Re: Re: PTSD and Obsessive thinking

August 7, 2009

Hello, Joanne,

It is interesting to see all the feed back on PTSD. You say it is caused by

particular traumatic occurances. I had the first documented flare up when I had

was in a car accident while I was nine months preganat. I and the baby were okay

but I felt " funny " for a long time. I got better but then I needed a

hysterectomy, I had a long bout of what was termed then as 'chronic fatigue

syndrom', I went into a long remission after working on my healing for about

three years. Then I got a divorce and lost my only sister the same week when I

received the papers. My symptoms returned but I had a handle on it. I tried

working which turned out to be in a very stressful environment, the darn thing

came back with full revenge. Since then it had been getting worse. But since

again after full battle it seems I may be heading for the better climb ahead.

But it took soooo much work and research. Before the period I meant to put AND

Faith...

Marie

From: Jill <gray04redyahoo (DOT) com>

Subject: Re: PTSD and Obsessive thinking

To: fibromyalgiacured@ yahoogroups. com

Date: Friday, 7 August, 2009, 5:44 PM

I have had and still have PTSD. I was abused as a child, developed amnesia, then

when an adult regained it. As an adult, I also experienced abuse. I had

Dissociative Identity Disorder with this.

The process of healing from the childhood abuse took around 10 years, which is

much shorter than usual. I used a lot of prayer, a lot of positive auto-hypnosis

tapes and therapy and worked most days on the memories. Each person in the group

of personalities had to process their abuse. Then I had to work on merging and

eliminating them when the healing (which did include true forgiveness) was

complete for each smaller group.

The memories would come spontaneously, and so I was in a high stress situation

of great fear from reliving the abuse. So, I ended up with adrenal problems,

eating problems. Luckily, Grace of God, I was sober and clean through most of

it. I was sober but considered a flake and so didn't have sponsorship, but I did

the best I could with the 12 step program.

The carbohydrates and sugars I ate were a comfort to me, but I have damaged my

body due to them.

What I need and do is to keep trusting HP that all these experiences will serve

a good purpose. That, as I move through this life, I make the choices that allow

me to love myself and others. That I use the experiences to develop compassion

for everyone, not just people who are like me.

Consciously choosing to be hopeful, choosing to trust even if I don't see a

positive end yet, doing each day what I can do to help myself and allow HP to

bring me the help I need is my challenge.

My prayers and good wishes are for all of us.

Jill in TX

>

> PTSD is Post traumatic stress disorder. It is a psychological illness that

develops following either very prolonged stress or extreme trauma such as rape,

witnessing a murder, being force to kill somebody or something like that.

Basically what happens is the mind is unable to cope with the trauma and instead

of taking the trauma through its natural progress, i.e denial, anger, despair,

frustration, blame, guiltï¿½etc to acceptance and moving on the mind gets

trapped in the early stages of the trauma response. It's a bit hard to explain.

but basically the person that is suffering from this longs to move to the

acceptance stage but the mind is simply unable to do this andï¿½basically loops

in the earlier stages going from anger, blame guilt, frustration, denial, to

frustration, guilt, anger blame and on and on. there is no respite from the

nightmare and this affects sleep, causes over production of adrenaline, often

cravings for sugar, and the

individual

> concerned, can end up binge eating.

> ï¿½

> In my case this is what happened and after years of this I started to develop

the symptoms of Fibromyalgia, fatigue, allergies, arthritic pain, anxiety,

Candida and so on.

> ï¿½

> Often when i see doctors they are keen to fix my physical symptoms which is OK

but so long as my mind is trapped in the abuse, I am reliving the abuse everyday

and every day I am re- abusinf my adrenals, my opancreas, my muscles etc

> ï¿½

> Now many people think people like me a maligerers who should just snap out of

it and stop feeling sorry for ourselves. But the experiance of PTSD does not

present itself in this fashion. The victim wants and is trying to come to terms

with the incidents, or in my case the incidents, but she is unable to stop the

mind looping and constantly chatting on about the cruelty of the event.

