis  ( affects the Stapes ) and ear wax have nothing to > > > do with 4S. Otoscerlosis is usually Genetic and affects only one ear most of > > > the time.   Depending on the advice of your ENT ( I would get several opinions ) > > > an operation will usually repair the stapes and your hearing in the affected ear > > > will be close to the non affected ear after a successful operation. > > > > > > Things to consider - If it will not affect you health or if the Otoscerlosisis > > > is not getting worse,  I would opt out of an operation †" there is a chance the > > > operation will fail and cause a worse hearing loss. A hearing aid would work > > > very well should you desire to hear better, you can take it out when you > > > don’t.  Also, I believe the repair of the Stapes usually lasts for 5-9 years on > > > average then another operation may be needed.  > > > > > > > > > From: mommyamarette <Amarette83@> > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 3:20 AM > > > Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > >  > > > Dr. - > > > > > > I thought I needed to respond to this particular thread because I 1) Have a > > > pretty bad case of Misophonia (at least it seems bad to me and those who I have > > > relations with) and 2) I have hearing loss. > > > > > > My particular type of hearing loss is from a condition called Otosclerosis > > > (sp?). One of the three bones in my ear is fused in place and does not move like > > > it should. This has gone on since I was a child (probably from birth, but not > > > confirmed... I did have excess earwax as a kid). My hearing is worse in my left > > > ear and my right ear approaches normal levels of hearing. When talking on the > > > phone, I have to hold it to my right ear. I don't have a hearing aid, and I can > > > generally hold a normal conversation without any problem, but my audiologist > > > said that whenever I wanted to do surgery for it, all I have to do is say the > > > word. (On a side note, he does not have a working knowledge of how to help me > > > with the Misophonia. I would love to know if anyone has contacts in the St. > > > Louis, MO area!) I do depend on this hearing impediment when dealing with my > > > Misophonia. Depending on the trigger and the volume of the actual sound, > > > sometimes I only need to cover my right ear to reduce my ability to hear it. > > > > > > > > > Currently, I am 28 and pregnant with my second child. Although I haven't noticed > > > an increase in my hearing loss, my ears do ring more often than normal. > > > > > > I figured you would be interested to find a case of Misophonia where the person > > > has hearing issues. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Amarette > > > > > > > > From: M <Oregon7@> > > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:50 AM > > > > > Subject: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > One little item I could contribute here is the fact that I have never yet > > > >evaluated someone with 4S/Miso who had significant hearing loss. > > > > > > > > > > The vast majority of sufferers have perfect hearing if not better than > > > >average hearing. One child recently had full -10 scores across the auditory test > > > >tones....that was kind of amazing, really, like a bionic ear and I do think this > > > >does contribute to the misery a bit. > > > > > > > > > > IT would be fantastic if I could do a 30 year study starting with initial > > > >auditory tests and using the MRQ (The Misophonia Reaction Questionnaire) along > > > >with a couple other evaluative tools, like Beck Test for Anxiety, etc. and then > > > >see, if over the decades, as the subjects aged and lost decibels of hearing, IF > > > >their 4S/Miso scores would improve. > > > > > > > > > > I suspect they do. > > > > > > > > > > Expose yourself to sound, people, listen to music, go to concerts, learn to > > > >play in a band or quartet, dance the flamenco, whatever it takes to expose your > > > >system to plenty of stimulation. > > > > > > > > > > Earplugs are not a good solution, they will simply cause your poor ol' brain > > > >to turn up its internal volume, trying to catch the noise and sounds, which are > > > >its nourishment, if you can see this clearly. > > > > > > > > > > When you deprive the auditory system of 'food' (sound), it starves for this > > > >and becomes even more acutely anxious in seeking it, and becomes ravenous for > > > >sound, and will find the tiniest crumb or speck and devour it!!!!!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > Seriously, that is what happens when you put in those ear plugs. > > > > > > > > > > Feed it, stuff it, make every day a Thanksgiving of Sound for your auditory > > > >system, indulge it, over eat it, consume and explore the vast realms of new > > > >types of ear-food for your brain! > > > > > > > > > > Do not ignore it. You can see that perhaps 4S/Miso can become a kind of > > > >anorexia for the ears! > > > > > > > > > > So go out and do this. Set up every space in your home as an auditory > > > >experience! > > > > > > > > > > A delightful Feast O Noise (A Dr. term...) > > > > > > > > > > Dr. Marsha , Audiologit, Portland, Oregon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 29, 2011 Report Share Posted November 29, 2011 In epilepsy, parts of the brain are in an irritable or hypersensitive state, and can be set off into a chain reaction by some trigger. Sometimes this is a recognised external stimulus, and this might be more common than supposed since it is rarely suspected or looked for. In some breeds of animals convulsions can be induced by loud sound, eg jangling keys. Audiogenic Epilepsy is a major animal model used for testing anticonvulsants. These animals have hyperactive cochleae due to incipient hearing loss, and can be acoustically sensitised or primed with loud sound at a critical early period of life. Autistic children have mysterious late onset epilepsy inexplicable bv congenital or acquired brain damage, but sensitisation of higher parts of the auditory system in audiosensitive children, as in these animals, now provides a simple mechanism for this. ********************************************************************** > > > > > > C, > > > > > > Is it possible to have 4S and also have other sounds that can be muddled? Very > > > acute hearing as well as muddled hearing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > From: C <venojim@> > > > To: " Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > > > > Sent: Thu, November 24, 2011 8:19:58 AM > > > Subject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > >  > > > As a hearing professional and someone who has suffered from 4S for 45 years I > > > can assure you Otoscerlosis  ( affects the Stapes ) and ear wax have nothing to > > > do with 4S. Otoscerlosis is usually Genetic and affects only one ear most of > > > the time.   Depending on the advice of your ENT ( I would get several opinions ) > > > an operation will usually repair the stapes and your hearing in the affected ear > > > will be close to the non affected ear after a successful operation. > > > > > > Things to consider - If it will not affect you health or if the Otoscerlosisis > > > is not getting worse,  I would opt out of an operation †" there is a chance the > > > operation will fail and cause a worse hearing loss. A hearing aid would work > > > very well should you desire to hear better, you can take it out when you > > > don’t.  Also, I believe the repair of the Stapes usually lasts for 5-9 years on > > > average then another operation may be needed.  > > > > > > > > > From: mommyamarette <Amarette83@> > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 3:20 AM > > > Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > >  > > > Dr. - > > > > > > I thought I needed to respond to this particular thread because I 1) Have a > > > pretty bad case of Misophonia (at least it seems bad to me and those who I have > > > relations with) and 2) I have hearing loss. > > > > > > My particular type of hearing loss is from a condition called Otosclerosis > > > (sp?). One of the three bones in my ear is fused in place and does not move like > > > it should. This has gone on since I was a child (probably from birth, but not > > > confirmed... I did have excess earwax as a kid). My hearing is worse in my left > > > ear and my right ear approaches normal levels of hearing. When talking on the > > > phone, I have to hold it to my right ear. I don't have a hearing aid, and I can > > > generally hold a normal conversation without any problem, but my audiologist > > > said that whenever I wanted to do surgery for it, all I have to do is say the > > > word. (On a side note, he does not have a working knowledge of how to help me > > > with the Misophonia. I would love to know if anyone has contacts in the St. > > > Louis, MO area!) I do depend on this hearing impediment when dealing with my > > > Misophonia. Depending on the trigger and the volume of the actual sound, > > > sometimes I only need to cover my right ear to reduce my ability to hear it. > > > > > > > > > Currently, I am 28 and pregnant with my second child. Although I haven't noticed > > > an increase in my hearing loss, my ears do ring more often than normal. > > > > > > I figured you would be interested to find a case of Misophonia where the person > > > has hearing issues. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Amarette > > > > > > > > From: M <Oregon7@> > > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:50 AM > > > > > Subject: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > One little item I could contribute here is the fact that I have never yet > > > >evaluated someone with 4S/Miso who had significant hearing loss. > > > > > > > > > > The vast majority of sufferers have perfect hearing if not better than > > > >average hearing. One child recently had full -10 scores across the auditory test > > > >tones....that was kind of amazing, really, like a bionic ear and I do think this > > > >does contribute to the misery a bit. > > > > > > > > > > IT would be fantastic if I could do a 30 year study starting with initial > > > >auditory tests and using the MRQ (The Misophonia Reaction Questionnaire) along > > > >with a couple other evaluative tools, like Beck Test for Anxiety, etc. and then > > > >see, if over the decades, as the subjects aged and lost decibels of hearing, IF > > > >their 4S/Miso scores would improve. > > > > > > > > > > I suspect they do. > > > > > > > > > > Expose yourself to sound, people, listen to music, go to concerts, learn to > > > >play in a band or quartet, dance the flamenco, whatever it takes to expose your > > > >system to plenty of stimulation. > > > > > > > > > > Earplugs are not a good solution, they will simply cause your poor ol' brain > > > >to turn up its internal volume, trying to catch the noise and sounds, which are > > > >its nourishment, if you can see this clearly. > > > > > > > > > > When you deprive the auditory system of 'food' (sound), it starves for this > > > >and becomes even more acutely anxious in seeking it, and becomes ravenous for > > > >sound, and will find the tiniest crumb or speck and devour it!!!!!