Re: fear/death

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/18/2004 8:09:37 AM Central Standard Time,

IonaDove@... writes:

>grant me a happy death!

Hi Alice, All,

This brings up for me how I've never been afraid to die, even though I didn't

want to and wasn't ready, etc. I've often wondered about that and figgered

it must be that ol' thing about not being able to really comprehend that the

world could go on without me, that it would really exist without me here, that,

like a teenager, I was immortal, in other words, plain old denial. We're

talking here about my ego/persona, not my spirit. Spirit/soul was something I

wasn't much into even though I've come to the conclusion that I was probably a

sort of closet mystic and didn't even realize it.

Anyway, as I've gotten older that sense of no fear about death hasn't left

even as the possibility grows closer. I've lost people, of course, (my husband

was only 30 when he died in a plane crash) and animals, and I've grieved over

them because I miss them, just like most. And yet, I remember at one point

saying to myself, " My death will be the greatest adventure I've ever gone on. "

And I was young then.

The only thing that concerned me about dying was not the event but the

surrounding circumstances. I didn't want to have a long, drawn out and painful

death like my mother. She had kidney cancer that metastasized to the bone. I'd

hoped to do it like my SO's grandmother did. She was 105 (at least) and at

breakfast one morning she announced, " Today I think I'll die. " After breakfast

she went back into her bedroom and when they checked on her about 20 minutes

later, she was dead. What a lovely, conscious way to go.

Anyway, I'm sending along a piece I wrote for one of my transpersonal studies

courses. It seems that maybe I've already died, and it was, literally, a

going to sleep. Then again, since I'm here typing this, we can't be sure, huh?

In my 50th year, I died. Oh, there was no traveling through a

tunnel, no bright white light, no floating above my body, none of the fun stuff.

At least, I don’t remember any of this sort of thing. But I don’t remember

dying, either. So, you wonder, how do I know I died? Well, I sort of

figured it out later. Then, you ask, how did you get to your death scene?

We’ll have to go back a ways, nearly 15 years before my death.

I’

d always taken my physical health and strength for granted. Then I got this

idea into my head that I needed to shape up. I started a program of running,

eventually competing in marathons as well as a lot of shorter races. I

consulted with experts on diet and complementary types of exercises like

strength

training. I did all the things we’re told we should do: I was de-fatted,

de-salted, de-sugared, and de-caffeinated. I even meditated. I did this along

with my job as a medical technologist, and I attended part-time university

classes and participated in a navy reserve unit. For a time all seemed just

fine.

Well, I was young and strong so why shouldn’t I be able to do it all? I was

about as healthy as it was possible for a person to be.

After a while I noticed that the usual aches after running no

longer went away, even after a good night’s sleep. Then I realized that I

rarely

accomplished a good night’s sleep any more. I would wake in the middle of

the night and be unable to get back to sleep. My weight started creeping up in

spite of my diet and intense exercise. Achy stiffness inexorably spread from

my legs and lower back to the rest of my body. Now it was with me all day,

every day, and it got more intense over the years. I developed an increasing

fatigue that lingered even after weeks of vacations. But I was strong and

healthy, right? Because I was doing all the right things. All I had to do was

cut

back a bit on my activity and give my body a chance to recover, right? Well,

I guess I was wrong.

I also experienced a bunch of stresses during this time. There was major

surgery, several personal losses by deaths, increasing job pressures, then a job

promotion and helping to prepare my reserve unit for deployment during Desert

Storm. After about 10 years of increasingly futile struggle, it all

culminated in a major crash-and-burn, a total physical, mental and emotional

collapse.

I had to take early retirement on disability. Exhausted, I simply sat in my

recliner all day, in constant pain all over, unable to think a clear thought,

emotionally distraught because I didn’t know what was happening to me and why.

How could I have been so betrayed? And by whom? I’d done all the right

things, hadn’t I?

That’s when I died. I think. One clear memory I have is of

sitting in my recliner, head back, eyes closed and actually saying aloud, even

though nobody else was in the house, “I can’t do this any more!†As near

as I

can tell, nothing happened, but I could be wrong. Again.

