Antibiotics question (non Lyme & Rife)

[Guest guest]

Hi Everyone,

I used to post a lot at Lymestrategies. My life has taken a few detours which

required more time and energy and made it difficult to keep up with any Lyme

forum.

I have had Lyme since childhood but only diagnosed since 2006, if memory serves

me, which it doesn't sometimes!

I found an LLMD who is integrative (uses some NutraMedix & homeopathics) but

still uses a lot of antibiotics. I am debating whether to continue with him or

not. I remember that someone posted (at LS) that one antibiotic could dissolve

the gallbladder and another could damage ligaments and tendons. Does anyone here

remember or know what are the names of these antibiotics?

I hope this is not too off topic. I will try not to post much about antibiotics

in the future. I know they are not the focus of this website.

Thanks for your help.

Avril

[Guest guest]

Hi Avril,Welcome and stick around.   You will find some of here have used, or are using abx.  And many of us never have used them.  You are not too OT.  There is a lot to be learned and a good starting point is Rosner's books. lymebook.com  I would read both of his books (library) before going back on abx and talk to Latestage Lyme sufferers. For most people who catch Lyme late in the game, abx will cause some die off, but apparently drive the spiros deeper and also force the spiros into cyst form (and L-form) which can lie dormant for years (which is why you feel better on the abx), but once the threat is removed, the cyst bursts open not with one but with 3-5 spiros and you are (very) sick again.  That's where rifing/coiling comes in.  It does not cause encysting. When I was diagnosed 18 months ago, I could trace my symptoms back to my teens (over 20 years).   I spent 6 months deciding on a treatment - it was abx free.  I think the best doc, if you can't find an LLMD who does more than abx and sleep meds.,  (which I don't go to) are good docs who understand hormons and cortisol level.  By adjusting these you will have a fifty percent improvement in your health - which simply allows you to feel well enough to focus on your illness. It's also great to have an excellent doc who understands KPU, methylation processes, and detoxing (the gentle way).  If you are in WA I can recommend several, just email me off group.

Some people here use abx for co-infections and rifing for Lyme.  You can rife/coil for all.  I suppose an argument could be made to use abx for the co's to save some time - maybe. probably. But at what cost?  Some people do not have the $ for a rife/coil machine.  And in that case, one can still choose the no abx route by using a meriad of affordable treatments such as salt/C, MMS1/2, Teasel/GSE, etc, while saving for a coil.

There are lots of choices. Many of us here have a preference and probably a well-informed and gut bias.  I don't think, though, should you decide to go abx that any one here will judge you.  Just befriend you and help you down this difficult path we are all on.

The main class of abx EVERYONE should avoid IMO are the fluroquinolones.  Me or my kids will NEVER be prescribed one of these for anything.  Mercola has a good article on them. Here's just a small part:

The Awful Truth About Fluoride Containing

or Fluoroquinolone Antibiotics

Most likely a great deal of the toxicity of these drugs is that they contain the highly toxic poison, fluoride.

Drugs with an attached fluoride can penetrate into very sensitive tissues that used to be impenetrable. The fluoroquinolones have the unique ability to penetrate your central nervous system, including your brain.

According to Bob Patton, a private citizen in England fighting to get

the truth out about these antibiotics, about half of the fluoroquinolone antibiotics that were once on the market have been removed from clinical practice due to their horrific side effects.

Omniflox, Raxar, Trovan, Zagam, and Tequin have all been banned.

However, Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox, and Floxin continue to be prescribed for a variety of infections, both major and minor. Cipro and Levaquin are by far the favorites.

Although they are admittedly powerful anti-infectives, they are too often prescribed as a first-line defense for minor problems such as sinus, bladder, and prostate infections. These super-antibiotics should be used as a last line of defense, not handed out like

candy for every patient with a sore throat, which has unfortunately become the norm.

