Re: IEE failed

[Guest guest]

Loree: They took away his autism category?   Did you sign " Agree " on that ARD? You cannot get ESY unless you can prove the child will have regression that cannot be regroup after a certain length of time (I'd have to go check, but I thought it was 6-9 weeks) if the child does not have ESY, OR the severity of the disability supports it. Check out ESY on slaw:     http://www.wrightslaw.com/info/esy.index.htm Also keep in mind that what might win with case law in other states does not really work too well in Texas if you went to mediation or due process.  Here is what our state has to say about ESY: http://ritter.tea.state.tx.us/special.ed/resources/esy.html Hilda   From: Texas-Autism-Advocacy [mailto:Texas-Autism-Advocacy ] On Behalf Of LorreeSent: Sunday, June 26, 2011 12:55 PMTo: Texas-Autism-Advocacy Subject: Re: IEE failed ok. so all the school testing shows he doesnt NEED any support services as they dont see any issues socially, functionally or other basically saying he is doing everything like a " normal " kid. which is where they say there is no academic need. he is doingmacceptable inall areas academically. so when i ask for art or music therapy or speech during esy even when i bring up how they willmhelp him with attention and focus they say there is no academic need and when i brin up how it will help prepare him for future they dont agree. even the iee stated there was no academic need due to his autism. he has a medical diagnosis for aspergers and adhd. they did not go over the autism supplement cause they took away his autism category. he is ohi and si now. Sent from my iPhone Did you see the posted Federal Register quote?• The definition of supplementaryaids and services in § 300.42 (proposed§ 300.41) has been modified to specifythat aids, services, and other supportsare also provided to enable childrenwith disabilities to participate inextracurricular and nonacademicsettings.Subpart B—State EligibilityFAPE Requirements• Section 300.101© has been revisedto clarify that a free appropriate publiceducation (FAPE) must be available toany individual child with a disabilitywho needs special education andrelated services, even though the childhas not failed or been retained in acourse, and is advancing from grade tograde.• Section 300.102(a)(3), regardingexceptions to FAPE, has been changed*******First, after viewing the video, I certainly do see Asperger's. He is better verbally than my son. Did he ever lose speech? IMO the difference between regressive autism and Asperger's is that while Asperger's children may begin to talk later, they never have speech then lose it, as my son did. My son is now fairly high functioning, but his emotional skills, speech skills -- well just about everything is about five years delayed.Now in the definition of FAPE where your son is concerned, the very fact that he has been diagnosed with a disability entitles him to every thing under the Autism supplement? Did they not go over the Autism Supplement with you?this is Dorene Philpot's website which can explain the Autism Supplement more as well as give you some court case law, I think. We have used Dorene in the past. She is VERY expensive. The only ting I didn't like is that she was not up front with her cost in the beginning, and we were blown away by her costs, so I don't like attorneys who are not honest up front about what they charge. Anyway, her site does have some good info.The Autism Supplement states in brief:AUTISM SUPPLEMENT – 11 POINTS THAT MUST BE DISCUSSED Parents and educators must discuss each of the following 11 points before creating an Individualized Education Program for a student with autism in Texas:Extended educational programming, including extended-day and extended-year servicesDaily schedules with minimal unstructured timeIn-home and community-based training that helps students acquire social and behavioral skills Positive behavioral support strategiesPlanning for the life, work and education of children of all agesParent and family training and supportSuitable student-to-staff ratios for children during the various stages of learningCommunication interventionsSocial skill supportsProfessional educator and staff support and trainingTeaching strategies based on research-based practices, including discrete-trial training and applied behavior analysis Also, based on section 300.101© as I quoted above, even though he is doing okay academically (which I think is the reason they are denying support services, they cannot deny him the things he needs in order to prepare him for: post-secondary education, employment, and independent living.If you can show the things you want him to have are VITAL to preparing him for these things, then you can convince them.If they did not go over the autism supplement with you before they started making all these decisions stating he doesn't need services -- I mean, he has been officially diagnosed? Hasn't he? what was his official diagnosis? Is it Asperger's or autism?I am saying they still have to provide services even if they find there is no ACADEMIC NEED, and evidently they are trying to deny support services based on there being no academic need, which is happening a lot right now. Even kids with ASD disorders who do well academically STILL have other educational needs such as social skills training speech, OT, behavioral etc... These needs must be met, too. You cannot deny services becasue a child is " passing " ; you cannot deny services on the basis of grades alone becasue in the eyes of courts, grades are viewed as very arbitrary and not reliable.But if you could swing an independent evaluation - complete across all areas, then you may have some ammo to battle with. The type of complete evaluations done by Adina Rich (Rich Educational Consulting) are very thorough and Adina is clear about what supports and services a child needs, and she even writes some IEP's that are helpful. She is on this list and has replied to one of your posts. If you could find someone like her to do an independent evaluation, it could help you.Can you give me some specifics as to what has gone on at school -- I'm thinking some behavior or social problems that the school is not giving the proper support for?Haven