Because conventional medicine and psychotherapy hadn’t been able

to help or even tell me what was wrong, eventually I began voracious reading

about natural and spiritual healing methods. I was starving for spiritual

knowledge without even realizing I’d been hungry. I investigated psychics and

other intuitive methods. My intellectual stance took a sharp turn from the

analytical, left-brained stuff I’d been so good at for so long.

Over the next 10 years I made changes in my diet, paying

attention to what my body wanted even if that didn’t agree with “all the

right things.

†I experimented with alternative therapies, some of which gave a bit of

relief and some that apparently did nothing. My weight gain continued while my

ability, now, to walk without pain is nonexistent. Nevertheless, my overall

body pains are less and I feel better emotionally and psychically. If someone

would ask me, I’d say I’m healthy. Go figure.

But, you ask impatiently, how do you know you died? I’m getting

to that. You know how, when you call up the memory of an event or a dream,

you not only recall it, you remember doing the deed or having the dream? Well,

did you ever have a memory of something you never did and that you never

dreamt? No? I did. A few years ago, without warning, this “memory†popped

into

my head. I’m coming up on a group of five or six people and I’m saying,

“I’

m home! I’m home!†I’m so overcome with emotion I can hardly breathe or

speak. The feelings of welcome and love are so achingly intense that I can’t

describe them. Believe me when I tell you, I’ve never felt anything like that

in

this world.

I was perplexed because I couldn’t account for such a memory. It

kept recurring at odd times, then one day it dawned on me that those weren’t

people! This is where it gets really weird. They were balls of sparkling

blue energy with diaphanous white wisps trailing beneath them. There was still

that emotional tone of overwhelming love and acceptance, though. Loving energy

balls? Wooo! Now it gets weirder. At some point I suddenly realized I must

look like that, too! By now I suppose you’re bound to decide that this was a

hallucination. You just have to take my word for it that this was completely

different from a hallucination.

It was some time before I concluded that these “people†were

souls who had greeted me on my return Home. Dumfounded, I was left with the

question, when could this have happened? After all, here I was, in this all too

solid and voluminous flesh, and definitely not dead. Ultimately I recollected

how I had felt those years ago in my recliner, unable to “do it anymore,â€

feeling like I would “die of tired.†I would breathe out and have to remind

myself to breathe in again even though I felt no urgent need to do so. I felt

so

sleepy, all my energy leaking out. Maybe I did “fall asleep†and breathe

out and not breathe in again. I’ll never know for sure.

If this is indeed what happened and I did die and go Home, it’s

pretty apparent I didn’t stay. Maybe I just went for a visit to charge up my

batteries, so to speak. Lack of tunnels and white lights notwithstanding, I do

believe something significant happened. After that is more or less when I

began my spiritual search in earnest, even though I didn’t become aware of the

memory itself for many, many more years.

Recently I was discussing the myth of the phoenix with some people. While it’

s interesting, and even seems associated with my astrological sign (Scorpio),

I didn’t feel any visceral connection. Later, I was having one of those

conversations, you know, the kind where you think you’re having a mental

discussion with someone else but you’re really talking to yourself. Anyway, I

was “

talking†about my crash and burn and I was saying that it was so severe that

“

there was nothing but ashes….†Bam! Blink. Light bulb! Crash and burn.

Dying. Ashes. Phoenix. Ahh, yes.

So, where am I now? Well, I’m not dead. I’m sitting in my

recliner, still with a greater or lesser degree of chronic pain, unable to walk

more than several feet, even with a cane, and literally nearly twice the woman I

used to be. Yet, after 20 years of symptoms and 10 years after I crashed and

ashed, I’m different, more hopeful, more alive than when I was healthy.

I’m rising out of my ashes.

[Guest guest]

Dear Alice and other members of Jung-Fire,

I would like to thank you for your kind words, and thoughts on death and fear

thereof as well. I had been giving the subject matter some thought for a

while previous to this occurrence, but perhaps avoiding giving it some insights

of expression, because I knew the subject and process was a bit too deep for me

to speak and write about as eloquently as some others who post here, but that

hasn't allayed me from the task as yet, and your words are very encouraging.