And with devastating results.The rest of the story is here: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/07/18/Antibiotics-to-Avoid-Like-the-Plague-Due-to-FDAs-Oversight-Failure.aspx

I think I'll try to get some sleep now. :-)

 

Hi Everyone,

I used to post a lot at Lymestrategies. My life has taken a few detours which required more time and energy and made it difficult to keep up with any Lyme forum.

I have had Lyme since childhood but only diagnosed since 2006, if memory serves me, which it doesn't sometimes!

I found an LLMD who is integrative (uses some NutraMedix & homeopathics) but still uses a lot of antibiotics. I am debating whether to continue with him or not. I remember that someone posted (at LS) that one antibiotic could dissolve the gallbladder and another could damage ligaments and tendons. Does anyone here remember or know what are the names of these antibiotics?

I hope this is not too off topic. I will try not to post much about antibiotics in the future. I know they are not the focus of this website.

Thanks for your help.

Avril

[Guest guest]

 Hi Avril,

     I am on antibiotics. I was diagnosed about 4 weeks ago and have probably had Lyme for about 6 years. I took 300mg of Doxy for the first three weeks and then stopped for a week and had an Igenex retest for coinfections. I have not had a real herx from the meds, but this is very common for me-- I have had other viral issues and have over come them and just not herxed, its really strage and my Dr agrees. I'll get more foggy, tired and swollen glands, but it isnt as severe as most people herx.

      I have ordered my Doug Coil machine and am waiting for it to arrive (prob a few more weeks).  I havent really decided yet what I am going to do to treat. My Dr and I arent sure how severe my Lyme  is because of some blood work we have shows it may not be super wide spread, and I am lack any pain or muscular symptoms-- my only symptom is brian fog (just confused about all this). Annnnyways. I am going to stay on antibiotics at least until I get my machine prob longer. In Rosner's book he goes into how for a 1-3 month period of time the Lyme is caught off gaurd and progress is made, so I may just be on antibiotics for that 3 month period of time.

    I am also going to be adding MMS soon, because I am curious to see if I get a real herx. If I do get a real herx of the MMS I would def consider going off abx (cause that means they werent doing their job).  I'll keep you updated.

 

Be well,

Whitney

 

Hi Avril,Welcome and stick around.   You will find some of here have used, or are using abx.  And many of us never have used them.  You are not too OT.  There is a lot to be learned and a good starting point is Rosner's books. lymebook.com  I would read both of his books (library) before going back on abx and talk to Latestage Lyme sufferers. For most people who catch Lyme late in the game, abx will cause some die off, but apparently drive the spiros deeper and also force the spiros into cyst form (and L-form) which can lie dormant for years (which is why you feel better on the abx), but once the threat is removed, the cyst bursts open not with one but with 3-5 spiros and you are (very) sick again.  That's where rifing/coiling comes in.  It does not cause encysting. When I was diagnosed 18 months ago, I could trace my symptoms back to my teens (over 20 years).   I spent 6 months deciding on a treatment - it was abx free.  I think the best doc, if you can't find an LLMD who does more than abx and sleep meds.,  (which I don't go to) are good docs who understand hormons and cortisol level.  By adjusting these you will have a fifty percent improvement in your health - which simply allows you to feel well enough to focus on your illness. It's also great to have an excellent doc who understands KPU, methylation processes, and detoxing (the gentle way).  If you are in WA I can recommend several, just email me off group.

Some people here use abx for co-infections and rifing for Lyme.  You can rife/coil for all.  I suppose an argument could be made to use abx for the co's to save some time - maybe. probably. But at what cost?  Some people do not have the $ for a rife/coil machine.  And in that case, one can still choose the no abx route by using a meriad of affordable treatments such as salt/C, MMS1/2, Teasel/GSE, etc, while saving for a coil.

There are lots of choices. Many of us here have a preference and probably a well-informed and gut bias.  I don't think, though, should you decide to go abx that any one here will judge you.  Just befriend you and help you down this difficult path we are all on.