> ï¿½

> It is very much like the min is percicuting me, blaming me for the extreme

cruelty of another person. My mind says you should have done this and you should

have done that and why did you put up with it and look at you now you are so ill

and you let this happen etc etc. My mind has difficulty forgiving me for not

protecting myself and feels responsibel for my Fibromyalgia. It is hard to fully

explain this because on a conscious level i know this is not my fault and I know

that at the time there was nothing more i could have done about what went on,

but part of me will not accept this, and I torment myself to death.

> ï¿½

> this is what I am refering to when I discuss obsessive thinking. There are

treatments available, talking therapies, tapping, eye movement etc and I do work

at these but occasionally my obsessive thinking returns and when it does my

symptoms of Fibromyalgia flare up

> ï¿½

> For instance if i see somebody being severly attacked on TV this can trigger

my PTSD or if somebody tells me my illness is all in my head, this can trigger

me, or if people start going on about how we should forgive our enemies and if

we die not forgiving them we will go to hell, this can trigger it.

> ï¿½

> I know to other people this thing might sound pathetic but it is extremely

difficult for me to deal with. i long just to be normal and to have normal

responses to things. Not to be crippled just because something not nice has just

happened.

> ï¿½

> I do believe my PTSD and Fibromyalgia are separate illnesses. I believe my

PTSD is triggering the Fibromyalgia. But to cure the later I must first overcome

the PTSD. if i do not it will not matter how many medicines, creams, therapies

for my Fibromyalgia I use it will still be triggered by the madness that is

going on inside of me

> ï¿½

> The good news is I am doing really well with my PTSD and my Fibromyalgia is

improving also

> ï¿½

> Kindest Regards

> ï¿½

> Joanne

>

August 7, 2009

Hi joanne: I tend to agree on the PTSD thing for me. This could be true

for many, but there never is one thing that is true for every single person.

What you are doing is energy work and I totally believe in that. My

therapist, (I have only been seeing one for a year and I fee like I should

have seen one 20 years ago) works with me on energy work. Nothing to

specific but if you read about energy work there are other therapies out

there that might help you if you feel the need for more. Jin Shin Jitsu is

one. Of course acupuncture helps my friend get rid of 80 percent of hers,

chiropractors sometimes have really good ideas too. Some don¹t though.

Reiki is another one. If anybody believes in Shaman work, I had really good

results with one session one time. Amazing actually. I try whatever seems

right at the time. Sometimes on vacations they offer different things and I

try them. Shiatsu massage is good for me as well.

>

> now i am going to raise yet another controvertial subject. The idea that

> Fibromyalgia is caused by PTSD. I do not know how many of you have studied

> this but I still have symptoms from my PTSD and I know they are at least in

> part keeping my Fibromyalgia symptoms going. Anyway, from time to time I get

> obsessive thinking and this affects my sleeping tremendously, and then of

> course the other symptoms set in. I am currently using Tapping, Eye Movement

> therapy and Hypnotherapy to overcome this, and they are helping me a lot but

> if anybody has anything they would like to share on this subject it really

> would be appreciated

>

> Joanne

>

> From: Sharpcatsaol (DOT) com <Sharpcatsaol (DOT) com>

> Subject: Re: Re: Food avoids and general thoughts - long

> To: fibromyalgiacured@ yahoogroups. com

> Date: Thursday, 6 August, 2009, 8:07 PM

>

> In a message dated 8/6/2009 12:49:49 AM Mountain Daylight Time,

> caswell_joy@ yahoo.com writes:

>

> Can I ask how you prepare it.. dog food is outragious these days...

>

> It is also harmful to your dogs at best and poison at the worst. I

> suggest that you try this group. The people there are fantastic and very

> knowledgeable. We should NOT feed our dogs the same food we eat. Dogs are

> carnivores. They cannot digest or gain any benefit from grains or vegetables

> unless they are highly processed. We know that processed foods are bad for

> us, so we should know that they are even worse for our pets. If you want any

> more information feel free to contact me privately, since I am sure this

> is pretty much off topic for a FMS group. _rawfeeding@ yahoogroups. com_

> (mailto:rawfeeding@ yahoogro ups.com)

>

> Pam in ID

>

> Pamacs Selkirk Rex

> Riverun Australian Shepherds - Feeding Raw

> To keep your pets safe....dogs in a fenced yard and cats in the house.

