Questions

[Guest guest]

> The cause of primary sclerosing cholangitis is >unknown. Theoretic

pathogens include toxins, >infectious agents, and abnormalities in immune

>regulation. Although excess copper has been >implicated, patients have not

responded to >chelation with penicillamine, suggesting that >elevated

hepatic copper levels are a secondary >phenomenon (as in primary biliary

cirrhosis).

----------------

Has anyone checked their copper levels ?? Would it say COPPER on the blood

test. ( Like it does Iron ) ??

-----------------

> Although both cytomegalovirus and reovirus type 3 may affect the

intrahepatic bile ducts, there is little evidence that these viruses are

present in all patients with PSC. Altered immune mechanisms appear to be the

most likely cause; HLA-B8 and HLA-DR3, often found in autoimmune diseases,

have also been associated with PSC. Destruction of the bile ducts in PSC

involves T lymphocytes, and alterations in many arms of the immune system

have been noted.

---------

Huh ?? What is or are HLA-B8 and HLA-DR3 ??

-------------

> Food entering the duodenum stimulates gallbladder contraction, releasing

much of the body pool (total, 3 to 4 g) of bile acids into the small

intestine. Bile acids are poorly absorbed by passive diffusion in the

proximal small intestine; most of the pool reaches the terminal ileum, where

90% is absorbed into the portal venous circulation by active transport.

Bile salts are efficiently extracted by the liver, promptly modified, and

secreted back into bile.

Bile acids undergo enterohepatic circulation 10 to 12 times per day. During

each pass, a small amount of primary bile acids reaches the colon, where

anaerobic bacteria containing 7-hydroxylase form secondary bile acids.

Cholic acid is thus converted to deoxycholic acid, which is largely

reabsorbed and conjugated. Chenodeoxycholic acid conjugates are converted in

the colon to their secondary bile acid form, lithocholic acid. This

insoluble secondary bile acid is partially reabsorbed; the rest is lost in

the feces.

---------

OK. Is this why URSO works ?? It adds some of the bile acid we need. If so

and we need it 10-12 times a day, wouldn't it be better if we take URSO

several different times a day instead of 3 or 4 twice a day ??

-------------

Barb

[Guest guest]

-----Original Message-----

From: T.J. Henshaw

Sent: Monday, November 27, 2000 11:01 AM

.... wouldn't it be better if we take URSO

several different times a day instead of 3 or 4 twice a day ??

Barb

Although originally directed to take 3 in the morning and 2 in the evening,

I take 2 in the morning, one at noon and two in the evening - seems to sit

with me better.

Arne

49 - UC 1977 - PSC 2000

Alive and (mostly) well in Minnesota

[Guest guest]

On Wed, 10 Jan 2001 18:47:30 -0600, Arne & Judy Myrabo wrote:

>I don't plan on telling everyone,

well Arne, are you SURE you want you picture and story on PSCF.org???

<http://www.pscf.org/family/ArneJudy.html>

it IS a public web site open to the entire world..

hmmmmmmm, entire universe..

DenverD

[Guest guest]

On Wed, 10 Jan 2001 18:47:30 -0600, Arne & Judy Myrabo wrote:

>I don't plan on telling everyone,

well Arne, are you SURE you want you picture and story on PSCF.org???

<http://www.pscf.org/family/ArneJudy.html>

it IS a public web site open to the entire world..

hmmmmmmm, entire universe..

DenverD

[Guest guest]

On Wed, 10 Jan 2001 18:47:30 -0600, Arne & Judy Myrabo wrote:

>I don't plan on telling everyone,

well Arne, are you SURE you want you picture and story on PSCF.org???

<http://www.pscf.org/family/ArneJudy.html>

it IS a public web site open to the entire world..

hmmmmmmm, entire universe..

DenverD

[Guest guest]

How do I even dream of getting off of these meds when so many of my symptoms come back as soon as just one of my meds is altered. I just don't see the light at the end of the tunnel that you talk about.