The main class of abx EVERYONE should avoid IMO are the fluroquinolones.  Me or my kids will NEVER be prescribed one of these for anything.  Mercola has a good article on them. Here's just a small part:

The Awful Truth About Fluoride Containing or Fluoroquinolone Antibiotics

Most likely a great deal of the toxicity of these drugs is that they contain the highly toxic poison, fluoride.

Drugs with an attached fluoride can penetrate into very sensitive tissues that used to be impenetrable. The fluoroquinolones have the unique ability to penetrate your central nervous system, including your brain.

According to Bob Patton, a private citizen in England fighting to get the truth out about these antibiotics, about half of the fluoroquinolone antibiotics that were once on the market have been removed from clinical practice due to their horrific side effects.

Omniflox, Raxar, Trovan, Zagam, and Tequin have all been banned.

However, Cipro, Levaquin, Avelox, and Floxin continue to be prescribed for a variety of infections, both major and minor. Cipro and Levaquin are by far the favorites.

Although they are admittedly powerful anti-infectives, they are too often prescribed as a first-line defense for minor problems such as sinus, bladder, and prostate infections. These super-antibiotics should be used as a last line of defense, not handed out like candy for every patient with a sore throat, which has unfortunately become the norm.

And with devastating results.

The rest of the story is here: http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/07/18/Antibiotics-to-Avoid-Like-the-Plague-Due-to-FDAs-Oversight-Failure.aspx

I think I'll try to get some sleep now.

:-)

 

Hi Everyone,I used to post a lot at Lymestrategies. My life has taken a few detours which required more time and energy and made it difficult to keep up with any Lyme forum. I have had Lyme since childhood but only diagnosed since 2006, if memory serves me, which it doesn't sometimes!

I found an LLMD who is integrative (uses some NutraMedix & homeopathics) but still uses a lot of antibiotics. I am debating whether to continue with him or not. I remember that someone posted (at LS) that one antibiotic could dissolve the gallbladder and another could damage ligaments and tendons. Does anyone here remember or know what are the names of these antibiotics?

I hope this is not too off topic. I will try not to post much about antibiotics in the future. I know they are not the focus of this website.Thanks for your help.Avril

-- Whitney Schmucker

[Guest guest]

Hi Avril,

Welcome to our group! You should recognize some members here from

LymeStrategies.... Also, I am so sorry to hear about all that hail you got

today.... Hey, what is hail anyway, anything like that snow stuff.... :-)

Do you realize we have something in common with Lyme? I too was dxd in 2006,

lived 15 years before then undxd...

I don't recall any posts on LS about an abx that can dissolve the gallbladder...

I did a Google search and find they use abx to dissolve gallstones, but nothing

about gallbladder... However, Fluoroquinolones, like Cipro and Levaquin can do

damage to tendons. Personally I would only take these if it were a life or death

situation... It may be just a coincidence, but I took a single tiny dose of

Cipro, 38.5 mg on Dec 18, 2005, the very next night I had terrible night head

sweats that continued every night until Dec 26, 2005, I awoke with what I

thought was the worst flu, I was in bed for 10 days and never recovered... My

main symptoms from then on were severe fatigue, brain fog and muscle and joint

pain all over my body... About 3 weeks later I realized this was Lyme and that

I didn't have the flu, but rather my first major herx...

Towards the middle of this link you will see a complete listing of the different

Fluoroquinolone drugs:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quinolone

Nothing about health is off topic on our group, just please use OT if the

subject does not pertain to Lyme and Rife... Our focus is Lyme, our roots are

Lyme and Rife, but for the most part anything health is open for discussion...

And certainly abx and LLMD's are a big part of Lyme, so please feel free to

openly discuss these topics...

Take care,

Jim

>

> Hi Everyone,

>

> I used to post a lot at Lymestrategies. My life has taken a few detours which

required more time and energy and made it difficult to keep up with any Lyme

forum.

>

> I have had Lyme since childhood but only diagnosed since 2006, if memory

serves me, which it doesn't sometimes!

