Guest guest Posted December 19, 1999 Report Share Posted December 19, 1999 > Go to 3 different docs, get 3 diff answers. No, your silver bullet diet plan is NOT by any sanctioned by the ADA/JDF or by any sanctioned diabetes center. Trust me, I know what those standards are. You are doing the diabetes community a disservice by spreading your gospel mainly due to the fact that it can be down right dangous to individuals who are not properly monitored. There is a real risk and so far, you really haven't respond much to that. > If you blow the dust off that meter and check for yourself, you will see > what will work for you. That is what we are doing. Like Sam says, the > meter doesn't lie. > I also don't like your insinuation that people who don't follow your plan aren't testing like they should. > You think low carb will harm your kidneys? You answered your own question here. > High protein does make your kidneys work harder High BG's of a diabetic, both before diagnosed and afterwards, are harmful on the kidneys and any extra stress on the kidneys should be avoided. Again, simple logic. > You two are the only ones here who insists there is only ONE way. Never said that, just stated that this gospial that you are preaching can be very dangerous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 19, 1999 Report Share Posted December 19, 1999 Does anyone remember the story of the blind man and the elephant? Insulin users may be able to lower their sugars by injecting insulin. I use diet alone, which means I can't do much about it after it is eaten. I read of some that meter and get on their exercise machine, Insulin users must match their meal with insulin in amount and timing. When they go low, they must eat to restore balance. I think a basic difference of approach is that I put in carbs as needed, a small amount at a time. I am not obliged to eat all my carbs at meals, and choose not to. I eat largely fruit with moderate amounts of protein, almost no fat. I speak of starches giving me high sugars even in modest amounts. Therefore I limit them. Sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 20, 1999 Report Share Posted December 20, 1999 I am not preaching, and I never said low carb was any gospel. I have said again and again, what works for you is what you should do. I have said, and so have others, that we have doctors who DO suppport low carb, so who are you to say our doctor is no good and your's is the GOD of the diabetic world. You are the one preaching here. Have you not heard from several people here that they have done the ada exchange and it was NOT controlling their bg's? Are you DEAF? I think that speaks for itself. You have not commented on anything except to take it out of context, twist it around to suit yourself, and try to make people who are working hard WITH their doctors to take control of this abhorrent disease feel they cannot win this battle. How depressing! Obviously if they continue on a woe that makes their bg's too high they will end up with complications. If low carb (PLEASE NOTE THAT IS NOT *NO* CARB) does that job you are doing them a huge disservice to try and remove that choice from them. I will repeat (and see if you can reply without taking this out of context yet again) 1. If a low fat ada exchange diet is working for you and you can follow it, stick with it. 2. If you are following a low fat ada exchange diet and your bg's still run consistently over 150 (mine were 180 - 200) you need to find something else to help - either medication or a different diet. 3. If you run consistently over 180 you WILL end up with complications and if lowering your carbs gets your bg's down to normal levels you are FAR LESS LIKELY to get those complications. Meenie Re: Jeff and > > > >> Go to 3 different docs, get 3 diff answers. > >No, your silver bullet diet plan is NOT by any sanctioned by the ADA/JDF or >by any sanctioned diabetes center. Trust me, I know what those standards >are. You are doing the diabetes community a disservice by spreading your >gospel mainly due to the fact that it can be down right dangous to >individuals who are not properly monitored. There is a real risk and so >far, you really haven't respond much to that. > > >> If you blow the dust off that meter and check for yourself, you will see >> what will work for you. That is what we are doing. Like Sam says, the >> meter doesn't lie. >> >I also don't like your insinuation that people who don't follow your plan >aren't testing like they should. > > >> You think low carb will harm your kidneys? >You answered your own question here. > >> High protein does make your kidneys work harder > >High BG's of a diabetic, both before diagnosed and afterwards, are harmful >on the kidneys and any extra stress on the kidneys should be avoided. >Again, simple logic. > >> You two are the only ones here who insists there is only ONE way. >Never said that, just stated that this gospial that you are preaching can be >very dangerous. > >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 20, 1999 Report Share Posted December 20, 1999 > >> Go to 3 different docs, get 3 diff answers. > >No, your silver bullet diet plan is NOT by any sanctioned by