It sounds like some of your symptoms are related to withdrawal from these medications, particularly the Zyprexa. Eventually these drugs cause every single symptom you describe. Apparently they aren't working all that well, are they??? I'm sure will address some of the other issues you have -- it would seem that you could benefit from cognitive therapy and changing some of your reactions to things and the way you deal with situations. Drugs will never help you do that. The more drugs you take, the sicker you are going to get. These drugs are very hard on every system of your body. As for your diabetes analogy, that doesn't hold much weight for those of us who know there is no such thing as a chemical imbalance -- that is pure propaganda from the drugs companies, so no, taking psych meds is NOT the same as a diabetic needing insulin. The diabetic DOES have a chemical imbalance -- one that can be measured with a blood test. There is no test to measure brain chemistry. The benefits of living med free are many -- one, you will be healthier. Gaining over 100 pounds on these drugs is very dangerous. What do your doctors say about this??? The other benefits are that you are dealing with life as it is, not in a medicated, foggy state. Life isn't easy. Most of us on this board have issues we deal with,, but we do it med free, having bought the lie that meds would help us when in fact they only made our lives a living hell.

"Blind Reason"

a novel of pharmaceutical intrigue

Think your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It's

Unsafe At Any Dose

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

If you hang around this group for a while you will understand a bit more about what has happened to you and what these drugs can do to you.You said you crashed after lowering your dose from 20 mg of zyprexa to 5 that's way to big a cut.You said you upped it to 10mg and that didn't stop the withdrawal so the doc upped it to 15 and you are starting to stablize a bit .Surly you can tell by now what happened and think about this you are putting 5mg less of zyprexa in your system.If you came down realy slowly from the zyprexa say 2mg at a time and got off it altogether some of the symptoms you are having would go away.You are on a big cocktail of heavy duty drugs I don't know how on gods green earth you can get through a day with all that in your system .Who ever put you on that lot needs their head looking into.

Hugs to you

[Guest guest]

" When you're a diabetic you take insulin. No one expects you to

live without insulin "

I wish I had a nickel for every time I heard this canard from

someone treating me. I believe the more you become informed the more

you will realize the faulty nature of this thinking. Furthermore,

the more you become informed the more you will realize that the

obstacle in front of you, although daunting and sure to have some

suffering involved, is not impossible and there are people here who

are living proof.

During my far too fast taper of Zyprexa I actually spent one night

up in bed praying all night that I wasn't dying. I literally was so

sick that I thought I was breathing my last breaths. I was waiting

for the pearly gates. That may be overly dramatic, but that was how

horrid I felt. Of course, this was all exacerbated by the shrink

telling me it was all in my head. Nevertheless, I have come from an

unthinkable abyss to a current state of bliss. Ok, just kidding. I

have my good days and my bad days. Still, it is an improvement and I

know more are ahead if I am religous about what I have learned here.

You are at a fork in the road just like I was. Instinctively and

with what I believe was God's help I chose the right path. I don't

mean God's help in terms of him divining me with a choice. Rather,

he gave me the strength to make the right choice. Trust your

instincts here my friend and go very slowly and take very small baby

steps. It won't be easy, but you can do it. God bless,

Casey

> I've been reading through the posts, and a question keeps

popping up... As you all know, I'm on Zoloft, Wellbutrin and

Zyprexa, with Neurontin as needed. I posted all of my symptoms, I

just don't see how I can get off of the meds and lead a " normal "

life. I just can't fathom it. I went from 20mgs of Zyprexa, down

to 5 and my whole world came crashing to a hault.

>

> I see my doc on Monday, a week earlier than previously

scheduled, because I did so poorly when I went down to 5 mgs. I

went up to 10 and stayed there for a week, but I just couldn't cope

with the uneasiness, dread feeling, so my doc upped me to 15mgs. So

far that's working better.

>

> How do I even dream of getting off of these meds when so many of

my symptoms come back as soon as just one of my meds is altered. I

just don't see the light at the end of the tunnel that you talk

about.