>

> I found an LLMD who is integrative (uses some NutraMedix & homeopathics) but

still uses a lot of antibiotics. I am debating whether to continue with him or

not. I remember that someone posted (at LS) that one antibiotic could dissolve

the gallbladder and another could damage ligaments and tendons. Does anyone here

remember or know what are the names of these antibiotics?

>

> I hope this is not too off topic. I will try not to post much about

antibiotics in the future. I know they are not the focus of this website.

>

> Thanks for your help.

> Avril

>

[Guest guest]

Avril,

 I  think youre talking about the IV abx Rochepin (sp?). There has been galbladder problems with some people that take that. But Ive thats the only abx Ive heard about that happening.

 

Whitney

 

Hi Avril,Welcome to our group! You should recognize some members here from LymeStrategies.... Also, I am so sorry to hear about all that hail you got today.... Hey, what is hail anyway, anything like that snow stuff.... :-)

Do you realize we have something in common with Lyme? I too was dxd in 2006, lived 15 years before then undxd... I don't recall any posts on LS about an abx that can dissolve the gallbladder... I did a Google search and find they use abx to dissolve gallstones, but nothing about gallbladder... However, Fluoroquinolones, like Cipro and Levaquin can do damage to tendons. Personally I would only take these if it were a life or death situation... It may be just a coincidence, but I took a single tiny dose of Cipro, 38.5 mg on Dec 18, 2005, the very next night I had terrible night head sweats that continued every night until Dec 26, 2005, I awoke with what I thought was the worst flu, I was in bed for 10 days and never recovered... My main symptoms from then on were severe fatigue, brain fog and muscle and joint pain all over my body... About 3 weeks later I realized this was Lyme and that I didn't have the flu, but rather my first major herx...

Towards the middle of this link you will see a complete listing of the different Fluoroquinolone drugs:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quinolone

Nothing about health is off topic on our group, just please use OT if the subject does not pertain to Lyme and Rife... Our focus is Lyme, our roots are Lyme and Rife, but for the most part anything health is open for discussion... And certainly abx and LLMD's are a big part of Lyme, so please feel free to openly discuss these topics...

Take care,Jim

>> Hi Everyone,> > I used to post a lot at Lymestrategies. My life has taken a few detours which required more time and energy and made it difficult to keep up with any Lyme forum.

> > I have had Lyme since childhood but only diagnosed since 2006, if memory serves me, which it doesn't sometimes!> > I found an LLMD who is integrative (uses some NutraMedix & homeopathics) but still uses a lot of antibiotics. I am debating whether to continue with him or not. I remember that someone posted (at LS) that one antibiotic could dissolve the gallbladder and another could damage ligaments and tendons. Does anyone here remember or know what are the names of these antibiotics?

> > I hope this is not too off topic. I will try not to post much about antibiotics in the future. I know they are not the focus of this website.> > Thanks for your help.> Avril>

-- Whitney Schmucker

[Guest guest]

I can't remember which family of abx it is, but there is one that has destroyed people's gallbladders.  Many Lyme folks feel this is a reasonable sacrifice if it gets rid of Lyme.  One must decide what else it is destroying and decide for themselves.  I wish I could remember which one......I think there might be more info at lymecommunity.com or in 's book - but I'm not sure.

 

Hi Avril,

Welcome to our group! You should recognize some members here from LymeStrategies.... Also, I am so sorry to hear about all that hail you got today.... Hey, what is hail anyway, anything like that snow stuff.... :-)

Do you realize we have something in common with Lyme? I too was dxd in 2006, lived 15 years before then undxd...

I don't recall any posts on LS about an abx that can dissolve the gallbladder... I did a Google search and find they use abx to dissolve gallstones, but nothing about gallbladder... However, Fluoroquinolones, like Cipro and Levaquin can do damage to tendons. Personally I would only take these if it were a life or death situation... It may be just a coincidence, but I took a single tiny dose of Cipro, 38.5 mg on Dec 18, 2005, the very next night I had terrible night head sweats that continued every night until Dec 26, 2005, I awoke with what I thought was the worst flu, I was in bed for 10 days and never recovered... My main symptoms from then on were severe fatigue, brain fog and muscle and joint pain all over my body... About 3 weeks later I realized this was Lyme and that I didn't have the flu, but rather my first major herx...

