Re: 911:: Changing Responce Times

[Guest guest]

In a message dated Fri, 29 Sep 2000 11:05:02 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

" Cournoyer, Bob (LESA Com) " writes:

<<I do agree that changing a time after the fact would be falsifying.>>

I agree Bob. It should be up to the responding unit to mark in their report

that discrepancy. It should not be up to the dispatchers. We can only note on

the computer what time we were told somebody arrived, responded, etc., not what

time it actually happened. It's not our fault they forget to pick up the radio

or don't have a chance to tell us at the exact time.

Charlottesville, VA Fire Dept.

[Guest guest]

<<Does anyone know if I am thinking straight on not

changing the times or am I just over reacting and there should be no problem

in changing the times. >>

I'd just add a comment to the text of the call that so & so says he arrived at

whatever time......

I do agree that changing a time after the fact would be falsifying.

Bob in Tacoma

Law Enforcement Support Agency

LESA is looking for a new Director.

[Guest guest]

>So what I am asking. Does anyone know if I am thinking straight on not

changing the times or am I just over reacting and there should be no problem

in changing the times.<

Our department is just getting ready to install some MDTs in some of

the commissions.... And although at this time they will not be able

to mark 10-23 (arrived)... the question came up....

And for once, our department stood up for what is right...

The Major and Lt. Col. in charge said that with these new MDTs the

OFFICERS will have to take the responsibility for entry of correct times

and emphasized it is THEIR responsibility...

They are making it very simple... one of the function keys will be used

and it will be the matter of punching one key...

Well... after the ramble, I'll answer your question.

No... I do not think you are overreacting... when you change the times

you may not be falsifying a report (and then again you may?). In any case

you are certainly changing an official record, and you must accept the

responsibility for doing that.

If you feel uncomfortable in doing that, as I would, then you have every

right not to do so.

Weintraut

[Guest guest]

> To: PoliceDispatchersegroups,

911_Information_Exchangeegroups,

> PSTC911egroups, 911consoleegroups,

911Talk@...

>

> Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 10:24:13 EDT

> Reply-to: 911consoleegroups

> Subject: 911:: Changing Responce Times

> So what I am asking. Does anyone know if I am thinking straight on not

> changing the times or am I just over reacting and there should be no problem

> in changing the times. Cuz if anything would ever go to court on a responce

> time, and the log showed I changed the times, I would never remember..Well I

> changed it cuz the crew forgot to mark themselfs on location?

>

>

> any Help out there

Jim,

Any such change to the CAD or MDT would be falsifying, as has been

previously stated. Even showing a blank time, or responding and on

scene at the same time or on scene and enroute to a secondary

location (jail - hospital - whatever) would be easier to explain than

explaining why you changed a time...same holds true for deleting a

record...

If someone requests for a record to be deleted, I have my dispatchers

(first if all, they don't have delete power) denote why the call

should/could be deleted and leave it alone, it is not deleted.

I would also say denote in the remarks / narrative of the call the

actual time the crew " claimed " to arrive on the scene. If you cannot

prove ((you were not there -- nothing verbal on tape, as in no one

checked out on the scene or in no other way were advised that they

were or were not on the scene, you must elude to their arrival as

being their claim, not something that you can verify.

Nick Wagner

Cortland Co. (NY) Sheriff's Dept

E9-1-1 Center/Sr. Supervisor

mailto:nwagner@...

[Guest guest]

Of course, on the other hand, I remember back in the " good ol days " when the

unit would arrive and clear from calls on the radio without ever leaving the

donut shop or picking up a telephone. So how do you really know? Yeah, I

know, the sky could fall, too.

Bob in Tacoma

[Guest guest]

> To: " '911consoleegroups' " <911consoleegroups>

>

> Date: Fri, 29 Sep 2000 12:42:06 -0700

> Reply-to: 911consoleegroups

> Subject: RE: 911:: Changing Responce Times

> Of course, on the other hand, I remember back in the " good ol days " when the

> unit would arrive and clear from calls on the radio without ever leaving the

> donut shop or picking up a telephone.

Ain't it the truth!!

But, my lawyer will tell you for free that if he does, that's on

him...

Nick Wagner

Cortland Co. (NY) Sheriff's Dept

E9-1-1 Center/Sr. Supervisor

mailto:nwagner@...

[Guest guest]

Subject: RE: 911:: Changing Responce Times

> <<Does anyone know if I am thinking straight on not

> changing the times or am I just over reacting and there should be no

problem

> in changing the times. >>

There's no way in our CAD system to change the times. That feature should

be locked out to prevent misuse.

Being able to change the times in the record invites fraud. The units in

the field should be professional enough to follow procedure.

Jim Reeves, Jr. KC6YRU ICQ # 884017

Tulare County CA Sheriff's Office 9-1-1/Dispatcher

Web pages at: http://kc6yru.cnetech.com

E-mail to: jimmiejoe@...

[Guest guest]

Re:Changing Times

In our CAD, we can change times rather easily...however...the CAD has an

internal clock that timestamps each entry and that cannot be changed. Now, as to

the reliability of these times...don't bet on them. Our CAD clock constantly

loses or gains time, and if the dispatcher doesn't (1) notice (2) take

action....the discrepancy in times steadily increases. I have had times

when the officers clear a call...and to look at the CAD times, they arrived when

they cleared and cleared 30 minutes in the FUTURE. So, I doubt if these times

would stand a very close scruntity in court or elsewhere.

Given these factors, I am divided on changing times. On one hand, it doesn't sit

easy to actually change an official type entry...but, on the other hand, the

entries are not of necessity accurate anyway, so changing them is not likely to

affect that...and, there is always the unmutable CAD internal clock time...

Freida

La Vergne PD

La Vergne, TN