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > Seriously, that is what happens when you put in those ear plugs. > > > > > > > > > > Feed it, stuff it, make every day a Thanksgiving of Sound for your auditory > > > >system, indulge it, over eat it, consume and explore the vast realms of new > > > >types of ear-food for your brain! > > > > > > > > > > Do not ignore it. You can see that perhaps 4S/Miso can become a kind of > > > >anorexia for the ears! > > > > > > > > > > So go out and do this. Set up every space in your home as an auditory > > > >experience! > > > > > > > > > > A delightful Feast O Noise (A Dr. term...) > > > > > > > > > > Dr. Marsha , Audiologit, Portland, Oregon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 29, 2011 Report Share Posted November 29, 2011 In epilepsy, parts of the brain are in an irritable or hypersensitive state, and can be set off into a chain reaction by some trigger. Sometimes this is a recognised external stimulus, and this might be more common than supposed since it is rarely suspected or looked for. In some breeds of animals convulsions can be induced by loud sound, eg jangling keys. Audiogenic Epilepsy is a major animal model used for testing anticonvulsants. These animals have hyperactive cochleae due to incipient hearing loss, and can be acoustically sensitised or primed with loud sound at a critical early period of life. Autistic children have mysterious late onset epilepsy inexplicable bv congenital or acquired brain damage, but sensitisation of higher parts of the auditory system in audiosensitive children, as in these animals, now provides a simple mechanism for this. ********************************************************************** > > > > > > C, > > > > > > Is it possible to have 4S and also have other sounds that can be muddled? Very > > > acute hearing as well as muddled hearing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > From: C <venojim@> > > > To: " Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > > > > Sent: Thu, November 24, 2011 8:19:58 AM > > > Subject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > >  > > > As a hearing professional and someone who has suffered from 4S for 45 years I > > > can assure you Otoscerlosis  ( affects the Stapes ) and ear wax have nothing to > > > do with 4S. Otoscerlosis is usually Genetic and affects only one ear most of > > > the time.   Depending on the advice of your ENT ( I would get several opinions ) > > > an operation will usually repair the stapes and your hearing in the affected ear > > > will be close to the non affected ear after a successful operation. > > > > > > Things to consider - If it will not affect you health or if the Otoscerlosisis > > > is not getting worse,  I would opt out of an operation †" there is a chance the > > > operation will fail and cause a worse hearing loss. A hearing aid would work > > > very well should you desire to hear better, you can take it out when you > > > don’t.  Also, I believe the repair of the Stapes usually lasts for 5-9 years on > > > average then another operation may be needed.  > > > > > > > > > From: mommyamarette <Amarette83@> > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 3:20 AM > > > Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > >  > > > Dr. - > > > > > > I thought I needed to respond to this particular thread because I 1) Have a > > > pretty bad case of Misophonia (at least it seems bad to me and those who I have > > > relations with) and 2) I have hearing loss. > > > > > > My particular type of hearing loss is from a condition called Otosclerosis > > > (sp?). One of the three bones in my ear is fused in place and does not move like > > > it should. This has gone on since I was a child (probably from birth, but not > > > confirmed... I did have excess earwax as a kid). My hearing is worse in my left > > > ear and my right ear approaches normal levels of hearing. When talking on the > > > phone, I have to hold it to my right ear. I don't have a hearing aid, and I can > > > generally hold a normal conversation without any problem, but my audiologist > > > said that whenever I wanted to do surgery for it, all I have to do is say the > > > word. (On a side note, he does not have a working knowledge of how to help me > > > with the Misophonia. I would love to know if anyone has contacts in the St. > > > Louis, MO area!) I do depend on this hearing impediment when dealing with my > > > Misophonia. Depending on the trigger and the volume of the actual sound, > > > sometimes I only need to cover my right ear to reduce my ability to hear it. > > > > > > > > > Currently, I am 28 and pregnant with my second child. Although I haven't noticed > > > an increase in my hearing loss, my ears do ring more often than normal. > > > > > > I figured you would be interested to find a case of Misophonia where the person > > > has hearing issues. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Amarette > > > > > > > > From: M <Oregon7@> > > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:50 AM > > > > > Subject: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > One little item I could contribute here is the fact that I have never yet > > > >evaluated someone with 4S/Miso who had significant hearing loss. > > > > > > > > > > The vast majority of sufferers have perfect hearing if not better than > > > >average hearing. One child recently had full -10 scores across the auditory test > > > >tones....that was kind of amazing, really, like a bionic ear and I do think this > > > >does contribute to the misery a bit. > > > > > > > > > > IT would be fantastic if I could do a 30 year study starting with initial > > > >auditory tests and using the MRQ (The Misophonia Reaction Questionnaire) along > > > >with a couple other evaluative tools, like Beck Test for Anxiety, etc. and then > > > >see, if over the decades, as the subjects aged and lost decibels of hearing, IF > > > >their 4S/Miso scores would improve. > > > > > > > > > > I suspect they do. > > > > > > > > > > Expose yourself to sound, people, listen to music, go to concerts, learn to > > > >play in a band or quartet, dance the flamenco, whatever it takes to expose your > > > >system to plenty of stimulation. > > > > > > > > > > Earplugs are not a good solution, they will simply cause your poor ol' brain > > > >to turn up its internal volume, trying to catch the noise and sounds, which are > > > >its nourishment, if you can see this clearly. > > > > > > > > > > When you deprive the auditory system of 'food' (sound), it starves for this > > > >and becomes even more acutely anxious in seeking it, and becomes ravenous for > > > >sound, and will find the tiniest crumb or speck and devour it!!!!!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > Seriously, that is what happens when you put in those ear plugs. > > > > > > > > > > Feed it, stuff it, make every day a Thanksgiving of Sound for your auditory > > > >system, indulge it, over eat it, consume and explore the vast realms of new > > > >types of ear-food for your brain! > > > > > > > > > > Do not ignore it. You can see that perhaps 4S/Miso can become a kind of > > > >anorexia for the ears! > > > > > > > > > > So go out and do this. Set up every space in your home as an auditory > > > >experience! > > > > > > > > > > A delightful Feast O Noise (A Dr. term...) > > > > > > > > > > Dr. Marsha , Audiologit, Portland, Oregon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 29, 2011 Report Share Posted November 29, 2011 Medical-research-studies-are-collecting-brain-images-showing-the-microscopic-physical-differences-in-the-brain-of-a-child-with-autism-compared-to-a-child-without;-from-birth-on.-Hopefully-there-will-be-some-concrete-answers-about-causation-for-this-very-complex-developmental-disorder(s)-soon. To: Soundsensitivity Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2011 5:34 AM Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso In epilepsy, parts of the brain are in an irritable or hypersensitive state, and can be set off into a chain reaction by some trigger. Sometimes this is a recognised external stimulus, and this might be more common than supposed since it is rarely suspected or looked for. In some breeds of animals convulsions can be induced by loud sound, eg jangling keys. Audiogenic Epilepsy is a major animal model used for testing anticonvulsants. These animals have hyperactive cochleae due to incipient hearing loss, and can be acoustically sensitised or primed with loud sound at a critical early period of life. Autistic children have mysterious late onset epilepsy inexplicable bv congenital or acquired brain damage, but sensitisation of higher parts of the auditory system in audiosensitive children, as in these animals, now provides a simple mechanism for this. ********************************************************************** > > > > > > C, > > > > > > Is it possible to have 4S and also have other sounds that can be muddled? Very > > > acute hearing as well as muddled hearing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > From: C <venojim@> > > > To: "Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > > > > Sent: Thu, November 24, 2011 8:19:58 AM > > > Subject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > >  > > > As a hearing professional and someone who has suffered from 4S for 45 years I > > > can assure you Otoscerlosis  ( affects the Stapes ) and ear wax have nothing to > > > do with 4S. Otoscerlosis is usually Genetic and affects only one ear most of > > > the time.   Depending on the advice of your ENT ( I would get several opinions ) > > > an operation will usually repair the stapes and your hearing in the affected ear > > > will be close to the non affected ear after a successful operation. > > > > > > Things to consider - If it will not affect you health or if the Otoscerlosisis > > > is not getting worse,  I would opt out of an operation â€" there is a chance the > > > operation will fail and cause a worse hearing loss. A hearing aid would work > > > very well should you desire to hear better, you can take it out when you > > > don’t.  Also, I believe the repair of the Stapes usually lasts for 5-9 years on > > > average then another operation may be needed.  > > > > > > > > > From: mommyamarette <Amarette83@> > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 3:20 AM > > > Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > >  > > > Dr. - > > > > > > I thought I needed to respond to this particular thread because I 1) Have a > > > pretty bad case of Misophonia (at least it seems bad to me and those who I have > > > relations with) and 2) I have hearing loss. > > > > > > My particular type of hearing loss is from a condition called Otosclerosis > > > (sp?). One of the three bones in my ear is fused in place and does not move like > > > it should. This has gone on since I was a child (probably from birth, but not > > > confirmed... I did have excess earwax as a kid). My hearing is worse in my left > > > ear and my right ear approaches normal levels of hearing. When talking on the > > > phone, I have to hold it to my right ear. I don't have a hearing aid, and I can > > > generally hold a normal conversation without any problem, but my audiologist > > > said that whenever I wanted to do surgery for it, all I have to do is say the > > > word. (On a side note, he does not have a working knowledge of how to help me > > > with the Misophonia. I would love to know if anyone has contacts in the St. > > > Louis, MO area!) I do depend on this hearing impediment when dealing with my > > > Misophonia. Depending on the trigger and the volume of the actual sound, > > > sometimes I only need to cover my right ear to reduce my ability to hear it. > > > > > > > > > Currently, I am 28 and pregnant with my second child. Although I haven't noticed > > > an increase in my hearing loss, my ears do ring more often than normal. > > > > > > I figured you would be interested to find a case of Misophonia where the person > > > has hearing issues. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Amarette > > > > > > > > From: M <Oregon7@> > > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:50 AM > > > > > Subject: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > One little item I could contribute here is the fact that I have never yet > > > >evaluated someone with 4S/Miso who had significant hearing loss. > > > > > > > > > > The vast majority of sufferers have perfect hearing if not better than > > > >average hearing. One child recently had full -10 scores across the auditory test > > > >tones....that was kind of amazing, really, like a bionic ear and I do think this > > > >does contribute to the misery a bit. > > > > > > > > > > IT would be fantastic if I could do a 30 year study starting with initial > > > >auditory tests and using the MRQ (The Misophonia Reaction Questionnaire) along > > > >with a couple other evaluative tools, like Beck Test for Anxiety, etc. and then > > > >see, if over the decades, as the subjects aged and lost decibels of hearing, IF > > > >their 4S/Miso scores would improve. > > > > > > > > > > I suspect they do. > > > > > > > > > > Expose yourself to sound, people, listen to music, go to concerts, learn to > > > >play in a band or quartet, dance the flamenco, whatever it takes to expose your > > > >system to plenty of stimulation. > > > > > > > > > > Earplugs are not a good solution, they will simply cause your poor ol' brain > > > >to turn up its internal volume, trying to catch the noise and sounds, which are > > > >its nourishment, if you can see this clearly. > > > > > > > > > > When you deprive the auditory system of 'food' (sound), it starves for this > > > >and becomes even more acutely anxious in seeking it, and becomes ravenous for > > > >sound, and will find the tiniest crumb or speck and devour it!!!!!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > Seriously, that is what happens when you put in those ear plugs. > > > > > > > > > > Feed it, stuff it, make every day a Thanksgiving of Sound for your auditory > > > >system, indulge it, over eat it, consume and explore the vast realms of new > > > >types of ear-food for your brain! > > > > > > > > > > Do not ignore it. You can see that perhaps 4S/Miso can become a kind of > > > >anorexia for the ears! > > > > > > > > > > So go out and do this. Set up every space in your home as an auditory > > > >experience! > > > > > > > > > > A delightful Feast O Noise (A Dr. term...) > > > > > > > > > > Dr. Marsha , Audiologit, Portland, Oregon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 29, 2011 Report Share Posted November 29, 2011 The brains of autistic children are indeed abnormal, but other than showing that autism is not just a disturbance of the mind but is related to brain function, I do not think any other conclusion can be drawn from years of brain imaging. Problems of interpretation include 1. Abnormal brain areas are variable and inconsistent, unlike in neurological disease where damage is specific and predictable. 2. The most prominent finding is a larger brain. 3. Autism seems to start after a few months of age, not at birth. Brain size is normal at birth. 4. It may seem obvious that it is the abnormal brain causing the disease, but I think it is the other way round, as in schizophrenia--the symptoms and the altered behavior and experience distort brain development. Rather than just scanning and hoping for answers, one needs to ask specific questions first. I have posed some very specific questions, and it will be just as useful for someone to prove these wrong than if they turn out to be correct. ********************************************************************** > > > > > > > > C, > > > > > > > > Is it possible to have 4S and also have other sounds that can be muddled?ÃÆ'‚ Very > > > > acute hearing as well as muddled hearing?ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > From: C <venojim@> > > > > To: " Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > > > > > Sent: Thu, November 24, 2011 8:19:58 AM > > > > Subject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > As a hearing professional and someone who has suffered from 4S for 45 years I > > > > can assure you Otoscerlosis ÃÆ'‚ ( affects the Stapes ) and ear wax have nothing to > > > > do with 4S.ÃÆ'‚ Otoscerlosis is usually Genetic and affects only one ear most of > > > > the time. ÃÆ'‚ ÃÆ'‚ Depending on the advice of your ENT ( I would get several opinions ) > > > > an operation will usually repair the stapes and your hearing in the affected ear > > > > will be close to the non affected ear after a successful operation.ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > Things to consider -ÃÆ'‚ If it will not affect you health or if the Otoscerlosisis > > > > is not getting worse, ÃÆ'‚ I would opt out of an operation ÃÆ'¢â‚¬ " there is a chance the > > > > operation will fail and cause a worse hearing loss.ÃÆ'‚ A hearing aid would work > > > > very well should you desire to hear better, you can take it out when you > > > > donÃÆ'¢â‚¬â„¢t.ÃÆ'‚ ÃÆ'‚ Also, I believe the repair of the Stapes usually lasts for 5-9 years on > > > > average then another operation may be needed. ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > > > From: mommyamarette <Amarette83@> > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 3:20 AM > > > > Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > Dr. - > > > > > > > > I thought I needed to respond to this particular thread because I 1) Have a > > > > pretty bad case of Misophonia (at least it seems bad to me and those who I have > > > > relations with) and 2) I have hearing loss. > > > > > > > > My particular type of hearing loss is from a condition called Otosclerosis > > > > (sp?). One of the three bones in my ear is fused in place and does not move like > > > > it should. This has gone on since I was a child (probably from birth, but not > > > > confirmed... I did have excess earwax as a kid). My hearing is worse in my left > > > > ear and my right ear approaches normal levels of hearing. When talking on the > > > > phone, I have to hold it to my right ear. I don't have a hearing aid, and I can > > > > generally hold a normal conversation without any problem, but my audiologist > > > > said that whenever I wanted to do surgery for it, all I have to do is say the > > > > word. (On a side note, he does not have a working knowledge of how to help me > > > > with the Misophonia. I would love to know if anyone has contacts in the St. > > > > Louis, MO area!) I do depend on this hearing impediment when dealing with my > > > > Misophonia. Depending on the trigger and the volume of the actual sound, > > > > sometimes I only need to cover my right ear to reduce my ability to hear it. > > > > > > > > > > > > Currently, I am 28 and pregnant with my second child. Although I haven't noticed > > > > an increase in my hearing loss, my ears do ring more often than normal. > > > > > > > > I figured you would be interested to find a case of Misophonia where the person > > > > has hearing issues. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Amarette > > > > > > > > > > From: M <Oregon7@> > > > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:50 AM > > > > > > Subject: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > One little item I could contribute here is the fact that I have never yet > > > > >evaluated someone with 4S/Miso who had significant hearing loss. > > > > > > > > > > > > The vast majority of sufferers have perfect hearing if not better than > > > > >average hearing. One child recently had full -10 scores across the auditory test > > > > >tones....that was kind of amazing, really, like a bionic ear and I do think this > > > > >does contribute to the misery a bit. > > > > > > > > > > > > IT would be fantastic if I could do a 30 year study starting with initial > > > > >auditory tests and using the MRQ (The Misophonia Reaction Questionnaire) along > > > > >with a couple other evaluative tools, like Beck Test for Anxiety, etc. and then > > > > >see, if over the decades, as the subjects aged and lost decibels of hearing, IF > > > > >their 4S/Miso scores would improve. > > > > > > > > > > > > I suspect they do. > > > > > > > > > > > > Expose yourself to sound, people, listen to music, go to concerts, learn to > > > > >play in a band or quartet, dance the flamenco, whatever it takes to expose your > > > > >system to plenty of stimulation. > > > > > > > > > > > > Earplugs are not a good solution, they will simply cause your poor ol' brain > > > > >to turn up its internal volume, trying to catch the noise and sounds, which are > > > > >its nourishment, if you can see this clearly. > > > > > > > > > > > > When you deprive the auditory system of 'food' (sound), it starves for this > > > > >and becomes even more acutely anxious in seeking it, and becomes ravenous for > > > > >sound, and will find the tiniest crumb or speck and devour it!!!!!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > Seriously, that is what happens when you put in those ear plugs. > > > > > > > > > > > > Feed it, stuff it, make every day a Thanksgiving of Sound for your auditory > > > > >system, indulge it, over eat it, consume and explore the vast realms of new > > > > >types of ear-food for your brain! > > > > > > > > > > > > Do not ignore it. You can see that perhaps 4S/Miso can become a kind of > > > > >anorexia for the ears! > > > > > > > > > > > > So go out and do this. Set up every space in your home as an auditory > > > > >experience! > > > > > > > > > > > > A delightful Feast O Noise (A Dr. term...) > > > > > > > > > > > > Dr. Marsha , Audiologit, Portland, Oregon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 29, 2011 Report Share Posted November 29, 2011 Your theory is interesting, like many others out there which remain to be proven or dis-proven. I am not the least capable of comprehending whether or not your theory has merit. I did know that so far the evidence points to symptoms of autism starting after birth. But can one can say with certainty that there are not abnormalities already utero or even beginning with damage to DNA? Maybe they just haven't been able to see it yet.Would you mind saying how you came about with point #4? I am sure living with schizophrenia can result in changes in the brain, but why would one have the abnormal behavior and experiences to begin with before the schizophrenia? Is that auditory as well? To: Soundsensitivity Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2011 10:42 AM Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso The brains of autistic children are indeed abnormal, but other than showing that autism is not just a disturbance of the mind but is related to brain function, I do not think any other conclusion can be drawn from years of brain imaging. Problems of interpretation include 1. Abnormal brain areas are variable and inconsistent, unlike in neurological disease where damage is specific and predictable. 2. The most prominent finding is a larger brain. 3. Autism seems to start after a few months of age, not at birth. Brain size is normal at birth. 4. It may seem obvious that it is the abnormal brain causing the disease, but I think it is the other way round, as in schizophrenia--the symptoms and the altered behavior and experience distort brain development. Rather than just scanning and hoping for answers, one needs to ask specific questions first. I have posed some very specific questions, and it will be just as useful for someone to prove these wrong than if they turn out to be correct. ********************************************************************** > > > > > > > > C, > > > > > > > > Is it possible to have 4S and also have other sounds that can be muddled?ÃÆ'‚ Very > > > > acute hearing as well as muddled hearing?ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > From: C <venojim@> > > > > To: "Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > > > > > Sent: Thu, November 24, 2011 8:19:58 AM > > > > Subject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > As a hearing professional and someone who has suffered from 4S for 45 years I > > > > can assure you Otoscerlosis ÃÆ'‚ ( affects the Stapes ) and ear wax have nothing to > > > > do with 4S.ÃÆ'‚ Otoscerlosis is usually Genetic and affects only one ear most of > > > > the time. ÃÆ'‚ ÃÆ'‚ Depending on the advice of your ENT ( I would get several opinions ) > > > > an operation will usually repair the stapes and your hearing in the affected ear > > > > will be close to the non affected ear after a successful operation.ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > Things to consider -ÃÆ'‚ If it will not affect you health or if the Otoscerlosisis > > > > is not getting worse, ÃÆ'‚ I would opt out of an operation ÃÆ'¢â‚¬" there is a chance the > > > > operation will fail and cause a worse hearing loss.ÃÆ'‚ A hearing aid would work > > > > very well should you desire to hear better, you can take it out when you > > > > donÃÆ'¢â‚¬â„¢t.ÃÆ'‚ ÃÆ'‚ Also, I believe the repair of the Stapes usually lasts for 5-9 years on > > > > average then another operation may be needed. ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > > > From: mommyamarette <Amarette83@> > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 3:20 AM > > > > Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > Dr. - > > > > > > > > I thought I needed to respond to this particular thread because I 1) Have a > > > > pretty bad case of Misophonia (at least it seems bad to me and those who I have > > > > relations with) and 2) I have hearing loss. > > > > > > > > My particular type of hearing loss is from a condition called Otosclerosis > > > > (sp?). One of the three bones in my ear is fused in place and does not move like > > > > it should. This has gone on since I was a child (probably from birth, but not > > > > confirmed... I did have excess earwax as a kid). My hearing is worse in my left > > > > ear and my right ear approaches normal levels of hearing. When talking on the > > > > phone, I have to hold it to my right ear. I don't have a hearing aid, and I can > > > > generally hold a normal conversation without any problem, but my audiologist > > > > said that whenever I wanted to do surgery for it, all I have to do is say the > > > > word. (On a side note, he does not have a working knowledge of how to help me > > > > with the Misophonia. I would love to know if anyone has contacts in the St. > > > > Louis, MO area!) I do depend on this hearing impediment when dealing with my > > > > Misophonia. Depending on the trigger and the volume of the actual sound, > > > > sometimes I only need to cover my right ear to reduce my ability to hear it. > > > > > > > > > > > > Currently, I am 28 and pregnant with my second child. Although I haven't noticed > > > > an increase in my hearing loss, my ears do ring more often than normal. > > > > > > > > I figured you would be interested to find a case of Misophonia where the person > > > > has hearing issues. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Amarette > > > > > > > > > > From: M <Oregon7@> > > > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:50 AM > > > > > > Subject: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > One little item I could contribute here is the fact that I have never yet > > > > >evaluated someone with 4S/Miso who had significant hearing loss. > > > > > > > > > > > > The vast majority of sufferers have perfect hearing if not better than > > > > >average hearing. One child recently had full -10 scores across the auditory test > > > > >tones....that was kind of amazing, really, like a bionic ear and I do think this > > > > >does contribute to the misery a bit. > > > > > > > > > > > > IT would be fantastic if I could do a 30 year study starting with initial > > > > >auditory tests and using the MRQ (The Misophonia Reaction Questionnaire) along > > > > >with a couple other evaluative tools, like Beck Test for Anxiety, etc. and then > > > > >see, if over the decades, as the subjects aged and lost decibels of hearing, IF > > > > >their 4S/Miso scores would improve. > > > > > > > > > > > > I suspect they do. > > > > > > > > > > > > Expose yourself to sound, people, listen to music, go to concerts, learn to > > > > >play in a band or quartet, dance the flamenco, whatever it takes to expose your > > > > >system to plenty of stimulation. > > > > > > > > > > > > Earplugs are not a good solution, they will simply cause your poor ol' brain > > > > >to turn up its internal volume, trying to catch the noise and sounds, which are > > > > >its nourishment, if you can see this clearly. > > > > > > > > > > > > When you deprive the auditory system of 'food' (sound), it starves for this > > > > >and becomes even more acutely anxious in seeking it, and becomes ravenous for > > > > >sound, and will find the tiniest crumb or speck and devour it!!!!!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > Seriously, that is what happens when you put in those ear plugs. > > > > > > > > > > > > Feed it, stuff it, make every day a Thanksgiving of Sound for your auditory > > > > >system, indulge it, over eat it, consume and explore the vast realms of new > > > > >types of ear-food for your brain! > > > > > > > > > > > > Do not ignore it. You can see that perhaps 4S/Miso can become a kind of > > > > >anorexia for the ears! > > > > > > > > > > > > So go out and do this. Set up every space in your home as an auditory > > > > >experience! > > > > > > > > > > > > A delightful Feast O Noise (A Dr. term...) > > > > > > > > > > > > Dr. Marsha , Audiologit, Portland, Oregon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 30, 2011 Report Share Posted November 30, 2011 - Thank you for responding to my post. I did want to clarify, however, that my Misophonia is NOT only in one ear. My Otosclererosis is worse in my left ear, making sounds harder to hear in that ear. Sometimes, a trigger sound is far enough away or quiet enough that my right ear is able to pick it up, but my left ear can't because of the Otosclerosis, not because I don't have Misophonia in that ear. If the trigger sound is close enough, loud enough, even covering my right ear or putting an ear plug in only that ear will not help. Correcting the Otosclerosis, I have decided, will not make the Misophonia better, and I don't think they are related. In fact, I look at the Otosclerosis as a blessing sometimes. If it were corrected by surgery, I think I would have a much harder time with the Misophonia because covering my right ear would never help escape the trigger (although it's difficult to imagine having a harder time than I already have!). Again, thank you for replying. I appreciate getting all the insight I can with this disorder. It would be so wonderful if I could find a way to cope with it before returning to work (and the music coming through the walls from next door!!) from my maternity leave. ~Amarette > > > > C, > > > > Is it possible to have 4S and also have other sounds that can be muddled? Very > > acute hearing as well as muddled hearing? > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: C <venojim@> > > To: " Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > > > Sent: Thu, November 24, 2011 8:19:58 AM > > Subject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > >  > > As a hearing professional and someone who has suffered from 4S for 45 years I > > can assure you Otoscerlosis  ( affects the Stapes ) and ear wax have nothing to > > do with 4S. Otoscerlosis is usually Genetic and affects only one ear most of > > the time.   Depending on the advice of your ENT ( I would get several opinions ) > > an operation will usually repair the stapes and your hearing in the affected ear > > will be close to the non affected ear after a successful operation. > > > > Things to consider - If it will not affect you health or if the Otoscerlosisis > > is not getting worse,  I would opt out of an operation †" there is a chance the > > operation will fail and cause a worse hearing loss. A hearing aid would work > > very well should you desire to hear better, you can take it out when you > > don’t.  Also, I believe the repair of the Stapes usually lasts for 5-9 years on > > average then another operation may be needed.  > > > > > > From: mommyamarette <Amarette83@> > > To: Soundsensitivity > > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 3:20 AM > > Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > >  > > Dr. - > > > > I thought I needed to respond to this particular thread because I 1) Have a > > pretty bad case of Misophonia (at least it seems bad to me and those who I have > > relations with) and 2) I have hearing loss. > > > > My particular type of hearing loss is from a condition called Otosclerosis > > (sp?). One of the three bones in my ear is fused in place and does not move like > > it should. This has gone on since I was a child (probably from birth, but not > > confirmed... I did have excess earwax as a kid). My hearing is worse in my left > > ear and my right ear approaches normal levels of hearing. When talking on the > > phone, I have to hold it to my right ear. I don't have a hearing aid, and I can > > generally hold a normal conversation without any problem, but my audiologist > > said that whenever I wanted to do surgery for it, all I have to do is say the > > word. (On a side note, he does not have a working knowledge of how to help me > > with the Misophonia. I would love to know if anyone has contacts in the St. > > Louis, MO area!) I do depend on this hearing impediment when dealing with my > > Misophonia. Depending on the trigger and the volume of the actual sound, > > sometimes I only need to cover my right ear to reduce my ability to hear it. > > > > > > Currently, I am 28 and pregnant with my second child. Although I haven't noticed > > an increase in my hearing loss, my ears do ring more often than normal. > > > > I figured you would be interested to find a case of Misophonia where the person > > has hearing issues. > > > > Regards, > > Amarette > > > > > > From: M <Oregon7@> > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:50 AM > > > > Subject: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > One little item I could contribute here is the fact that I have never yet > > >evaluated someone with 4S/Miso who had significant hearing loss. > > > > > > > > The vast majority of sufferers have perfect hearing if not better than > > >average hearing. One child recently had full -10 scores across the auditory test > > >tones....that was kind of amazing, really, like a bionic ear and I do think this > > >does contribute to the misery a bit. > > > > > > > > IT would be fantastic if I could do a 30 year study starting with initial > > >auditory tests and using the MRQ (The Misophonia Reaction Questionnaire) along > > >with a couple other evaluative tools, like Beck Test for Anxiety, etc. and then > > >see, if over the decades, as the subjects aged and lost decibels of hearing, IF > > >their 4S/Miso scores would improve. > > > > > > > > I suspect they do. > > > > > > > > Expose yourself to sound, people, listen to music, go to concerts, learn to > > >play in a band or quartet, dance the flamenco, whatever it takes to expose your > > >system to plenty of stimulation. > > > > > > > > Earplugs are not a good solution, they will simply cause your poor ol' brain > > >to turn up its internal volume, trying to catch the noise and sounds, which are > > >its nourishment, if you can see this clearly. > > > > > > > > When you deprive the auditory system of 'food' (sound), it starves for this > > >and becomes even more acutely anxious in seeking it, and becomes ravenous for > > >sound, and will find the tiniest crumb or speck and devour