[Guest guest]

Documentation and evaluation. There are other criteria they need to use besides grades. Check your prior written notice to see what or how it is written. Behavior is a very big component of educational need and they may not have been up against a person that looks past or closely to the wording. A complaint will be investigated by TEA, and they have to answer a lot of questions and have their documentation and responses to you checked and double checked. At the least, it is aggravating for them. At the best, TEA will require some kind of compensation, which could give you access to more services.Thanks,AdinaSent from my iPhone

Yes I am here in houston, but not HISD. I am in a different district.

so are you saying by that federal register that a SD must provide services for a child even if there is no educational need? I dont understand that. Because from my interpretation of IDEA it says that even though a child has a diagnosed disability it doesnt mean that they are elegible for sped services. So when I request things like interactive metronome or speech during the summer (ESY) or recreational therapy or whatever they say "there is no educational need" not necessarily "no" and thats it. I try to get them to say "no" but they dont, they just say "we dont see any educational need based on our testing" or something similar. They know how to word the words to not get caught I guess. So if its true that there DOES NOT need to be educational need then how do I convince them of that?

Re: IEE failed

Loree,Are you down neaqr Houston? I think that is where you told me you were.How old is your son again?I noticed that Adina gave input here. She is an awesome diagnostician and advocate. I wish you could come up and let her evaluate your son. Her evaluations have been a great help to us in the advocacy of our son.I agree with her. I also agree with EVERYTHING Hilda said, and I was going to say a lot of that here, but she gave you the info. ANY time they disagree to anything you feel your child needs, THEY MUST decline it in writing and give a detailed written response as to why it isn't needed.In a good evaluation -- such as the kind Adina would do, you would know where your child is with regard to functional skills, social skills, adaptability, speech, and academics. They cannot say he doesn't need it if it hasn't been tested.This sounds like a district that is in dire need of an attitude adjustment. If you feel your child's civil rights are being denied, you can file a complaint with the OCR and they will investigate (at no cost to you). You can complain to the TEA, but KNOW that whatever complaint you file with them must be presented to the district. You MUST try to resolve the complaint at the local level first so that it looks like YOU tried.Many districts keep their local complaint process a secret unless you ask. Cheek the school handbook and there should be a section in there on the local complaint process. Follow that to the letter. Then if you can't resolve it there, you file with TEA and send an EXACT copy of the complaint to the district (Superintendent and school board members). then TEA will investigate.It is very important that you save EVERYTHING. Have your notebooks in chronological order and have them include all your child's school work. It maybe that his grades/progress looks good on paper but if you were to look closer, you might find they are not doing their jobs.If you could ever go to a 's Law conference, it would be some of the best money you ever spent, but if you can's then get the book "From Emotions to Advocacy" and the Pete 's book "Special Education Law, and start studying. Do everything in the emotions book the way Pete says to do it. The strategies work.I find even if you become knowledgeable, there is always strength in numbers. I like having an advocate come along. Adina has come many times for us. I'd grab a few people off the street if I had to just to have some extra bodies in there on my child's side. My husband, though he is a very quiet person, knows he still has to "be there." It doesn't matter if they say a word, you just need your "gang."You MUST tape every meeting. The declaration Hilda mentioned is a great idea so that you can later use the recordings in DP if you have to.I used to tape, but then for my twentieth anniversary, my husband got me an ipad, and wow! This thing can record for hours, and then you can download it to your computer and then burn it onto a CD and place it in your educational notebook. It is by far the best gift he ever got me (He gave me a choice between jewelry and the ipad, and I soooo made the right choice!). We need to work together to turn this thing around for you. I think you are going to need a full evaluation at your own expense. Ask Adina who she might recommend in your area and how much it will cost you. MHMR might do it at a reduced rate -- or Easter Seals?Haven