I don't wish to give many details of my mother's demise on the list, and

really don't think they are all that important as far as circumstances go

publicly

anyhow. I just would like to carry as much understanding of this hidden

mystery of Life with me to my own grave some day. So once again, thanks for

being

there and do keep yourself warm and happy, I'll try to do the same!

Dail

[Guest guest]

Dear Alice,

I think we all feel better after reading one of your posts. Even on

fear and death. I may be the second oldest on the list,75. I will be

watching my dreams for a symbol. Hope it will be something happy

like Aberduffy Day.

Betty

-- In JUNG-FIRE , IonaDove@a... wrote:

>

> I am taking the liberty of sharing a letter I wrote to a memb of J-

F, in case

> it cld comfort anyone else.

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 1/19/2004 1:46:56 PM Central Standard Time,

omagramps410@... writes:

>I have never, never read anything so beautiful, and I cannot tell you how

much I >love it.

Wow, Toni! Thanks so much. I'm glad it had meaning for you and maybe, in

some way, it can help you get through the travails you're experiencing right

now. I can't see a direct connection but maybe...

My foster daughter is going through a terribly difficult time right now and

it's the closest I can come to understanding what people with kids go through

with theirs. I'll keep yours in mind and hope the good thoughts help.

I'll keep your Timmy-cat in mind, too. Maybe it'll help. I know how hard it

is to lose animals that depend on us and even though he may yet come home, it

is a difficult situation. Prayers of all kinds help in so many ways.

Namasté

Sam in Texas §(ô¿ô)§

seen on a bridge overpass, in Rochester, ny 1970

.... " AND THE TRUTH WILL MAKE YOU LAUGH " !

" Don’t bother just to be better than your contemporaries or predecessors. Try

to be better than yourself. " - Faulkner

It is in the hands of the heart the intellect becomes intelligence. - ardis

[Guest guest]

Dear Sam,

I have never, never read anything so beautiful, and I cannot tell you how much I

love it. Thank you so much for this fantastically honest sharing.

Like you, I have never been afraid to die. I've been near death a few times and

nothing ever made me fearful, sad . And like you even today, I imagine it all as

a grand adventure. I have always had a lot of faith and been close to the

spiritual side of my nature. ( no that didn't make me " gooder " or holy, still

the same old headstrong me)

I too had a collapse, but I never despaired ultimately even then. And I do

remember the peace of my worst " dying " time. I never had the unremitting pain

you must have daily which I cannot even imagine. My longest bout was several

weeks in duration. And I was not resigned nor accepting, I screamed bloody

murder most of the time.

But nothing like that beautiful account of yours. It was a numinous experience

and I am sure it happened. Don't even think " hallucination " it was real to you

was it not? We cannot bring those experiences on ourselves.

Your spirit is wonderful. Thank you again for writing about this. You will never

know how many people you have touched, Sam.

love,

Toni

Re: fear/death

In a message dated 1/18/2004 8:09:37 AM Central Standard Time,

IonaDove@... writes:

>grant me a happy death!

Hi Alice, All,

This brings up for me how I've never been afraid to die, even though I didn't

want to and wasn't ready, etc.

snip

Recently I was discussing the myth of the phoenix with some people.

While it’

s interesting, and even seems associated with my astrological sign (Scorpio),

I didn’t feel any visceral connection. Later, I was having one of those

conversations, you know, the kind where you think you’re having a mental

discussion with someone else but you’re really talking to yourself. Anyway,

I was “

talking†about my crash and burn and I was saying that it was so severe that

“

there was nothing but ashes….†Bam! Blink. Light bulb! Crash and burn.

Dying. Ashes. Phoenix. Ahh, yes.

So, where am I now? Well, I’m not dead. I’m sitting in my

recliner, still with a greater or lesser degree of chronic pain, unable to

walk

more than several feet, even with a cane, and literally nearly twice the woman

I

used to be. Yet, after 20 years of symptoms and 10 years after I crashed and

ashed, I’m different, more hopeful, more alive than when I was healthy.

I’m rising out of my ashes.