Towards the middle of this link you will see a complete listing of the different Fluoroquinolone drugs:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quinolone

Nothing about health is off topic on our group, just please use OT if the subject does not pertain to Lyme and Rife... Our focus is Lyme, our roots are Lyme and Rife, but for the most part anything health is open for discussion... And certainly abx and LLMD's are a big part of Lyme, so please feel free to openly discuss these topics...

Take care,

Jim

>

> Hi Everyone,

>

> I used to post a lot at Lymestrategies. My life has taken a few detours which required more time and energy and made it difficult to keep up with any Lyme forum.

>

> I have had Lyme since childhood but only diagnosed since 2006, if memory serves me, which it doesn't sometimes!

>

> I found an LLMD who is integrative (uses some NutraMedix & homeopathics) but still uses a lot of antibiotics. I am debating whether to continue with him or not. I remember that someone posted (at LS) that one antibiotic could dissolve the gallbladder and another could damage ligaments and tendons. Does anyone here remember or know what are the names of these antibiotics?

>

> I hope this is not too off topic. I will try not to post much about antibiotics in the future. I know they are not the focus of this website.

>

> Thanks for your help.

> Avril

>

[Guest guest]

Yes talks about it in his books (just read it last night!).

 

 

I can't remember which family of abx it is, but there is one that has destroyed people's gallbladders.  Many Lyme folks feel this is a reasonable sacrifice if it gets rid of Lyme.  One must decide what else it is destroying and decide for themselves.  I wish I could remember which one......I think there might be more info at lymecommunity.com or in 's book - but I'm not sure.

 

Hi Avril,Welcome to our group! You should recognize some members here from LymeStrategies.... Also, I am so sorry to hear about all that hail you got today.... Hey, what is hail anyway, anything like that snow stuff.... :-)

Do you realize we have something in common with Lyme? I too was dxd in 2006, lived 15 years before then undxd... I don't recall any posts on LS about an abx that can dissolve the gallbladder... I did a Google search and find they use abx to dissolve gallstones, but nothing about gallbladder... However, Fluoroquinolones, like Cipro and Levaquin can do damage to tendons. Personally I would only take these if it were a life or death situation... It may be just a coincidence, but I took a single tiny dose of Cipro, 38.5 mg on Dec 18, 2005, the very next night I had terrible night head sweats that continued every night until Dec 26, 2005, I awoke with what I thought was the worst flu, I was in bed for 10 days and never recovered... My main symptoms from then on were severe fatigue, brain fog and muscle and joint pain all over my body... About 3 weeks later I realized this was Lyme and that I didn't have the flu, but rather my first major herx...

Towards the middle of this link you will see a complete listing of the different Fluoroquinolone drugs:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quinolone

Nothing about health is off topic on our group, just please use OT if the subject does not pertain to Lyme and Rife... Our focus is Lyme, our roots are Lyme and Rife, but for the most part anything health is open for discussion... And certainly abx and LLMD's are a big part of Lyme, so please feel free to openly discuss these topics...

Take care,Jim

>> Hi Everyone,> > I used to post a lot at Lymestrategies. My life has taken a few detours which required more time and energy and made it difficult to keep up with any Lyme forum.

> > I have had Lyme since childhood but only diagnosed since 2006, if memory serves me, which it doesn't sometimes!> > I found an LLMD who is integrative (uses some NutraMedix & homeopathics) but still uses a lot of antibiotics. I am debating whether to continue with him or not. I remember that someone posted (at LS) that one antibiotic could dissolve the gallbladder and another could damage ligaments and tendons. Does anyone here remember or know what are the names of these antibiotics?