it!!!!!!!!!! > > > > > > > > Seriously, that is what happens when you put in those ear plugs. > > > > > > > > Feed it, stuff it, make every day a Thanksgiving of Sound for your auditory > > >system, indulge it, over eat it, consume and explore the vast realms of new > > >types of ear-food for your brain! > > > > > > > > Do not ignore it. You can see that perhaps 4S/Miso can become a kind of > > >anorexia for the ears! > > > > > > > > So go out and do this. Set up every space in your home as an auditory > > >experience! > > > > > > > > A delightful Feast O Noise (A Dr. term...) > > > > > > > > Dr. Marsha , Audiologit, Portland, Oregon > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 30, 2011 Report Share Posted November 30, 2011 The heritability of autism is very high, which means that genes are involved (probably very many). There are also some abnormalities of pregnancy and gestation, but these tend to be nebulous, inconsistent and non-specific, and again could be a result not cause of deviance. For example, a fetus with poor vestibular reflexes is liable to breech birth. Brain abnormality or damage would usually show up from birth, as with anoxia or intracranial bleeds. I think most experts would accept the Neurodevelopmental Theory of schizophrenia, ie there are important behavioural, biological and experiential abnormalities throughout early life long before the disease erupts. Personally, I think the major cause is infection in infancy, especially ear infections which disrupt auditory and vestibular development. The seasonality of schizophrenic births is an important clue here. Apart from schizophrenia in a close relative, the largest risk factor for schizophrenia is previous otitis media. In a large sample of military inductees, hearing loss strongly pedicted future schizophrenia. I think auditory hallucinations always start in the ear. I have been able to thoroughly check the literature for musical hallucinations, and find there is invariably an otological cause, probably Meniere Spectrum Disorder. I cannot find a single reported case of musical hallucination with normal ears and a plausible neurological lesion, nor have neurologists contacted me to report one. So I think lifelong auditory and vestibular anomalies can account well for major symptoms of schizophrenia. Unlike for autism, I am not sure at this point if all the symptoms can be accounted for in this way. ********************************************************************** > > > > > > > > > > C, > > > > > > > > > > Is it possible to have 4S and also have other sounds that can be muddled?ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ Very > > > > > acute hearing as well as muddled hearing?ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > > From: C <venojim@> > > > > > To: " Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > > > > > > Sent: Thu, November 24, 2011 8:19:58 AM > > > > > Subject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > As a hearing professional and someone who has suffered from 4S for 45 years I > > > > > can assure you Otoscerlosis ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ ( affects the Stapes ) and ear wax have nothing to > > > > > do with 4S.ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ Otoscerlosis is usually Genetic and affects only one ear most of > > > > > the time. ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ Depending on the advice of your ENT ( I would get several opinions ) > > > > > an operation will usually repair the stapes and your hearing in the affected ear > > > > > will be close to the non affected ear after a successful operation.ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > Things to consider -ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ If it will not affect you health or if the Otoscerlosisis > > > > > is not getting worse, ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ I would opt out of an operation ÃÆ'Æ'¢ÃÆ'¢â€šÂ¬ " there is a chance the > > > > > operation will fail and cause a worse hearing loss.ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ A hearing aid would work > > > > > very well should you desire to hear better, you can take it out when you > > > > > donÃÆ'Æ'¢ÃÆ'¢â€šÂ¬ÃÆ'¢â€žÂÃ\ ‚¢t.ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ Also, I believe the repair of the Stapes usually lasts for 5-9 years on > > > > > average then another operation may be needed. ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: mommyamarette <Amarette83@> > > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 3:20 AM > > > > > Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > Dr. - > > > > > > > > > > I thought I needed to respond to this particular thread because I 1) Have a > > > > > pretty bad case of Misophonia (at least it seems bad to me and those who I have > > > > > relations with) and 2) I have hearing loss. > > > > > > > > > > My particular type of hearing loss is from a condition called Otosclerosis > > > > > (sp?). One of the three bones in my ear is fused in place and does not move like > > > > > it should. This has gone on since I was a child (probably from birth, but not > > > > > confirmed... I did have excess earwax as a kid). My hearing is worse in my left > > > > > ear and my right ear approaches normal levels of hearing. When talking on the > > > > > phone, I have to hold it to my right ear. I don't have a hearing aid, and I can > > > > > generally hold a normal conversation without any problem, but my audiologist > > > > > said that whenever I wanted to do surgery for it, all I have to do is say the > > > > > word. (On a side note, he does not have a working knowledge of how to help me > > > > > with the Misophonia. I would love to know if anyone has contacts in the St. > > > > > Louis, MO area!) I do depend on this hearing impediment when dealing with my > > > > > Misophonia. Depending on the trigger and the volume of the actual sound, > > > > > sometimes I only need to cover my right ear to reduce my ability to hear it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Currently, I am 28 and pregnant with my second child. Although I haven't noticed > > > > > an increase in my hearing loss, my ears do ring more often than normal. > > > > > > > > > > I figured you would be interested to find a case of Misophonia where the person > > > > > has hearing issues. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Amarette > > > > > > > > > > > > From: M <Oregon7@> > > > > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:50 AM > > > > > > > Subject: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'Æ'Æ'ÃÆ'¢â‚¬Å¡ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > One little item I could contribute here is the fact that I have never yet > > > > > >evaluated someone with 4S/Miso who had significant hearing loss. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The vast majority of sufferers have perfect hearing if not better than > > > > > >average hearing. One child recently had full -10 scores across the auditory test > > > > > >tones....that was kind of amazing, really, like a bionic ear and I do think this > > > > > >does contribute to the misery a bit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IT would be fantastic if I could do a 30 year study starting with initial > > > > > >auditory tests and using the MRQ (The Misophonia Reaction Questionnaire) along > > > > > >with a couple other evaluative tools, like Beck Test for Anxiety, etc. and then > > > > > >see, if over the decades, as the subjects aged and lost decibels of hearing, IF > > > > > >their 4S/Miso scores would improve. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I suspect they do. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Expose yourself to sound, people, listen to music, go to concerts, learn to > > > > > >play in a band or quartet, dance the flamenco, whatever it takes to expose your > > > > > >system to plenty of stimulation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Earplugs are not a good solution, they will simply cause your poor ol' brain > > > > > >to turn up its internal volume, trying to catch the noise and sounds, which are > > > > > >its nourishment, if you can see this clearly. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When you deprive the auditory system of 'food' (sound), it starves for this > > > > > >and becomes even more acutely anxious in seeking it, and becomes ravenous for > > > > > >sound, and will find the tiniest crumb or speck and devour it!!!!!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Seriously, that is what happens when you put in those ear plugs. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Feed it, stuff it, make every day a Thanksgiving of Sound for your auditory > > > > > >system, indulge it, over eat it, consume and explore the vast realms of new > > > > > >types of ear-food for your brain! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do not ignore it. You can see that perhaps 4S/Miso can become a kind of > > > > > >anorexia for the ears! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So go out and do this. Set up every space in your home as an auditory > > > > > >experience! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A delightful Feast O Noise (A Dr. term...) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dr. Marsha , Audiologit, Portland, Oregon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > > > . > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 30, 2011 Report Share Posted November 30, 2011 Here is an interesting study. Would these findings support your theory on the development of schizophrenia?http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/10/111013153945.htm To: Soundsensitivity Sent: Wednesday, November 30, 2011 6:47 AM Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso he heritability of autism is very high, which means that genes are involved (probably very many). There are also some abnormalities of pregnancy and gestation, but these tend to be nebulous, inconsistent and non-specific, and again could be a result not cause of deviance. For example, a fetus with poor vestibular reflexes is liable to breech birth. Brain abnormality or damage would usually show up from birth, as with anoxia or intracranial bleeds. I think most experts would accept the Neurodevelopmental Theory of schizophrenia, ie there are important behavioural, biological and experiential abnormalities throughout early life long before the disease erupts. Personally, I think the major cause is infection in infancy, especially ear infections which disrupt auditory and vestibular development. The seasonality of schizophrenic births is an important clue here. Apart from schizophrenia in a close relative, the largest risk factor for schizophrenia is previous otitis media. In a large sample of military inductees, hearing loss strongly pedicted future schizophrenia. I think auditory hallucinations always start in the ear. I have been able to thoroughly check the literature for musical hallucinations, and find there is invariably an otological cause, probably Meniere Spectrum Disorder. I cannot find a single reported case of musical hallucination with normal ears and a plausible neurological lesion, nor have neurologists contacted me to report one. So I think lifelong auditory and vestibular anomalies can account well for major symptoms of schizophrenia. Unlike for autism, I am not sure at this point if all the symptoms can be accounted for in this way. ********************************************************************** > > > > > > > > > > C, > > > > > > > > > > Is it possible to have 4S and also have other sounds that can be muddled?ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ Very > > > > > acute hearing as well as muddled hearing?ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > > > From: C <venojim@> > > > > > To: "Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > > > > > > Sent: Thu, November 24, 2011 8:19:58 AM > > > > > Subject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > As a hearing professional and someone who has suffered from 4S for 45 years I > > > > > can assure you Otoscerlosis ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ ( affects the Stapes ) and ear wax have nothing to > > > > > do with 4S.ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ Otoscerlosis is usually Genetic and affects only one ear most of > > > > > the time. ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ Depending on the advice of your ENT ( I would get several opinions ) > > > > > an operation will usually repair the stapes and your hearing in the affected ear > > > > > will be close to the non affected ear after a successful operation.ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > Things to consider -ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ If it will not affect you health or if the Otoscerlosisis > > > > > is not getting worse, ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ I would opt out of an operation ÃÆ'Æ'¢ÃÆ'¢â€šÂ¬" there is a chance the > > > > > operation will fail and cause a worse hearing loss.ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ A hearing aid would work > > > > > very well should you desire to hear better, you can take it out when you > > > > > donÃÆ'Æ'¢ÃÆ'¢â€šÂ¬ÃÆ'¢â€žÂ¢t.ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ Also, I believe the repair of the Stapes usually lasts for 5-9 years on > > > > > average then another operation may be needed. ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From: mommyamarette <Amarette83@> > > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 3:20 AM > > > > > Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > Dr. - > > > > > > > > > > I thought I needed to respond to this particular thread because I 1) Have a > > > > > pretty bad case of Misophonia (at least it seems bad to me and those who I have > > > > > relations with) and 2) I have hearing loss. > > > > > > > > > > My particular type of hearing loss is from a condition called Otosclerosis > > > > > (sp?). One of the three bones in my ear is fused in place and does not move like > > > > > it should. This has gone on since I was a child (probably from birth, but not > > > > > confirmed... I did have excess earwax as a kid). My hearing is worse in my left > > > > > ear and my right ear approaches normal levels of hearing. When talking on the > > > > > phone, I have to hold it to my right ear. I don't have a hearing aid, and I can > > > > > generally hold a normal conversation without any problem, but my audiologist > > > > > said that whenever I wanted to do surgery for it, all I have to do is say the > > > > > word. (On a side note, he does not have a working knowledge of how to help me > > > > > with the Misophonia. I would love to know if anyone has contacts in the St. > > > > > Louis, MO area!) I do depend on this hearing impediment when dealing with my > > > > > Misophonia. Depending on the trigger and the volume of the actual sound, > > > > > sometimes I only need to cover my right ear to reduce my ability to hear it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Currently, I am 28 and pregnant with my second child. Although I haven't noticed > > > > > an increase in my hearing loss, my ears do ring more often than normal. > > > > > > > > > > I figured you would be interested to find a case of Misophonia where the person > > > > > has hearing issues. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Amarette > > > > > > > > > > > > From: M <Oregon7@> > > > > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:50 AM > > > > > > > Subject: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'Æ'Æ'ÃÆ'¢â‚¬Å¡ÃÆ'Æ'‚ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > One little item I could contribute here is the fact that I have never yet > > > > > >evaluated someone with 4S/Miso who had significant hearing loss. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The vast majority of sufferers have perfect hearing if not better than > > > > > >average hearing. One child recently had full -10 scores across the auditory test > > > > > >tones....that was kind of amazing, really, like a bionic ear and I do think this > > > > > >does contribute to the misery a bit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IT would be fantastic if I could do a 30 year study starting with initial > > > > > >auditory tests and using the MRQ (The Misophonia Reaction Questionnaire) along > > > > > >with a couple other evaluative tools, like Beck Test for Anxiety, etc. and then > > > > > >see, if over the decades, as the subjects aged and lost decibels of hearing, IF > > > > > >their 4S/Miso scores would improve. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I suspect they do. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Expose yourself to sound, people, listen to music, go to concerts, learn to > > > > > >play in a band or quartet, dance the flamenco, whatever it takes to expose your > > > > > >system to plenty of stimulation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Earplugs are not a good solution, they will simply cause your poor ol' brain > > > > > >to turn up its internal volume, trying to catch the noise and sounds, which are > > > > > >its nourishment, if you can see this clearly. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When you deprive the auditory system of 'food' (sound), it starves for this > > > > > >and becomes even more acutely anxious in seeking it, and becomes ravenous for > > > > > >sound, and will find the tiniest crumb or speck and devour it!!!!!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Seriously, that is what happens when you put in those ear plugs. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Feed it, stuff it, make every day a Thanksgiving of Sound for your auditory > > > > > >system, indulge it, over eat it, consume and explore the vast realms of new > > > > > >types of ear-food for your brain! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Do not ignore it. You can see that perhaps 4S/Miso can become a kind of > > > > > >anorexia for the ears! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So go out and do this. Set up every space in your home as an auditory > > > > > >experience! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A delightful Feast O Noise (A Dr. term...) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dr. Marsha , Audiologit, Portland, Oregon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ÃÆ'‚ > > > > > > > > > > > > . > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 30, 2011 Report Share Posted November 30, 2011 Thanks Amarette for the extra information. I do not recall ever seeing audiosensitivity in an otosclerotic ear once there was a conductive hearing loss in it, so I still suspect the misophonia/audiosensitivity problem arises from the good right ear (assuming you do not have Cochlear Otosclerosis). A moderately loud sound on your left side tries to get down the ear canal and down your ossicles, but will not get past the fixed stapes. However, part of the sound waves also vibrates the skull bones around the left ear directly, bypassing the middle ear, and once in the skull they go to both cochleae. Hence the need to carefully mask the good ear when testing the hearing in the bad one. I suggest you ask your audiologist to confirm which cochlea the sound is entering when you find the sound annoying. Tuning fork tests may also help (on second thoughts maybe not, unless the forks are very loud). ********************************************************************** > > > > > > C, > > > > > > Is it possible to have 4S and also have other sounds that can be muddled? Very > > > acute hearing as well as muddled hearing? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > From: C <venojim@> > > > To: " Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > > > > Sent: Thu, November 24, 2011 8:19:58 AM > > > Subject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > >  > > > As a hearing professional and someone who has suffered from 4S for 45 years I > > > can assure you Otoscerlosis  ( affects the Stapes ) and ear wax have nothing to > > > do with 4S. Otoscerlosis is usually Genetic and affects only one ear most of > > > the time.   Depending on the advice of your ENT ( I would get several opinions ) > > > an operation will usually repair the stapes and your hearing in the affected ear > > > will be close to the non affected ear after a successful operation. > > > > > > Things to consider - If it will not affect you health or if the Otoscerlosisis > > > is not getting worse,  I would opt out of an operation †" there is a chance the > > > operation will fail and cause a worse hearing loss. A hearing aid would work > > > very well should you desire to hear better, you can take it out when you > > > don’t.  Also, I believe the repair of the Stapes usually lasts for 5-9 years on > > > average then another operation may be needed.  > > > > > > > > > From: mommyamarette <Amarette83@> > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 3:20 AM > > > Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > >  > > > Dr. - > > > > > > I thought I needed to respond to this particular thread because I 1) Have a > > > pretty bad case of Misophonia (at least it seems bad to me and those who I have > > > relations with) and 2) I have hearing loss. > > > > > > My particular type of hearing loss is from a condition called Otosclerosis > > > (sp?). One of the three bones in my ear is fused in place and does not move like > > > it should. This has gone on since I was a child (probably from birth, but not > > > confirmed... I did have excess earwax as a kid). My hearing is worse in my left > > > ear and my right ear approaches normal levels of hearing. When talking on the > > > phone, I have to hold it to my right ear. I don't have a hearing aid, and I can > > > generally hold a normal conversation without any problem, but my audiologist > > > said that whenever I wanted to do surgery for it, all I have to do is say the > > > word. (On a side note, he does not have a working knowledge of how to help me > > > with the Misophonia. I would love to know if anyone has contacts in the St. > > > Louis, MO area!) I do depend on this hearing impediment when dealing with my > > > Misophonia. Depending on the trigger and the volume of the actual sound, > > > sometimes I only need to cover my right ear to reduce my ability to hear it. > > > > > > > > > Currently, I am 28 and pregnant with my second child. Although I haven't noticed > > > an increase in my hearing loss, my ears do ring more often than normal. > > > > > > I figured you would be interested to find a case of Misophonia where the person > > > has hearing issues. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Amarette > > > > > > > > From: M <Oregon7@> > > > > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:50 AM > > > > > Subject: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > One little item I could contribute here is the fact that I have never yet > > > >evaluated someone with 4S/Miso who had significant hearing loss. > > > > > > > > > > The vast majority of sufferers have perfect hearing if not better than > > > >average hearing. One child recently had full -10 scores across the auditory test > > > >tones....that was kind of amazing, really, like a bionic ear and I do think this > > > >does contribute to the misery a bit. > > > > > > > > > > IT would be fantastic if I could do a 30 year study starting with initial > > > >auditory tests and using the MRQ (The Misophonia Reaction Questionnaire) along > > > >with a couple other evaluative tools, like Beck Test for Anxiety, etc. and then > > > >see, if over the decades, as the subjects aged and lost decibels of hearing, IF > > > >their 4S/Miso scores would improve. > > > > > > > > > > I suspect they do. > > > > > > > > > > Expose yourself to sound, people, listen to music, go to concerts, learn to > > > >play in a band or quartet, dance the flamenco, whatever it takes to expose your > > > >system to plenty of stimulation. > > > > > > > > > > Earplugs are not a good solution, they will simply cause your poor ol' brain > > > >to turn up its internal volume, trying to catch the noise and sounds, which are > > > >its nourishment, if you can see this clearly. > > > > > > > > > > When you deprive the auditory system of 'food' (sound), it starves for this > > > >and becomes even more acutely anxious in seeking it, and becomes ravenous for > > > >sound, and will find the tiniest crumb or speck and devour it!!!!!!!!!! > > > > > > > > > > Seriously, that is what happens when you put in those ear plugs. > > > > > > > > > > Feed it, stuff it, make every day a Thanksgiving of Sound for your auditory > > > >system, indulge it, over eat it, consume and explore the vast realms of new > > > >types of ear-food for your brain! > > > > > > > > > > Do not ignore it. You can see that perhaps 4S/Miso can become a kind of > > > >anorexia for the ears! > > > > > > > > > > So go out and do this. Set up every space in your home as an auditory > > > >experience! > > > > > > > > > > A delightful Feast O Noise (A Dr. term...) > > > > > > > > > > Dr. Marsha , Audiologit, Portland, Oregon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 I agree - i thought i heard my ex husband eating something, I filled with rage, then looked around and it was my cat cleaning himself all of a sudden, all the rage, anxiety completely disappeared and all that replaced it was relief. To: "Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > Sent: Saturday, November 26, 2011 1:32 AM Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso I know from experience when I am doing something I enjoy very much, and am focused and engaged that my problem does not bother me as much. Especially with people I really enjoy. It could help to find things to keep his mind off of the trigger sounds as much as possible. He should start by taking little doses of esposure at a time followed by alone time to restore. It may be a start. Mike To: Soundsensitivity Sent: Friday, November 25, 2011 4:47 PMSubject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso Mike - how can I get my 13 year old to have this attitude? He isolates himself.... I have the same thing in that if I am being driven by a sound that I think is a trigger sound like snoring then find it is not being made by a person, it doesn't effect me. So strange..Sent from my iPhone I agree that Misophonia in not a physical problem. If I hear a sound similar to a trigger noise, say that sounds like someone eating and find out that it really was not eating but something else, the nearly identical sound doesn't bother me in the least. Only when it is a person making the noise, especially if they are deliberately doing it to bother me. Then I feel out of control, a big part of the extreme reaction for me. That said, I do have very acute hearing and can diferentiate sounds I think better than most people. Like my radar is looking for a trigger noise to get angry at. Funny, but I am a very easygoing person otherwise. Also, I have found it to be very benefical to expose myself, in varying doses, to lots of human sounds. Spent the day with a mob of noisy kids yesterday. By the end of the day I was practically numb to all the screaming kids and ambiant eating noises. It requires being in good mental, emotional and physical condition, but plenty worth the effort. Isolation from noise and other bothersome sounds is , I believe, a dangerous thing if you have this condition. It only leads to a lower tolerance to sound. I spent many years in self- imposed isolation, and I won't do it anymore. I missed out on too much of the good things in life. I refuse to die a lonely old man! Mike To: "Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > Sent: Friday, November 25, 2011 5:21 AMSubject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso I firmly believe Misophonia has little to do with our hearing and ALL to do with our brain. Visual sensitivities cause the same reaction to many of us as sounds do - for some of us, a pen clicking is Ok BUT the sound of Gum snapping causes rage. There are MANY sounds that create anger and stress in some Misophonia sufferers that do not bother others who suffer from it. We even go crazy from a breathing sound which is sometimes barely audible. I believe it is not the sound that bothers us but the action. To: Soundsensitivity Sent: Friday, November 25, 2011 7:46 AMSubject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso Thank you very much Amarette for mentioning your otoscerosis, which is indeed highly relevant. The likely reason why ear problems or deafness are not so prominent in mispohonia circles is that those misophonics with ear disease think (probably correctly) that the misophonia is secondary to ear disease, so go to otologists. Misophonia sites are therefore biassed towards those looking for a non-otological cause. Just because there is no obvious ear disorder, and particularly if there is no pure tone loss on an audiogram, should not mean that the cause is non-otological, it may mean one has to look harder for atypical or subtle otological disorder. Amarette clearly has misophonia in one ear only, which surely shows that the cause is in the ear and not the brain. As someone who has tested hundreds of otoscerotics, I was surprised to read 's view that OS affects only one ear most of the time. I agree with Wikipedia that it is generally a bilateral condition, though one ear may be much more severely affected. In most cases of apparent unilateral OS, I found characteristic reversed stapedial reflexes in the good ear even when the pure tone audiogram was normal. Interestingly, this is one of the very same reflex abnormalities I found in patients with every other cause of audiosensitivity (including autism!). The obvious cause for these reversed reflexes was mechanical, slippage at the incudo-stapedial joint for example. Since the common cause of audiosensitivity in other conditions seems to be pressure change inside the cochlea (hydrops), it now seems more parsimonious to postulate the same mechanism in OS. If the pressure drops, the footplate could get jammed in the oval window for example. The clinical manifestation of hydrops is Meniere Spectrum Disorder. This will now account for some occasional features of OS, like tinnitus, musical hallucinations, vertigo, cochlear otosclerosis, and audiosensitivity (in the early stages of OS). Other characteristic early MSD symptoms are muffled dull hearing and pitch distortion. I do not think there is any ear disorder apart from MSD that can produce both muddled and acute hearing.**********************************************************************>> C,> > Is it possible to have 4S and also have other sounds that can be muddled? Very > acute hearing as well as muddled hearing? > > > > > > ________________________________> From: C > To: "Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity >> Sent: Thu, November 24, 2011 8:19:58 AM> Subject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso> >  > As a hearing professional and someone who has suffered from 4S for 45 years I > can assure you Otoscerlosis  ( affects the Stapes ) and ear wax have nothing to > do with 4S. Otoscerlosis is usually Genetic and affects only one ear most of > the time.   Depending on the advice of your ENT ( I would get several opinions ) > an operation will usually repair the stapes and your hearing in the affected ear > will be close to the non affected ear after a successful operation. > > Things to consider - If it will not affect you health or if the Otoscerlosisis > is not getting worse,  I would opt out of an operation â€" there is a chance the > operation will fail and cause a worse hearing loss. A hearing aid would work > very well should you desire to hear better, you can take it out when you > don’t.  Also, I believe the repair of the Stapes usually lasts for 5-9 years on > average then another operation may be needed.  > > > From: mommyamarette > To: Soundsensitivity > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 3:20 AM> Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso> > >  > Dr. -> > I thought I needed to respond to this particular thread because I 1) Have a > pretty bad case of Misophonia (at least it seems bad to me and those who I have > relations with) and 2) I have hearing loss.> > My particular type of hearing loss is from a condition called Otosclerosis > (sp?). One of the three bones in my ear is fused in place and does not move like > it should. This has gone on since I was a child (probably from birth, but not > confirmed... I did have excess earwax as a kid). My hearing is worse in my left > ear and my right ear approaches normal levels of hearing. When talking on the > phone, I have to hold it to my right ear. I don't have a hearing aid, and I can > generally hold a normal conversation without any problem, but my audiologist > said that whenever I wanted to do surgery for it, all I have to do is say the > word. (On a side note, he does not have a working knowledge of how to help me > with the Misophonia. I would love to know if anyone has contacts in the St. > Louis, MO area!) I do depend on this hearing impediment when dealing with my > Misophonia. Depending on the trigger and the volume of the actual sound, > sometimes I only need to cover my right ear to reduce my ability to hear it. > > > Currently, I am 28 and pregnant with my second child. Although I haven't noticed > an increase in my hearing loss, my ears do ring more often than normal.> > I figured you would be interested to find a case of Misophonia where the person > has hearing issues.> > Regards,> Amarette> > > > From: M <Oregon7@>> > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:50 AM> > > Subject: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso> > > > > > > > >  > > > One little item I could contribute here is the fact that I have never yet > >evaluated someone with 4S/Miso who had significant hearing loss.> > > > > > The vast majority of sufferers have perfect hearing if not better than > >average hearing. One child recently had full -10 scores across the auditory test > >tones....that was kind of amazing, really, like a bionic ear and I do think this > >does contribute to the misery a bit.> > > > > > IT would be fantastic if I could do a 30 year study starting with initial > >auditory tests and using the MRQ (The Misophonia Reaction Questionnaire) along > >with a couple other evaluative tools, like Beck Test for Anxiety, etc. and then > >see, if over the decades, as the subjects aged and lost decibels of hearing, IF > >their 4S/Miso scores would improve.> > > > > > I suspect they do.> > > > > > Expose yourself to sound, people, listen to music, go to concerts, learn to > >play in a band or quartet, dance the flamenco, whatever it takes to expose your > >system to plenty of stimulation.> > > > > > Earplugs are not a good solution, they will simply cause your poor ol' brain > >to turn up its internal volume, trying to catch the noise and sounds, which are > >its nourishment, if you can see this clearly.