[Guest guest]

yes, as Hilda said, they need to respond in writing to each thing they disagree to and explain why.  Unfortunately if they did the testing you can request outside at their expense or you can pay for another full assessment and hope it shows that he does need help.  Without this, you have little to stand on.

The only other thing you could do is that if you kept ALL his papers you could look at them and add things up and see if his actually work reflects the grades they gave.

[Guest guest]

well for now i plan to have another ard in the fall and will see what happens there. i did sign agree to the last ard which was probably a mistake. its hard to make a case when you have 10 people telling you and iee saying there is no educational need. they are good at making me feel like i am wrong and dont know anything and am a horrible parent cause they can control my son but i cant. Sent from my iPhone

Documentation and evaluation. There are other criteria they need to use besides grades. Check your prior written notice to see what or how it is written. Behavior is a very big component of educational need and they may not have been up against a person that looks past or closely to the wording. A complaint will be investigated by TEA, and they have to answer a lot of questions and have their documentation and responses to you checked and double checked. At the least, it is aggravating for them. At the best, TEA will require some kind of compensation, which could give you access to more services.Thanks,AdinaSent from my iPhone

Yes I am here in houston, but not HISD. I am in a different district.

so are you saying by that federal register that a SD must provide services for a child even if there is no educational need? I dont understand that. Because from my interpretation of IDEA it says that even though a child has a diagnosed disability it doesnt mean that they are elegible for sped services. So when I request things like interactive metronome or speech during the summer (ESY) or recreational therapy or whatever they say "there is no educational need" not necessarily "no" and thats it. I try to get them to say "no" but they dont, they just say "we dont see any educational need based on our testing" or something similar. They know how to word the words to not get caught I guess. So if its true that there DOES NOT need to be educational need then how do I convince them of that?

Re: IEE failed

Loree,Are you down neaqr Houston? I think that is where you told me you were.How old is your son again?I noticed that Adina gave input here. She is an awesome diagnostician and advocate. I wish you could come up and let her evaluate your son. Her evaluations have been a great help to us in the advocacy of our son.I agree with her. I also agree with EVERYTHING Hilda said, and I was going to say a lot of that here, but she gave you the info. ANY time they disagree to anything you feel your child needs, THEY MUST decline it in writing and give a detailed written response as to why it isn't needed.In a good evaluation -- such as the kind Adina would do, you would know where your child is with regard to functional skills, social skills, adaptability, speech, and academics. They cannot say he doesn't need it if it hasn't been tested.This sounds like a district that is in dire need of an attitude adjustment. If you feel your child's civil rights are being denied, you can file a complaint with the OCR and they will investigate (at no cost to you). You can complain to the TEA, but KNOW that whatever complaint you file with them must be presented to the district. You MUST try to resolve the complaint at the local level first so that it looks like YOU tried.Many districts keep their local complaint process a secret unless you ask. Cheek the school handbook and there should be a section in there on the local complaint process. Follow that to the letter. Then if you can't resolve it there, you file with TEA and send an EXACT copy of the complaint to the district (Superintendent and school board members). then TEA will investigate.It is very important that you save EVERYTHING. Have your notebooks in chronological order and have them include all your child's school work. It maybe that his grades/progress looks good on paper but if you were to look closer, you might find they are not doing their jobs.If you could ever go to a 's Law conference, it would be some of the best money you ever spent, but if you can's then get the book "From Emotions to Advocacy" and the Pete 's book "Special Education Law, and start studying. Do everything in the emotions book the way Pete says to do it. The strategies work.I find even if you become knowledgeable, there is always strength in numbers. I like having an advocate come along. Adina has come many times for us. I'd grab a few people off the street if I had to just to have some extra bodies in there on my child's side. My husband, though he is a very quiet person, knows he still has to "be there." It doesn't matter if they say a word, you just need your "gang."You MUST tape every meeting. The declaration Hilda mentioned is a great idea so that you can later use the recordings in DP if you have to.I used to tape, but then for my twentieth anniversary, my husband got me an ipad, and wow! This thing can record for hours, and then you can download it to your computer and then burn it onto a CD and place it in your educational notebook. It is by far the best gift he ever got me (He gave me a choice between jewelry and the ipad, and I soooo made the right choice!). We need to work together to turn this thing around for you. I think you are going to need a full evaluation at your own expense. Ask Adina who she might recommend in your area and how much it will cost you. MHMR might do it at a reduced rate -- or Easter Seals?Haven