>

> I'm not trying to be disrespectful or anything, I just honestly

don't see it for me. Yes, I *want* with all of my heart to be med

free, but how do I live normally with all of the suicide thoughts,

chronic diahreah every hour of the day, stomach aches from too much

acid in my stomach, etc. etc.

>

> I guess I've been seeing this as a diabetic would. When you're

a diabetic you take insulin. No one expects you to live without

insulin. They would die if they went off of it. I know we won't

die if we go off of our psych meds, but it sure raises the level of

possilibility of suicide.

>

> How or why do I want to live without the meds? I don't want to

go back to that place. I'm living in part of it every day with the

meds, actually as I write this, why do I want to stay medicated for

the rest of my life. Is there a happy medium? Is there reality in

living a normal, healthy, fun life without meds? How would I live

like that, being afraid of the dark, afraid of people, afraid of

myself.

>

> Just some thoughts that I had. I am open to what you are

talking about, it's just new to me...

>

[Guest guest]

Dear

You said " I've been reading through the posts, and a question keeps

popping up... As you all know, I'm on Zoloft, Wellbutrin and

Zyprexa, with Neurontin as needed. I........ " etc etc

**** When you say Neurontin as needed would you mind further

elabourating on this point ...........if I read you correctly then

you are taking this substance on an irregular basisis like some days

on / some days off.

What dose are you taking, how often, do you build up and taper

down ........or just stop and start?

What was the Neurontin prescribed for

Regards

BTW I took that product Neurontin ®(also known as (gabapentin)

for a number of years.

I'll write more on multiple meds / drug cocktails in a seperate post

> I've been reading through the posts, and a question keeps

popping up... As you all know, I'm on Zoloft, Wellbutrin and

Zyprexa, with Neurontin as needed. I posted all of my symptoms, I

just don't see how I can get off of the meds and lead a " normal "

life. I just can't fathom it. I went from 20mgs of Zyprexa, down

to 5 and my whole world came crashing to a hault.

>

> I see my doc on Monday, a week earlier than previously

scheduled, because I did so poorly when I went down to 5 mgs. I

went up to 10 and stayed there for a week, but I just couldn't cope

with the uneasiness, dread feeling, so my doc upped me to 15mgs. So

far that's working better.

>

> How do I even dream of getting off of these meds when so many of

my symptoms come back as soon as just one of my meds is altered. I

just don't see the light at the end of the tunnel that you talk

about.

>

> I'm not trying to be disrespectful or anything, I just honestly

don't see it for me. Yes, I *want* with all of my heart to be med

free, but how do I live normally with all of the suicide thoughts,

chronic diahreah every hour of the day, stomach aches from too much

acid in my stomach, etc. etc.

>

> I guess I've been seeing this as a diabetic would. When you're

a diabetic you take insulin. No one expects you to live without

insulin. They would die if they went off of it. I know we won't

die if we go off of our psych meds, but it sure raises the level of

possilibility of suicide.

>

> How or why do I want to live without the meds? I don't want to

go back to that place. I'm living in part of it every day with the

meds, actually as I write this, why do I want to stay medicated for

the rest of my life. Is there a happy medium? Is there reality in

living a normal, healthy, fun life without meds? How would I live

like that, being afraid of the dark, afraid of people, afraid of

myself.

>

> Just some thoughts that I had. I am open to what you are

talking about, it's just new to me...

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,butting in again .Just to say my GP made it clear to me to take my Neurontin at the same time each day ,and not to just stop and start .I couldnt understand why said as needed ? Cyndi x

I suspect that it's just more bad medical advice. I can't image that this drug was ever designed to be taken PRN. It's also one of the most controversial drugs -- ever since the whistleblower came forward and admitted that it has horrid side effects, including brain tumors, and that the head marketing guy for the company who makes it, told his reps to downplay the side effects and make sure that doctors prescribe it FOR EVERYTHING!! This is my idea of really BAD medicine.