>

August 7, 2009

Yes I agree with what joanne said but I have a little bit more to add. When

the trauma occurs generally the victim will dissociate from her body. This

is a survival mechanism so the full brunt of the pain is not felt. The

little bodies, or even adult bodies and our minds, cannot deal with it so in

order to survive we dissociate from our mind, the memory, part of our body,

or completely from the whole body. Sometimes the lower half of the body

will be dissociated from the top half of our body as in sexual abuse. When

that occurs some people will have much leg and lower back pain. Because we

are dissociate our ability to heal if affected by that.

The trauma response causes hyperarousal of our nervous system. When our

nervous system is hyperaroused our pain receptors are on full volume so

something that would hurt another person only a little causes us tremendous

pain.

Those two things are what you and me can work on with energy work.

This I took from a book called Waking the Tiger by Levine. It is a

tremendous book and I bet you can get it on amazon.com second hand really

cheap. This book changed my life and my therapist recommended it to me. I

could not believe this information.

I hope this helps as well.

>

> PTSD is Post traumatic stress disorder. It is a psychological illness that

> develops following either very prolonged stress or extreme trauma such as

> rape, witnessing a murder, being force to kill somebody or something like

> that. Basically what happens is the mind is unable to cope with the trauma and

> instead of taking the trauma through its natural progress, i.e denial, anger,

> despair, frustration, blame, guilt etc to acceptance and moving on the mind

> gets trapped in the early stages of the trauma response. It's a bit hard to

> explain. but basically the person that is suffering from this longs to move to

> the acceptance stage but the mind is simply unable to do this and basically

> loops in the earlier stages going from anger, blame guilt, frustration,

> denial, to frustration, guilt, anger blame and on and on. there is no respite

> from the nightmare and this affects sleep, causes over production of

> adrenaline, often cravings for sugar, and the individual

> concerned, can end up binge eating.

>

> In my case this is what happened and after years of this I started to develop

> the symptoms of Fibromyalgia, fatigue, allergies, arthritic pain, anxiety,

> Candida and so on.

>

> Often when i see doctors they are keen to fix my physical symptoms which is OK

> but so long as my mind is trapped in the abuse, I am reliving the abuse

> everyday and every day I am re- abusinf my adrenals, my opancreas, my muscles

> etc

>

> Now many people think people like me a maligerers who should just snap out of

> it and stop feeling sorry for ourselves. But the experiance of PTSD does not

> present itself in this fashion. The victim wants and is trying to come to

> terms with the incidents, or in my case the incidents, but she is unable to

> stop the mind looping and constantly chatting on about the cruelty of the

> event.

>

> It is very much like the min is percicuting me, blaming me for the extreme

> cruelty of another person. My mind says you should have done this and you

> should have done that and why did you put up with it and look at you now you

> are so ill and you let this happen etc etc. My mind has difficulty forgiving

> me for not protecting myself and feels responsibel for my Fibromyalgia. It is

> hard to fully explain this because on a conscious level i know this is not my

> fault and I know that at the time there was nothing more i could have done

> about what went on, but part of me will not accept this, and I torment myself

> to death.

>

> this is what I am refering to when I discuss obsessive thinking. There are

> treatments available, talking therapies, tapping, eye movement etc and I do

> work at these but occasionally my obsessive thinking returns and when it does

> my symptoms of Fibromyalgia flare up

>

> For instance if i see somebody being severly attacked on TV this can trigger

> my PTSD or if somebody tells me my illness is all in my head, this can trigger

> me, or if people start going on about how we should forgive our enemies and if

> we die not forgiving them we will go to hell, this can trigger it.

>

> I know to other people this thing might sound pathetic but it is extremely

> difficult for me to deal with. i long just to be normal and to have normal

> responses to things. Not to be crippled just because something not nice has

> just happened.