[Guest guest]

they didnt provide pwn as they dont think they said no. i didnt ask. but still might. but i need to have another ard in the fall to reask for these things. Sent from my iPhone

yes, as Hilda said, they need to respond in writing to each thing they disagree to and explain why. Unfortunately if they did the testing you can request outside at their expense or you can pay for another full assessment and hope it shows that he does need help. Without this, you have little to stand on.

The only other thing you could do is that if you kept ALL his papers you could look at them and add things up and see if his actually work reflects the grades they gave.

[Guest guest]

Lorree:Don't be so hard on yourself.  We've all been in your shoes.  I know I certainly have.  They told me that if I did not sign " agree " they couldn't implement his IEP and I believed them (and if I didn't sign I would be a very terrible mother for doing so).  Remember they excel at this.  Hilda From: Texas-Autism-Advocacy [mailto:Texas-Autism-Advocacy ] On Behalf Of LorreeSent: Sunday, June 26, 2011 7:15 PMTo: Texas-Autism-Advocacy Subject: Re: IEE failed well for now i plan to have another ard in the fall and will see what happens there. i did sign agree to the last ard which was probably a mistake. its hard to make a case when you have 10 people telling you and iee saying there is no educational need. they are good at making me feel like i am wrong and dont know anything and am a horrible parent cause they can control my son but i cant. Sent from my iPhone Documentation and evaluation. There are other criteria they need to use besides grades. Check your prior written notice to see what or how it is written. Behavior is a very big component of educational need and they may not have been up against a person that looks past or closely to the wording. A complaint will be investigated by TEA, and they have to answer a lot of questions and have their documentation and responses to you checked and double checked. At the least, it is aggravating for them. At the best, TEA will require some kind of compensation, which could give you access to more services.Thanks,AdinaSent from my iPhone Yes I am here in houston, but not HISD. I am in a different district. so are you saying by that federal register that a SD must provide services for a child even if there is no educational need? I dont understand that. Because from my interpretation of IDEA it says that even though a child has a diagnosed disability it doesnt mean that they are elegible for sped services. So when I request things like interactive metronome or speech during the summer (ESY) or recreational therapy or whatever they say " there is no educational need " not necessarily " no " and thats it. I try to get them to say " no " but they dont, they just say " we dont see any educational need based on our testing " or something similar. They know how to word the words to not get caught I guess. So if its true that there DOES NOT need to be educational need then how do I convince them of that? Re: IEE failed Loree,Are you down neaqr Houston? I think that is where you told me you were.How old is your son again?I noticed that Adina gave input here. She is an awesome diagnostician and advocate. I wish you could come up and let her evaluate your son. Her evaluations have been a great help to us in the advocacy of our son.I agree with her. I also agree with EVERYTHING Hilda said, and I was going to say a lot of that here, but she gave you the info. ANY time they disagree to anything you feel your child needs, THEY MUST decline it in writing and give a detailed written response as to why it isn't needed.In a good evaluation -- such as the kind Adina would do, you would know where your child is with regard to functional skills, social skills, adaptability, speech, and academics. They cannot say he doesn't need it if it hasn't been tested.This sounds like a district that is in dire need of an attitude adjustment. If you feel your child's civil rights are being denied, you can file a complaint with the OCR and they will investigate (at no cost to you). You can complain to the TEA, but KNOW that whatever complaint you file with them must be presented to the district. You MUST try to resolve the complaint at the local level first so that it looks like YOU tried.Many districts keep their local complaint process a secret unless you ask. Cheek the school handbook and there should be a section in there on the local complaint process. Follow that to the letter. Then if you can't resolve it there, you file with TEA and send an EXACT copy of the complaint to the district (Superintendent and school board members). then TEA will investigate.It is very important that you save EVERYTHING. Have your notebooks in chronological order and have them include all your child's school work. It maybe that his grades/progress looks good on paper but if you were to look closer, you might find they are not doing their jobs.If you could ever go to a 's Law conference, it would be some of the best money you ever spent, but if you can's then get the book " From Emotions to Advocacy " and the Pete 's book " Special Education Law, and start studying. Do everything in the emotions book the way Pete says to do it. The strategies work.I find even if you become knowledgeable, there is always strength in numbers. I like having an advocate come along. Adina has come many times for us. I'd grab a few people off the street if I had to just to have some extra bodies in there on my child's side. My husband, though he is a very quiet person, knows he still has to " be there. " It doesn't matter if they say a word, you just need your " gang. " You MUST tape every meeting. The declaration Hilda mentioned is a great idea so that you can later use the recordings in DP if you have to.I used to tape, but then for my twentieth anniversary, my husband got me an ipad, and wow! This thing can record for hours, and then you can download it to your computer and then burn it onto a CD and place it in your educational notebook. It is by far the best gift he ever got me (He gave me a choice between jewelry and the ipad, and I soooo made the right choice!). We need to work together to turn this thing around for you. I think you are going to need a full evaluation at your own expense. Ask Adina who she might recommend in your area and how much it will cost you. MHMR might do it at a reduced rate -- or Easter Seals?Haven