"Blind Reason"

a novel of pharmaceutical intrigue

Think your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It's

Unsafe At Any Dose

[Guest guest]

Hiya , trouble is ,what else do I take ? The peripheral neuropathy is extremely painful ,today it's worse than the arthritis.When I saw the doc at hospital he agreed with my GP that this is what I needed

I would bet that your neuropathy was caused by the Paxil. It's a common side effect, so what you're doing is medicating away the side effects from the drugs that caused the problem. As for your arthritis, I'd bet that was exacerbated by Paxil as well. I know so many people whose physical conditions got so much worse on this drug. When I was on it and coming off of it, I had every symptom of fibromyalgia, arthritis, and a host of other physical ailments, all of which went away after I got off the drug.

"Blind Reason"

a novel of pharmaceutical intrigue

Think your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It's

Unsafe At Any Dose

[Guest guest]

said that ,and the 'jerks' I have probably are caused by that as well .I've got an ear infection at the moment and today life seems just one total pain.I'm pretty depressed ,but i'm not going back on the parox.

Paroxetine also causes ear infections and ear tumors. I know at least a dozen people who took Neurontin and got so sick they had to get off of it -- one of the things it caused in these people was peripheral neuropathy. Just because your doctors said you need it doesn't mean it's true.

"Blind Reason"

a novel of pharmaceutical intrigue

Think your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It's

Unsafe At Any Dose

[Guest guest]

I hear you, . I'm not talking about going back into a living

hell, I'm talking about living well without these meds.

It is dufficult for many people to fathom this as a possibility

so I understand what you're feeling. I'll fill in some of the

blanks for you when I return from my trip. You may also find my

answers to you difficult to believe but remember --the vast majority

of people have been brought up since birth in the conventional

medicine model of disease and treatment. I'm fortunate enough to

live in a different " world " where I see people recover all the time

from these types of diagnoses. I'll talk more with you when I

return. You can go a long way with the open mind you have.

Regards,

> I've been reading through the posts, and a question keeps

popping up... As you all know, I'm on Zoloft, Wellbutrin and

Zyprexa, with Neurontin as needed. I posted all of my symptoms, I

just don't see how I can get off of the meds and lead a " normal "

life. I just can't fathom it. I went from 20mgs of Zyprexa, down

to 5 and my whole world came crashing to a hault.

>

> I see my doc on Monday, a week earlier than previously

scheduled, because I did so poorly when I went down to 5 mgs. I

went up to 10 and stayed there for a week, but I just couldn't cope

with the uneasiness, dread feeling, so my doc upped me to 15mgs. So

far that's working better.

>

> How do I even dream of getting off of these meds when so many of

my symptoms come back as soon as just one of my meds is altered. I

just don't see the light at the end of the tunnel that you talk

about.

>

> I'm not trying to be disrespectful or anything, I just honestly

don't see it for me. Yes, I *want* with all of my heart to be med

free, but how do I live normally with all of the suicide thoughts,

chronic diahreah every hour of the day, stomach aches from too much

acid in my stomach, etc. etc.

>

> I guess I've been seeing this as a diabetic would. When you're

a diabetic you take insulin. No one expects you to live without

insulin. They would die if they went off of it. I know we won't

die if we go off of our psych meds, but it sure raises the level of

possilibility of suicide.

>

> How or why do I want to live without the meds? I don't want to

go back to that place. I'm living in part of it every day with the

meds, actually as I write this, why do I want to stay medicated for

the rest of my life. Is there a happy medium? Is there reality in

living a normal, healthy, fun life without meds? How would I live

like that, being afraid of the dark, afraid of people, afraid of

myself.

>

> Just some thoughts that I had. I am open to what you are

talking about, it's just new to me...