>

> I do believe my PTSD and Fibromyalgia are separate illnesses. I believe my

> PTSD is triggering the Fibromyalgia. But to cure the later I must first

> overcome the PTSD. if i do not it will not matter how many medicines, creams,

> therapies for my Fibromyalgia I use it will still be triggered by the madness

> that is going on inside of me

>

> The good news is I am doing really well with my PTSD and my Fibromyalgia is

> improving also

>

> Kindest Regards

>

> Joanne

>

> From: tanya_m72 <cianalas@... <mailto:cianalas%40westnet.com.au> >

> Subject: Re: PTSD and Obsessive thinking

> To: fibromyalgiacured

> <mailto:fibromyalgiacured%40yahoogroups.com>

> Date: Thursday, 6 August, 2009, 10:09 PM

>

> Hi Joanne, beacause I am new and I do not have this disease, my niece does, I

> am a little behind the 8 ball, can you tell me what is PTSD?

> Thanks

>

August 7, 2009

Hey maria: that is exactly the type of stress I have read about for many

people just before they get fibro. I had a very stressful job situation and

had a hysterectomy. That¹s when my started. Coincidence????

>

> Hello, Joanne,

> It is interesting to see all the feed back on PTSD. You say it is caused by

> particular traumatic occurances. I had the first documented flare up when I

> had was in a car accident while I was nine months preganat. I and the baby

> were okay but I felt " funny " for a long time. I got better but then I needed a

> hysterectomy, I had a long bout of what was termed then as 'chronic fatigue

> syndrom', I went into a long remission after working on my healing for about

> three years. Then I got a divorce and lost my only sister the same week when I

> received the papers. My symptoms returned but I had a handle on it. I tried

> working which turned out to be in a very stressful environment, the darn thing

> came back with full revenge. Since then it had been getting worse. But since

> again after full battle it seems I may be heading for the better climb ahead.

> But it took soooo much work and research. Before the period I meant to put AND

> Faith...

> Marie

>

> From: Jill <gray04redyahoo (DOT) com>

> Subject: Re: PTSD and Obsessive thinking

> To: fibromyalgiacured@ yahoogroups. com

> Date: Friday, 7 August, 2009, 5:44 PM

>

> I have had and still have PTSD. I was abused as a child, developed amnesia,

> then when an adult regained it. As an adult, I also experienced abuse. I had

> Dissociative Identity Disorder with this.

>

> The process of healing from the childhood abuse took around 10 years, which is

> much shorter than usual. I used a lot of prayer, a lot of positive

> auto-hypnosis tapes and therapy and worked most days on the memories. Each

> person in the group of personalities had to process their abuse. Then I had to

> work on merging and eliminating them when the healing (which did include true

> forgiveness) was complete for each smaller group.

>

> The memories would come spontaneously, and so I was in a high stress situation

> of great fear from reliving the abuse. So, I ended up with adrenal problems,

> eating problems. Luckily, Grace of God, I was sober and clean through most of

> it. I was sober but considered a flake and so didn't have sponsorship, but I

> did the best I could with the 12 step program.

>

> The carbohydrates and sugars I ate were a comfort to me, but I have damaged my

> body due to them.

>

> What I need and do is to keep trusting HP that all these experiences will

> serve a good purpose. That, as I move through this life, I make the choices

> that allow me to love myself and others. That I use the experiences to develop

> compassion for everyone, not just people who are like me.

>

> Consciously choosing to be hopeful, choosing to trust even if I don't see a

> positive end yet, doing each day what I can do to help myself and allow HP to

> bring me the help I need is my challenge.

>

> My prayers and good wishes are for all of us.