[Guest guest]

I feel like I'm becoming an old pro at the ins and outs and lies and

misinformation that are the ARD meetings, but I learned something new here, so a

big fat thanks! I too was told that if I didn't sign off agreeing that they

could deny my son ESY services, they couldn't implement his IEP. I told them I

was never going to sign it, and we recessed for a week, during which time I felt

confident that his teacher (the only saving grace in this awful little

committee) would do what was best when it came to the daily implementation of

appropriate educational goals for my kid.

It's good to know that they CAN implement his IEP goals in that situation,

because I'm sure that there will be MANY times in the future where I will be

forced to say, " Ya, I'm never going to sign that. "

Serena

>

>

>

> Yes I am here in houston, but not HISD. I am in a different district.

>

>

>

> so are you saying by that federal register that a SD must provide services for

a child even if there is no educational need? I dont understand that. Because

from my interpretation of IDEA it says that even though a child has a diagnosed

disability it doesnt mean that they are elegible for sped services. So when I

request things like interactive metronome or speech during the summer (ESY) or

recreational therapy or whatever they say " there is no educational need " not

necessarily " no " and thats it. I try to get them to say " no " but they dont,

they just say " we dont see any educational need based on our testing " or

something similar. They know how to word the words to not get caught I guess.

So if its true that there DOES NOT need to be educational need then how do I

convince them of that?

>

>

>

> Re: IEE failed

>

>

>

>

>

> Loree,

>

> Are you down neaqr Houston? I think that is where you told me you were.

> How old is your son again?

>

> I noticed that Adina gave input here. She is an awesome diagnostician and

advocate. I wish you could come up and let her evaluate your son. Her

evaluations have been a great help to us in the advocacy of our son.

>

> I agree with her. I also agree with EVERYTHING Hilda said, and I was going to

say a lot of that here, but she gave you the info.

>

> ANY time they disagree to anything you feel your child needs, THEY MUST

decline it in writing and give a detailed written response as to why it isn't

needed.

>

> In a good evaluation -- such as the kind Adina would do, you would know where

your child is with regard to functional skills, social skills, adaptability,

speech, and academics. They cannot say he doesn't need it if it hasn't been

tested.

>

> This sounds like a district that is in dire need of an attitude adjustment.

If you feel your child's civil rights are being denied, you can file a complaint

with the OCR and they will investigate (at no cost to you). You can complain to

the TEA, but KNOW that whatever complaint you file with them must be presented

to the district. You MUST try to resolve the complaint at the local level first

so that it looks like YOU tried.

>

> Many districts keep their local complaint process a secret unless you ask.