the ADA/JDF or >by any sanctioned diabetes center. Not too long ago, self metering wasn't sanctioned either. If a handful of doctors hadn't bucked the system and pushed for that where would be be now? It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that bg's over 180 WILL damage your kidneys. Trust me, I know what those standards >are. Why should I trust you? Who are you but another person on the net? I'm following a diet plan that has made me feel better than I have in years, has gotten my bg's into the normal range, gotten rid of the tingling in my feet, the rollercoaster of highs and lows, and given me peace of mind for the first time in 4 years. And I'm supposed to stop it, return to a way of eating that was definately (and by recognised ADA standards) going to cause me diabetic complications, and because you pop up in here and say " ohhh you can't do that " you think I'm going to go back to a woe that was harming me? I don't think so. Stop playing God. >You are doing the diabetes community a disservice by spreading your >gospel mainly due to the fact that it can be down right dangous to >individuals who are not properly monitored. There is a real risk and so >far, you really haven't respond much to that. I have responded, you have turned a deaf ear except to excerpts that you can pull out and twist into meaning things I never said. I never said I followed a NO CARB diet. I never suggested anyone should follow a NO CARB diet. >> If you blow the dust off that meter and check for yourself, you will see >> what will work for you. That is what we are doing. Like Sam says, the >> meter doesn't lie. >> >I also don't like your insinuation that people who don't follow your plan >aren't testing like they should. I never said that people who don't follow low carb aren't testing like they should. I said, and I will say YET AGAIN - if low fat ada exchange works for you then DO IT. But test so you know . I tell everyone who comes through this " door " to test, testing is the key to diabetic control (or didn't they teach you THAT gem? - the dlc class I went to did at least teach that) >> You think low carb will harm your kidneys? >You answered your own question here. >> High protein does make your kidneys work harder Again, you took my answer completly out of context. YOU never answer questions and YOU twist things around. > >High BG's of a diabetic, both before diagnosed and afterwards, are harmful >on the kidneys and any extra stress on the kidneys should be avoided. >Again, simple logic. And simple to test for - AS I SAID - but of course you cut that part out, didn't you - oh my. I said you should be checked out by your physician before changing to any diet plan and that includes checking your kidney function. I also said if you had any kidney problems then a low carb diet might not be the answer for you. > >> You two are the only ones here who insists there is only ONE way. >Never said that, just stated that this gospial that you are preaching can be >very dangerous. Yes you have said it and continue to say it. Meenie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 20, 1999 Report Share Posted December 20, 1999 Oh, stop it, you guys. There IS only one way to fight diabetes, and that is with all your heart, soul, and every single scrap of information you can come up with! Sticks and stones may break your bones - but information and opportunities will never harm you. You know, when I first started learning about diabetes, I was toeing the standard line that most nutritionists do - ADA (Amer. DIETETIC Assoc., that is). I came out hard against low-carbing because scientific fact as *I* understood it does indeed point to this dietary plan as being dangerous, if not ineffective. And even though I never won any battles with the CDE at the local hospital - she is anti-supplement and I would never go a single day without supplements - we did kind of agree on the low-carb issue. I knew that carbs had a dramatic effect on blood sugar levels, but I held onto the hope that I would eventually get people to recognize the importance of complex carbohydrates (most people wouldn't know one if it kicked 'em in the shins) and that I could someday get people to quit eating dairy products (that's my other torch that I carry...sigh) and that I would simply change the world one diabetic at a time. But rather than resurrect all that I read and learned which have re-educated me in this regard, I would like to use this forum to once again air my personal AND professional frustration at the state of diabetes treatment as most of us know it. Just to note, I am talking about type 2 diabetes, as I do not currently work with any type 1s. I simply cannot believe that, with all we know, there is someone diagnosed with type 2 diabetes EVERY 40 SECONDS. I also continue to be totally, completely aghast at the number of people whom I meet, on lists like this and elsewhere, who get a diagnosis of type 2 diabetes and are immediately put on at least two kinds of diabetes medications! Whether anyone of this list agrees with me or not, I just have to say to the mainstream medical community, " Come on, you guys, wake up! Something is NOT working here! " We