>

[Guest guest]

Hi ,butting in again .Just to say my GP made it clear to me to take my Neurontin at the same time each day ,and not to just stop and start .I couldnt understand why said as needed ? Cyndi xbryce_j_j wrote:

Dear You said "I've been reading through the posts, and a question keeps popping up... As you all know, I'm on Zoloft, Wellbutrin and Zyprexa, with Neurontin as needed. I........" etc etc**** When you say Neurontin as needed would you mind further elabourating on this point ...........if I read you correctly then you are taking this substance on an irregular basisis like some days on / some days off.What dose are you taking, how often, do you build up and taper down ........or just stop and start?What was the Neurontin prescribed forRegardsBTW I took that product Neurontin ®(also known as (gabapentin)for a number of years.I'll write more on multiple meds / drug cocktails in a seperate

post> I've been reading through the posts, and a question keeps popping up... As you all know, I'm on Zoloft, Wellbutrin and Zyprexa, with Neurontin as needed. I posted all of my symptoms, I just don't see how I can get off of the meds and lead a "normal" life. I just can't fathom it. I went from 20mgs of Zyprexa, down to 5 and my whole world came crashing to a hault. > > I see my doc on Monday, a week earlier than previously scheduled, because I did so poorly when I went down to 5 mgs. I went up to 10 and stayed there for a week, but I just couldn't cope with the uneasiness, dread feeling, so my doc upped me to 15mgs. So far that's working better. > > How do I even dream of getting off

of these meds when so many of my symptoms come back as soon as just one of my meds is altered. I just don't see the light at the end of the tunnel that you talk about. > > I'm not trying to be disrespectful or anything, I just honestly don't see it for me. Yes, I *want* with all of my heart to be med free, but how do I live normally with all of the suicide thoughts, chronic diahreah every hour of the day, stomach aches from too much acid in my stomach, etc. etc. > > I guess I've been seeing this as a diabetic would. When you're a diabetic you take insulin. No one expects you to live without insulin. They would die if they went off of it. I know we won't die if we go off of our psych meds, but it sure raises the level of possilibility of suicide. > > How or why do I want to live without the

meds? I don't want to go back to that place. I'm living in part of it every day with the meds, actually as I write this, why do I want to stay medicated for the rest of my life. Is there a happy medium? Is there reality in living a normal, healthy, fun life without meds? How would I live like that, being afraid of the dark, afraid of people, afraid of myself. > > Just some thoughts that I had. I am open to what you are talking about, it's just new to me... > To subscribe to the off-topic list go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/socialWandR/

from Cyndi in Cornwall xxx

[Guest guest]

Hiya , trouble is ,what else do I take ? The peripheral neuropathy is extremely painful ,today it's worse than the arthritis.When I saw the doc at hospital he agreed with my GP that this is what I needed.Sometimes, even the water from the shower on my toes was enough to make me cry .I dont know what the alternative is ? Cyndi .xglitterari@... wrote:

Hi ,butting in again .Just to say my GP made it clear to me to take my Neurontin at the same time each day ,and not to just stop and start .I couldnt understand why said as needed ? Cyndi xI suspect that it's just more bad medical advice. I can't image that this drug was ever designed to be taken PRN. It's also one of the most controversial drugs -- ever since the whistleblower came forward and admitted that it has horrid side effects, including brain tumors, and that the head marketing guy for the company who makes it, told his reps to downplay the side effects and make sure that doctors prescribe it FOR EVERYTHING!! This is my idea of really BAD medicine.

"Blind Reason" a novel of pharmaceutical intrigueThink your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It'sUnsafe At Any DoseTo subscribe to the off-topic list go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/socialWandR/

from Cyndi in Cornwall xxx

[Guest guest]

said that ,and the 'jerks' I have probably are caused by that as well .I've got an ear infection at the moment and today life seems just one total pain.I'm pretty depressed ,but i'm not going back on the parox.glitterari@... wrote:

Hiya , trouble is ,what else do I take ? The peripheral neuropathy is extremely painful ,today it's worse than the arthritis.When I saw the doc at hospital he agreed with my GP that this is what I neededI would bet that your neuropathy was caused by the Paxil. It's a common side effect, so what you're doing is medicating away the side effects from the drugs that caused the problem. As for your arthritis, I'd bet that was exacerbated by Paxil as well. I know so many people whose physical conditions got so much worse on this drug. When I was on it and coming off of it, I had every symptom of fibromyalgia, arthritis, and a host of other physical ailments, all of which went away after I got off the drug.