Cheek the school handbook and there should be a section in there on the local

complaint process. Follow that to the letter. Then if you can't resolve it

there, you file with TEA and send an EXACT copy of the complaint to the district

(Superintendent and school board members). then TEA will investigate.

>

> It is very important that you save EVERYTHING. Have your notebooks in

chronological order and have them include all your child's school work. It

maybe that his grades/progress looks good on paper but if you were to look

closer, you might find they are not doing their jobs.

>

> If you could ever go to a 's Law conference, it would be some of the

best money you ever spent, but if you can's then get the book " From Emotions to

Advocacy " and the Pete 's book " Special Education Law, and start studying.

Do everything in the emotions book the way Pete says to do it. The strategies

work.

>

> I find even if you become knowledgeable, there is always strength in numbers.

I like having an advocate come along. Adina has come many times for us. I'd

grab a few people off the street if I had to just to have some extra bodies in

there on my child's side. My husband, though he is a very quiet person, knows

he still has to " be there. " It doesn't matter if they say a word, you just need

your " gang. "

>

> You MUST tape every meeting. The declaration Hilda mentioned is a great idea

so that you can later use the recordings in DP if you have to.

> I used to tape, but then for my twentieth anniversary, my husband got me an

ipad, and wow! This thing can record for hours, and then you can download it to

your computer and then burn it onto a CD and place it in your educational

notebook. It is by far the best gift he ever got me (He gave me a choice

between jewelry and the ipad, and I soooo made the right choice!).

>

> We need to work together to turn this thing around for you. I think you are

going to need a full evaluation at your own expense. Ask Adina who she might

recommend in your area and how much it will cost you. MHMR might do it at a

reduced rate -- or Easter Seals?

>

> Haven

>

[Guest guest]

It doesn't matter if you signed " agree. "   a parent may revoke ALL or PART of the ARD agreement at ANY time.  It is not set in stone.  Any time you get new information, or even if you go home and sleep on it and feel you made a mistake, you can call an emergency ARD or you can fill out a " Revocation of ALL or Part of the ARD agreement and send it to them certified mail.  Then they will have to reconvene within ten days (request it in the letter).

You don't have to wait until the fall.  You can call it now.  I would imagine the principal and other pertinent personnel are still working.  You may have to give permission for some of the ARD members to be absent.  You can also fill out the R of A or P of the ARD agreement and mail it now, then they will HAVE to reconvene in time to get an plans in place by start of the new school year.

District personnel are masters at manipulation and intimidation.  When they spout law, it is usually incorrect and just used as a means of manipulation.  You don't have to sign at all.  You can " table " the discussion and reconvene within ten days.  It makes you a GOOD mother.

The next best thing to a good education is a pushy mother.  Remember that.  Einstein's mother was told he would never amount to anything.  My brother had problems in school.  I think he had ADHD, but no one really knew about that back then, but my mother's solution was to blame him and mistreat him for his issues.  Even she thought he would wind up in prison.  But sometimes it just takes someone -anyone to take interest in a child and nourish that good spark.  Thank God we had my grandmother and of all people, my mother's maid who was the kindest person.  My brother also had a teacher who saw the good in him.

He never went to college, but he owns his own trucking company and a lot of land and owes no one. His reading and writing issues were never fully addressed and he still struggles with that a bit but he has learned to compensate.  Your child is lucky becasue he has his mother who doesn't blame him for his disabilities and wants to help  him, and you are fighting to prevent the school from short changing him.  He is one lucky kid to have you in his corner.

[Guest guest]

If you don't agree, then whatever IEP was previously in place, stays in place until a new one is agreed upon, or they can implement (and they ought to) until the new one is in place.  You can alwasy agree to " PART. "

This is one thing I hate:  For each section in the ARD agreement there is a box at the end that says the parent agrees or disagrees with that section of the agreement.  Well, most school districts pre determine the IEP and also pre check of that the parents agree with EVERY section!!! This is such a huge violation of procedure.  Nothing should be checked off until the parent reads it.  No IEP's should be developed before the annual ARd without the parents input.

Again, you can agree to implement those parts you do agree with and disagree with those you don't.  You have to put notes by your signature.  I would sign disagree and then put the parts I disagreed with.  Then they could implement the other parts.