have five classes of meds, with new ones coming out every week it seems, and it is only recently that meds have even BEGUN to address the problem (insulin sensitivity) and not simply the symptoms. And treatment of type 2 diabetes continues to be 90% pharmaceutical. If diet and/or exercise is even mentioned as part of that remaining 10% it is based on old ideas with no reference to new information that's been uncovered about what's really going on in the body of a type 2 diabetic! I just want to say that although doctors and CDEs and dietitians and the like most certainly do have a lot of knowlege - knowlege is pretty relative when you think about it. All knowlege is not good knowlege. Sorry for the rant. I'm just pretty frustrated this week. It's not just about type 2 diabetes. Everyone I know owns a human body - the finest instrument they will EVER own - but nearly everyone I know has, for the most part inadvertently, messed that body up so badly with horrible diets, antibiotics, etc., etc. that even though the body can heal itself of *anything* - including diabetes - it is no longer able to do so. Then we seek the advice of doctors, who just give us more medications and rarely look at the power that still exists in the body itself to repair and revitalize. Now, medications are not terrible. They can do a lot of good and for many of you they have been literal lifesavers. But there's a healthier way. And I've spent the better part of two years telling people this and no one is listening. Again, sorry for the rant. Please forgive me if I've offended anyone. Kramer " Notice the difference between what happens when a man says to himself, 'I have failed three times,' and what happens when he says, 'I'm a failure.' " - S. I. Hayakawa Re: Jeff and > > > > > > >> Go to 3 different docs, get 3 diff answers. > > > >No, your silver bullet diet plan is NOT by any sanctioned by the ADA/JDF or > >by any sanctioned diabetes center. > Not too long ago, self metering wasn't sanctioned either. If a handful of > doctors hadn't bucked the system and pushed for that where would be be now? > It doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that bg's over 180 WILL damage > your kidneys. > > > Trust me, I know what those standards > >are. > > Why should I trust you? Who are you but another person on the net? I'm > following a diet plan that has made me feel better than I have in years, has > gotten my bg's into the normal range, gotten rid of the tingling in my feet, > the rollercoaster of highs and lows, and given me peace of mind for the > first time in 4 years. And I'm supposed to stop it, return to a way of > eating that was definately (and by recognised ADA standards) going to cause > me diabetic complications, and because you pop up in here and say " ohhh you > can't do that " you think I'm going to go back to a woe that was harming me? > I don't think so. Stop playing God. > > >You are doing the diabetes community a disservice by spreading your > >gospel mainly due to the fact that it can be down right dangous to > >individuals who are not properly monitored. There is a real risk and so > >far, you really haven't respond much to that. > > I have responded, you have turned a deaf ear except to excerpts that you can > pull out and twist into meaning things I never said. > I never said I followed a NO CARB diet. > I never suggested anyone should follow a NO CARB diet. > > >> If you blow the dust off that meter and check for yourself, you will see > >> what will work for you. That is what we are doing. Like Sam says, the > >> meter doesn't lie. > >> > >I also don't like your insinuation that people who don't follow your plan > >aren't testing like they should. > > I never said that people who don't follow low carb aren't testing like they > should. > I said, and I will say YET AGAIN - if low fat ada exchange works for you > then DO IT. But test so you know . I tell everyone who comes through this > " door " to test, testing is the key to diabetic control (or didn't they teach > you THAT gem? - the dlc class I went to did at least teach that) > > >> You think low carb will harm your kidneys? > >You answered your own question here. > >> High protein does make your kidneys work harder > > Again, you took my answer completly out of context. YOU never answer > questions and YOU twist things around. > > > >High BG's of a diabetic, both before diagnosed and afterwards, are harmful > >on the kidneys and any extra stress on the kidneys should be avoided. > >Again, simple logic. > > And simple to test for - AS I SAID - but of course you cut that part out, > didn't you - oh my. I said you should be checked out by your physician > before changing to any diet plan and that includes checking your kidney > function. I also said if you had any kidney problems then a low carb diet > might not be the answer for you. > > > >> You two are the only ones here who insists there is only ONE way. > >Never said that, just stated that this gospial that you are preaching can > be > >very dangerous. > > Yes you have said it and continue to say it. > Meenie > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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