>

> Jill in TX

>

>> >

>> > PTSD is Post traumatic stress disorder. It is a psychological illness that

>> develops following either very prolonged stress or extreme trauma such as

>> rape, witnessing a murder, being force to kill somebody or something like

>> that. Basically what happens is the mind is unable to cope with the trauma

>> and instead of taking the trauma through its natural progress, i.e denial,

>> anger, despair, frustration, blame, guiltï¿½etc to acceptance and moving on

>> the mind gets trapped in the early stages of the trauma response. It's a bit

>> hard to explain. but basically the person that is suffering from this longs

>> to move to the acceptance stage but the mind is simply unable to do this

>> andï¿½basically loops in the earlier stages going from anger, blame guilt,

>> frustration, denial, to frustration, guilt, anger blame and on and on. there

>> is no respite from the nightmare and this affects sleep, causes over

>> production of adrenaline, often cravings for sugar, and the

> individual

>> > concerned, can end up binge eating.

>> > ï¿½

>> > In my case this is what happened and after years of this I started to

>> develop the symptoms of Fibromyalgia, fatigue, allergies, arthritic pain,

>> anxiety, Candida and so on.

>> > ï¿½

>> > Often when i see doctors they are keen to fix my physical symptoms which is

>> OK but so long as my mind is trapped in the abuse, I am reliving the abuse

>> everyday and every day I am re- abusinf my adrenals, my opancreas, my muscles

>> etc

>> > ï¿½

>> > Now many people think people like me a maligerers who should just snap out

>> of it and stop feeling sorry for ourselves. But the experiance of PTSD does

>> not present itself in this fashion. The victim wants and is trying to come to

>> terms with the incidents, or in my case the incidents, but she is unable to

>> stop the mind looping and constantly chatting on about the cruelty of the

>> event.

>> > ï¿½

>> > It is very much like the min is percicuting me, blaming me for the extreme

>> cruelty of another person. My mind says you should have done this and you

>> should have done that and why did you put up with it and look at you now you

>> are so ill and you let this happen etc etc. My mind has difficulty forgiving

>> me for not protecting myself and feels responsibel for my Fibromyalgia. It is

>> hard to fully explain this because on a conscious level i know this is not my

>> fault and I know that at the time there was nothing more i could have done

>> about what went on, but part of me will not accept this, and I torment myself

>> to death.

>> > ï¿½

>> > this is what I am refering to when I discuss obsessive thinking. There are

>> treatments available, talking therapies, tapping, eye movement etc and I do

>> work at these but occasionally my obsessive thinking returns and when it does

>> my symptoms of Fibromyalgia flare up

>> > ï¿½

>> > For instance if i see somebody being severly attacked on TV this can

>> trigger my PTSD or if somebody tells me my illness is all in my head, this

>> can trigger me, or if people start going on about how we should forgive our

>> enemies and if we die not forgiving them we will go to hell, this can trigger

>> it.

>> > ï¿½

>> > I know to other people this thing might sound pathetic but it is extremely

>> difficult for me to deal with. i long just to be normal and to have normal

>> responses to things. Not to be crippled just because something not nice has

>> just happened.

>> > ï¿½

>> > I do believe my PTSD and Fibromyalgia are separate illnesses. I believe my

>> PTSD is triggering the Fibromyalgia. But to cure the later I must first

>> overcome the PTSD. if i do not it will not matter how many medicines, creams,

>> therapies for my Fibromyalgia I use it will still be triggered by the madness

>> that is going on inside of me

>> > ï¿½

>> > The good news is I am doing really well with my PTSD and my Fibromyalgia is

>> improving also

>> > ï¿½

>> > Kindest Regards

>> > ï¿½

>> > Joanne

>> >

>

August 7, 2009

Hello...

You are right on the button, Joanne....it does take a type of 12 step program to

heal. And it is through the 'Higher Power' who will lead you, guide you, help

you, and heal you.

My power is God My Father...Abba. I go direct not around the bushes!

I have been very blessed to have a wonderful companion, friend, and husband who

himself has directed and pushed me into the 'healing fields'. Some have family,

some have friends...I only have him. My children live in another state and,

frankly, do not want to have any part of the sickness side of life.

But I dwell and rejoice in the fact that I have my companion who supports me and

you, my friend and friends in this group to encourage and teach me.

Each day I do my chores and briskly walk to the computer to converse and see

what my lovely friends have discovered and share for the day.

I have been so blessed!

Love everyone of you,

M