> > I hope this is not too off topic. I will try not to post much about antibiotics in the future. I know they are not the focus of this website.> > Thanks for your help.> Avril>

-- Whitney Schmucker

[Guest guest]

It would seem to me that the destruction of the GB might come from really large die-off which the liver/GB simply couldn't handle. This is just speculation, but if someone wanted to really protect the GB, gallbladderattack.com is a great site that tells everything needed to protect, heal, or dissolve stones. Or even how to live without one if it's been removed already. Armed with this info in advance could make a big difference.Be well,Léna I can't remember which family of abx it is, but there is one that has destroyed people's gallbladders. Many Lyme folks feel this is a reasonable sacrifice if it gets rid of Lyme. One must decide what else it is destroying and decide for themselves. I wish I could remember which one......I think there might be more info at lymecommunity.com or in 's book - but I'm not sure. On Wed, May 26, 2010 at 4:24 PM, Sunshine <jimjax2gmail> wrote: Hi Avril, Welcome to our group! You should recognize some members here from LymeStrategies.... Also, I am so sorry to hear about all that hail you got today.... Hey, what is hail anyway, anything like that snow stuff.... :-) Do you realize we have something in common with Lyme? I too was dxd in 2006, lived 15 years before then undxd... I don't recall any posts on LS about an abx that can dissolve the gallbladder... I did a Google search and find they use abx to dissolve gallstones, but nothing about gallbladder... However, Fluoroquinolones, like Cipro and Levaquin can do damage to tendons. Personally I would only take these if it were a life or death situation... It may be just a coincidence, but I took a single tiny dose of Cipro, 38.5 mg on Dec 18, 2005, the very next night I had terrible night head sweats that continued every night until Dec 26, 2005, I awoke with what I thought was the worst flu, I was in bed for 10 days and never recovered... My main symptoms from then on were severe fatigue, brain fog and muscle and joint pain all over my body... About 3 weeks later I realized this was Lyme and that I didn't have the flu, but rather my first major herx... Towards the middle of this link you will see a complete listing of the different Fluoroquinolone drugs: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quinolone Nothing about health is off topic on our group, just please use OT if the subject does not pertain to Lyme and Rife... Our focus is Lyme, our roots are Lyme and Rife, but for the most part anything health is open for discussion... And certainly abx and LLMD's are a big part of Lyme, so please feel free to openly discuss these topics... Take care, Jim > > Hi Everyone, > > I used to post a lot at Lymestrategies. My life has taken a few detours which required more time and energy and made it difficult to keep up with any Lyme forum. > > I have had Lyme since childhood but only diagnosed since 2006, if memory serves me, which it doesn't sometimes! > > I found an LLMD who is integrative (uses some NutraMedix & homeopathics) but still uses a lot of antibiotics. I am debating whether to continue with him or not. I remember that someone posted (at LS) that one antibiotic could dissolve the gallbladder and another could damage ligaments and tendons. Does anyone here remember or know what are the names of these antibiotics? > > I hope this is not too off topic. I will try not to post much about antibiotics in the future. I know they are not the focus of this website. > > Thanks for your help. > Avril >

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

Whitney just posted it is IV Rocephin...

Jim

> > >

> > > Hi Everyone,

> > >

> > > I used to post a lot at Lymestrategies. My life has taken a few detours

> > which required more time and energy and made it difficult to keep up with

> > any Lyme forum.

> > >

> > > I have had Lyme since childhood but only diagnosed since 2006, if memory

> > serves me, which it doesn't sometimes!

> > >

> > > I found an LLMD who is integrative (uses some NutraMedix & homeopathics)

> > but still uses a lot of antibiotics. I am debating whether to continue with

> > him or not. I remember that someone posted (at LS) that one antibiotic could

> > dissolve the gallbladder and another could damage ligaments and tendons.

> > Does anyone here remember or know what are the names of these antibiotics?

> > >

> > > I hope this is not too off topic. I will try not to post much about

> > antibiotics in the future. I know they are not the focus of this website.

> > >

> > > Thanks for your help.

> > > Avril

> > >

> >

> >

> >

>