"Blind Reason" a novel of pharmaceutical intrigueThink your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It'sUnsafe At Any DoseTo subscribe to the off-topic list go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/socialWandR/

from Cyndi in Cornwall xxx

[Guest guest]

I know I'm a total over anxious wimp ,but knowing that does not give me the courage to undo years of being put down mentally and physically.I would love to be in charge for a change

But you ARE in charge of your health and what you put or don't put into your body. You should never abdicate your well-being to anyone else.

"Blind Reason"

a novel of pharmaceutical intrigue

Think your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It's

Unsafe At Any Dose

[Guest guest]

Yes I understand the logic of what you're saying ,but life has formed me into a ridiculously inept human being.Some-one in authority says it is what I need to take so I take it ,cos no one shows me an alternative ,nor tells me it's OK to stand up to this person.

I know I'm a total over anxious wimp ,but knowing that does not give me the courage to undo years of being put down mentally and physically.I would love to be in charge for a change ,but surely the reason I'm 'talking' to you and this group ,is because I took Seroxat ,which is because ,,,,,,,,,,I am an over anxious wimp !! So we've come full circle.

Some times the physical pain of today is a relief because I understand what I'm feeling .glitterari@... wrote:

said that ,and the 'jerks' I have probably are caused by that as well .I've got an ear infection at the moment and today life seems just one total pain.I'm pretty depressed ,but i'm not going back on the parox.Paroxetine also causes ear infections and ear tumors. I know at least a dozen people who took Neurontin and got so sick they had to get off of it -- one of the things it caused in these people was peripheral neuropathy. Just because your doctors said you need it doesn't mean it's true.

"Blind Reason" a novel of pharmaceutical intrigueThink your antidepressant is safe? Think again. It'sUnsafe At Any DoseTo subscribe to the off-topic list go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/socialWandR/

from Cyndi in Cornwall xxx

[Guest guest]

JUlie, I know exactly where you are coming from. I am paranoid

schizophrenic and when I am not on meds I can't function. (I lose all

sense of realituy. I am dangerous to myself and to others. I don't see

how I can live a drug free life.

wolfie

>

>

> I've been reading through the posts, and a question keeps popping up... As

> you all know, I'm on Zoloft, Wellbutrin and Zyprexa, with Neurontin as

> needed. I posted all of my symptoms, I just don't see how I can get off of

> the meds and lead a " normal " life. I just can't fathom it. I went from

> 20mgs of Zyprexa, down to 5 and my whole world came crashing to a hault.

>

> I see my doc on Monday, a week earlier than previously scheduled, because I

> did so poorly when I went down to 5 mgs. I went up to 10 and stayed there

> for a week, but I just couldn't cope with the uneasiness, dread feeling, so

> my doc upped me to 15mgs. So far that's working better.

>

> How do I even dream of getting off of these meds when so many of my symptoms

> come back as soon as just one of my meds is altered. I just don't see the

> light at the end of the tunnel that you talk about.

>

> I'm not trying to be disrespectful or anything, I just honestly don't see it

> for me. Yes, I *want* with all of my heart to be med free, but how do I

> live normally with all of the suicide thoughts, chronic diahreah every hour

> of the day, stomach aches from too much acid in my stomach, etc. etc.

>

> I guess I've been seeing this as a diabetic would. When you're a diabetic

> you take insulin. No one expects you to live without insulin. They would

> die if they went off of it. I know we won't die if we go off of our psych

> meds, but it sure raises the level of possilibility of suicide.

>

> How or why do I want to live without the meds? I don't want to go back to

> that place. I'm living in part of it every day with the meds, actually as I

> write this, why do I want to stay medicated for the rest of my life. Is

> there a happy medium? Is there reality in living a normal, healthy, fun

> life without meds? How would I live like that, being afraid of the dark,

> afraid of people, afraid of myself.