> > > > > > When you deprive the auditory system of 'food' (sound), it starves for this > >and becomes even more acutely anxious in seeking it, and becomes ravenous for > >sound, and will find the tiniest crumb or speck and devour it!!!!!!!!!!> > > > > > Seriously, that is what happens when you put in those ear plugs.> > > > > > Feed it, stuff it, make every day a Thanksgiving of Sound for your auditory > >system, indulge it, over eat it, consume and explore the vast realms of new > >types of ear-food for your brain!> > > > > > Do not ignore it. You can see that perhaps 4S/Miso can become a kind of > >anorexia for the ears!> > > > > > So go out and do this. Set up every space in your home as an auditory > >experience!> > > > > > A delightful Feast O Noise (A Dr. term...)> > > > > > Dr. Marsha , Audiologit, Portland, Oregon> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2011 Report Share Posted December 2, 2011 I agree - i thought i heard my ex husband eating something, I filled with rage, then looked around and it was my cat cleaning himself all of a sudden, all the rage, anxiety completely disappeared and all that replaced it was relief. To: "Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > Sent: Saturday, November 26, 2011 1:32 AM Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso I know from experience when I am doing something I enjoy very much, and am focused and engaged that my problem does not bother me as much. Especially with people I really enjoy. It could help to find things to keep his mind off of the trigger sounds as much as possible. He should start by taking little doses of esposure at a time followed by alone time to restore. It may be a start. Mike To: Soundsensitivity Sent: Friday, November 25, 2011 4:47 PMSubject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso Mike - how can I get my 13 year old to have this attitude? He isolates himself.... I have the same thing in that if I am being driven by a sound that I think is a trigger sound like snoring then find it is not being made by a person, it doesn't effect me. So strange..Sent from my iPhone I agree that Misophonia in not a physical problem. If I hear a sound similar to a trigger noise, say that sounds like someone eating and find out that it really was not eating but something else, the nearly identical sound doesn't bother me in the least. Only when it is a person making the noise, especially if they are deliberately doing it to bother me. Then I feel out of control, a big part of the extreme reaction for me. That said, I do have very acute hearing and can diferentiate sounds I think better than most people. Like my radar is looking for a trigger noise to get angry at. Funny, but I am a very easygoing person otherwise. Also, I have found it to be very benefical to expose myself, in varying doses, to lots of human sounds. Spent the day with a mob of noisy kids yesterday. By the end of the day I was practically numb to all the screaming kids and ambiant eating noises. It requires being in good mental, emotional and physical condition, but plenty worth the effort. Isolation from noise and other bothersome sounds is , I believe, a dangerous thing if you have this condition. It only leads to a lower tolerance to sound. I spent many years in self- imposed isolation, and I won't do it anymore. I missed out on too much of the good things in life. I refuse to die a lonely old man! Mike To: "Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity > Sent: Friday, November 25, 2011 5:21 AMSubject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso I firmly believe Misophonia has little to do with our hearing and ALL to do with our brain. Visual sensitivities cause the same reaction to many of us as sounds do - for some of us, a pen clicking is Ok BUT the sound of Gum snapping causes rage. There are MANY sounds that create anger and stress in some Misophonia sufferers that do not bother others who suffer from it. We even go crazy from a breathing sound which is sometimes barely audible. I believe it is not the sound that bothers us but the action. To: Soundsensitivity Sent: Friday, November 25, 2011 7:46 AMSubject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso Thank you very much Amarette for mentioning your otoscerosis, which is indeed highly relevant. The likely reason why ear problems or deafness are not so prominent in mispohonia circles is that those misophonics with ear disease think (probably correctly) that the misophonia is secondary to ear disease, so go to otologists. Misophonia sites are therefore biassed towards those looking for a non-otological cause. Just because there is no obvious ear disorder, and particularly if there is no pure tone loss on an audiogram, should not mean that the cause is non-otological, it may mean one has to look harder for atypical or subtle otological disorder. Amarette clearly has misophonia in one ear only, which surely shows that the cause is in the ear and not the brain. As someone who has tested hundreds of otoscerotics, I was surprised to read 's view that OS affects only one ear most of the time. I agree with Wikipedia that it is generally a bilateral condition, though one ear may be much more severely affected. In most cases of apparent unilateral OS, I found characteristic reversed stapedial reflexes in the good ear even when the pure tone audiogram was normal. Interestingly, this is one of the very same reflex abnormalities I found in patients with every other cause of audiosensitivity (including autism!). The obvious cause for these reversed reflexes was mechanical, slippage at the incudo-stapedial joint for example. Since the common cause of audiosensitivity in other conditions seems to be pressure change inside the cochlea (hydrops), it now seems more parsimonious to postulate the same mechanism in OS. If the pressure drops, the footplate could get jammed in the oval window for example. The clinical manifestation of hydrops is Meniere Spectrum Disorder. This will now account for some occasional features of OS, like tinnitus, musical hallucinations, vertigo, cochlear otosclerosis, and audiosensitivity (in the early stages of OS). Other characteristic early MSD symptoms are muffled dull hearing and pitch distortion. I do not think there is any ear disorder apart from MSD that can produce both muddled and acute hearing.**********************************************************************>> C,> > Is it possible to have 4S and also have other sounds that can be muddled? Very > acute hearing as well as muddled hearing? > > > > > > ________________________________> From: C > To: "Soundsensitivity " <Soundsensitivity >> Sent: Thu, November 24, 2011 8:19:58 AM> Subject: Re: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso> >  > As a hearing professional and someone who has suffered from 4S for 45 years I > can assure you Otoscerlosis  ( affects the Stapes ) and ear wax have nothing to > do with 4S. Otoscerlosis is usually Genetic and affects only one ear most of > the time.   Depending on the advice of your ENT ( I would get several opinions ) > an operation will usually repair the stapes and your hearing in the affected ear > will be close to the non affected ear after a successful operation. > > Things to consider - If it will not affect you health or if the Otoscerlosisis > is not getting worse,  I would opt out of an operation â€" there is a chance the > operation will fail and cause a worse hearing loss. A hearing aid would work > very well should you desire to hear better, you can take it out when you > don’t.  Also, I believe the repair of the Stapes usually lasts for 5-9 years on > average then another operation may be needed.  > > > From: mommyamarette > To: Soundsensitivity > Sent: Thursday, November 24, 2011 3:20 AM> Subject: Re: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso> > >  > Dr. -> > I thought I needed to respond to this particular thread because I 1) Have a > pretty bad case of Misophonia (at least it seems bad to me and those who I have > relations with) and 2) I have hearing loss.> > My particular type of hearing loss is from a condition called Otosclerosis > (sp?). One of the three bones in my ear is fused in place and does not move like > it should. This has gone on since I was a child (probably from birth, but not > confirmed... I did have excess earwax as a kid). My hearing is worse in my left > ear and my right ear approaches normal levels of hearing. When talking on the > phone, I have to hold it to my right ear. I don't have a hearing aid, and I can > generally hold a normal conversation without any problem, but my audiologist > said that whenever I wanted to do surgery for it, all I have to do is say the > word. (On a side note, he does not have a working knowledge of how to help me > with the Misophonia. I would love to know if anyone has contacts in the St. > Louis, MO area!) I do depend on this hearing impediment when dealing with my > Misophonia. Depending on the trigger and the volume of the actual sound, > sometimes I only need to cover my right ear to reduce my ability to hear it. > > > Currently, I am 28 and pregnant with my second child. Although I haven't noticed > an increase in my hearing loss, my ears do ring more often than normal.> > I figured you would be interested to find a case of Misophonia where the person > has hearing issues.> > Regards,> Amarette> > > > From: M <Oregon7@>> > > To: Soundsensitivity > > > Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2011 10:50 AM> > > Subject: Hearnig Loss and 4S/miso> > > > > > > > >  > > > One little item I could contribute here is the fact that I have never yet > >evaluated someone with 4S/Miso who had significant hearing loss.> > > > > > The vast majority of sufferers have perfect hearing if not better than > >average hearing. One child recently had full -10 scores across the auditory test > >tones....that was kind of amazing, really, like a bionic ear and I do think this > >does contribute to the misery a bit.> > > > > > IT would be fantastic if I could do a 30 year study starting with initial > >auditory tests and using the MRQ (The Misophonia Reaction Questionnaire) along > >with a couple other evaluative tools, like Beck Test for Anxiety, etc. and then > >see, if over the decades, as the subjects aged and lost decibels of hearing, IF > >their 4S/Miso scores would improve.> > > > > > I suspect they do.> > > > > > Expose yourself to sound, people, listen to music, go to concerts, learn to > >play in a band or quartet, dance the flamenco, whatever it takes to expose your > >system to plenty of stimulation.> > > > > > Earplugs are not a good solution, they will simply cause your poor ol' brain > >to turn up its internal volume, trying to catch the noise and sounds, which are > >its nourishment, if you can see this clearly.> > > > > > When you deprive the auditory system of 'food' (sound), it starves for this > >and becomes even more acutely anxious in seeking it, and becomes ravenous for > >sound, and will find the tiniest crumb or speck and devour it!!!!!!!!!!> > > > > > Seriously, that is what happens when you put in those ear plugs.> > > > > > Feed it, stuff it, make every day a Thanksgiving of Sound for your auditory > >system, indulge it, over eat it, consume and explore the vast realms of new > >types of ear-food for your brain!> > > > > > Do not ignore it. You can see that perhaps 4S/Miso can become a kind of > >anorexia for the ears!> > > > > > So go out and do this. Set up every space in your home as an auditory > >experience!> > > > > > A delightful Feast O Noise (A Dr. term...)> > > > > > Dr. Marsha , Audiologit, Portland, Oregon> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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