>

> Just some thoughts that I had. I am open to what you are talking about,

> it's just new to me...

>

>

>

> To subscribe to the off-topic list go to:

>

> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/socialWandR/

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Wolfie

You said " I don't see

> how I can live a drug free life............... "

At one stage I thought that way too ........like you & I had

been led to believe that it was essential for me to be maintained on

a cocktail of various drug classes taken all at once.

Until fairly recently I had a very serious diagnosis that included

terms like manic depression (Bi-Polar) & temp lobe epilepsy.

Looking back over the years what was sold to me & my family was a

story of ever worsening mental health .........sliding down a

slippery slope into what I see when I read the community psychiatric

nurses opinion of me was in her own words was a " questionable

prognosis "

They really never expected me to get better .........so much for

their fuc*ing " treatment "

The more they treated me the iller I presented to them necessatiting

even more drugs .........never being able to turn my health round I

was literally one step away from the dustbin diagnosis of B D P

When I discovered what my real illness was .......I gradually

stopped each & every psych drug in one taper after another.

I was suffering from Iatrogenis.

These people who took it upon themselves to TREAT us really cant see

the wood for the trees.

Sure loads of people have got issues ....psychiatry only exacerbates

them.

Regards

(Psych drug free)

> >

> >

> > I've been reading through the posts, and a question keeps

popping up... As

> > you all know, I'm on Zoloft, Wellbutrin and Zyprexa, with

Neurontin as

> > needed. I posted all of my symptoms, I just don't see how I can

get off of

> > the meds and lead a " normal " life. I just can't fathom it. I

went from

> > 20mgs of Zyprexa, down to 5 and my whole world came crashing to

a hault.

> >

> > I see my doc on Monday, a week earlier than previously

scheduled, because I

> > did so poorly when I went down to 5 mgs. I went up to 10 and

stayed there

> > for a week, but I just couldn't cope with the uneasiness, dread

feeling, so

> > my doc upped me to 15mgs. So far that's working better.

> >

> > How do I even dream of getting off of these meds when so many of

my symptoms

> > come back as soon as just one of my meds is altered. I just

don't see the

> > light at the end of the tunnel that you talk about.

> >

> > I'm not trying to be disrespectful or anything, I just honestly

don't see it

> > for me. Yes, I *want* with all of my heart to be med free, but

how do I

> > live normally with all of the suicide thoughts, chronic diahreah

every hour

> > of the day, stomach aches from too much acid in my stomach, etc.

etc.

> >

> > I guess I've been seeing this as a diabetic would. When you're

a diabetic

> > you take insulin. No one expects you to live without insulin.

They would

> > die if they went off of it. I know we won't die if we go off of

our psych

> > meds, but it sure raises the level of possilibility of suicide.

> >

> > How or why do I want to live without the meds? I don't want to

go back to

> > that place. I'm living in part of it every day with the meds,

actually as I

> > write this, why do I want to stay medicated for the rest of my

life. Is

> > there a happy medium? Is there reality in living a normal,

healthy, fun

> > life without meds? How would I live like that, being afraid of

the dark,

> > afraid of people, afraid of myself.

> >

> > Just some thoughts that I had. I am open to what you are

talking about,

> > it's just new to me...

> >

> >

> >

> > To subscribe to the off-topic list go to:

> >

> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/socialWandR/

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > ________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

So I was diagonsed with Fibro about 5 months ago....and since then I have been

taking this wonderful cocktail of meds. Every time I to my doctors they add a

new pill because the other ones are not working quite like they want or because

there is an interaction with the pills and now I need one to counteract the

effects of this. I can not tell you how much I hate all of this. I do not like

the way they make me feel or do I their wonderful side effects. I have decided I

think maybe I should re consider my situation and see if there is a better path

to take. So I was hoping I could get some advise on where to start. I am not

sure what to do first. Are there any websites anyone can recommend to help with

this new road. You can email here or for site at my email whatever is easier!

Thank you so much in advance!